voiceofunreason
Footballguy
I can't see him going much before the 5th either and the cowboys are definitely a good bet to grab him. Bengals are another team. Not sure many others (maybe the eagles?) will take him off waivers.
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Joe Mixon's lawyers release video of RB punching female student in '14 (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Concept Coop
- Start date
jabarony
Footballguy
JFS171
Footballguy
I mentioned this in the 2017 Draft Prospects thread, but just last year Seattle and KC drafted dudes with just as big (if not bigger) off-field red flags.
Mixon punched a girl when he was 18 -- no condoning that whatsoever. Horrible, terrible, inexcusable. However, he was 18 years old, he was being antagonized (and he was antagonizing too), and he wasn't convicted of anything in the eyes of the law, given the female in this case was also guilty of assault (again, in the eyes of the law).
In 2015, Frank Clark was drafted in the 2nd round by the Seattle Seahawks. Afterwards, articles like this, and like this, and like this, and many others popped up all over, saying the Seahawks didn't care that Clark punched a woman. Their hometown paper even accused the Seahawks of not talking to witnesses, which the team later confirmed, saying they only spoke to Frank Clark. In November of 2014 Clark beat up his girlfriend in a hotel room, was arrested, kicked off the Michigan football team, and later took a plea deal. That didn't hold back the Seahawks from making him a 2nd rounder in the draft occurring just six months later.
Then last year, the Chiefs drafted Tyreek Hill in the 5th round. In December of 2014, Hill got in a fight with his pregnant girlfriend over text messages, allegedly choked her and punched her in the stomach. He was immediately kicked off the OSU football team and track & field team. In March of 2015, word came out he would stand trial for domestic violence charges. In August of 2015, he plead guilty, and as part of the deal was given 3 years probation, mandatory counseling, and a few other hurdles. He was no longer enrolled at OSU, and instead enrolled and played at West Alabama Gulf University in 2015. None of that stopped the Chiefs from drafting him. in 2016.
Mixon, by comparison, faced extenuating circumstances (it wasn't his girlfriend and some lover's spat -- he was being antagonized as well, was pushed, and was slapped). The female accuser didn't even want the surveillance video released (likely because it showed her playing a role). The courts didn't have enough to convict him as she was also *LEGALLY* guilty of assault. In a plea deal, Mixon was given a deferred sentence of 1-year probation (I believe), community service, and counseling. He *WASN'T* kicked off the team at OU or kicked out of school like Clark and Hill. His incident occurred 2 years ago, though the video just surfaced. Mixon has since kept his nose clean, played extremely well, including last week's 180+ yard, 5-reception, 2 TD Sugar Bowl performance, and positioned himself as an elite talent.
There's no way I buy that a league willing to draft Frank Clark 6 months after beating up his girlfriend and being kicked off his college team, AND a league willing to draft Tyreek Hill who likewise plead guilty and likewise was kicked off his school's team 18 months prior to being drafted, won't give Joe Mixon a 2nd chance for an incident that occurred more than 2 years ago and had legally mitigating circumstances involved... not after the talent he's displayed on the field.
I'll be floored if Mixon isn't drafted.
Mixon punched a girl when he was 18 -- no condoning that whatsoever. Horrible, terrible, inexcusable. However, he was 18 years old, he was being antagonized (and he was antagonizing too), and he wasn't convicted of anything in the eyes of the law, given the female in this case was also guilty of assault (again, in the eyes of the law).
In 2015, Frank Clark was drafted in the 2nd round by the Seattle Seahawks. Afterwards, articles like this, and like this, and like this, and many others popped up all over, saying the Seahawks didn't care that Clark punched a woman. Their hometown paper even accused the Seahawks of not talking to witnesses, which the team later confirmed, saying they only spoke to Frank Clark. In November of 2014 Clark beat up his girlfriend in a hotel room, was arrested, kicked off the Michigan football team, and later took a plea deal. That didn't hold back the Seahawks from making him a 2nd rounder in the draft occurring just six months later.
Then last year, the Chiefs drafted Tyreek Hill in the 5th round. In December of 2014, Hill got in a fight with his pregnant girlfriend over text messages, allegedly choked her and punched her in the stomach. He was immediately kicked off the OSU football team and track & field team. In March of 2015, word came out he would stand trial for domestic violence charges. In August of 2015, he plead guilty, and as part of the deal was given 3 years probation, mandatory counseling, and a few other hurdles. He was no longer enrolled at OSU, and instead enrolled and played at West Alabama Gulf University in 2015. None of that stopped the Chiefs from drafting him. in 2016.
