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RB Antonio Gibson, NE (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Faust
- Start date
massraider
Footballguy
This for sure.
There's a reason young guys build up their snap counts over the season. Coaches need to trust.
massraider
Footballguy
Double
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Tanner9919
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
I have a flex PPR decision of Gibson, Joshua Kelly, Sony Michel, Jerrick McKinnon, Matt Breida.
I'm going McKinnon because JETS, but Gibson is right there.......
I'm going McKinnon because JETS, but Gibson is right there.......
I am not understanding the McKinnon hype. He scored a TD and had a handful of touches. He looked ok but it was for sure Mostert's backfield (at least for one week). Until I see more consistent usage I would be worried that if he didn't get a TD it's a lost day.
rockaction
Footballguy
I watched the SF game and it seemed like we saw McKinnon quite a bit after Mostert got stuffed on fourth and one at the goal line. Mostert looks like he might be the 49ers back to own between the twenties, McKinnon or WIlson when they're in the red zone.
rockaction
Footballguy
But Gibson. I didn't get a chance to see the game. Regardless, it doesn't matter where you've drafted a guy; it's who is playing more and playing better. You've got to be ready to cut bait if it looks like a guy has lost his job or add if a guy looks to have command.
massraider
Footballguy
Had a couple carries but 5 targets. None of the others had a catch. He could be involved in the passing game all game long, AND get garbage touches v Jets. I'm not hyped for McKinnon, but there's a path to 10 points pretty easily in PPR.
rockaction
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
massraider
Footballguy
True, but he wasn't on that group of players I listed above that I was choosing from for my flex.
I would choose Mostert over Gibson, for the record.
Buck Bradcanon
Footballguy
I don't think we can reasonably start Gibson until we see more usage and production, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if that happens this week.
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Insoxicated
In Deeper PPR leagues he's an upside start, but agreed for the most part.
I think we're looking at a 9-10 pt median... probably a 6-8pt floor, and an outside chance at a 15-20pt game in PPR (ie breaks big rush/catch, and gets in the endzone).
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massraider
Footballguy
If he makes bonehead rookie mistakes, he could slink off to the bench, but I simply don't see enough juice in this offense that they cannot give an explosive player looks. Logan Thomas is a great example. He is not a great TE. But they have one WR worth a darn, and Thomas can move. So Logan is a thing right now.
Haskins hasn't shown he's going to win games by himself yet, so he needs guys like Thomas and Gibson to take safe passes to unsafe places. Barber can't do that. McLaurin can't have 20 targets a game can he? (well, maybe)
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Topic title writer needs to take a deep breath. 
ATB
Footballguy
Yep, I get that. And that's not what I'm trying to say. Point is that, unless Gibson lives up to that 5th round draft pedigree, I'm going to be thin at the flex. It's going to be a constant debate on whether to close my eyes and say a prayer by flexing him or drawing a name out of a hat from my other bench and WW options. Because of that fact, it's hard to be pleased with that Week 1 performance.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Gibson recently traded for Fuller in my league.
i had an offer to the Fuller owner of a 2022 1st and he decided he’d rather have Gibson.
i think he overpaid, personally. But that’s a trade that recently happened.
mcintyre1
Footballguy
Probably a bit less than that? Hard to say with rookie picks, though. Certainly wouldn't get him with a 2nd. I got him for Gallup just before the season.
rockaction
Footballguy
My bad. I thought you were talking about SF backs as a group. Not the group you listed.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Oh lort, are our posts going on our permanent record?
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
rockaction
Footballguy
People just paid seconds for him in rookie drafts when he was behind Guice, Love, and Peterson. How is he decreasing? He's worth a one or high two and people won't talk until then.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
We all value players differently. I said what I think he’s worth. I doubt his owner would accept such an offer from me, but I think Love is a good RB who could cause disruption, and I’m not that high on the Washington TBDs regardless.
i’m not saying his value is decreasing. I’m saying what I’d be willing to pay. And dude didn’t exactly light the world on fire week 1.
rockaction
Footballguy
Yeah, but then it's all relativistic and there's no point in discussion. I'm talking general consensus. He's at about Henry Ruggs's value on Dynasty League Football, so he's around a first or early second at worst. This is consistent with both other calcs and experience. And don't bother picking fights with the calcs; this one just reflects ADP and value per startups over a myriad of websites.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
See above: someone in my dynasty had a choice of my 2022 1st (likely a mid-to-late) or Gibson for Fuller. He opted to go with Gibson.
