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RB Saquon Barkley, PHI (1 Viewer)

Dizzy said:
On Barkley, it looks to me like he is on a limited snap count ROS. I saw a few plays from Sunday's game and it looks like he knows exactly when he's coming out and not ready to go right back in (not spelling him, but purposely not playing him). Whether it is due to injury, conditioning, trying to preserve an asset, or what ever.

Seen this in their last two games... he'll bust a run towards the NYG sideline he immediately takes his helmet off and starts walking towards the bench. Almost like a "OK, that's my 2nd carry this QTR... I'm done for a while" kind of look to it.
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FWIW I noticed one play yesterday where he had just had a couple of carries within maybe 3 plays and they sent in Booker. It looked to me like Barkley tried to wave him off to satin the game before relenting and going to the sideline. Then, he was back in the next play. Snap count overall was down though.

 
J R said:
FWIW I noticed one play yesterday where he had just had a couple of carries within maybe 3 plays and they sent in Booker. It looked to me like Barkley tried to wave him off to satin the game before relenting and going to the sideline. Then, he was back in the next play. Snap count overall was down though.
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Honestly, I thought this was due to game script. In the beginning it was mostly Barkley. But then Herbert turned it on and they were down a ton and it got out of hand so I thought they put Booker in more. Think a lot of Bookers runs were when they were behind a ton and expecting pass so Booker had easy runs.

 
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Buttonhook said:
Did he look any more decisive/explosive this week?
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Yes, a tad better than the previous weeks.  He seemed more decisive, and pushed the pile for a few 5-7 yard carries.  He seemed to be on a touch limit though, as he came out of the game often, and never got a rhythm going.  He’s been hovering around 17 touches since returning from the ankle injury (and really all season).  He looked awful the first week back, then a little better every week since then.  Still not the same as 2-3 years ago, but I thought he looked more like week 4 at New Orleans. 

 
neal cassady said:
Yes, a tad better than the previous weeks.  He seemed more decisive, and pushed the pile for a few 5-7 yard carries.  He seemed to be on a touch limit though, as he came out of the game often, and never got a rhythm going.  He’s been hovering around 17 touches since returning from the ankle injury (and really all season).  He looked awful the first week back, then a little better every week since then.  Still not the same as 2-3 years ago, but I thought he looked more like week 4 at New Orleans. 
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Thanks.  Been waiting to play him after watching his first few games back, so glad to hear this weekend was another step in the right direction.

Don't like this week's matchup (DAL), but hoping/expecting following two weeks (@PHI, @CHI) to be closer with more opportunities for SB.

 
Saquon Barkley (ankle) returned to practice on Thursday.

It's been hard to trust Barkley for fantasy production since his return from the ankle -- the Giants are just dragging his production down that much -- but he should be in line as a volume-based RB2 play against the Cowboys on Sunday. Barkley's receiving touchdown in Week 14 was his first since Week 4. 

SOURCE: Dan Duggan on Twitter

Dec 16, 2021, 1:46 PM ET
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I never thought I would say this, but how do you trust Barkley in your fantasy playoffs?  Between the gimpy ankle and Booker touches, I'm seriously considering starting Knox over him.  He should get at least 8 to 10 targets today without Beasley and Gabe Davis.  Diggs may get 15 targets.

 
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JohnnyU said:
I never thought I would say this, but how do you trust Barkley in your fantasy playoffs?  Between the gimpy ankle and Booker touches, I'm seriously considering starting Knox over him.  He should get at least 8 to 10 targets today without Beasley and Gabe Davis.  Diggs may get 15 targets.
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I'm debating Penny over Barkley. That's how low he's fallen

 
Soulfly3 said:
today will be the monster day ppl wanted and needed.
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We can say that until our faces turn blue, but my eyes tell me something else entirely.  A bad wheel and Booker getting all those touches makes Barkley in a trap game for fantasy players. 

Edited:  I forgot about E Sanders, so it could be the Diggs and Sanders show today.  I still think Knox will have a great game but I will play Barkley over Knox.  Mainly because I'm ahead right now, but I still think Barkley is more risky than Knox because of the ankle, but I'm hoping Barkley gets some receptions.  To be honest, 12 - 15 fantasy points from Barkley today is a wiin.