Mixon, by comparison, faced extenuating circumstances (it wasn't his girlfriend and some lover's spat -- he was being antagonized as well, was pushed, and was slapped). The female accuser didn't even want the surveillance video released (likely because it showed her playing a role). The courts didn't have enough to convict him as she was also *LEGALLY* guilty of assault. In a plea deal, Mixon was given a deferred sentence of 1-year probation (I believe), community service, and counseling. He *WASN'T* kicked off the team at OU or kicked out of school like Clark and Hill. His incident occurred 2 years ago, though the video just surfaced. Mixon has since kept his nose clean, played extremely well, including last week's 180+ yard, 5-reception, 2 TD Sugar Bowl performance, and positioned himself as an elite talent.
There's no way I buy that a league willing to draft Frank Clark 6 months after beating up his girlfriend and being kicked off his college team, AND a league willing to draft Tyreek Hill who likewise plead guilty and likewise was kicked off his school's team 18 months prior to being drafted, won't give Joe Mixon a 2nd chance for an incident that occurred more than 2 years ago and had legally mitigating circumstances involved... not after the talent he's displayed on the field.
I'll be floored if Mixon isn't drafted.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
He will be gone before the 5th, but I don't understand why if he falls to the 5th how only 2 teams would be a sure bet to grab him? Why wouldn't a team take a flier on a good talent such as him for such a low investment? If there's a RB in round 4, 5, 6 who can turn out to be a huge steal why wouldn't I grab him? Because of one mistake 2 years ago? As far as the rest of us know, the 2 years since he has been out of trouble. Maybe you're throwing teams out there who take chances on guys with jaded pasts... but it's not like he shot himself in the leg illegally carrying a firearm in a nightclub and was arrested a dozen times.
I would honestly be surprised if he slipped past rounds 3-4. I'd be very excited if my team drafted him round 3 or lower... talk about a potential steal
A good comparison would be Laremy Tunsil. The day of the draft a video surfaced of him smoking pot 2 years prior in the gas mask. I believe Mixon was projected as a 1-2nd round talent without this incident. Tunsil was projected as a top pick in the draft. He dropped to 13... Granted, pot and striking a woman are two completely different offenses, but it stands to reason that it only takes 1 team to look at it and say, yeah it was 2 years ago and he's been clean, we are getting great value here. Some teams took Tunsil off their draft board entirely. And that's fine. Many teams have taken Mixon off their draft board entirely I'm sure. But there are 32 teams... only takes one...
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Rational or not, fair or not, the existence of a video of the incident makes it "worse" in terms of PR. It will never be out of sight, out of mind. The media can remind people with it at any time. Opposing fans (and some dissenting homers) will keep it popping up on social media constantly. It's just a whole different level of distraction/PR nightmare. And if he does it again, that footage will be there to haunt whoever took a shot on him, too.
He needs to hope he's invited to the combine, he needs to hope he gets in front of all those reporters, coaches, and front office guys on the media day, and he has to have the most open/honest/remorseful press conference of his life. He's gotta own it and show he's an enlightened, changed man on a much bigger stage.
He needs to hope he's invited to the combine, he needs to hope he gets in front of all those reporters, coaches, and front office guys on the media day, and he has to have the most open/honest/remorseful press conference of his life. He's gotta own it and show he's an enlightened, changed man on a much bigger stage.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Actually he had a really worrying, immature episode much more recently that kinda gave us a red flag that he still has anger issues or at least very bad judgement in the limelight. He had a verbal altercation with a meter maid or a traffic cop and tore up his parking ticket in their face. I'm pretty sure that's what happened.
It's a weird footnote on anyone else's scouting report but this is a dude who was supposed to be walking the line on his best behavior and he couldn't help himself.
I love his talent but that's worrisome.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
No, not anything concrete. Seems people in the media aren't taking it as a given which is all I have to go on right now.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Yes this would be something that would raise my eyebrows I suppose. Nothing major but something to note.
Interseptopus
Footballguy
He isn't a senior... so the only requirement would be if he is able to "satisfy all NCAA and NFL requirements are eligible to participate. Whatever that means
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JFS171
Footballguy
Can't see this one either -- dude gets a first round grade from the Draft Advisory Council, then doesn't get a combine invite? That would be truly shocking.
Again... this is the here and now and he just declared, and this video is a big deal... in 5 months, who knows? It'll be mentioned on draft day, like it was for Clark and Hill, and then it'll be forgotten. Does anyone remember that Dede Westbrook had two assault charges prior to coming to OU (which almost wrecked his scholarship offer)? Nope.
