Shutout
Footballguy
Which proves my statement most likely. Nobody has ever sustained that. (E.g., they are playing over their heads about right now).
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RB Kareem Hunt, CLE (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Biabreakable
- Start date
msudaisy26
Footballguy
zoonation
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
No is saying he isn't the real deal, but saying he is a top 5 overall dynasty pick after 3 games is crazy.
He might be a top 5 overall dynasty guy, but I for one need to see it all year before I put him there.
Shutout
Footballguy
They feed Cadillac the ball 30 times a game and he averaged about 5 yards a pop. Good, but not all that comparable. They ran him into the ground, then he got hurt.
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zoonation
Footballguy
Bottled up? He had 100 yards on a dozen carries before he broke off that run. Okay....
FreeBaGeL
Footballguy
In what world is 103 yards at 7ypc (which is what he had through 3 1/2 quarters) "getting bottled up".
In only one of the three games was he bottled up before the big run at the end. In each of the other two he had a really good game going already before that.
The bottom line is who cares, you could even ignore those runs. Just watch this guy play, he is the real deal. Every run he is shedding tacklers without losing speed and getting 3x as many yards as the play was blocked for. When there is 1 yard there he gets 4. When there are 4 yards there he gets 10. When there are 10 yards there he gets 60.
STUD.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
And in that game where where he had his big late run, he scored another TD after that. He's a superstar.
The Jacket
Footballguy
Absolutely. He is a proven commodity at this point. Now teams will adjust and slow him down, but he is still gonna get his.
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
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Insoxicated
Yep, he's gotten almost 100pts in 3 games. I think ~300pts is a borderline lock if he stays healthy. Approaching 400 is a possibility
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
So how much higher is Hunt's value today? Any doubters still? One holdout, maybe two? 
beast.
beast.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
Sell high! His value will never be higher!So how much higher is Hunt's value today? Any doubters still? One holdout, maybe two?
beast.
(Of course, the same could be said for any top-10 dynasty asset. Nowhere to go but down.)
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
Trying to think of an instance when a rookie was a league MVP*?
* AP award
Jim Brown - '57
Earl Campbell - '78 (non-AP award)
Not Elliot, Moss, Dickerson, Marino.
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MVP awards favor QBs. There are numerous backs who had monster rookie season. Elliott of course. And Dickerson did 1800 yards rushing, 400 receiving with 20 TDs. Billy Sims had over 1900 yfs and 16 TDs. Marshall Faulk 1800 yfs and 12 TDs. Earl Cambell, Edge, Barry Sanders, Curtis Martin, Terrel Davis, and Adrian Peterson were all top backs in the league as rookies So it is not all that uncommon for great backs to explode on to the scene and in almost all these cases go on and have HOF type careers, barring injuries. So yes, it is more likely than not Hunt is a great back and will continue to produce at high levels.
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Crystalsteam99
Footballguy
msudaisy26
Footballguy
ponchsox
Footballguy
This kid is such a treat to watch. I don't think anyone expects to him to keep putting up 25+ point fantasy games each week but I think his floor and ceiling are insanely high. For where he was drafted he's going to be on many championship teams.
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steelers1080
Footballguy
Before the season I traded Dez and Hunt for Amari Cooper. I feel pretty dumb right now. At this point I'd probably just hold if I owned him unless someone was offering a vast overpay. Ride him to a championship.
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
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Insoxicated
2017 MVP Odds (sportsbook.ag)
Aaron Rodgers +300
Tom Brady +400
Matt Ryan +450
Matt Stafford +500
Derek Carr +1500
Kareem Hunt +1500
Kirk Cousins +2000
Marcus Mariota +2000
Dak Prescott +2500
Jameis Winston +2500
Russell Wilson +2500
Alex Smith +3000
Carson Wentz +3500
LeVeon Bell +4000
(Zeke is +5000, Antonio Brown is +7500)
Aaron Rodgers +300
Tom Brady +400
Matt Ryan +450
Matt Stafford +500
Derek Carr +1500
Kareem Hunt +1500
Kirk Cousins +2000
Marcus Mariota +2000
Dak Prescott +2500
Jameis Winston +2500
Russell Wilson +2500
Alex Smith +3000
Carson Wentz +3500
LeVeon Bell +4000
(Zeke is +5000, Antonio Brown is +7500)
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
True in both the league I stole him in the 6th (before Ware was known to be out all year) and a week later in the 1.07 spot (where I also got to draft his 50 points since it was Saturday before the season)
hes been a monster for me and worth every bit of both draft selections. More of a gamble in the 1st round, but man - I never want this ride to end.
