Yenrub
Footballguy
As a Giants fan I am afraid that this is what is going to happen, especially if Mike Wallace signs with Miami
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Harvin to Bills/ Formerly the Harvin to Hawks & Jets (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Bigboy10182000
- Start date
TheFanatic
Footballguy
Not every player gets his rookie season (AJ Green, Boldin), and not every guy nails it in the 2nd or more prototypical 3rd. But he has shown nice progression over his three seasons and made a big step forward last year. More weapons in the passing game could be a blessing...He has been a disappointment but I had been optimistic about this season until now.And you're just now feeling this way?Golden Tate owner
bonesman
Footballguy
I think this is worse news for Doug Baldwin. Talks were of Tate moving to flanker with Rice as the split end and put Harvin in the slot. He'll miss a few games at some point anyway. Harvin probably gets punt return duties and Leon stays on kick returns. I also think Russell Wilson is the type of QB to spread the wealth and find the open man rather than force feeding one or two players exclusively. And there could be a lot of TDs to go around. I had been shopping Tate this offseason but I'm taking him off the block now. He's going to be a starter on an offensive Juggernaut.He has been a disappointment but I had been optimistic about this season until now.And you're just now feeling this way?Golden Tate owner
Johnny Bing
Footballguy
That's right, its the organizations fault.
cstu
Footballguy
Your team is better off, Adrian.
mr roboto
Footballguy
Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
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The new Barry Sanders, he'll retire in disgust after next season.And who could blame him.
B-Deep
Footballguy
I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
mr roboto
Footballguy
I wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
PEterson made no comment on his work ethic in that tweat. Randy Moss is the most gifted WR I've ever seen, but the Raiders didn't get much for their money for them, now did they? So please don't pretend you speak for ADPI think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
B-Deep
Footballguy
Why?if he can't recognize that Harvin is a slacker who does not want to work hard, what use is he?he seems like a malcontent enablerI wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
cstu
Footballguy
Not only a malcontent but one who wants a huge contract. Draft picks are worth a ton today and this trade frees up money to sign another WR.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
B-Deep
Footballguy
you think when a slacker malcontent gets kicked off the team an all world hard worker like Pererson feels like he has been "kicked in the stomach"i can just see AP working his #### off to come back from an ACL while Harvin slacks and then AP feeling like he was kicked in the stomach when Harvin gets the bootthat makes total senseI trust y'all on thisPEterson made no comment on his work ethic in that tweat. Randy Moss is the most gifted WR I've ever seen, but the Raiders didn't get much for their money for them, now did they? So please don't pretend you speak for ADPI think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
cstu
Footballguy
Everyone should keep in mind that a kick in the stomach to AP is like getting hit by a 5 year old to the rest of us.
mr roboto
Footballguy
Let me say this one more time. I was responding to TRex. Not ADP. A happy and producing Harvin is better than the picks they got. An unhappy and hold-out Harvin is much worse. Making the trade now saves cap room to pay others, bring in another big WR. So I think the Vikings are better off with this trade than not trading Harvin (with the assumption that Harvin would hold out). I also think that the front office would be more objective than a fellow player. ADP is right in his tweet. Harvin is incredible. So was Moss and TO. How many rings did they get? The front office has to take everything into consideration. FF clouds many people's perspectives. SEA is now being talked about as some Patriots 07 offensive juggernaut because of the names. Real football is a team sport. An unhappy star is not good in the real NFL.Why?if he can't recognize that Harvin is a slacker who does not want to work hard, what use is he?he seems like a malcontent enablerI wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
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B-Deep
Footballguy
my only point is it takes a special someont to think they know enough about Harvin to say Peterson is wrong and should be glad because his team got betterPeterson knows more about Harvin, the vikings and football than any of us idiots
mr roboto
Footballguy
So you're talking about cstu?