Hankmoody
Footballguy
Neither of those had video which will be played over and over leading up to the draft. After what happened to Ray Rice I can't believe anyone is dismissing the importance of this. Dude went from a 2 game suspension to outcast overnight. You really think Hill is even on an NFL roster if there's a video of him punching a pregnant woman in the midsection? C'mon man.
JFS171
Footballguy
I don't mean to dismiss the importance of this, and I get that video adds a different layer to this than no video, but at the end of the day I still bet he gets drafted.
ETA - the presence of the video (and their own admission that their punishment may not have been sufficient) didn't cause OU to pull him off the field for the Sugar Bowl. My guess is he's eventually drafted, the team admits to his past transgressions, says Joe convinced them in pre-draft interviews that he's a changed man, it was a mistake, etc. I'd bet his OU coaches speak favorably towards Joe, as do his teammates, and this eventually goes away.
I get the Ray Rice comparison given the presence of video in both instances. In one, a 27 YO man cold cocks his fiancé in a domestic dispute, then drags her by the hair from the elevator. In another an 18-YO is pushed and slapped before punching a girl. I'm not condoning or excusing the actions, but to me those two incidents are different. Plus Ray Rice had just sucked through an entire NFL season... lack of talent + off-field issues + age is a problematic equation. TALENT + off-field issues is something someone will take advantage of.
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Concept Coop
Footballguy
I think you're right. I expected the initial backlash would last longer, but it's already fading. People move on.
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
The initial backlash took off like wild fire. Within minutes of its release it was on every fantasy site, every news and sports outlet and all the radio shows were talking about it. The initial blast was second to none, to the point were everyone including Mixon thought he would return to school. Now it sounds like when he got the news of his 1st round grade he made his final decision. Like you said it's fading away just as fast as it came.
Tex
Interseptopus
Footballguy
Comparing Ray Rice to Mixon is comparing apples to oranges. Both fruit but very different. Ray Rice's issue was at the forefront of an NFL PR nightmare of violence against women. Both scenarios were VERY different in what happened. Ray Rice was an existing NFL employee. Mixon was not. Ray Rice was near the END of his career of significance, Mixon is just budding. No one wanted to take a chance on Ray Rice a year after his incident because he was old and likely wouldn't make the cut anyways, therefore not worth any kind of PR fallout that would happen. Plus his video was WAY more egregious IMO. ADP was suspended for a season and was welcomed back with open arms. Child abuse is worse than spousal abuse IMO.
To add: Mixon is worth any PR issues that come with this for a few reason:
1. He comes a little cheaper than he should and his upside is incredible
2. Any questions to the GM about this the GM can say it happened 2 years ago we are moving on, but we do not tolerate that here if it were to happen while he was on this team
3. If he is successful and stays out of trouble then this entire incident is moot; no one will be talking about it and no one will care. Now if he gets out of hand again, then yes this is blasted all over the place.
It's all up to Mixon at this point
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JFS171
Footballguy
We may actually look back on this and see it as a brilliant move by Mixon and his team to get it out when he did. The media gets their field day, the university takes some heat, Mixon gets questioned about it. Bottom line - it's in the open, the NFL is aware of it, the media is aware of it. Mixon can display contrition and say, "I screwed up as an 18 YO, accepted my punishment from the State and my university, and I grew up."
He's got two years of excellent game tape and a very, very bright future on the field. At this point, as long as he keeps his nose clean, this will be forgiven and forgotten.
Concept Coop
Footballguy
I think the court forced their hand, as they were going to unseal it. But good timing none the less. Best case scenario for OU (which feels dirty). Had they released it right away, I think they'd have caved to the pressure to kick him off the team.
When the video was first released, I didn't think he'd get drafted. One football game later, I'm guessing a team takes a chance in the 3rd maybe.
JFS171
Footballguy
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
I have to agree with Brew you never ever hit a women unless she has a deadly weapon but to think she isn't wrong is nuts. I'm not sure what he said but just like you never hit a women any person should act like a lunatic over a word. Lets not act like he was there for 20 minutes calling her names.
Yeah it is. At best, this guy will get one chance and one chance only. There won't even be a leash. Whoever drafts him will make sure to let him know that so it's up to. I expect him to get drafted mainly because Hill got drafted and he did the same without a video, in fact worse. He punched a pregnant woman in the stomach.
