Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums
Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
2017 New York Jets: Robby Anderson has been arrested in Florida for the second straight offseason. This is why we can't have nice things. (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Dr. Octopus
- Start date
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
On a positive note the Broncos, Niners and Bears all won - SF is likely not within reach but hopefully Denver and Chicago can sneak in a few more wins.
sheerterror
Footballguy
I want Bowles gone. It's easy to say this on the heals of yesterday's stinker, but I've felt this way since pretty much last season. The writing has been on the wall with this guy - Rex part deus. Hopefully he doesn't linger for a year or 2 too long also. When you make the same mistakes in year 3 that you did in year 1, you are NOT progressing as a head coach. Players get held accountable for not getting better as their careers progress, AND LOSE THEIR JOBS BECAUSE OF IT - why would we not hold head coaches to the same regard? With his ultra conservative garbage, mixed with late game meltdowns, questionable ability to evoke sustained effort from his team, poor performance from the defense he is supposed to be the guru of, clock mismanagement, and icing on the cake - vague, mumble mouthed garbage with regards to the media - get him the F out of here.
It's typical Jet organization/fan reactionary thinking to derive "Well, the Jets were better than they were supposed to be this year, therefore let's bring back the same pieces that'll assuredly keep us stuck in the mud for another 4 years (read: McCown/Bowles)." Bring Bowles back, miss the playoffs again, and now we'll be 4 years with him and no playoff appearances. Can you still keep him? Most assuredly no. So why bother with next season? To prolong the inevitable regime change for an extra season? To hope they catch lightning in a bottle AGAIN with a journeyman QB having a statistical anomaly of a season, and give the delusion of a team who may randomly be able to squeak out a wild card birth?
This (as with seemingly most other years) is a massively pivotal upcoming offseason. As the Jets QB purgatory continues to slowly march on year after year and the glut of available FA/rookie QBs, somebody/someone/something needs to be done to make sure that we PROGRESS this massive, massive need in the right direction. Whether it's getting an Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins or Case Keenum because the organization identifies it's closer to "competing" now than is worth while to take the time to develop a rookie, or it involves actually identifying, acquiring and developing a rookie, I'm not sure how anyone at this point can trust that a Todd Bowles led staff would be the ones to defy the odds and finally bring stability to the position that we've lacked since.....................?
It's typical Jet organization/fan reactionary thinking to derive "Well, the Jets were better than they were supposed to be this year, therefore let's bring back the same pieces that'll assuredly keep us stuck in the mud for another 4 years (read: McCown/Bowles)." Bring Bowles back, miss the playoffs again, and now we'll be 4 years with him and no playoff appearances. Can you still keep him? Most assuredly no. So why bother with next season? To prolong the inevitable regime change for an extra season? To hope they catch lightning in a bottle AGAIN with a journeyman QB having a statistical anomaly of a season, and give the delusion of a team who may randomly be able to squeak out a wild card birth?
This (as with seemingly most other years) is a massively pivotal upcoming offseason. As the Jets QB purgatory continues to slowly march on year after year and the glut of available FA/rookie QBs, somebody/someone/something needs to be done to make sure that we PROGRESS this massive, massive need in the right direction. Whether it's getting an Alex Smith, Kirk Cousins or Case Keenum because the organization identifies it's closer to "competing" now than is worth while to take the time to develop a rookie, or it involves actually identifying, acquiring and developing a rookie, I'm not sure how anyone at this point can trust that a Todd Bowles led staff would be the ones to defy the odds and finally bring stability to the position that we've lacked since.....................?
Kiddnets
Footballguy
well there it was...the stinker of all stinkers that we all knew they were capable of this year but so far avoided....the fact that it could come on the heels of such a solid win is truly mind boggling.....I have not been a Bowles fan since last season but give credit that he has the team fighting each week - especially last week...quite frankly I viewed that as one of the only positives as in game management/adjustments are terrible.....yesterday should be viewed by any competent owner as a termination game...it was that bad.
Not only was the team not ready to play...but there was no gameplan...no adjustments....no fire at all....and the team quit...from the top down....once it was clear the team wasn't prepared Bowles' action was to get this game over as fast as possible...no urgency....running non-stop to keep the clock moving instead of trying to mount a comeback.
not calling timeouts at the end of the half with over a minute to play and taking a knee was one of the worst coaching decisions I have ever seen since Herm Edwards took a knee in Pittsburgh yrs ago to try a long FG rather than try to get closer.....it sent a msg to the team that this game was over....it was embarrassing and should be an end to the Bowles era.....keep in mind this was a reeling Denver team coming off an awful stretch and Bowles was acting like this was the Super Bowl team from a few yrs back...it was that bad.