 
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Rally Monkey said:
He is a terrible player. Doesnt need any caveats. 

Studs carry teams, Taylor was down 4 OLineman and still ran for 100+.

Talent always out does situation. Fact is Barkley is terrible, lucky to be ona an NFL team and those who think he would do better with a different OLine or team, please...rookies liek Reynolds on bad teams have more 100 yard games then this inept player.

He can rush for 100+ and 2 scores today and he still wont be a good player as good players do that often, not one or two games a year. 

Being healthy is part of being great, he and his huge quads are a joke. 

Come at me Barkley defenders, you have no defense as his production speaks for itself. 

They dont feed him for a reason, he is a liability as he can get hurt just being looked at.

I dont play fantasy, this is pure real NFL opinion.
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I disagree with you that talent always wins out, especially for RBs.  A bad OL can cripple a good RB.  Taylor got most of his yards on one carry.  He was lucky to break 100.  A bad QB hurts a talented WR, but not as much as a bad OL hurts a great RB.  As for Barkley, there are more things at play here.  He does have a bad wheel and they are playing Booker more than I would like.

 
JohnnyU said:
I disagree with you that talent always wins out, especially for RBs.  A bad OL can cripple a good RB.  Taylor got most of his yards on one carry.  He was lucky to break 100.  A bad QB hurts a talented WR, but not as much as a bad OL hurts a great RB.  As for Barkley, there are more things at play here.  He does have a bad wheel and they are playing Booker more than I would like.
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Taylor broke 3 good runs and almost broke several more. Still got a hundred. With his entire line out.  All five. And the TE if I got it right  Definitely not lucky  Patient and we’ll called and played based on what they had imo

Welcome to Najee land btw.  

But he still was instrumental in controlling the clock and game.  That’s normal for a Najee game, and some form of that should be expected from an RB1  

Barkeky looks like he has that talent but all I see is him running sideways for his life. He didn’t come to the Giants that way

 
How good is the Giants OL coach compared to the Colts one ? How good are the actual running schemes being devised by the OC at the Giants compared to the Colts. There’s a little more to it than just personnel, theres tons of things at play. The Lions had a decent OL line last year under the old coaching staff and couldn’t run a lick. This year practise squad call ups can run for 100+ behind pretty much the same line give or taken some injuries. 
 

There’s so many factors with Barkley some of which are his and some of which aren’t 

- has he fully recovered yet ? 
- can he indeed stay fit ? 
- has he permanently lost something ? 
- how good/bad is the personnel on the line ? 
- how good/bad is the OL coaching ? 
- how good/bad are the running schemes ?

- is the QB a dual threat that requires some attention ?
 

These things aren’t easy to fully deduce, however, what is easy to deduce is what club does he currently play for and how is that currently going ?
 

Maybe next year he’s fully recovered and maybe next year the line is a little better. Or maybe not to some of that or all of it.  

 
Rally Monkey said:
Until they realize he cant stay healthy and isnt really good? 

His legs are virtually useless as an NFL sense. His huge quads doesnt get him that extra yard.

He cant block that well and he is losing touches to booker.

Why has Barkley not demanded to be force fed? He doesnt want to be the guy. I think he is totally cool with not trying hard and taking money. 

There is no signs he tries hard at all.
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You are just being ridiculous and over the top dramatic at this point.  Not very useful.

 
Rally Monkey said:
Can anyone even really say what he does well at this point besides sit on the IR like a rockstar? 
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Win leagues? I know it's a what have you done for me lately world. But he had multiple years bringing championships home.
RB is the most volatile position. It requires some luck to be able to ride your horse to the finish line. 

 
It is interesting Booker was the Giants player who appeared before the media yesterday. Usually it’s HC, the QB, one other offensive player - like, say, Team Captain Sequon Barkley - and a defensive player. Typically veterans or stars of the game. 

From here it could go a couple different directions. Maybe he’s the latest example of a used up running back (from David Johnson to Earl Campbell and scores in between.)

Of he’s yet another case of Y1 after a major injury not being the final chapter. Oftentimes it isn’t until Y2 before a player is back to himself.