Milkman
Footballguy
#1 in PPR
He's been the most impressive RB tape I've seen so far this year. Of course with the off the field stuff he falls to #2 but I can't see taking Dalvin Cook in front of him ever. He reminds me of LeVeon Bell after he lost all that weight.
Hooper31
Footballguy
I find these moral outrage stories interesting. I tend to lean on the not passing judgment side. I don't know what was said. I don't know what happened leading up to the incident. Maybe that would change my opinion in some way. That said, trying to size up an entire person in what happens over a few drunk seconds is lame to the nth degree.
I do know that some people are going to look to punish this kid over and over because it was caught on video. Yes, he punched a girl. Yes, it was a stupid thing to do. But now what? He can't have job in the NFL? Well, does that mean he can never hold a job for life? If he can, is it only some specific field that society deems is appropriate? I guess I view this for the moment as a non-story unless he does something else similar again. And really, if something happens it will get ignored eventually if he's a talent.
Rambling pyschobabble thoughts? Do people who want to punish the crap out of this guy because of their own personal guilt for things they've done? Do people like me want to let it go because our own personal guilt for bad things I've done? Where does all this moral outrage or lack of it come from? IDK...
I do know that some people are going to look to punish this kid over and over because it was caught on video. Yes, he punched a girl. Yes, it was a stupid thing to do. But now what? He can't have job in the NFL? Well, does that mean he can never hold a job for life? If he can, is it only some specific field that society deems is appropriate? I guess I view this for the moment as a non-story unless he does something else similar again. And really, if something happens it will get ignored eventually if he's a talent.
Rambling pyschobabble thoughts? Do people who want to punish the crap out of this guy because of their own personal guilt for things they've done? Do people like me want to let it go because our own personal guilt for bad things I've done? Where does all this moral outrage or lack of it come from? IDK...
He became an outcast because he couldn't play anymore. Doesn't matter what Mixon did because he's an enormous talent. That's all that matters to those boys, no matter what they say.
steelers1080
Footballguy
Are there any good compilation videos of his runs/touches this year? Need to see more tape on him but what I've seen looks really good (on the field).
ZWK
Footballguy
FUBAR
Footballguy
Generally, I'm in favor of second chances. Especially when the mistake, as bad as it is, was as a teenager. I happen to work in a field where you get fired for this behavior, or spend some time in jail, but these are slightly different circumstances. a 27 year old doing this - the employer should fire him and he should spend some time in jail. An 18 year old? Community service, education, and get the kid a positive mentor or three.
Football Jones
Footballguy
Mixon screwed up big-time. I would be appalled if my son had done this. However, I'd hate to think we can't give 18-year olds second chances under these circumstances. He was just out of high school & had turned 18 a month or so before the incident. Some things don't derseve second chances. Murder, rape, & a few other reprehensible acts I can think of, especially to children. Not that assault isn't one of them depending on the circumstances, but when you put everything together like age & situation, I believe he deserves a second chance.
The thing that makes a big difference to me is Mixon wasn't the original aggressor. He retaliated, but it's not like he sought her out. She motioned for him to come to the table, got in his face, & assaulted him (technically). Mixon had turned to walk away before she became aggressive. Nothing physical would've happened had she just left it at words. She has some culpability in this incident, but I actually ended up admiring her for staying at OU despite being advised to transfer. She's been the target of a lot of hate & has persevered. She seems like a nice kid who made a mistake.
Tyreek Hill's domestic abuse may actually help Mixon, although, this could still go either way. Mixon has another incident on his resume, albeit minor (tearing up a parking ticket), he must answer to & any other negative thing he does, however small, will get blown out of proportion (& rightly so). I'd be curious to find out how he comes off in interviews which could be critical to his draft stock. He's also likely going to have to stay out of trouble to keep an an NFL job so that's something to consider, as well. I believe Mixon is a late 1st/early 2nd-rounder on talent alone, but it's anybody's guess where he'll go. I think we're looking at anywhere from round 3 to a UDFA.
The thing that makes a big difference to me is Mixon wasn't the original aggressor. He retaliated, but it's not like he sought her out. She motioned for him to come to the table, got in his face, & assaulted him (technically). Mixon had turned to walk away before she became aggressive. Nothing physical would've happened had she just left it at words. She has some culpability in this incident, but I actually ended up admiring her for staying at OU despite being advised to transfer. She's been the target of a lot of hate & has persevered. She seems like a nice kid who made a mistake.
