(Baby Formula Shortage): Biden ADMITS He Knew Of Crisis In Early April (4/27/22 23:53 PST) (3 Viewers)

[Nugget]

I do put American's first - absolutely 

At least the pre-born. In existing Americans. 

 

[Gatorman]

The brutal irony is Americans should beg for EU food regulations

Exactly.  You know who would hate this: The US companies that make "food".  There are a ton of things we consider to be "food" in the US that the EU would not.  Now if the EU has to take the American definition of "food" there is no way they would do it. 

Now, if you want to say "anything approved in the EU has conditional approval in the US" then perhaps you are on to something.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Now, if you want to say "anything approved in the EU has conditional approval in the US" then perhaps you are on to something.

Is my mic broken or something?

 

[Whyatt]

Great question.  I've been arguing for years that we should establish (in essence) regulatory reciprocity with other developed countries whose regulatory agencies align with our own.  I don't trust Indian regulators, and neither should you.  But I do trust EU regulators.  I'm not super-familiar with their Canadian, Australian, Japanese or Korean counterparts, but those countries are all pretty solid and I would have no worries about me or my family consuming products approved for sale in those countries.

Our default rule should be that if a product is approved for sale in the EU, it should also be approved for sale in the US unless the FDA (or whoever) explicitly and affirmatively states otherwise.  Right now, these products are all banned unless the FDA specifically approves them.  We should reverse that and treat these products as approved unless the FDA specifically bans them.

That would more or less instantly solve our formula shortage.  

As I work in the drug industry this is a topic I have more than a casual level understanding.

What you are proposing is what the EU countries did. Here are some problems:

• There is zero chance the EU would reciprocate. and without reciprocity this would not be workable.
  
• While I imagine folks in this thread will snicker, the FDA is the leading regulator in the world, it would be derelict to relinquish authority in this manner
  
• The EU, because of the regulatory reciprocity across many nations, is notoriously slow moving - sound like you are not in favor of that. The UK, having just left the EU is now much more agile
  

 

[IvanKaramazov]

As I work in the drug industry this is a topic I have more than a casual level understanding.

What you are proposing is what the EU countries did. Here are some problems:

• There is zero chance the EU would reciprocate. and without reciprocity this would not be workable.
  
• While I imagine folks in this tread will snicker, the FDA is the leading regulator in the world, it would be derelict to relinquish authority in this manner
  
• The EU, because of the regulatory reciprocity across many nations, is notoriously slow moving - sound like you are not in favor of that. The UK, having just left the EU is now much more agile
  

Thanks.  

I can't really comment on the second two points, but the first is getting at something a little different than what I'm arguing for.  I don't care if the EU actually reciprocates or not.  I just want to give American consumers the option of buying products that have been approved by responsible regulators, regardless of whether those regulators are American, European, Japanese, or whatever.  I don't care what happens with European consumers in this scenario -- that's between them and their government.  

As I see it, the main "drawback" of my proposal is that it lets consumers do an end-run around the FDA when the FDA is being a stick in the mud.  That's a feature, not a bug IMO.  For example, imagine a hypothetical in which the FDA was doing something really evil, like creating an artificial shortage of infant formula because it was irrationally worried about product labeling conventions.  It would be good to let parents import infant formula from Europe so that their kids don't starve to death and so that our detention facilities don't turn into civil war POW camps, which is apparently something that we should be concerned about.  

 

[moleculo]

I'm not in favor of abandoning our regulatory authority, relegating to other countries - EU, Canada, etc.  That leads manufacturers to move production to which ever country will rubber stamp with the least amount of oversight -  a race to the bottom.  It wouldn't be long until all medicine and baby food is made in Ireland or Greece.
 

I am in favor of suspending labeling requirements as needed to stream-line import for emergency use.  I don't understand why that hasn't happened yet.

 

[dutch]

I'm not in favor of abandoning our regulatory authority, relegating to other countries - EU, Canada, etc.  That leads manufacturers to move production to which ever country will rubber stamp with the least amount of oversight -  a race to the bottom.  It wouldn't be long until all medicine and baby food is made in Ireland or Greece.
 

I am in favor of suspending labeling requirements as needed to stream-line import for emergency use.  I don't understand why that hasn't happened yet.

Sounds like it has:

https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-takes-important-steps-improve-supply-infant-and-specialty-formula-products

Expediting the necessary certificates to allow for flexibility in the movement of already permitted products from abroad into the U.S

Offering a streamlined import entry review process for certain products coming from foreign facilities with favorable inspection records. 

Exercising enforcement discretion on minor labeling issues for both domestic and imported products to help increase volume of product available as quickly as possible.

 

[Stealthycat]

At least the pre-born. In existing Americans. 

just how many of the worlds 3 billion in poverty would it take coming into the USA illegally to give you any worries at all?

1 million? 5 million? 50 million? 200 million? 

 

[Gatorman]

Thanks.  

I can't really comment on the second two points, but the first is getting at something a little different than what I'm arguing for.  I don't care if the EU actually reciprocates or not.  I just want to give American consumers the option of buying products that have been approved by responsible regulators, regardless of whether those regulators are American, European, Japanese, or whatever.  I don't care what happens with European consumers in this scenario -- that's between them and their government.  

