Islanders rule
Footballguy
Nice call ?
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Thoughts on Alex Green going forward? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter ponchsox
- Start date
Hendo
Footballguy
duaneok66
Footballguy
bad logic with regard to LSH.
ponchsox
Footballguy
Call of the year!
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Easy to beat up a guy when a call goes wrong. It happens to everybody sometime. Projecting fantasy football scoring can be a humiliating experience. At least guy went out on a limb and called his shot....not like 90 percent of the lurkers who wait for the trainwreck and pounce.
otb_lifer
Footballguy
It's one thing to go "out on a limb"; quite another to call it a "no brainer"
Raiderfan32904
Footballguy
Agreed. But it's not really going out on a limb unless you qualify just how sure you are. I was thinking that Minnesota's defense was a no-brainer start last night, and I was so wrong. Wonder if it's the oracle avatar that makes people want toIt's one thing to go "out on a limb"; quite another to call it a "no brainer"
Not that I'm sticking up for anybody.OK ... Martin doesn't count either.But aside from LSH and Martin ... no one runs on MIN , no one.
shadyridr
Footballguy
SameSongNDance is a great poster. We're just busting his balls a little bit. No harm in thatAgreed. But it's not really going out on a limb unless you qualify just how sure you are. I was thinking that Minnesota's defense was a no-brainer start last night, and I was so wrong. Wonder if it's the oracle avatar that makes people want toIt's one thing to go "out on a limb"; quite another to call it a "no brainer"
otb_lifer
Footballguy
Agreed .. i find him to be a good " read" here in the SP, and I agree with him more often than not. As they say on the West Side "no autopsy, no foul" ...SameSongNDance is a great poster. We're just busting his balls a little bit. No harm in thatAgreed. But it's not really going out on a limb unless you qualify just how sure you are. I was thinking that Minnesota's defense was a no-brainer start last night, and I was so wrong. Wonder if it's the oracle avatar that makes people want toIt's one thing to go "out on a limb"; quite another to call it a "no brainer"
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
No offense and thanks for sticking your neck out, but thank God I didn't listen to you last night.
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
I have little interest in everyone pulling a LHUCKS and calling their shot based on nothing more than a 'gut feeling'. That crap serves no purpose and I'd rather wait for the lurkers to pounce instead of baseless projections. That said, Song has made several good calls and he's generally worth paying attention to. Still, this was a horrific call. Unless Green blows up (and he may), this is going to be one of the biggest swings and misses of the year.
otb_lifer
Footballguy
Rodgers.
SameSongNDance
Footballguy
Haha oh boy was I wrong. I was actually trying to recount where it was that I advised someone to sit Martin, forgot it was here.How embarrassing. You guys can't tell me you were not utterly surprised by Martin last night though. WTH happened to MIN? They looked like NO out there.
Either way, no one if perfect and I certainly deserve to catch some flack for that post.
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packersfan
Footballguy
Rodgers is always the goal-line option.The Packers have had one GL carry in the two games Green started and Green got it. So assuming they get near the end zone on Sunday and decide to run odds are quite high it'll be Green getting the carry.
Honestly, I think he made a horrible call. Martin has actually proven he can be a featured RB. Green has proven NOTHING behind an offensive line that was built to pass block and needs to improve a lot on their run blocking. Minnesota's run defense is also overrated...it's like people still think Pat Williams is still there in his prime. Kevin Williams is also old and losing it...he's all pass rush now...he was only able to stop the run with Pat next to him.'dickey moe said:
Dr. Awesome
Footballguy
No bueno.
It's actually 3 weeks in a row and 4 if you take away 1 carry.Starks has 1 carry for 8 yds longer than any of Greens 16 runs
Hendo
Footballguy
He tripped on his own OL for what looked like a potential gainer.... looks too tippy toe to the line still however is really really good at those screen and dump off passes. By no means he looks good but I think people need to give this kid just a lil room as this is basicaly his rookie yr and coming off a serious injury.
Lobary
Footballguy
Owning any GB running back is a very losing proposition. Whenever they're inside the freakin ten they're almost always in a spread formation with Rodgers in the shotgun, and if they actually do call a running play it's going to Rodgers or Kuhn. You simply cannot rely on any Packer back to get you decent fantasy points. Ugh.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Brutal watching him run. He sucked before the ACL.
Starks isn't the long term answer for running the ball, but he's better than this turd.