I favor the former over the latter but none of us knows rn.

 
BobbyLayne said:
It is interesting Booker was the Giants player who appeared before the media yesterday. Usually it’s HC, the QB, one other offensive player - like, say, Team Captain Sequon Barkley - and a defensive player. Typically veterans or stars of the game. 

From here it could go a couple different directions. Maybe he’s the latest example of a used up running back (from David Johnson to Earl Campbell and scores in between.)

Of he’s yet another case of Y1 after a major injury not being the final chapter. Oftentimes it isn’t until Y2 before a player is back to himself.

I favor the former over the latter but none of us knows rn.
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I think Saquon Barkley and David Johnson have had pretty similar careers to this point. They also are similar style players, where they have great size, but win most in space.

Personally, I want no part of Barkley going forward, and I'm kinda disappointed I got sucked into taking him this year, when I could absolutely see this season coming. Seemed like such a potential steal in the mid 2nd round. Oh well. 

 
travdogg said:
I think Saquon Barkley and David Johnson have had pretty similar careers to this point. They also are similar style players, where they have great size, but win most in space.

Personally, I want no part of Barkley going forward, and I'm kinda disappointed I got sucked into taking him this year, when I could absolutely see this season coming. Seemed like such a potential steal in the mid 2nd round. Oh well. 
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Barkley was a different prospect in every way. He was 3 years younger coming into the league, had high draft capital, and had a much better collegiate career. Barkley's produced at a high level until this year. DJ had a couple of good years. One ELITE year. The only comparison is both players are top notch people IRL. 

I've seen enough. It's time to put offers out to Barkley owners after next week. I'm buying on all this terrible sentiment. 

 
dipandglide said:
Barkley was a different prospect in every way. He was 3 years younger coming into the league, had high draft capital, and had a much better collegiate career. Barkley's produced at a high level until this year. DJ had a couple of good years. One ELITE year. The only comparison is both players are top notch people IRL. 

I've seen enough. It's time to put offers out to Barkley owners after next week. I'm buying on all this terrible sentiment. 
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I meant mostly in the sense that they are both underachievers as power backs despite their size, they are both more of the scatback type, and both have been pretty meh after season #2.

 
Rally Monkey said:
Yesterdays game, which was close at the half!

15 carries for 32 yards and 1 catch for -4 yards. 

28 total yards. Not an outlier, his typical stat line we have come to get use too.

0 - 100 yard games this year. 

0 - 70 yard games this year.

1  - 60 yard game this year.

2  - 20 yard games

Last rushing TD - October 3rd. Almost 3 months ago. Three. Dudes is so good he hasnt found the stripe rushing in 3 months. Infact, he doesnt know how to find the stripe even when given the ball at the GL. 
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Saquon Barkley has 2 carries inside the 5 all year lol. He’s 1/2 on these carries. Good facts though!

 
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Rally Monkey said:
Oh this rhetoric, I mean when you have nothing to defend Barkley with, you have rhetoric.

This is a thing, unless you love Saquan Barkley you are troll. Maybe the trolls are you people defending an awful player who has done nothing but get hurt cuz you wanna be captain-save-a-player on a forum.  

Again stats prove he sucks and those saying he is good or even capable in the least are clearly not watching football. Fanboys will fanboy cuz they own him in fantasy. Maybe thats what makes me see the obvious, Im not jaded because I dont play fantasy or drafted him in a league.  Im not trying to talk up a player to make me feel better about owning or drafting such a bad player. 
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I'm curious about what drew you to a fantasy football community given that you don't play fantasy.

RE: Barkley, sometimes the data you gather from watching football supports the stats and sometimes it doesn't. What I've watched suggests to me Barkley has been hurt and has been in a really bad situation. If you're arguing that he should be able to put up great stats in spite of those obstacles, I don't think you've proven he sucks. I think you've only proven he's not Barry Sanders.

 
Rally Monkey said:
I love responses like this, Im about to show you why. LOL You bolded the last line in my entire post, ignoring all other facts. But hey, you got likes on the internet. Cool! Lets discuss your only response since you didnt dispute any others.