As I see it, the main "drawback" of my proposal is that it lets consumers do an end-run around the FDA when the FDA is being a stick in the mud.  That's a feature, not a bug IMO.  For example, imagine a hypothetical in which the FDA was doing something really evil, like creating an artificial shortage of infant formula because it was irrationally worried about product labeling conventions.  It would be good to let parents import infant formula from Europe so that their kids don't starve to death and so that our detention facilities don't turn into civil war POW camps, which is apparently something that we should be concerned about.  

I think a better work around is giving the president or the FDA the ability to conditionally approve something based on its being approved in another country (under some sort of "emergency power")

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I'm not in favor of abandoning our regulatory authority, relegating to other countries - EU, Canada, etc.  That leads manufacturers to move production to which ever country will rubber stamp with the least amount of oversight -  a race to the bottom.  It wouldn't be long until all medicine and baby food is made in Ireland or Greece.

This is why we're supposed to be selective about which countries' regulators we presumptively defer to.  Does the EU actually have different standards for products manufactured in Greece vs. those manufactured in Germany?  If so, I can see why that's a problem.  But then we can just impose a rule that says "If it's approved in Germany . . . " instead of "If it's approved in the EU."  

Admittedly this is a bit of a tangent featuring a policy proposal that has zero chance of being adopted any time soon, so I'll just let it go.

 

[Stealthycat]

if only there was something else to give babies other than mother's milk .... 

 

[Gatorman]

just how many of the worlds 3 billion in poverty would it take coming into the USA illegally to give you any worries at all?

1 million? 5 million? 50 million? 200 million? 

Hello Straw man!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

[Stealthycat]

Hello Straw man!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

there are REAL, negative impacts on American citizens, this is but one more example

its actually NOT what a straw man is - but good deflection off the real problem I guess

 

[moleculo]

This is why we're supposed to be selective about which countries' regulators we presumptively defer to.  Does the EU actually have different standards for products manufactured in Greece vs. those manufactured in Germany?  If so, I can see why that's a problem.  But then we can just impose a rule that says "If it's approved in Germany . . . " instead of "If it's approved in the EU."  

Admittedly this is a bit of a tangent featuring a policy proposal that has zero chance of being adopted any time soon, so I'll just let it go.

I have no idea what a regulatory framework is like in the EU.  It gets murky very quickly, and more layers of murkiness isn't really helpful. That's why I generally support our own regulatory agencies, as difficult as they can be.  

 

[Whyatt]

As I see it, the main "drawback" of my proposal is that it lets consumers do an end-run around the FDA when the FDA is being a stick in the mud.  That's a feature, not a bug IMO.  For example, imagine a hypothetical in which the FDA was doing something really evil, like creating an artificial shortage of infant formula because it was irrationally worried about product labeling conventions.  It would be good to let parents import infant formula from Europe so that their kids don't starve to death and so that our detention facilities don't turn into civil war POW camps, which is apparently something that we should be concerned about.  

Ivan, in this scenario all Food and Drugs would be approved by the EU as an end around to the FDA. One regulatory approval is easier than 2. This would essentially abandon our regulatory authority and accountability.

I wonder why you think the EU regulators are more practical, less bureaucratic. They are not.  They are more bureaucratic.

 

[Toby2ElectricBugaloo]

The government has other tools it can use to diversify our supplies of vital goods. Most prominently, the FTC could start enforcing our antitrust laws far more aggressively. It hasn't done for many years, across multiple administrations.

 

[moleculo]

Ivan, in this scenario all Food and Drugs would be approved by the EU as an end around to the FDA. One regulatory approval is easier than 2. This would essentially abandon our regulatory authority and accountability.

I wonder why you think the EU regulators are more practical, less bureaucratic. They are not.  They are more bureaucratic.

this is consistent with my experience as well.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Ivan, in this scenario all Food and Drugs would be approved by the EU as an end around to the FDA. One regulatory approval is easier than 2. This would essentially abandon our regulatory authority and accountability.

I wonder why you think the EU regulators are more practical, less bureaucratic. They are not.  They are more bureaucratic.

I was arguing in favor of products needing FDA approval or EU approval.  One or the other, not both.

 

[Whyatt]

I was arguing in favor of products needing FDA approval or EU approval.  One or the other, not both.

With approval comes an ongoing relationship with the regulator, including audits as well as other filed reports and dialog. 

Here's another angle. It's not customary for a regulator to inspect a facility that doesn't supply the country, so a manufacturer could avoid this unpleasant and "risk" event by filing with the EU but only selling to the US. 

All of this is inside baseball stuff, things you probably didn't consider when you brought this interesting option up. I'm pushing back a bit as thought I could add to the discussion. 

I also have an opinion on whether or not the executives should be jailed because they elected to buy back stock instead of building a new facility, but that's not nearly as interesting to discuss IMO.  