That's a bit more in line with what you're looking for I believe.
massraider
Footballguy
https://twitter.com/BenStandig/status/1306342615940562945?s=19
From the offensive coordinator:
On Antonio Gibson:
"His role will continue to grow"
On Peyton Barber snap count:
"We ran the ball to kill clock at the end.. that's why his snap count was so high"
Seems like Gibson will be given more volume each passing game, and that negative scripts will favor him more.
From the offensive coordinator:
On Antonio Gibson:
"His role will continue to grow"
On Peyton Barber snap count:
"We ran the ball to kill clock at the end.. that's why his snap count was so high"
Seems like Gibson will be given more volume each passing game, and that negative scripts will favor him more.
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
LINK VideoDavis Mattek@DavisMattek
The All-22 of every Antonio Gibson touch from his rookie debut against the Eagles
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Not trying to harsh anyone’s mellow here, but I’m kind of not very impressed by anything I just watched.
Davis Mattek@DavisMattek
The All-22 of every Antonio Gibson touch from his rookie debut against the Eagles
Very little burst to the outside, most of those runs went for not much.
on his longest run at the 1:00 mark - he had great blocking with a hole you could drive a truck through, and then he tripped over his own blocker, or he coulda easily had 10 more yards. I question his vision there.
Fluid receiver, but ball placement kinda set him up to be hit early - he didn’t do much to miss many tackles though. One play he made the 1st guy miss, but otherwise...
Stuffed in his carry inside the 5.
What am I not seeing with Gibson that others seem to be seeing? Is it merely that he has opportunity? Is the Eagles run D so good that I should be impressed with what he managed to do here?
Help me understand the Gibson love. I’m perplexed.
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Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
You might want to take another look.Not trying to harsh anyone’s mellow here, but I’m kind of not very impressed by anything I just watched.
Very little burst to the outside, most of those runs went for not much.
on his longest run at the 1:00 mark - he had great blocking with a hole you could drive a truck through, and then he tripped over his own blocker, or he coulda easily had 10 more yards. I question his vision there.
Fluid receiver, but ball placement kinda set him up to be hit early - he didn’t do much to miss many tackles though. One play he made the 1st guy miss, but otherwise...
Stuffed in his carry inside the 5.
What am I not seeing with Gibson that others seem to be seeing? Is it merely that he has opportunity? Is the Eagles run D so good that I should be impressed with what he managed to do here?
Help me understand the Gibson love. I’m perplexed.
- 1st touch - carry - hole closed he hit it and got as much as it gave
- 2nd touch - carry - defender was in the backfield and had him before he got the ball
- 3rd touch - reception - QB lead him where he had to stretch out hand (made excellent grab) defender right in front of him, he shoulder faked him and hopped up over him and got past him but three DBs came up and took him down
- 4th touch - carry - the slide hole started to open but just as he made the cut it engulfed him, he 'could' have cut it outside but his RT got stood up and pushed back so it wasn't good blocking
- 5th touch - carry - WR seals off his DB inside, the TE in motion is supposed to lead but the unblocked DE doesn't bite and come inside he takes an outside rush and nearly runs into the TE who has to side-step him and loses momentum and misses the S who has the angle on Antonio who wanted to take it outside but had to cut inside
- 6th touch - carry - good run that he got more than the blocking allowed
- 7th touch - carry - long run where he showed good/excellent burst to take it outside his WR legs were all over the place as he struggled to make a high block, a defender has the inside angle so he had to cut outside but came up on the WR too quickly and had his arm up to steady before making the cut when the WRs leg came back, he could not see since he had his eyes up and would have beaten the DB but his toe hit the WRs leg, the run leading up to that point showed excellent burst and speed to the outside
- 8th touch - reception - outside dump where DBs had the angle and he took it out as far as allowed
- 9th touch - GL carry - RG got stood/blown up as three defenders swallowed him up at the LOS, no chance
- 10th touch - carry - wide but shallow hole, he got as much as allowed
- 11th touch - carry - awkward handoff where Haskins nearly bumped into Antonio, not sure if it was Antonio's fault or the QB but a slight hesitation, two defenders had him dead outside he was able to stop and bounce back inside where he got a 'lil' bit but still trapped in the backfield
Take another look. See if you agree.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I watched it three times.
I could not possibly disagree with this more. I mean, I agree with the parts were the offensive line didn’t do him many favors, but he certainly didn’t do himself any either. A lot of this sounds like Rose-colored glasses for a mediocre performance.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I think this is among the most realistic/accurate posts in here: he’s not great, but he’s the best RB Washington has.
I wish I could see what Love can do, but I guess he’s not healthy enough to play?
WAS needs to stop calling that stretch play, because he can’t get to the outside.