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
I think they had him #1 or #2 in the FBS in that seemingly important stat last year. Also heard a stat that he was the only RB in the nation with 40+ receptions and 0 drops. Plus he never lost a fumble in four seasons (weirdly did first NFL carry, before a record setting debut). So an interesting confluence of RB skills distinguish his constellation of traits.
Not just fantasy/dynasty owners (of more concern to us), but props to Andy Reid, who appears to have hit the proverbial jackpot - we can now understand why KC traded up for him. A color commentator on the broadcast noted defensive players and coaches were realizing they needed to tackle him low to bring him down, that he had two jackhammers for thighs.
* It wouldn't be possible to do what he has done without exemplary, extraordinary balance. Also, some backs (Marcus Allen comes to mind for me) have a knack for just never taking a kill shot, a combo of proximity sense, peripheral vision, body control, agility, quicker reflexes/reactions to turn their body at the last instant like a martial artist and render the blow glancing or missed. Sort of like a mash up of an eel, bullet time-mode Neo and Pai Mei (even when Uma Thurman was inches away, she couldn't touch him).
** Kareem Hunt fun fact: Added another NFL record to his first game combined yards, first player in league history with a 50+ yard score in his first three games.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I got a little chub on the 20+ yard burst from their own 10. The 69 yard TD & I almost had to change my underpants.
fruity pebbles
Footballguy
My favorite run of the day was where he just bulldozes Tre Boston and runs right over the top of him.I got a little chub on the 20+ yard burst from their own 10. The 69 yard TD & I almost had to change my underpants.
otb_lifer
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
He's also one of those slippery backs who looks like he's running one direction with his torso & another direction with his legs - and he keeps shifting around making defenders miss a split second before he gets to them ala Westbrook/Tomlinson.
I've said it before, when I first watched him run, he more than passed the eye test. His speed/power/vision/hands/elusiveness is a super rare combination of skills and it's a joy to watch. I don't see anything slowing him but injury, and I'm hopeful the elusiveness will help him in that regard,
ETA he couldn't have landed in a better spot coaching or O-Line wise. Credit where due, the skills are legit but his situation is ideal.
the kid is a beast and should dot a lot of championship rosters this year.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I noticed this (and posted something about it) in game 1...he has that elusiveness and vision, where he manages to never truly absorb a direct hit even when running right up the gut. It's an attribute that I hope keeps him on the field. He's definitely slipper for a back with his power. I continue to be incredibly impressed. There's not another player in the NFL I'd rather have on my FFB roster, and I cannot think of a better dynasty guy.
WR's have always seemed like fool's gold to me. Everyone wants the next 20 TD Randy Moss, but WRs are dependent on a QB's production whereas RBs make their own yards.
This was obvious last year when Gurley excelled in spite of Goff and Fisher. Oh, wait...
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
The OL had a lot to do with that too. And as you mentioned, Fisher.
Who's been better for Dynasty owners this year, Odell Beckham or Todd Gurley? Even when healthy I'm not expecting Eli & that OL to suddenly become competent. Is the future brighter for NYG or LAR?
When Big Ben was hurt how'd ABrown's production do for consistency?
no player is truly independent in a team sport. But in my experience RBs are more consistent assets in FFB.
But your point is valid - nothing exists in a vacuum and I was over-generalizing a bit.
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Andrew74
Footballguy
I have to agree with @msudaisy26. 3 games seem a little early to anoint him.
And before someone labels me a hater, as a life long Chiefs fan, I hope to goodness he is. I'd like to see a SB win before I die.
And yes I do wish he were on my dynasty team.
And before someone labels me a hater, as a life long Chiefs fan, I hope to goodness he is. I'd like to see a SB win before I die.
And yes I do wish he were on my dynasty team.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I agree, too early to anoint him.
it's ok that I have his photo in my wallet, and occasionally take it out an kiss it though, right?
uh, asking for a friend.
"Who's been better for Dynasty owners this year" is phrased in a way that makes me think you mostly play redraft. Yes, the current season matters a lot, but the fact remains that WRs are worth more in dynasty leagues because they have a much longer shelf life.
I'm not sure anyone would trade Beckham for Hunt in a redraft league, either. At the end of the season it is far more likely that Beckham outscores Hunt, simply because RBs get hurt at a much higher rate (and to a lesser extent because Hunt is a rookie who will probably hit the wall in November).
Bronco Billy
Footballguy
I disagree with this completely. The lack of career longevity as well as the scarcity of bell cow RBs in the NFL is exactly what enhances their value and gives them more value than WRs in dynasty formats. The longer a player can be great at what they do only increases the size of that tier of the talent pool as other great players enter it while the current residents don't leave.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I do. And it was phrased that was intentionally. but there was also some long-term view there. I used to have a dynasty team though.