 

[ekbeats]

Holy cow.  I just heard a segment on the baby food shortage and it sounds like a complete case of mismanagement by the Biden Administration.  Shouldn't they have anticipated this problem last Fall when the baby food plant in Michigan issue occurred?  Then Biden doesn't even take accountability for it, and sounds pissed that he has to address it because it's "on the front pages".  This Administration is completely incompetent.

 

[GordonGekko]

We have a responsibility to feed those we detain. That includes criminals in prison, migrants at the border, and anyone else we have locked away. If we don’t have the resources to feed them, then we have to let them go. Period. 
 

Direct Headline: CBS's Margaret Brennan presses Buttigieg on baby formula shortage: 'Why has it taken so long?'

"I know the president said more action is coming, but this has been ongoing for months. There were supply chain issues already, then you have issues with this one plant, Abbott. Whistleblower in September, February the recall. It's May, why has it taken so long and why did the president on Friday seem to say it was new information to him?" Brennan asked, quoting Biden's comments from May 13.....The president said that had they been "better mind readers," they could have acted on the shortage earlier....The transportation secretary said that America was a "capitalist country" and that "the government does not make baby formula, nor should it. Companies make formula."....  Buttigieg said the Biden administration acted from "day one,"....

By Hanna Panreck May 15, 2022 3:51pm EDT

https://www.foxnews.com/media/cbss-margaret-brennan-buttigieg-baby-formula-shortage

VIDEO: Buttigieg says Biden administration working to end baby formula shortage May 15, 2022   Face the Nation

Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg says the Biden administration is working to ramp up production of baby formula, and stressed that a major plant needs to get back up and running safely.

https://youtu.be/uUQF1emFcOA?t=106

VIDEO: Pete Buttigieg: Paid Family Leave Is ‘Not A Vacation’ Oct 17, 2021 NBC News

Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg tells Meet the Press that paid family leave remains a priority for the White House, despite reports that it may be dropped from the Democrats' domestic spending bill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFEa9BsELAQ

VIDEO: Pete Buttigieg Says People Upset With Near-Record Gas Prices Should Buy An Electric Vehicle Mar 7, 2022

President Joe Biden’s Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg said people upset with near-record gas prices should buy an electric vehicle, during his remarks at the White House on infrastructure on 3/7/2022.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2QSm91Rwmc

*******

Or never let them into the country in the first place.

You conveniently ignore that issue entirely.

I know there are "Mayor Pete" fans here but he's gotten himself into some long term self inflicted toxic media narratives here. Margaret Brennan refuses to let up on Buttigieg about the baby formula crisis because she understands her core audience base and looking even slightly complicit in the normal Biden Administration condescending double talk/gaslighting routine would only hurt her own individual brand.

Everything Buttigieg is saying here about baby formula is going to work against him if he runs for POTUS 2024.

The "We're Set", in terms of talking about his own children and baby formula is going to haunt him.

That it dovetails into his bizarre "Paid Family Leave is really work" angle will also brutalize him in a general election cycle.

Mentioning people without cars who can't search for baby formula non stop only hurts him with all his tone deaf "Just Buy A EV" comments with massive inflation, no practical widespread EV infrastructure in the US in place and a long period where buying any car was difficult/expensive.

Whatever gains the Democratic Party made on the abortion issue with suburban women voters was lost three fold over with this baby formula crisis.

Obama/Biden/Harris/Rice is so toxic right now, they dragged Mayor Pete into the cesspool with them and destroyed him as a political asset. Which is actually pretty horrible for Team Blue. They desperately need Buttigieg in a positive light for their long term future with down the road election cycles.

Susan Rice believed she should have been VPOTUS. And she made sure anyone who had the job (Harris) or might be given half the ticket in the future ( Whitmer, Buttigieg) were going to be punished no matter the overall damage to the Party brand.

If any of you love Mayor Pete, you should give him a bucket of water and tell him to throw it on Susan Rice to see if she starts melting and then he can have a chance to salvage his political career.

 

[Stealthycat]

During an inspection that spanned multiple dates in January, February and March, FDA investigators found Cronobacter sakazakii bacteria in several areas inside the plant.

Additionally, the FDA's review of company records found that Abbott had detected Cronobacter bacteria in finished formula batches produced in 2019 and 2020.

In preliminary findings, the FDA reported that Abbott did not establish a system of process controls covering all stages of processing to prevent contamination of formula with microoganisms and that all surfaces that touched the infant formula were maintained to prevent contamination.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/16/health/abbott-formula-shortage/index.html

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK

That's what people want to give their babies?   

 

[belljr]

Holy cow.  I just heard a segment on the baby food shortage and it sounds like a complete case of mismanagement by the Biden Administration.  Shouldn't they have anticipated this problem last Fall when the baby food plant in Michigan issue occurred?  Then Biden doesn't even take accountability for it, and sounds pissed that he has to address it because it's "on the front pages".  This Administration is completely incompetent.

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing - how is the white house responsible for baby formula production?   I'm generally asking - I don't know enough to have an opinion one way or the other......

 

[Max Power]

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/16/health/abbott-formula-shortage/index.html

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEK

That's what people want to give their babies?   