Where to go from here? next 2 weeks are good teams playing for something.....If they try put McCown out there with a broken hand - even if it is non-throwing - Bowles shouldnt be allowed back on the complex....Petty looked awful but so was McCown...now he's hurt as well as 38....I know they are scared to death of the world seeing Mac's shame picks but it's time....Petty threw it about 10 yds over WRs heads...he looked rattled, scared and completely unprepared...so what. Roll him out there and then put Hack out there as well...let them stink.....if these 2 can't perform competently in any way then it falls on MAc for lousy picks and Bowles for not developing them. Time to pull open the curtain and see how bad it is....and im sure it is bad!
It's still the Jets here so I would still expect Bowles to return....but if the wheels fall off the next 3 weeks and they look like yesterday then even the Johnson boys would acknowledge its time for a change....you can't hand over a top 10 pick and $80M in cap $ to these 2 at this point.
Not only was the team not ready to play...but there was no gameplan...no adjustments....no fire at all....and the team quit...from the top down....once it was clear the team wasn't prepared Bowles' action was to get this game over as fast as possible...no urgency....running non-stop to keep the clock moving instead of trying to mount a comeback.
not calling timeouts at the end of the half with over a minute to play and taking a knee was one of the worst coaching decisions I have ever seen since Herm Edwards took a knee in Pittsburgh yrs ago to try a long FG rather than try to get closer.....it sent a msg to the team that this game was over....it was embarrassing and should be an end to the Bowles era.....keep in mind this was a reeling Denver team coming off an awful stretch and Bowles was acting like this was the Super Bowl team from a few yrs back...it was that bad.
Where to go from here? next 2 weeks are good teams playing for something.....If they try put McCown out there with a broken hand - even if it is non-throwing - Bowles shouldnt be allowed back on the complex....Petty looked awful but so was McCown...now he's hurt as well as 38....I know they are scared to death of the world seeing Mac's shame picks but it's time....Petty threw it about 10 yds over WRs heads...he looked rattled, scared and completely unprepared...so what. Roll him out there and then put Hack out there as well...let them stink.....if these 2 can't perform competently in any way then it falls on MAc for lousy picks and Bowles for not developing them. Time to pull open the curtain and see how bad it is....and im sure it is bad!
It's still the Jets here so I would still expect Bowles to return....but if the wheels fall off the next 3 weeks and they look like yesterday then even the Johnson boys would acknowledge its time for a change....you can't hand over a top 10 pick and $80M in cap $ to these 2 at this point.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
I mean we must be talking worst of all time scary....the way McCown and Petty looked yesterday how much worse could it be? They must think a lot worse which is unreal
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
The best thing for this organization would be to press the reset button and bring in a new GM and HC.
If they have to keep one, it's Mac imo. He's done some good things - although he obviously has some major misses. Bowles and his staff obviously can not groom a young QB and the last thing we need is to take a rookie and have him learn a whole new system in Year 2, after Bowles is fired following the 2018 season.
I'm at the point where I think they have to take a QB in the draft. I'm a big Cousins fan and can live with that but don't want to see them go down the McCown, Smith, Eli, Palmer...(i.e. washed up veteran) rabbit hole again.
As we said a team with some nice young parts, a top 10 draft pick and $80+MM in cap space should attract some talented football people. We may never be in a better position to get the right people in. Too bad Woody will likely mess it up again.
If they have to keep one, it's Mac imo. He's done some good things - although he obviously has some major misses. Bowles and his staff obviously can not groom a young QB and the last thing we need is to take a rookie and have him learn a whole new system in Year 2, after Bowles is fired following the 2018 season.
I'm at the point where I think they have to take a QB in the draft. I'm a big Cousins fan and can live with that but don't want to see them go down the McCown, Smith, Eli, Palmer...(i.e. washed up veteran) rabbit hole again.
As we said a team with some nice young parts, a top 10 draft pick and $80+MM in cap space should attract some talented football people. We may never be in a better position to get the right people in. Too bad Woody will likely mess it up again.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
I feel bad for McCown - the guy played better than anyone could have expected - but this is the best thing for the franchise. Now Bowles has no choice but to do the right thing. Ideally we'd see Petty Week 15 and unless he's lights out, give Hack a 2 game audition.
Knowing Bowles I'm sure they'll sign Matt Hasselbeck and start him this week.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
McCown is a grade 1 competitor and a class act.....put his brain/guts into Hack's 20 yr old franchise QB body and the Jets would be set for yrs.....hope he becomes a coach and sticks around but the only way he should be on the team next year is backing up a highly drafted rookie QB.