Either the Eagles fun D is super underrated, or the WAS OL is truly awful, or Gibson isn’t that great. Or some combination. The only good I saw on that montage was:
1. He made one good cut. Still a short gain.
2. He made 1 defender miss after a catch, got clobbered 1 yard later.
3. He held on to the ball after 2 throws that set him up to get crushed.
otherwise, meh.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I don’t get why they released Peterson if they were going to give slow mo Peyton Barber so much work.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’m interested in that as well.
I’m not saying he can’t be better than what I just saw, I just didn’t see much that made me sit up in my chain and go “wow, this kid is special!”
Maybe I’m more critical or maybe I just expected to see more after all the hype.
He has a job - that’s worth something in FF. It’ll be interesting to see how his season goes.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
I think for some reason you are missing some special things and I don't know why but he's definitely not 'meh' in my estimation. I see some special things.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Maybe you’re more optimistic about what you’re seeing.
Time will tell. It’s a small sample size. But at the end of the day we both watched a video that was 11 touches for under 40 rushing yards with 2 receptions that went nowhere. And not to be the “if not for that long run” guy, but if not for that long run where he tripped over a teammate in the open field, he would have had closer to 2 YPC than the 4 he had.
I remain unconvinced. I am not closed minded nor am I making a definitive statement about ROS. But on that video I saw very little to get excited about.
-jb-
Footballguy
...and of not for that trip, we’re looking at another 10-20 yards.Maybe you’re more optimistic about what you’re seeing.
Time will tell. It’s a small sample size. But at the end of the day we both watched a video that was 11 touches for under 40 rushing yards with 2 receptions that went nowhere. And not to be the “if not for that long run” guy, but if not for that long run where he tripped over a teammate in the open field, he would have had closer to 2 YPC than the 4 he had.
I remain unconvinced. I am not closed minded nor am I making a definitive statement about ROS. But on that video I saw very little to get excited about.
jk
we have very little to go off of right now. Today will give us a much better understanding
candian fantasy guy
Footballguy
FYI, I am not playing against him over 12 leagues, guaranteed dud coming up, I will let you know when I get a high frequency week. 
Alex P Keaton
Footballguy
Yeah, that seems like a fair and balanced take overall. Logical and unemotional. We probably need more of that in this thread.Maybe you’re more optimistic about what you’re seeing.
Time will tell. It’s a small sample size. But at the end of the day we both watched a video that was 11 touches for under 40 rushing yards with 2 receptions that went nowhere. And not to be the “if not for that long run” guy, but if not for that long run where he tripped over a teammate in the open field, he would have had closer to 2 YPC than the 4 he had.
I remain unconvinced. I am not closed minded nor am I making a definitive statement about ROS. But on that video I saw very little to get excited about.
It’s also worth noting that without that long run, he still would have had a higher ypc than Peyton Barber, who is really his only competition until Bryce Love is healthy.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I don’t disagree with this at all.
and your statement was spot on - he left ~10 yards on the field with that trip. I re-watched that play a dozen times to see how/why he tripped and I still have no explanation. Some players have a feel for where other bodies are - peripheral vision matters. Again - only one play. I’m not gonna make a blanket statement on that sample size. But it wasn’t a good look.
-jb-
Footballguy
IMHO that was a rookie/patience thing. In college, these kids have just needed to run as fast as they could once they hit the second level. Now they need to demonstrate the same patience that got them there. I’m not concerned about that at all.
KingPrawn
Footballguy
I think we'll know more but we still won't know all. He's a rookie in the NFL with no pre-season games and making the switch from a WR to a primary ball carrier. The Washington coaches have said they want to bring him along slowly. Patience is the key here. I don't think we'll know all there is to know until week 5-6 IMHO.
Morton Muffley
Footballguy
I own him and felt equally unimpressed watching the games live last week. He runs like a WR taking an end-around. By that I mean, he seems to lack patience and vision...he's too fast to attack where the hole SHOULD be. I know he USED to be a WR and I hope he can slow down just a bit, but in his first game he seemed to play a little too fast for his own good.Not trying to harsh anyone’s mellow here, but I’m kind of not very impressed by anything I just watched.
Very little burst to the outside, most of those runs went for not much.
on his longest run at the 1:00 mark - he had great blocking with a hole you could drive a truck through, and then he tripped over his own blocker, or he coulda easily had 10 more yards. I question his vision there.
Fluid receiver, but ball placement kinda set him up to be hit early - he didn’t do much to miss many tackles though. One play he made the 1st guy miss, but otherwise...
Stuffed in his carry inside the 5.
What am I not seeing with Gibson that others seem to be seeing? Is it merely that he has opportunity? Is the Eagles run D so good that I should be impressed with what he managed to do here?
Help me understand the Gibson love. I’m perplexed.