It's FDA approved, so you know its good.

 

[Toby2ElectricBugaloo]

If anyone here needs formula and is having issues locating it, the NYT's Wirecutter (usually consumer reviews) is keeping a running list of places to buy and order it here.  And again, if the group here can do anything at all to help please tell us! You can DM me if you don't want to say anything in the thread 

 

[The Commish]

WTF has happened to my alleged "capitalists" around this place?  I'm not sure if anyone's noticed, but every single time (in recent memory) an industry, company etc has fallen on it's face, the response is "why did the government let this happen!??!?!?!?!"  Really?  Can't have it both ways here guys.  Either let the industry be the industry and lay blame appropriately at their feet or drop the "capitalist" moniker you claim to support and replace it with the more appropriate "socialist" moniker.

I'm speaking to both sides of this coin....it's absurd.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

WTF has happened to my alleged "capitalists" around this place?  I'm not sure if anyone's noticed, but every single time (in recent memory) an industry, company etc has fallen on it's face, the response is "why did the government let this happen!??!?!?!?!"  Really?  Can't have it both ways here guys.  Either let the industry be the industry and lay blame appropriately at their feet or drop the "capitalist" moniker you claim to support and replace it with the more appropriate "socialist" moniker.

I'm speaking to both sides of this coin....it's absurd.

I'm a capitalist who supports free trade.  As far as I can tell, this shortage exists primarily because the government is blocking American consumers from buying formula sold in the EU, which nobody seriously argues is any way unsafe or risky or anything.  

So yeah, I do see this as an example of government failure.

 

[Toby2ElectricBugaloo]

WTF has happened to my alleged "capitalists" around this place?  I'm not sure if anyone's noticed, but every single time (in recent memory) an industry, company etc has fallen on it's face, the response is "why did the government let this happen!??!?!?!?!"  Really?  Can't have it both ways here guys.  Either let the industry be the industry and lay blame appropriately at their feet or drop the "capitalist" moniker you claim to support and replace it with the more appropriate "socialist" moniker.

I'm speaking to both sides of this coin....it's absurd.

The argument, I believe, is that the government "forced" them to voluntarily close the plant. Which has a bit of truth to it; I'm not sure it's really a bad thing to close plants after a couple kids die to make sure everything is good, but there should have been more long term planning and I'm not sure why it's taking so long to reopen.  

Some of the board's more reasonable folks have also correctly pointed out that trade restrictions have contributed to the problem, although the Trump supporters have not joined that call because Trump is the most anti-free trade president of our lifetimes.

No comments yet as to the forces that resulted in there only being two purveyors of baby formula in the United States in the first place, or that left one of them unable to pivot after a single factory contamination.

 

[sho nuff]

I'm a capitalist who supports free trade.  As far as I can tell, this shortage exists primarily because the government is blocking American consumers from buying formula sold in the EU, which nobody seriously argues is any way unsafe or risky or anything.  

So yeah, I do see this as an example of government failure.

Didn't they ease this some early today/late last night?  Allowing some imports?

 

[The Commish]

I'm a capitalist who supports free trade.  As far as I can tell, this shortage exists primarily because the government is blocking American consumers from buying formula sold in the EU, which nobody seriously argues is any way unsafe or risky or anything.  

So yeah, I do see this as an example of government failure.

Let's put to the side for a second that we basically have two providers in this country and apparently at least ONE of them has a single point of failure (that's squarely on the companies in my view).  It's not like we didn't know what our FDA rules are on this.  Why aren't we built to abide by those rules?  It seems dishonest to lay this at the feet of the government unless we are to believe the "plan" for these companies was that if there was a problem in their US plants, they'd pivot to their EU plants and they are completely taken aback by the fact that plan is completely against the rules.

It's my understanding that the perceived shortages are because the product isn't in the places it needs to be most.  That seems like a supply chain problem.  But that's coming from a NPR segment I listened to and a reuters article I read a few days ago.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Let's put to the side for a second that we basically have two providers in this country and apparently at least ONE of them has a single point of failure (that's squarely on the companies in my view).  It's not like we didn't know what our FDA rules are on this.  Why aren't we built to abide by those rules?  It seems dishonest to lay this at the feet of the government unless we are to believe the "plan" for these companies was that if there was a problem in their US plants, they'd pivot to their EU plants and they are completely taken aback by the fact that plan is completely against the rules.

It's my understanding that the perceived shortages are because the product isn't in the places it needs to be most.  That seems like a supply chain problem.  But that's coming from a NPR segment I listened to and a reuters article I read a few days ago.

I agree with this part BTW.  The folks running the plant in question should have followed whatever regulations they were supposed to follow.  (I'm not very familiar with what's involved in manufacturing formula, but I assume that cleanliness is fairly important).  

But things happen.  Instead of having the plant shut down by the FDA (?), it could have been leveled by an earthquake, burned to the ground, struck by lightning, or blown up by breastfeeding extremists (a joke).  We need to have a little more resiliency baked into the system so that things don't immediately go sideways when one part of the system fails in a predictable way.  Trade is great for stuff like this.