Starks isn't the long term answer for running the ball, but he's better than this turd.
smackdaddies
Footballguy
If he could block, pass catch, or stay healthy, sure.
SameSongNDance
Footballguy
What are the odds SJax gets traded to GB? Even though it was a blow-out, I got the feeling STL was seeing exactly what they had with the DRich/Pead combo today.
Sudoku_in_the_Bathtub
Footballguy
Dark Matter
Footballguy
:FACEPLANT:
It seems that Packers fans and coaches are so running back deprived that they have lost their senses.
They are ecstatic with Cedric (The Savior) Benson's 3.5 ypc and thrilled with Alex (The Future) Green's bloated 2.9 ypc (2.4 minus 1 carry)
Meanwhile they scoff at Brandon (Never Lost a Fumble) Jackson (career 3.8 ypc) and are disgusted at the thought of James (Trash) Starks (career 4.3 ypc)
WTH is going on here!?!?
They are ecstatic with Cedric (The Savior) Benson's 3.5 ypc and thrilled with Alex (The Future) Green's bloated 2.9 ypc (2.4 minus 1 carry)
Meanwhile they scoff at Brandon (Never Lost a Fumble) Jackson (career 3.8 ypc) and are disgusted at the thought of James (Trash) Starks (career 4.3 ypc)
WTH is going on here!?!?
JFS171
Footballguy
I asked it last week, and I'll ask it again this week. Barring a trade (which none of us can predict, especially given Ted Thompson's track record of hoarding picks), and given the organization's apparent disgust with James Starks, is it time we look into Johnny White?
I'm not saying he's anything special, but Green is clearly struggling with his golden opportunity. The team refuses to give Starks any work, and I'm not sure Thompson thinks he *needs* to trade for a RB to make a deep playoff run when Benson is eligible to return, and says he's improving.
White could see some looks moving forward... I certainly wouldn't be shocked.
I'm not saying he's anything special, but Green is clearly struggling with his golden opportunity. The team refuses to give Starks any work, and I'm not sure Thompson thinks he *needs* to trade for a RB to make a deep playoff run when Benson is eligible to return, and says he's improving.
White could see some looks moving forward... I certainly wouldn't be shocked.
When there is no significant difference in all other determining factors (i.e. blocking, pass catching etc ...).We all know that coaches never make mistakes or let their egos get in the way of making the correct decisions.
Dark Matter
Footballguy
We Packer Fans would love to see Ted shock the world and make a move for Steven Jackson or DWill, hell Blount might even work. Until the line figures out how to run block it really won't matter. 
Edit to Add: I thought Alex Green did pretty good in pp yesterday. So weird what they are doing with Starks. The 2nd half started with him on the sidelines wearing his pink beenie, got in for a couple strong runs, wiffed in pp and he was out.
Edit to Add: I thought Alex Green did pretty good in pp yesterday. So weird what they are doing with Starks. The 2nd half started with him on the sidelines wearing his pink beenie, got in for a couple strong runs, wiffed in pp and he was out.
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Carter_Can_Fly
Footballguy
Obviously they do.But if you have two equally below average RB's and one seems to run further per touch, I would assume you would want to see if he is better than the guy struggling at the moment. But that is just me. Starks has obviously done something to get demoted and fall so out of favour that he can't get any touches.
I think Dwill would be unbelievable in that offenseWe Packer Fans would love to see Ted shock the world and make a move for Steven Jackson or DWill, hell Blount might even work. Until the line figures out how to run block it really won't matter.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Who has been thrilled with Green?Jackson was not a great runner when given the chance to be a feature back.
Starks, we like...he just can't stay healthy or pick up a blitz and his pass catching skills are mediocre (and that is being generous).
sho nuff
Footballguy
There has been a significant different in those things though.Jackson, however, was a great blocker.
Mediocre runner...decent pass catcher.
He also left because he wanted more money than GB was willing to give to a 3rd down back. Which is all he was and will ever be.
packersfan
Footballguy
For those who may have missed it, McCarthy came out in full support of Green on Monday. Starks may see a little more action but Green is definitely the starter and will continue to be the dominant ballcarrier in the backfield.
Curious that RotoWorld - which has been generating so much pro-Starks buzz despite no evidence to support it - failed to report this yesterday. They posted other things from McCarthy's press conference. Odd they would ignore this. Oh well.