The last line was... "Infact, he doesnt know how to find the stripe even when given the ball at the GL."

And your response was a stat saying finding the endzone once out of twice means he knows how to find the endzone? Correct. I sense from the condensation that was your point. 

I guess some have to be told, a players whole career matters, so...tell me his TDs rates in 2019 his last season with reasonable carries. Nevermind, Ill do it to save you trouble and to prove I am right and you are wrong, lets hear from the player himself. Isnt that the point of these forums, to have some friendly discussion with a few gotchas here and there. 

That was your attempt at a gotcha, lets do mine...

First, lets post a link where the player discusses for himself his lack of ability to score at the GL.

https://giantswire.usatoday.com/2020/07/04/new-york-giants-saquon-barkley-goal-line/

You can click the link, but the opening is nice and kinda brings it home for me. The first two paragraphs...You ready for this? You ready? Ok, Here it is...

So thats 1-7 in 2019. 0-fer in 2020, and 1 of 2 in 2021. Thats 2-9 in 2019 and 2021 and he didnt score in 2020 and only had 3 carries inside the redzone though I cant find his GL touches. None the less, those are good facts.

So, is your angle that 2 for 9 since 2019 is good from inside the 5 yard line when you have Barkley quads? I must just be trolling with my facts and links proving my point about Barkley, I guess. 
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Fast forward 1 year, end of season 2022, what do Saquon's stats look like?  

 
BobbyLayne said:
literally every thread he's in

I've yet to see him post anything besides [rhymes with pit] posts
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Even if he’s right about something, being as abrasive as he is makes others dismiss him and view him as a drama queen or miserable person.  It’s not a good look in any way.  People who do that don’t influence others to see their points and are ineffective communicators.

 
JohnnyU said:
Even if he’s right about something, being as abrasive as he is makes others dismiss him and view him as a drama queen or miserable person.  It’s not a good look in any way.  People who do that don’t influence others to see their points and are ineffective communicators.
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It's a discussion that's worth having but, I agree, discussion style can be a turn off. It's one of my pet peeves on message boards in general. There's no need to use language that is derogatory or inflames the discussion. Rally presented some really good information and his style is abrasive but our responses shouldn't necessarily point that out as it derails the discussion. Rebuttal should stick to the actual discussion and elide over the style/language.

Barkley has been a disappointment for sure and injuries have played a role in it as has the offensive line and QB play. He hasn't looked very good at all this year (I own him in one league so I watch closely) but that offense is terrible and does not use his strengths. He needs to stay healthy and get his explosiveness back but he looks average right now. I'm hopeful going forward but hesitant to rank him too high. If he falls into the end of the RB2 range or better the RB3 range I will take the chance. He's too big a risk as a RB1 for me.

 
Rally Monkey said:
I understand your points, we also have to understand some people just type and they dont sit and proof read every thing to make sure they are worried about offending people, Im talking football, im not really worried or shouldnt be worried people taking talk about players personally. That seems strange itself. 

I agree, respond to the football talk, who cares how someone says it if they are not insulting you. Good point. I like smart alec people too, it adds something sometimes.

What always gets me is in such a violent game of hitting and injuries and even blood, same dudes who may watch MMA and boxing and hockey to see fights, care about abrasive tone on the internet still in 2021. As if because one is abrasive it makes them a bad person. I know many abrasive talking people who have the biggest hearts. So whatever. 

There is a scen in Dexter where Harrison was wrestling a kid, and the kid was bullying him, head butting him, drew blood. All parents were cheering, and as Dexter says in the scene "Normal people are so strange." Meaning parents are cheering on a violent fight, but at the end, Harrison broke the dudes arm and everyone flipped out. Take that for what its worth. 

Im hear to discuss football, not worry about if you guys like me or my style. If you dont like my points because Im abrasive, oh well. Dont respond, and ignore me. I aint worried, Im still gonna talk football as I'm not breaking any rules until the rules state you cant insult NFL football players, Im good.  I dont name call and I dont insult any poster, but I will insult awful players who make millions. Some people like to always be positive, I like to be negative about bad players because maybe it makes others see it isnt all roses, roses can really smell like, oh well you get it. As everyone else loves positivity, almost too much, so much so it makes them say things like Barkley is good to appear rational when saying such is anything but. I criticize, I discuss and at no point trolled anyone who didnt respond with condescending in anyway.  Welcome to the real world where people dont always talk in the tone you want them to. 