(It doesn't need to involve transitioning production to a plant owned by the same company in the EU.  We could just European companies sell their wares here.) 

 

[The Commish]

We need to have a little more resiliency baked into the system so that things don't immediately go sideways when one part of the system fails in a predictable way.  Trade is great for stuff like this.

Agree 100%  Where we seem to disagree on is where that responsibility lies. In my view thats up to the companies. I dont disagree that there can be circumstances that would be serious enough that government intervention would be needed. I just dont see this as one of those situations. What's  happened here is covered on day one of Operations/Logistics 101 class. 

 

[Grace Under Pressure]

Somewhat unsurprisingly, the government has protected the industry to the detriment of the consumer with this situation and now we're seeing the fallout from that. Just having a couple of companies producing a very sensitive product like this is an accident waiting to happen. The fact that one factory shutdown for one of those companies causes a shortage like this is a problem within that problem. In sensitive industries, there should be more producers, not fewer, and they should have more distributed resources, again not fewer. Oversight of industries like this are supposed to protect the consumer.

"What's your plan if the factory has to shut down?" You're not on top of that question as a regulator? And while the companies deserve some culpability, know that a company is going to strive to maximize profit. That's what companies are supposed to do. If it makes more sense for them to centralize operations, then that's what they'll do unless there are requirements otherwise. That's why we have regulators and oversight. 

In the meantime while we fix those things, and while we hopefully remember that anti-competition can sometimes be harmful in a capitalist model (there's a whole agency for this), especially in sensitive industries (hello PPE), it deserves to be called out that the administration should have proactively implemented short term importing strategies more quickly to address the problem. Sure, the last administration and the current administration are both at fault for this situation coming to a head, but only the current administration can help fix it, and they were slow to react. That's a recurring theme with this administration. 

Fortunately it does appear they'll be importing Nestle product in the short term, and that the Abbott factory is getting back to operations again. 

Just some data on the impact. Infant formula is recommended for those 12 months and younger. There's roughly 3.6 million 0-1 year olds in the country at any given point in time. If say half of those infants are using formula, there are roughly 2 million households that require infant formula. Zero of them should ever have to worry about getting formula. So like we do with supply chain shortages that we just had a lot of experience dealing with during the pandemic, let's accurately assess the impact so we can take a smart approach to the solution. Or if you're the current administration, flail around for 8 weeks while you get bashed over the head.

 

[urbanhack]

Somewhat unsurprisingly, the government has protected the industry to the detriment of the consumer with this situation and now we're seeing the fallout from that. Just having a couple of companies producing a very sensitive product like this is an accident waiting to happen. The fact that one factory shutdown for one of those companies causes a shortage like this is a problem within that problem. In sensitive industries, there should be more producers, not fewer, and they should have more distributed resources, again not fewer. Oversight of industries like this are supposed to protect the consumer.

This seems to be the norm.

 

[Rockchild]

In case you're curious, here's a story from April 2021 describing how the government treats the importation of infant formula from overseas -- basically, it's the same way that they treat the importation of heroin.

https://www.cbp.gov/newsroom/local-media-release/philadelphia-cbp-seizes-nearly-600-cases-infant-formula-unapproved

Again, we're talking here about people who are trying to buy a product that is approved for sale in Germany.  This is not some sketchy vendor operating out of India or someplace like that.  This is almost certainly just as safe as anything sold in the US, but the government cracks down on it anyway because government is the problem.  @tommyGunZ hates it when people point that out, but yet here we are.

Is it the government being the problem or business trying to keep competitors out of the market? We like to always blame the government but who has the governments ear? Lobbyists and special interest groups. We don't have a government for the people by the people anymore (or did we really ever have it) but it is controlled more and more by big business.

 

[Desert_Power]

Ed O'Keefe @edokeefe

JUST IN: @POTUS Biden is invoking the Defense Production Act to accelerate the production of baby formula, forcing manufacturers to make ingredients needed and sell them first to formula manufacturers. He's also ordering use of DOD planes to transport formula from to U.S.

https://twitter.com/edokeefe/status/1527046436004700161/photo/1

 

[Whyatt]

Ed O'Keefe @edokeefe

JUST IN: @POTUS Biden is invoking the Defense Production Act to accelerate the production of baby formula, forcing manufacturers to make ingredients needed and sell them first to formula manufacturers. He's also ordering use of DOD planes to transport formula from to U.S.

https://twitter.com/edokeefe/status/1527046436004700161/photo/1

My take is that invoking the DPA is most likely 100% for show.

Flying formula could be valuable though. Obviously it’s much quicker to the shelves. Air shipping is in the order of 10x the cost of boat, so feds will absorb this cost that manufacturers don’t want to pay.

 

[PhillipPhoto]

My take is that invoking the DPA is most likely 100% for show.

Flying formula could be valuable though. Obviously it’s much quicker to the shelves. Air shipping is in the order of 10x the cost of boat, so feds will absorb this cost that manufacturers don’t want to pay.

It must be for show since last week they told us it wouldnt do any good because it's such a specialized manufacturing.   

At least they are trying now, too bad they had zero foresight.  The babies were infected what last September/October?