The story also all but dismisses the possibility the Packers will trade for a RB such as Steven Jackson. As Packers fans know all too well, that's not the type of move Ted Thompson will make. Plus given the team's belief in Green I'd be surprised if they bailed on him this quickly.
"James will probably be given more opportunities as we go through the week, but there are a number of different factors that are involved with that and the biggest one is Alex Green has earned these opportunities."
Something else interesting in the story was the discussion of Green's possible lack of vision. Sounds like he was doing what the coaches instructed him to do against the Jags:
However, offensive coordinator Tom Clements said that Green was directed to hit the holes fast against the Jaguars because of the type of runs that were being called. Offensive lineman Evan Dietrich-Smith was used several times as a tight end in hopes of opening a crease for Green.
"Most of the runs that we had in yesterday were more downhill runs where you're trying to get to the line quicker," Clements said. "We had Evan Dietrich-Smith in there a couple of times at different positions where he was essentially trapping one of their linemen and that's a quick-hitting type play.
"A lot of the other plays were quick-hitting. When we do more of the outside zone or the inside zone, that requires some patience, but most of the ones yesterday were downhill."
Link
Curious that RotoWorld - which has been generating so much pro-Starks buzz despite no evidence to support it - failed to report this yesterday. They posted other things from McCarthy's press conference. Odd they would ignore this. Oh well.
The story also all but dismisses the possibility the Packers will trade for a RB such as Steven Jackson. As Packers fans know all too well, that's not the type of move Ted Thompson will make. Plus given the team's belief in Green I'd be surprised if they bailed on him this quickly.
"James will probably be given more opportunities as we go through the week, but there are a number of different factors that are involved with that and the biggest one is Alex Green has earned these opportunities."
Something else interesting in the story was the discussion of Green's possible lack of vision. Sounds like he was doing what the coaches instructed him to do against the Jags:
However, offensive coordinator Tom Clements said that Green was directed to hit the holes fast against the Jaguars because of the type of runs that were being called. Offensive lineman Evan Dietrich-Smith was used several times as a tight end in hopes of opening a crease for Green.
"Most of the runs that we had in yesterday were more downhill runs where you're trying to get to the line quicker," Clements said. "We had Evan Dietrich-Smith in there a couple of times at different positions where he was essentially trapping one of their linemen and that's a quick-hitting type play.
"A lot of the other plays were quick-hitting. When we do more of the outside zone or the inside zone, that requires some patience, but most of the ones yesterday were downhill."
Link
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JFS171
Footballguy
Still think White remains an interesting watch. They seem really hesitant to give the ball to Starks. White's combine numbers aren't TERRIBLY far off from Green's, and it's possible he's a bit more shifty, a bit better through the hole. I don't know... just seems like three straight games where Green hasn't been very productive on a per play basis. Yes, two were against stout run defenses in Houston and St. Louis, but I expected much more against the Jags.
Here's White's combine report from NFL.com: here
Combine Video: here
Looks like a fairly natural receiver in the drills, which we know is important to the Pack. Not sure how he rates as a pass blocker though...
Here's White's combine report from NFL.com: here
Combine Video: here
Looks like a fairly natural receiver in the drills, which we know is important to the Pack. Not sure how he rates as a pass blocker though...
packersfan
Footballguy
The one thing I'll continue to stress and repeat is that the Packers are very high on Green. People are either ignoring that or refusing to believe it. However, that's been obvious the past three weeks and it's obvious again based on McCarthy's quotes yesterday. He's essentially a rookie in many ways so given how high the Packers are on him plus his youth I don't see them backing away from him quickly - especially since the team is winning and it's rather obvious the offensive line isn't doing well in the run game at all.
It's also important to note that Green continues to fare well in pass protection. He handled most of the third-down snaps against the Jags with Kuhn out and didn't cause Rodgers to get blasted at any point. Given the team's reliance on the passing game this is another huge aspect that can't be overlooked.
It seems pretty obvious the team has no desire to give Starks a bigger role. That really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone either. Maybe White gets a shot at some point but if Kuhn's healthy this week I'd expect White to be inactive. As I said when Benson got hurt, the Packers were prepared to begin a season with Super Bowl aspirations with Starks, Green and Kuhn and much of that was due to their strong belief in Green. That's one of the reasons why I don't see them trading for a RB this week. I think they'll stick with what they have, keep coaching Green up and hope he realizes the potential they believe he has.