It's finally time for the kids....interested to see how Petty does with a full week of reps....really hope they start Hack the last 2 games as well but not holding my breath.
bigupsetter
Footballguy
McCown was amazing. Hope he comes back because no one has said the Jets real QB issue is they have no one/no ability to develop a QB.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
That Miami win was a "win" for the Jets draft slot also. I hate the Dolphins perhaps maybe even more than the Pats but I was pulling for them last night.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Decisions like this are common for Bowles and why he must go. I'm sure that decision really inspired the team.
So kicking a FG (at least) and THEN getting the ball back in the second half wouldn't be the best thing? So a 38 year old QB's banged up hip would significantly heal up during the 15 minutes of halftime?
This has been his mindset since day 1 - this ultra-conservative approach does not work in today's NFL.
Fariq
Footballguy
There is no defending Bowles for that decision in the second quarter and then the entire second half. My mentality has always been if you are going to go down, do it with a fight. You don't just give up. You don't punt while down 23-0 midway through the 4th quarter. Bowles quit on the team on Sunday.
With McCown done, I can't envision wins vs the Saints or Chargers. I actually could see the Jets beating the Patriots in Week 17 and costing themselves four spots in the draft as Tom Brady plays one series and Brian Hoyer plays the rest of the game and the Patriots go with an ultra vanilla offensive attack while locked into the 2 seed.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
This would be the most Jets thing ever - and everyone fully expects it to happen. We just need to hope the Pats and Steelers go into the last week tied for the top seed and home field.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Bowles explanation was expected and changes nothing....if McCown was too beat up to handle a drive put in your backup....it was a complete white flag moment and the fact that he doesnt get it exemplifies why he needs to go.
We'll have to see how last week shakes out....losing out will help but any way you slice it they will be too far to land the top QBs without a trade up.
We'll have to see how last week shakes out....losing out will help but any way you slice it they will be too far to land the top QBs without a trade up.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
OC Morton quoted in article admitting Jets didnt have a chance and he was just running out the clock at the end of the game with lots of time left (no mention of the halftime white flag) - while he has had a good 1st yr that is loser mentality.....what does that say to your team? We are talking 3 scores in a quarter.....I dont care how bad a team is playing its the NFL....if that was the philosophy there would never be Monday Night Miracle or other crazy comebacks....maybe the Pats should have given up in the Super Bowl - they were getting killed......
this is inexcusable and should be a ticket out of here for the entire staff....unreal.
"Listen, we were behind, we didn't have a chance," Morton said. "I mean, they're just dropping back in coverage and we're just going to be throwing and forcing balls. I didn't want that. I didn't think that was fair. Call it whatever you want, I just thought that was the right decision."
How about adjusting and taking what you could get....this is why Jets are a losing franchise...I'm really disgusted at this.
this is inexcusable and should be a ticket out of here for the entire staff....unreal.
"Listen, we were behind, we didn't have a chance," Morton said. "I mean, they're just dropping back in coverage and we're just going to be throwing and forcing balls. I didn't want that. I didn't think that was fair. Call it whatever you want, I just thought that was the right decision."
How about adjusting and taking what you could get....this is why Jets are a losing franchise...I'm really disgusted at this.
Last edited by a moderator:
Mystery Achiever
Footballguy
Wilkerson was late again and will be inactive Sunday. Isn't making the trip. At this point he must be trying to get cut, right?
Last edited by a moderator:
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Guys I have a couple near 50 yard line bunker level tix available. Hit me up if you're interested. Reasonable $ all things considered. If this is inappropriate just let me know and I will delete thanks.
rockaction
Footballguy
Hell no -- it's not inappropriate. If I were down there I'd be in in a heartbeat. Thanks for the offer from the fans, SID.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Last edited by a moderator:
rockaction
Footballguy
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Wilk will forever be the poster boy example of players mailing it in after being paid....every time a team looks to lock up an up and coming young player the GM should make sure it's a player with integrity so they "don't get Wilked".....what a shame he could have been one of the all time Jet greatsTLEF316 said:
NYRAGE
Footballguy
The funny thing is that Manish has been after Wilkerson for 2 years now as if Wilk had stolen his family or something.
Living in Texas, I've always gone to NOLA on those rare occasions that the Jets make it down here. I completely missed this game though. Maybe subconsciously I knew they would be terrible and not worth the 6 hour drive. NOLA is a fun place to watch a game though. I would be tempted to still go if I didn't already have plans tomorrow night.