B-Deep
Footballguy
you were responding to an ADP quoteand to think you should correct his quote because you know more about the situation is ridiculous, he may be wrong but he has a better idea of what sort of player/worker/person harvin is than you ever will. when you have stood naked next to HArvin come back here and post about how well you know him.AND if you would NOT say this to ADP it just makes what you posted here even more ridiculousLet me say this one more time. I was responding to TRex. Not ADP. A happy and producing Harvin is better than the picks they got. An unhappy and hold-out Harvin is much worse. Making the trade now saves cap room to pay others, bring in another big WR. So I think the Vikings are better off with this trade than not trading Harvin (with the assumption that Harvin would hold out). I also think that the front office would be more objective than a fellow player. ADP is right in his tweet. Harvin is incredible. So was Moss and TO. How many rings did they get? FF clouds many people's perspectives. SEA is now being talked about as some Patriots 07 offensive juggernaut because of the names. Real football is a team sport. An unhappy star is not good in the real NFL.Why?if he can't recognize that Harvin is a slacker who does not want to work hard, what use is he?he seems like a malcontent enablerI wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
mr roboto
Footballguy
This has to be fishing. Please read the quotes above. The only person who directly disagreed/referenced adp was cstu. In done. Good luck with the fishes.you were responding to an ADP quoteand to think you should correct his quote because you know more about the situation is ridiculous, he may be wrong but he has a better idea of what sort of player/worker/person harvin is than you ever will. when you have stood naked next to HArvin come back here and post about how well you know him.AND if you would NOT say this to ADP it just makes what you posted here even more ridiculousLet me say this one more time. I was responding to TRex. Not ADP. A happy and producing Harvin is better than the picks they got. An unhappy and hold-out Harvin is much worse. Making the trade now saves cap room to pay others, bring in another big WR. So I think the Vikings are better off with this trade than not trading Harvin (with the assumption that Harvin would hold out). I also think that the front office would be more objective than a fellow player. ADP is right in his tweet. Harvin is incredible. So was Moss and TO. How many rings did they get? FF clouds many people's perspectives. SEA is now being talked about as some Patriots 07 offensive juggernaut because of the names. Real football is a team sport. An unhappy star is not good in the real NFL.Why?if he can't recognize that Harvin is a slacker who does not want to work hard, what use is he?he seems like a malcontent enablerI wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
SSOG
Moderator
You mean 1300 yards and 9 TDs. Over his last 16 games, Percy Harvin has 112 receptions, 1496 offensive yards, and 11 offensive TDs. Plus an extra touchdown via kickoff return. I doubt he keeps up that pace, because Jerry Rice in his prime didn't average 1500 yards a year. I feel a lot better about his chances at continuing anywhere near that level in Seattle than I would have in Minnesota, though.
Nobody speaks for ADP except for ADP, and he's made it abundantly clear how he feels about Harvin.Players in the NFL don't care about the same things we care about. When their teammates hold out or complain, they don't usually view them as malcontents- in fact, they usually support their teammates in any disputes with management. Witness Flacco with Boldin for the most recent example. Given that Harvin's dust ups have largely been with a front office he felt underpaid him and a coaching staff he felt misused him, I doubt his teammates held it against him. Heck, given Peterson's "best all-around player ever" comment, I suspect Peterson agrees with him. I do think Harvin's work ethic is above reproach, though. Players don't care when their teammates snipe at the front office, but they sure as hell care when their teammates aren't giving their full effort. Lots of examples in history of teammates throwing talented players under the bus for not pulling their weight.
Sebowski
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Adrian Peterson owners should worry too much. After what he showed last season with his recovery from a torn ACL, a couple of kicks to the stomach shouldn't have much long lasting affect.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
I believe he's All Day Peterson as in the kid could run all day. Either way, go be a board cop somewhere else...
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Well you have to admit that his statement doesn't come across as some one that is happy to have a team cancer, due to having a poor work ethic and being a malcontent, shipped out.PEterson made no comment on his work ethic in that tweat. Randy Moss is the most gifted WR I've ever seen, but the Raiders didn't get much for their money for them, now did they? So please don't pretend you speak for ADPI think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
cstu
Footballguy
Harvin was getting $2M a year so it made it really easy to stomach his issues. At 5-6 times that it's won't be so easy. Good luck Seattle.
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SSOG
Moderator
Funny how being on a good team who gave you a big contract has a habit of turning malcontents into model citizens.
TheFanatic
Footballguy
Lots of inferences being made about ADP's intent...
Wonder if the poor work ethic tag stems from the migraine issues. If I'm Harvin and having prolonged migraine issues I might "dog" it in practice if I'm still putting up great #'s on Sunday. When you're finally migraine-free I'd imagine you want to rock the boat as little as possible.
SacramentoBob
Footballguy
After Megatron, I'm hard pressed to come up with another WR more dominant than Harvin.
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
Don't know how much of a slacker he is but I did see him come back into a game and finish on a completely torn ligament in his ankle.
Bandite
Footballguy
Someone explain to me why the SeaHawks didnt just wait a few days to sign Victor Cruz to an offer sheet and give the Giants first round pick as compensation since he is an RFA? Cruz would make the same amount as Harvin most likely, isnt coming off an injury, and isnt a headcase.
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The Giants could match any offer Cruz receives
Bandite
Footballguy
beef
Footballguy
For reals?
cstu
Footballguy
New here?
cstu
Footballguy
So you're talking about cstu?
My point is that that AP is a player and can recognize talent but he's not a coach or a GM who necessarily knows what is best for the team.
Shutout
Footballguy
I think the Rams are the team we should be worrying about.