It's also important to note that Green continues to fare well in pass protection. He handled most of the third-down snaps against the Jags with Kuhn out and didn't cause Rodgers to get blasted at any point. Given the team's reliance on the passing game this is another huge aspect that can't be overlooked.
It seems pretty obvious the team has no desire to give Starks a bigger role. That really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone either. Maybe White gets a shot at some point but if Kuhn's healthy this week I'd expect White to be inactive. As I said when Benson got hurt, the Packers were prepared to begin a season with Super Bowl aspirations with Starks, Green and Kuhn and much of that was due to their strong belief in Green. That's one of the reasons why I don't see them trading for a RB this week. I think they'll stick with what they have, keep coaching Green up and hope he realizes the potential they believe he has.
Well, my understanding was that pass protection was the biggest hindrance to Green's possible success.I figured they'd be coaching him up on this more than anything else, and as such, the actual running the ball part of his game may have taken a hit for a couple of games. Based on the language used by the coaches, it would appear that the only thing he really cares about is keeping Rodgers from getting Squished by some defensive players.Given what Rodgers does for that team, this is not entirely unreasonable. As such, I dont think he cares if Green underproduces on the ground for a couple of games while improving his blocking.I think as long as Green is at least adequate in this area they will continue to give him a shot.
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
I own Green in 11/12 dynasties so I really want to believe in him long-term. But man he looks bad right now running the ball. Blocking has been pretty good from what I've seen and he's a natural catching the ball, but sooner or later he's gotta pick up some yards on the ground.
packersfan
Footballguy
We've definitely been watching different games because the offensive line has been pathetic. I think that's one of the reasons why McCarthy still believes in Green. He knows the line has been awful. I'm not saying Green has looked because I don't think he has the last two games but the offensive line has been a joke as far as run blocking. There's almost nowhere for him to run on most of his carries. But I agree with McCarthy one of the biggest things Green needs to do is turn those 1 and 2 yard gains into 3 and 4. Get some positive yardage and give Rodgers easier down and distances to work with. That's what the Packers basically want from their running game. Green did that very well against the Texans and I think that played a big role in why the passing game looked outstanding that night.
SameSongNDance
Footballguy
It's quite possible JAC has also stepped up their game in the last few weeks (they are allowing the 3rd least fantasy points to RBs in the last three weeks). They were able to hold off DMC for a full four quarters, something KC, a perceivably equally as porous rush defense wasn't able to do. Who knows. I will say, the schedule isn't exactly easy. They face..
ARI (21rst), DET (27th), NYG (24th), MIN (18th), DET (27th), CHI (31rst), TEN (3rd)
There's nothing easy here, although MIN has been exposed in the last two weeks.
Another thing that surprised me is how much work Green is actually getting. 23, 24, 26, those are the amount of touches Green has gotten in his last three games respectively. In each of those games, he received 20+ carries. Benson received 20+ carries only once in his five starts. This leads me to believe GB really is that high on him. Why else would you continue to feed him the ball as he averages sub 3 YPC?
IMO, fantasy or no fantasy, something has got to change if GB feels like winning a SB. Eventually, someone is going to completely sell out, asking Green to beat them and I'm just not sure if he can. Maybe Green will step up his game, Starks will resurrect his career, White will take us by surprise or SJax will be signed. Either way, something has got to give. They're winning now, but you'd have to be delusional to think it's sustainable with out a legit run game. It's not as if Rodgers is invincible (I think it was made pretty evident this year).
ARI (21rst), DET (27th), NYG (24th), MIN (18th), DET (27th), CHI (31rst), TEN (3rd)
There's nothing easy here, although MIN has been exposed in the last two weeks.
Another thing that surprised me is how much work Green is actually getting. 23, 24, 26, those are the amount of touches Green has gotten in his last three games respectively. In each of those games, he received 20+ carries. Benson received 20+ carries only once in his five starts. This leads me to believe GB really is that high on him. Why else would you continue to feed him the ball as he averages sub 3 YPC?
IMO, fantasy or no fantasy, something has got to change if GB feels like winning a SB. Eventually, someone is going to completely sell out, asking Green to beat them and I'm just not sure if he can. Maybe Green will step up his game, Starks will resurrect his career, White will take us by surprise or SJax will be signed. Either way, something has got to give. They're winning now, but you'd have to be delusional to think it's sustainable with out a legit run game. It's not as if Rodgers is invincible (I think it was made pretty evident this year).
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