Living in Texas, I've always gone to NOLA on those rare occasions that the Jets make it down here. I completely missed this game though. Maybe subconsciously I knew they would be terrible and not worth the 6 hour drive. NOLA is a fun place to watch a game though. I would be tempted to still go if I didn't already have plans tomorrow night.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
getting ready for the likely blow out today - if you get a chance check out the joe/evan interview with Manish - Joe loses his mind but it is pretty entertaining back and forth....they all are intrigued with Bridgewater for next yr...but Joe crushing Bowles while Manish defends him is great radio....
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/audio/joe-benigno-and-evan-roberts/
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/audio/joe-benigno-and-evan-roberts/
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Petty has shown that at best he’s a career backup level QB.
Its criminal not to give Hack the last two games to see what he has. There is zero downside and only benefit to the franchise to do so - even if they just don’t think he has it based on practices.
I just don’t get it.
Its criminal not to give Hack the last two games to see what he has. There is zero downside and only benefit to the franchise to do so - even if they just don’t think he has it based on practices.
I just don’t get it.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
There is zero excuse for not looking at Hack....it shows that he is one of the biggest busts in Jet history without even getting on the field in back to back 5 win season - both in pick and the lack of development.....I've never seen anything like it......it's an embarrassment and both coach and GM should be held accountable.
Last edited by a moderator:
Aznflyer14
Footballguy
Jets' brain trust would be smart to retain Todd Bowles as their head coach next year (and possibly beyond). He has had made his players play hard despite all drama unfolding internally such as Muhammad Wilkinson's malcontent behaviors.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Players should play hard. Bowles has a loser mentality, is way too conservative, has shown an inability to work with young QBs, and his players failed to show up in the most meaningful game he's coached so far.
Although I dont love contsant turnover in coaching staffs, I would like to see a fresh start with a rookie QB and an offensive orientated HC.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Agreed - besides getting players to play hard what has he done? Whiffed in the one game with playoff on line....putrid record since....players missing meetings....routine late game collapses....awful clock mgt....completely uninspiring.....worst offensive performance in decades vs Denver....not able to develop Petty and Hack to the point where they have top hide a 2d rd pick......and add multiple 12 men in huddle and illegal substitution penalties that should not happen.....o I need to go on?
This is a huge offseason with a new QB, top draft pick...time to get a new offensive minded coach to develop
Fariq
Footballguy
Most players are hired guns. Aside from weird guys like Muhammad Wilkerson, most are always looking to play well so that they'll get another contract instead of being out of the league in the blink of an eye. Bowles had a young team this year. I don't give much credit to any coaches for getting guys to play hard in the NFL. I believe this sort of thing can be an issue in baseball, but we are discussing football here.
Fariq
Footballguy
I hate to root for an injury, but I would like to see Petty get knocked out of the game next week. Nothing too serious, but something that has to see him exit the game in the 1st quarter. If the Jets are down by two scores or more, I imagine they would have Forte, McGuire, and Powell operate as single wing tailbacks. It would be interesting, though, if the score is Chargers 7, Jets 7. Would Hackenberg come into the game then? I don't know. It's a tough one. Down 10-0 with 1:41 remaining in the 1st quarter it's an easy call. Game over. Just like in Denver two weeks earlier. But, I mean, tie game late 1st quarter, Petty's done. You gotta make a different type of call there. You could put in Hackenberg and just have him take snaps and hand it off but you are kind of playing 10-on-11 football there. So maybe you do have the RBs take snaps out of wildcat formations and such and just let Hackenberg watch.
What do you do if Petty is out and all three running backs are injured? You'd probably have to have ArDarius Stewart take all the snaps. Or mix and match with Stewart and Darryl Roberts. Maybe Roberts played quarterback in Pop Warner.
Last edited by a moderator:
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Bowles says Wilkerson paid the penalty and they are moving on.....if they play Wilk and he gets hurt he is guaranteed all of his salary next season.....playing him in 2 meaningless games after the disrespect he showed the franchise would seriously be insane....hope Bowles is just doing his usual cat and mouse crap with the media but i will be going nuts if this guy plays!
NYRAGE
Footballguy
Forget the respect aspect for now, I'm more concerned about him getting hurt and him getting his contract guaranteed for next year. That would be the biggest risk.
Sandy Alderson got extended by the Mets yesterday. If that's not the biggest kick in the teeth, then it will be when this clown Bowles gets extended after the season. I'll give him credit for getting the team to play hard in most games (Denver? TB?), but he sucks at just about everything else. As a Jets fan, I fully expect him to get extended, but I'm praying he's gone the day after the season.