Now back to football, I love talking football. Anywhere, Twitter, Facebook, Radio shows, here. Found this place from twitter actually. I know this much, fantasy players are jaded. I played for 20 years, have not played in 3 now...its different. I talk football on a real sense that doesnt take fantasy points into account. 

I loved Barkley after his rookie year, my last year of fantasy. I owned him. He was un real, I watched him so much and won a title because of him, I love all player who won me cash, how can one not.

So that being said, I loathe him as a player because the heart and will and drive he played with isnt there anymore. I wont mince words, he isnt playing with any heart at all. You can see it in his runs. I watched the Lions as a fan and people on that 0-16 team years back tried hard. Dan Campbell, who I am not a fan of very much, does have a heart of a Lion though. That type of heart in a player isnt in Barkley. Thats bothers me as a fan. When he was a rook, you were not stopping him. Now, you can push him over if he even runs toward you and not the sideline. 

Also, some of you who call me abrasive probably love those shows with the abrasive mouthy guy. lol Just different seeing it written out I guess.
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No worries. I'm not offended by your post. We all have our preferences but it shouldn't cloud our discussions.

I agree that Barkley does not look to be playing with the same passion. Is he playing scared of getting hurt again? Or his physical skills have deteriorated because of the injuries? Who knows but I am not totally writing him off quite yet. Like I mentioned in a previous post, I like him as an upside RB3 more than a RB2.

 
It’s just as important how you say something as it is what you say, if you want to be effective with your communication.

 
I think the Giants should shut him down for the year. They aren't going anywhere and it would give Barkley a nice head start in trying to get back to 100%.  Anyone watching can see he's not close to what he was pre-ACL tear. It doesn't help that he's smothered the instant he gets the handoff, but at this point, Booker even looks better. The same Booker who was behind both Lindsay and Freeman in Denver. 

Sit him down and hope the explosive, dynamic top 3 RB in the league can make it back next year. Watching a 75% Barkley get mauled at the line isn't productive for him or the team. 

 
Quakertown Tom said:
I think the Giants should shut him down for the year. They aren't going anywhere and it would give Barkley a nice head start in trying to get back to 100%.  Anyone watching can see he's not close to what he was pre-ACL tear. It doesn't help that he's smothered the instant he gets the handoff, but at this point, Booker even looks better. The same Booker who was behind both Lindsay and Freeman in Denver. 

Sit him down and hope the explosive, dynamic top 3 RB in the league can make it back next year. Watching a 75% Barkley get mauled at the line isn't productive for him or the team. 
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i agree and another devastating injury now with nothing to play for would be a bad 2022 business decision for the Giants.

 
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Saquon Barkley rushed 21 times for 102 yards in the Giants' Week 17 loss to the Bears.

Mike Glennon had two turnovers on the Giants’ first two possessions, which led to Joe Judge almost wholly refusing to call a pass play for the rest of the game. That led to Barkley and Devontae Booker having high-volume days, and the former actually had pretty respectable efficiency, although it still didn’t lead to many fantasy points since he didn’t score and wasn’t involved as a pass-catcher. Barkley is splitting snaps with Booker on the worst offense in football right now. Despite his big-name appeal, Barkley’s short-term outlook isn’t great.

Jan 2, 2022, 3:57 PM ET
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What in the world do we do with him in dynasty?  

I almost feel like I have to hold.  He's only 24.  He's been injured off and on the last 3 years.  He's had a few nice games but hasn't gotten back to the world beater form he was as a rookie.  And then the Giants are just a Giant dumpster fire.  

 
jm192 said:
What in the world do we do with him in dynasty?  

I almost feel like I have to hold.  He's only 24.  He's been injured off and on the last 3 years.  He's had a few nice games but hasn't gotten back to the world beater form he was as a rookie.  And then the Giants are just a Giant dumpster fire.  
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I am in the same boat, I placed him on my trade Bait and will see what chum drops in the water. 

 
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