 

[ZADO]

Politics at its worst   Only acting after public pressure

 

[GordonGekko]

WTF has happened to my alleged "capitalists" around this place?  I'm not sure if anyone's noticed, but every single time (in recent memory) an industry, company etc has fallen on it's face, the response is "why did the government let this happen!??!?!?!?!"  Really?  Can't have it both ways here guys.  Either let the industry be the industry and lay blame appropriately at their feet or drop the "capitalist" moniker you claim to support and replace it with the more appropriate "socialist" moniker.

I'm speaking to both sides of this coin....it's absurd.

TWEET: Brent Scher XX@XXBrentScher

My wife just alerted me that the official XX@XXWhiteHouse advice for mom’s out of baby formula is to call your doctor and ask for free samples

5:54 PM · May 17, 2022

https://twitter.com/BrentScher/status/1526727906583580672

TWEET: Joe Pilot, MD XX@XXJoeSilverman7

Replying to XX@XXTomRoyce   XX@XXBrentScher  and 2 others

We don’t have samples.

6:09 PM · May 17, 2022

https://twitter.com/JoeSilverman7/status/1526731596669374465

*****

Biden Administration to direct all the anger that parents feel....onto every day pediatricians.

Tell them to bombard their pediatricians for "free samples" without understanding many pediatricians don't have free samples to give out.

Team Blue has already lost the legacy military vote, suburban women voters, the law enforcement vote, small business owners vote, working class minority voters and now....the collective votes of pediatricians in America too?

The Biden Administration can't have it both ways. They can't start shouting out that that the "adults are finally back in charge" and then get caught up in scandal after scandal and disaster after disaster.

 

[GordonGekko]

WTF has happened to my alleged "capitalists" around this place?  I'm not sure if anyone's noticed, but every single time (in recent memory) an industry, company etc has fallen on it's face, the response is "why did the government let this happen!??!?!?!?!"  Really?  Can't have it both ways here guys.  Either let the industry be the industry and lay blame appropriately at their feet or drop the "capitalist" moniker you claim to support and replace it with the more appropriate "socialist" moniker.

I'm speaking to both sides of this coin....it's absurd.

TWEET: RNC Research XX@XXRNCResearch

Democrat Rep. Katie Porter claims Biden has acted "very, very quickly" on the baby formula shortages and blames worried parents "buying a lot." Biden waited until last week to make his first comments on the shortage.

Dem Rep. Porter: Biden Acted "Quickly" On Baby Formula Shortages

7:56 AM · May 18, 2022

https://twitter.com/RNCResearch/status/1526939727240302593

VIDEO: House Member Aims To Curb Price Gouging At The Pump May 18, 2022 MSNBC

House Oversight Committee member Rep. Katie Porter, D-Calif., discusses how Democrats are addressing inflation, a bill about price gauging at the gas pump that she is introducing as well as addressing how the Biden WH is dealing with the baby formula shortage.

https://youtu.be/lUFvnuouZ3Q?t=194

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUFvnuouZ3Q

*******

Biden, is on record, says the baby formula crisis, that he first heard of it last week. Katie Porter and others are trying to spin that the entire Democratic Party knew of the problem long term and have been efforting the problem long before that.

Once Porter is instructed by Susan Rice to say lay it all on the FDA for failures in oversight, that makes it a government problem. You can't have a "free market" when it's not exactly free from regulations that bog it down. Biden ( or Rice to be direct about it) could have used the DPA far earlier. Or any number of solutions before waiting until it turned into a total nightmare for everyone involved.

Then there's the ridiculous "free shot" taking at parents in general saying they are hoarding. Of course they are hoarding it if they can. What do you expect them to do?

Here's what can't happen "both ways"

Team Blue can't keep declaring war on America's children and then pretend that they are not and it's not their fault. It's only been a year and a half. How much total damage has this administration inflicted on children in this country already. Does anyone want to brace for two and a half more years of this madness?

Katie Porter was on camera like a rat trying to escape a drowning ship, desperate to throw anyone and everyone under a  bus to save her own political hide. Much of this is going to eventually fall into Gina Raimondo's lap, which is horrible for the DNC, they actually need her for 2024.

This is not capitalism versus socialism. This is what you get when you have a power structure built around a political groupie ( Jennifer Dillon), a dark money bagman who couldn't run a lemonade stand ( Ron Klain), a cackler who self destructs whenever another person enters the room ( Kamala Harris), a guy that everyone is pretty sure at this point has dementia or such severe cognitive decline that the only consolation prize is that he's forgotten how accountable he is for creating most of systemic racism in this country (The Great Nemesis Of Corn Pop), and of course, Susan Rice, who is "allegedly" just a "high level advisor" who has never been elected to anything and whose claim to fame is enabling one of the largest acts of genocide in all of recorded human history.

This is stupid versus more stupid versus idiotic versus catastrophic.

This isn't rocket science, someone should just bite the bullet in the Party power structure and just put Amy Klobuchar in charge. She is literally this administrations only hope to salvage the next two and a half years from more chaos.