That's the theory I see often - WR have a longer shelf life. But I question the validity of that. Seems like WRs not only also get hurt, but the ones who stay healthy suffer swings of greater inconsistency. I wonder how many Julio Jones dynasty owners have championships under their belts? Dude puts up monster numbers seemingly in a handful of games, but also puts up duds and gets hurt. Yet he's considered a top dynasty asset and annual 1st rounder in redraft.
I took him 5th last year and when he had his 300 yard game it was incredible! Unfortunately it only counted as 1 win, and he wasn't that great for many more games. But his end of season #s looked good - good enough to again make him a redraft 1st rounder. Now his back is hurt. Meanwhile Hunt has touched the ball many more times and he seems pretty healthy. So it's kind of a crap shoot on injuries - football is a dangerous sport. Any hit could be the one. Or in Jones case, landing badly on a foot or tweaking a back could mean reduced production for a season or more.
I've been playing this game a long time, and I've had players at every position get hurt. One could say RBs get hurt more compared to WR. One could also point out that most teams in the NFL use more receivers than RBs, skewing that comparison a bit.
For dynasty I'm just not sure you're truly going to get more longevity, and more importantly, more production over a longer time from a WR vs a RB. It's an interesting discussion, and hardly one I see as purely fact-based.
It's a fine speculation. You may end up being correct. Then again, you may not. From what I see, KC is managing Hunt's workload pretty effectively. Right around 20 touches a game.
Not every rookie RB hits the rookie wall - some play well all year. Some of those players go on to great careers. Then again, some are named Olandis Gary. There's a whole range of possible outcomes between the two. Hunt will be somewhere on that spectrum.
There do seem to be more "flash in the pan" RBs than WR. I'll concede that. Many RB have 1 great season then crap the bed. But then historically WRs tend to take a couple years to ramp up and then go on for a while comparatively. The RB position transitions easier from college to the pros, as I understand it. Far more rare that a year 1 WR is a stud compared to a year 1 RB.
So even if it's true that WRs have longer careers, if the first 2-3 years are learning curve compared to 2-3 years of feature back usage, it seems to average out, no?
I have serious doubts that ODB will outscore Hunt this year, but that's just an opinion as well.
It is an interesting debate though.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Agree with this. Rarity of true 3-down backs makes a young asset like Hunt incredibly valuable.
i can see the track record "only been 3 games" argument, but it's hard for me to accept that "WRs are more valuable assets due to longevity".
i still tend to think the value of anything is rated to supply & demand.
Andrew74
Footballguy
Tell your friend it's okay. I'd do the same if he were on my team. No need to be ashamed of man-love.I agree, too early to anoint him.
it's ok that I have his photo in my wallet, and occasionally take it out an kiss it though, right?
uh, asking for a friend.
The Jacket
Footballguy
https://twitter.com/BaldyNFL/status/912436631696789504
PFF elusiveness rating:
3rd place: Dalvin Cook, 60.2
2nd place: Jordan Howard, 68.1
1st place: Kareem Hunt, 158.0
PFF elusiveness rating:
3rd place: Dalvin Cook, 60.2
2nd place: Jordan Howard, 68.1
1st place: Kareem Hunt, 158.0
Football Jones
Footballguy
Hunt is a good example of why it's important to be ready to adjust your opinion of a player on the fly based on the "eyeball test" (regardless of stats). I was fairly high on Hunt & took him in the 1st round of a dynasty league, but after his performance in week 1, he shot up my rankings. It was evident in that game (at least to me), Hunt had All-Pro ability. Weeks 2 & 3 have reinforced my opinion of him.
The reason you want to adjust quickly is because it gives you an edge in trade talks instead of being slow to change your opinion & very likely being too late to acquire your target at a reasonable price. I see people recommending patience with values, but while it's safer, you typically miss out on players like Hunt. When a player shows that kind of ability, I believe you need to be aggressive.
It's inevitable Hunt will have some sub-par games, but the talent & situation is there for him to be an elite FF RB.
The reason you want to adjust quickly is because it gives you an edge in trade talks instead of being slow to change your opinion & very likely being too late to acquire your target at a reasonable price. I see people recommending patience with values, but while it's safer, you typically miss out on players like Hunt. When a player shows that kind of ability, I believe you need to be aggressive.
It's inevitable Hunt will have some sub-par games, but the talent & situation is there for him to be an elite FF RB.
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