Tyreek Hill's domestic abuse may actually help Mixon, although, this could still go either way. Mixon has another incident on his resume, albeit minor (tearing up a parking ticket), he must answer to & any other negative thing he does, however small, will get blown out of proportion (& rightly so). I'd be curious to find out how he comes off in interviews which could be critical to his draft stock. He's also likely going to have to stay out of trouble to keep an an NFL job so that's something to consider, as well. I believe Mixon is a late 1st/early 2nd-rounder on talent alone, but it's anybody's guess where he'll go. I think we're looking at anywhere from round 3 to a UDFA.
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FUBAR
Footballguy
Careful with the bolded. Much like assault, circumstances are key. Not to excuse any of it, but 18yo on 16yo and drunken are different than what most people think of. Crimes, sure. Punish them, but I'll give the 18yo acting on impulse a job. Wouldn't want any of them to date my daughter.
ghostguy123
Footballguy
Not that I really care about this guy, but he can't attend the combine because he has a history of "domestic violence"?
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
good
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
We're supposed to be a society of second chances. Guy did something horrible but he was also 18 years old and went through the court system. The NFL should give him a clean slate (even if it comes with a very short leash) and not ruin someone's career over a mistake as an 18 year old.
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
They're more concerned with the bad video PR than they are about whether he's violent or not. This was always about the PR
a_rackowski
Footballguy
Delvin Cook beat a woman(although he wasnt convicted) and nobody seems to talk about it
jabarony
Footballguy
Pipes
Footballguy
There wasn't video that's why. It doesn't make it any worse but people freak out when they see something with their own eyes.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
- Mixon entered an Alford plea to a misdemeanor assault charge in October 2014 for punching a woman named Amelia Molitor in the head, causing broken bones in her face which required hospitalization and surgery. The incident happened on July 25, 2014 at Pickleman's Gourmet Cafe in Norman, on Campus Corner.
- Oklahoma suspended Mixon for one game in November 2016 after an incident involving him and a parking attendant. After receiving a parking citation, Mixon confronted the attendant, tore the citation in half, and threw the pieces, which hit her in the face. According to the incident report, he then "inched at the officer" with his vehicle "to intimidate the officer".
BigTex
Don't mess with Texas
FUBAR
Footballguy
At least in the 2016 incident he appears to have learned to not punch people. But yes, he needs to grow up and not act like a thug.
BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Threaten their life with a car. Sure that's better.
And if you threaten to hit someone with a car, not verbally but while driving, that is felony assault (or worse) where I am at (Cali). And I see it happen a couple times a year at my club.
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Biabreakable
Footballguy
RSP Film Room NO.94: RB Joe Mixon, Extended Look
I think Matt does a good job of identifying some of Mixon's strengths. He compares his playing style to DeSean Foster who was a pretty good RB and might have ad a better career if not for constantly fighting injuries it seems, as well as having to share time with other quality RBs.
Matt also shows a play where Mixon is demonstrating poor vision, which I found pretty interesting.
For all of the gushing over this guy I have read recently in this forum, I was expecting to see something more exciting when watching him than I have.
I think Matt does a good job of identifying some of Mixon's strengths. He compares his playing style to DeSean Foster who was a pretty good RB and might have ad a better career if not for constantly fighting injuries it seems, as well as having to share time with other quality RBs.
Matt also shows a play where Mixon is demonstrating poor vision, which I found pretty interesting.
For all of the gushing over this guy I have read recently in this forum, I was expecting to see something more exciting when watching him than I have.
FUBAR
Footballguy
I'm not excusing the behavior but unless you've read something here I haven't (which is entirely possible), I don't quite consider "inching forward to intimidate" equal to "threatening her life". Granted, this is just one line which may or may not be entirely accurate. Again, not saying it's okay.
I honestly don't know why I'm feeling like defending the kid, maybe it's just that he's a kid and I'm assuming facts not in evidence. Maybe I'm just hoping the best for a guy.
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BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Of course it is. You could just "ask" them to move. But instead you are plainly (and without any doubt) intimating running them over if they don't.
And his mindset already has him upset, throwing stuff in her face and then getting into his car and doing this.
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FUBAR
Footballguy
I'm starting to feel like his defense attorney, which wasn't my intention. I fully understand what you're saying. My only point in my initial response was to say that yes, he was wrong. But he did show some restraint. Doesn't mean much to some, you seem to want to put the kid in jail. Maybe he should be, maybe that's where he ends up, but I'm looking for hope for a guy who has anger issues.
I don't want my team drafting him high, but he should get a chance and I hope he does something good with it.