 

[GordonGekko]

Agree 100%  Where we seem to disagree on is where that responsibility lies. In my view thats up to the companies. I dont disagree that there can be circumstances that would be serious enough that government intervention would be needed. I just dont see this as one of those situations. What's  happened here is covered on day one of Operations/Logistics 101 class. 

TWEET: RNC Research XX@XX RNCResearch

HEARTBREAKING: “Two children were hospitalized for intestinal illnesses after their parents could not find the formula they needed.”

Two kids hospitalized after their parents could not find formula

6:24 AM · May 18, 2022

https://twitter.com/RNCResearch/status/1526916541089996805

Direct Headline: 2 children hospitalized in Memphis because their specialty formula is out of stock

A doctor at Le Bonheur Children’s Hospital in Memphis, Tennessee, says he admitted two young patients – a toddler and a preschooler – because the specialty formula they need is out of stock and they haven’t been able to tolerate any replacements....

The toddler, who had been in the hospital for about a week, was discharged Tuesday. The preschooler, who was admitted in April, remains in the hospital, according to a hospital spokesperson...

Formula maker Abbott produced about 80% of the specialty formula they need, a brand called EleCare. When its Sturgis, Michigan, production plant shut down in February, patients on that formula were switched to those made by smaller suppliers, and now those stocks have run out too....

By Brenda Goodman, CNN  11:24 AM EDT, Wed May 18, 2022

https://www.cnn.com/2022/05/18/health/memphis-children-hospitalized-formula-shortage/index.html

*****

When you are QB1 on the depth chart, all wins are yours even if you didn't earn it. All loses also belong to you, even if someone else chokes the game.

That's how it works. That's how it's always worked. That's how it will always work forever.

I generally don't roll down on "Whataboutism" but if this was Donald Trump, I just don't see this kind of response from people in the PSF and in the mainstream media. There would an endless firestorm of chaos over it.

Could you say those same exact words if that toddler in Memphis was one of your kids? Or a child of one of the regular posters here?

“The superior man blames himself. The inferior man blames others.” – Don Shula

 

[Desert_Power]

Here are the Republicans who bucked the party on baby formula bills

A handful of Republican lawmakers bucked their party on Wednesday in votes on two separate bills aiming to address the nationwide baby formula shortage causing rising concern for parents across the country.

The main bill, dubbed the Infant Formula Supplemental Appropriations Act, passed in a 231-192 vote that mainly broke along party lines. Four Republicans and one Democrat did not vote.

The legislation would grant the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) $28 million in emergency funding to respond to the scarcity of baby formula.

Twelve Republicans bucked House GOP leadership and voted for the legislation: Reps. Don Bacon (Neb.), Brian Fitzpatrick (Pa.), Anthony Gonzalez (Ohio), Trey Hollingsworth (Ind.), John Katko (N.Y.), Adam Kinzinger (Ill.), David McKinley (W.Va.), Tom Rice (S.C.), Chris Smith (N.J.), Mike Turner (Ohio), Fred Upton (Mich.) and Ann Wagner (Mo.).

Earlier on Wednesday, Minority Whip Steve Scalise (R-La.) sent a memo to all House GOP offices recommending that members vote against the legislation. He argued that Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) brought up the bill “in hopes of covering up the administration’s ineptitude by throwing additional money at the FDA with no plan to actually fix the problem, all while failing to hold the FDA accountable.”

The House on Wednesday also passed the Access to Baby Formula Act in a 414-9 vote that was largely bipartisan. Five Republicans and one Democrat did not vote.

The bill calls for permanently relaxing restrictions on the kinds of baby formula that individuals in the federal low-income assistance program for women, children and infants are allowed to purchase. The program is formally known as the Special Supplemental Nutrition Program for Women, Infants and Children, commonly referred to as the WIC program.

The only opposition to the legislation came from the Republican Party: the “no” votes were from Reps. Andy Biggs (Ariz.), Lauren Boebert (Colo.), Matt Gaetz (Fla.), Louie Gohmert (Texas), Paul Gosar (Ariz.), Marjorie Taylor Greene (Ga.), Clay Higgins (La.), Thomas Massie (Ky.) and Chip Roy (Texas).

There was no overlap in the two groups of GOP outlier votes.

Pete Williams retiring from NBC Senate Democrats propose DOJ license requirement for gun purchases

Massie and Greene have stood out for their votes on a number of recent occasions, at times bucking the majority of their party to oppose bipartisan measures such as aide to Ukraine and sanctions against Russia.

The baby formula bills come as parents across the country are struggling to purchase formula for their children, leaving lawmakers scrambling to restock shelves and prevent the scarcity from worsening.

The U.S. has been grappling with the instant baby formula shortage since at least the week beginning April 24, when the out-of-stock percentage of the merchandise reached 40 percent, according to an analysis by retail tracking company Datasembly.

https://thehill.com/news/house/3493832-here-are-the-republicans-who-bucked-the-party-on-baby-formula-bills/

 

[squistion]

Here are the Republicans who bucked the party on baby formula bills

A handful of Republican lawmakers bucked their party on Wednesday in votes on two separate bills aiming to address the nationwide baby formula shortage causing rising concern for parents across the country.