Shutout
Footballguy
AJ green, Julio, Dez, It really comes down to how players are used in their system. I'm likely in the minority it I'm selling my Harvins because I think he will be hard pressed to sustain his status in ppr.He was a volume accumulator based on spoon feeding and I don't see him getting that treatment in Seattle. Some have said he will get larger gains and all but in ppr, you really can't Overlook what it means to basically be guaranteed and extra 3-4 catches and 20-40 yards every week. I just don't think that will be his role in Seattle.As far as "dominant" receivers, I know he won't show it on a fake football team but when I watch Dez Bryant when he is ballin', I think he is as dominant a receiver as there is. That game against the eagles where he basically just run over the eagles to get to the end zone was as physical a play as you see by a wr in the nfl
Similar scenario was when the Lions decided to move on from Titus Young, Calvin was pretty much on board with it. I don't think harvin was ever a malcontent on the field when with his teammates, but with the moronic coaching staff and front office.you think when a slacker malcontent gets kicked off the team an all world hard worker like Pererson feels like he has been "kicked in the stomach"i can just see AP working his #### off to come back from an ACL while Harvin slacks and then AP feeling like he was kicked in the stomach when Harvin gets the bootthat makes total senseI trust y'all on thisPEterson made no comment on his work ethic in that tweat. Randy Moss is the most gifted WR I've ever seen, but the Raiders didn't get much for their money for them, now did they? So please don't pretend you speak for ADPI think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
You gonna bring him an Orange Peanut?I wasn't talking to ADP. But I will take his number. He's my favorite player. I'd like to ask him out on a man date.I think it is obvious you'd have a better idea of Harvin's work ethic than Peterson, I'll get you his number so you can explain football to him.Um, yes. Maybe not in magical pretend football, but in the real nfl you want guys who buy in and work hard. Harvin is a malcontent. Get what you can for him and let him complain elsewhere.
Dippa
Footballguy
habsfan
Footballguy
Lynch comes to mind...Funny how being on a good team who gave you a big contract has a habit of turning malcontents into model citizens.
SSOG
Moderator
Elite from a fantasy standpoint or from an NFL standpoint? From a fantasy standpoint, the only WR who has scored more points in his last 16 games is Calvin Johnson. From an NFL standpoint, one of the best front offices in the league just traded three picks for him, one of them a first rounder, despite the fact that he's a known malcontent coming off a season-ending injury and asking for a $100m contract. I think from either standpoint, Harvin would qualify for any reasonable definition of elite.If you owned Harvin, who would you be trading him for in dynasty?
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Great trade for both teams. Minnesota got three picks for a guy who didn't want to be there, and Seattle got a very good WR with elite talent who could become an elite player on the right team and in the right situation (Minnesota was not it; Seattle could very well be). Hard to argue with either side here.
LOL.
mr roboto
Footballguy
As a Vikings fan, I never thought I'd hear someone as knowledgable as you call their front office one of the best. Although the last draft was a home run IMO.
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biju
Footballguy
Was he calling the Vikings FO one of the best or the Seattle FO? As a Seahawks fan I certainly read that as Seattle's front office. They've been hitting home runs recently both in trades and in the draft. Well, the Whitehurst and Lendale White trades weren't great but Lynch, Leon Washington, and Chris Clemons deals were strong.
mr roboto
Footballguy
Oh, yea. You're right.
LawFitz
Footballguy
Folks, this was highway robbery by the Seahawks. They just stole the second best all around WR in the game - at the age of 25 - for a late first round pick and a couple later round picks. Percy has HOF talent, without the HOF durability or longevity (yet). Before you jump all over me, I'm not saying he'll make the HOF, but if he doesn't it will be for reasons other than talent. On the field as a play maker, there are very few better. Don't let last year fool you... Harvin is a better version of Randall Cobb and when healthy and motivated, because of his all-purpose skills and production, he's a week-to-week threat for WR1 overall.
And now Percy's in a MUCH improved offensive situation, especially in the passing game. On a PPG basis he will be a beast going forward, particularly in PPR and return leagues. Anyone who doesn't consider this an upgrade for both Harvin and the Seahawks offense as a whole is missing the boat. Back him up accordingly if you draft him, but know that you are getting a PPG beast in a great new situation. Love it as a fan and prospective 2013 Harvin drafter. For fantasy football, these are the seismic shifts that create huge values in redrafts, especially in a case like this where the "what have you done for me lately" crowd talks an established star down the board.
Harvin gets undervalued every single year in my PPR/return leagues, and I'm sure this year it will be no different, except that the upside to the return on investment just went through the roof.
And now Percy's in a MUCH improved offensive situation, especially in the passing game. On a PPG basis he will be a beast going forward, particularly in PPR and return leagues. Anyone who doesn't consider this an upgrade for both Harvin and the Seahawks offense as a whole is missing the boat. Back him up accordingly if you draft him, but know that you are getting a PPG beast in a great new situation. Love it as a fan and prospective 2013 Harvin drafter. For fantasy football, these are the seismic shifts that create huge values in redrafts, especially in a case like this where the "what have you done for me lately" crowd talks an established star down the board.
Harvin gets undervalued every single year in my PPR/return leagues, and I'm sure this year it will be no different, except that the upside to the return on investment just went through the roof.