TLEF316
Footballguy
They're gonna fire O'Brien after he lost Watson, Watt and several other key players?
Not a big fan of the guys personality but I'd be on board with that hire.
Wilkerson really is just unreal. Saw some articles this morning about how he keeps insisting that he "earned his money" the past 2 years. Just sickening. And the really sad part is that someone will probably pay him a couple mill on a prove it deal next season. And he'll probably play well
Not a big fan of the guys personality but I'd be on board with that hire.
Wilkerson really is just unreal. Saw some articles this morning about how he keeps insisting that he "earned his money" the past 2 years. Just sickening. And the really sad part is that someone will probably pay him a couple mill on a prove it deal next season. And he'll probably play well
Last edited by a moderator:
mphtrilogy
Footballguy
I'd be shocked if Bowles gets fired...
rockaction
Footballguy
Also, Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to all. I hope these next few weeks are good for you guys.
This franchise is a mess
This franchise is a mess
NYRAGE
Footballguy
Merry Christmas to all.
I was hoping for a new coach under my tree, but Santa just dropped off a lump of coals in the shape of Bowles. Oh well, another hard-fought battle and preservation of our draft spot. For the love of God, please obtain some offensive weapons next year if we're not getting an offensive coach.
I was hoping for a new coach under my tree, but Santa just dropped off a lump of coals in the shape of Bowles. Oh well, another hard-fought battle and preservation of our draft spot. For the love of God, please obtain some offensive weapons next year if we're not getting an offensive coach.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
If Bowles insists on keeping Hack in mothballs again the absolute only interest in this week to me is draft position....if they started Hack/Petty all yr there is no doubt in my mind they would be looking at a top 2 pick....now im reading best case 4th (if everything breaks for them which is unlikely) and worst case 11th or so.....I'm reading that 6-7 seems to be the sweet spot assuming they lose to the Pats.....but do the Pats have anything to play for? If not - I can totally see them resting everyone and of course handing the Jets a worse pick lol.....anyone have info on this?
Mystery Achiever
Footballguy
I think the Pats are still fighting the Steelers for 1st seed.
fred_1_15301
Footballguy
Yup pats have a lot to play for. Would be one of the most shocking outcomes of the year if they somehow lost to the Jets at home.
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
Any word if Quincy Enunwa is expected to make a full recovery and be back next year?
Kiddnets
Footballguy
very quiet on his recovery....had surgery in August that had a 6-9 month recovery so should be ready for training camp if no set backs....if healthy a Kearse, Anderson, Enuwa WR trio would give the team a very nice corp
Fariq
Footballguy
Hackenberg clearly sucks beyond belief. Even as weird a coach as Bowles would have gone to Hackenberg by now. He had an opportunity to start Hackenberg in Week 17 last year and decided to go back to Fitzpatrick who was out the door the next day anyway. Now with McCown having gone down for the season, Bowles could have gotten out in front of everything and said, "Petty and Hackenberg will each start a game down the stretch of this season barring one of them getting injured in practice or something."
But, no. Hackenberg is so bad that he cannot even get to play. It is now an established fact. The Hackenberg draft selection was a complete waste. It is impossible to believe a team with double digit losses in consecutive seasons would sit a 2nd round drafted QB two seasons in a row as some sort of learning experience. It makes no sense in this day and age. Hackenberg is terrible. We saw this in preseason. It has been confirmed by him holding the tablet. I am serious. If Petty went down, the Jets might have the running backs take snaps the rest of the game on Sunday.
So there are two questions to answer.
1. Is Bowles coming back?
2. Assuming McCown is brought back in some capacity, who will be the other two quarterbacks?
I hate Bowles' "willing loser" mentality but I don't want a lateral move here. If there are no good game changing candidates, then just bring him back and convince yourself that Bowles' coaching in Denver was some sort of lesson as in "You guys don't want to play today, then I won't coach." Do not reach and get the next Vance Joseph or Scott Linehan.
I think the Jets have to strongly consider Kirk Cousins. If they cannot get him, then be sure to get a Sam Bradford or Teddy Bridgewater- somebody who has started and played and done well at times. Do not bring this type of player in to be the starter. I understand the better the player, the less likely he would be interested in being a backup.
Draft a quarterback in the first round if Cousins is not signed. The only reason to not take a QB in round 1 would be if Cousins is signed or if the Jets somehow don't like any QBs in this draft.
Kiddnets
Footballguy
well if the Jets win and it costs the Pats home field it would take away the sting of the lost draft position.....of course if it is close I'll be waiting to see how the refs find a way to help them this time