The main bill, dubbed the Infant Formula Supplemental Appropriations Act, passed in a 231-192 vote that mainly broke along party lines. Four Republicans and one Democrat did not vote.

The legislation would grant the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) $28 million in emergency funding to respond to the scarcity of baby formula.

Twelve Republicans bucked House GOP leadership and voted for the legislation: Reps. Don Bacon (Neb.), Brian Fitzpatrick (Pa.), Anthony Gonzalez (Ohio), Trey Hollingsworth (Ind.), John Katko (N.Y.), Adam Kinzinger (Ill.), David McKinley (W.Va.), Tom Rice (S.C.), Chris Smith (N.J.), Mike Turner (Ohio), Fred Upton (Mich.) and Ann Wagner (Mo.).

Earlier on Wednesday, Minority Whip Steve Scalise (R-La.) sent a memo to all House GOP offices recommending that members vote against the legislation. He argued that Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) brought up the bill “in hopes of covering up the administration’s ineptitude by throwing additional money at the FDA with no plan to actually fix the problem, all while failing to hold the FDA accountable.”

The House on Wednesday also passed the Access to Baby Formula Act in a 414-9 vote that was largely bipartisan. Five Republicans and one Democrat did not vote.

The bill calls for permanently relaxing restrictions on the kinds of baby formula that individuals in the federal low-income assistance program for women, children and infants are allowed to purchase. The program is formally known as the Special Supplemental Nutrition Program for Women, Infants and Children, commonly referred to as the WIC program.

The only opposition to the legislation came from the Republican Party: the “no” votes were from Reps. Andy Biggs (Ariz.), Lauren Boebert (Colo.), Matt Gaetz (Fla.), Louie Gohmert (Texas), Paul Gosar (Ariz.), Marjorie Taylor Greene (Ga.), Clay Higgins (La.), Thomas Massie (Ky.) and Chip Roy (Texas).

There was no overlap in the two groups of GOP outlier votes.

Pete Williams retiring from NBC Senate Democrats propose DOJ license requirement for gun purchases

Massie and Greene have stood out for their votes on a number of recent occasions, at times bucking the majority of their party to oppose bipartisan measures such as aide to Ukraine and sanctions against Russia.

The baby formula bills come as parents across the country are struggling to purchase formula for their children, leaving lawmakers scrambling to restock shelves and prevent the scarcity from worsening.

The U.S. has been grappling with the instant baby formula shortage since at least the week beginning April 24, when the out-of-stock percentage of the merchandise reached 40 percent, according to an analysis by retail tracking company Datasembly.

https://thehill.com/news/house/3493832-here-are-the-republicans-who-bucked-the-party-on-baby-formula-bills/

Yes, Republicans are so pro life that 192 of them voted against baby formula yesterday.

 

[BassNBrew]

Yes, Republicans are so pro life that 192 of them voted against baby formula yesterday.

This is lazy posting.

Let's say Rep Squistion votes against the baby formula bill because it contain a provision that it's only for white babies.  Is Rep Squistion now against baby formula?  Maybe the baby formula bill only has enough funding to cover 50% of the babies so Rep. Squisition votes no in order to get a bill through with double the funding.  Is Rep. Squistion against baby formula?

 

[squistion]

This is lazy posting.

Let's say Rep Squistion votes against the baby formula bill because it contain a provision that it's only for white babies.  Is Rep Squistion now against baby formula?  Maybe the baby formula bill only has enough funding to cover 50% of the babies so Rep. Squisition votes no in order to get a bill through with double the funding.  Is Rep. Squistion against baby formula?

Talk about lazy posting. 

There was nothing in the two bills passed yesterday that had any provision that mentioned race at all or national origin. 

 

[Amused to Death]

Twelve Republicans bucked House GOP leadership and voted for the legislation: Reps. Don Bacon (Neb.), Brian Fitzpatrick (Pa.), Anthony Gonzalez (Ohio), Trey Hollingsworth (Ind.), John Katko (N.Y.), Adam Kinzinger (Ill.), David McKinley (W.Va.), Tom Rice (S.C.), Chris Smith (N.J.), Mike Turner (Ohio), Fred Upton (Mich.) and Ann Wagner (Mo.).

My Congressman, who seems pretty independent and not a Trump guy (as evidenced by Trump calling for him to be primaried). I would support him if he was so anti-choice with his abortion stance.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I would have voted against that bill too.  We should be cutting the FDA's budget, not expanding it.  Preferably by cutting it's budget to $0.00.  And blowing up the building, and salting the earth where it once stood.  

The fact that we're rewarding the agency that seems to be directly responsible for creating this problem in the first place is odd policy-making.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

I would have happily voted for a bill that told the FDA to politely #### right off about how European companies label their infant formula.  Problem solved, and $28 million dollars saved.

 

[BassNBrew]

Talk about lazy posting. 

There was nothing in the two bills passed yesterday that had any provision that mentioned race at all or national origin. 

You really don't follow?

Curious what your age and education level are?