Bucsfan5493
Footballguy
You literally said ‘I’m racist simply because I’m white’. But no one even said anything remotely close to that so why did you say it? Because you feel the majority of people outside of this forum actually think that?
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I'm tired of hearing about race (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter supermike80
- Start date
supermike80
Footballguy
I did say that HOWEVER, I did not accuse anyone in the thread of saying that. So watch your accusations and if you are going to accuse me of putting words in someone's mouth, you might want to check yourself first.
Bucsfan5493
Footballguy
Actually, 37% of the Republican Party says black people face no discrimination so seems like you’re wrong on that one.
supermike80
Footballguy
I don't know...I don't know you. I cant tell you why you think what you think. Sorry. Looks like Mookie might be able to help you with that however.
supermike80
Footballguy
Polls!!! Well if you havent been here long Sho and Tim can tell you what I think of polls.
But good stuff.
If you discount every poll out of hand do you have a plan to honestly track where we are as a nation on a number of important issues? Or do you just not like the polls you don't support?
Polling is a solid statistical tool and an important component of understanding our communities
supermike80
Footballguy
I reject all polls. I believe the majority of them are biased and are created not to poll, but to push a position. So yes quick answer is I reject all polls.
crackattack
Footballguy
I wanna add just a little to this. I know it's anecdotal and I'm sure I could find plenty more examples.
Let's take the Meghan Markle, Morgan, and Osbourne situation. It has been repeated by people like Don Lemon, some of his guests, and other prominent African Americans. Their stance is if you're white, and "automatically don't believe a African Americans" claim of racism, then you, the white individuals are racist. Is it possible to just not believe a claim of racism without proof and not be racist? Can I require evidence and not a he said she said and not be racist?
It's gotten out of hand with the "unconscious bias", "systemic racism", and rhetoric about "white supremacy". I get tired of people saying things like this. That's what turns me off. I just want to treat everyone the way they'll treat me.
FairWarning
Footballguy
fatguyinalittlecoat
Footballguy
Race has a lot of explanatory power, I'm not sure how not talking about race would even work.
"Mom, Grandpa grew up in Alabama but he went to college in a different state, why?'
"Sorry kid, can't tell you."
"Mom, Grandpa grew up in Alabama but he went to college in a different state, why?'
"Sorry kid, can't tell you."
Yenrub
Footballguy
So can you provide the examples (of the transgressions you were referring to and how they were made up) or not?
Bucsfan5493
Footballguy
Don Lemon is a primetime CNN host who literally makes a living off of lying to his viewers to rile them up. I mentioned this the other day in another thread but I don’t view him and Cuomo any different than Tucker and Hannity on FOX. So yes, I wish they would stop with that bull#### just like I wish Tucker and Hannity would stop pushing their racist narratives.
squistion
Footballguy
I have never heard or seen a quote by Don Lemon saying that someone is racist simply because they're white.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Sorry, I guess when somebody says "every day life", I take that to mean in real life, not online. Hence the question so he could clarify.
We all have this warped perspective that online stuff represents real life.
dkp993
Footballguy
Why can’t there be space for both? I can understand how the preponderance of headlines about racial issues can become overwhelming or tiresome when your daily experiences don’t involve racism or you don’t feel you have racism in your heart. But that also doesn’t mean there aren’t people who do experience racism with consistency or that institutional racism doesn’t exist for many.
Both experiences can be true and accurate hence the complexity of the issue. And unfortunately we still have a long way to go to bridge all the different gaps.
supermike80
Footballguy
Beyond what some are saying here, I am not advocating we end the conversation over race. Of course not. But is there a point where it is as frequent as it is now, does it become muted?
supermike80
Footballguy
I mean if this needs explaining to you, maybe sit back and let those that know the topic discuss it and you can educate yourself about this thread, rather than posting things when you have no idea, or don't understand, what the topic is about?
dkp993
Footballguy
For some yes, for others no and more is warranted. A persons daily life experiences probably shape that opinion.
crackattack
Footballguy
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.foxnews.com/media/don-lemon-racist-born-us.amp&ved=2ahUKEwiCsLSU4sbvAhWVUs0KHT6zAl8QFjADegQIDBAC&usg=AOvVaw3Nd3BXx_cL3-uYa3UnU3lk&ampcf=1
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.washingtonpost.com/arts-entertainment/2018/10/31/cnn-host-don-lemon-said-white-men-are-biggest-terror-threat-this-country/%3FoutputType%3Damp&ved=2ahUKEwiCsLSU4sbvAhWVUs0KHT6zAl8QFjAJegQIBRAC&usg=AOvVaw136rweNElcVrED-tKBnvAJ&ampcf=1
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/03/08/don_lemon_on_british_royals_of_course_theyre_racist_thats_what_the_entire_monarchy_is_built_on.amp.html&ved=2ahUKEwiqvsvW48bvAhUEZc0KHarFDEAQFjAIegQIBxAC&usg=AOvVaw07nzkZLT0yj4CDbzWLFef6&ampcf=1
White people are racist is his theme in every one of these posts. There's many more links out there.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I understand and agree with some of this, but even me the bolded goes a bit too far. I do like that you put the "reflect upon" part in there though. I think the most important thing is try to think about and listen to other people's experiences. But we have to be honest - so many people have other things to do to get through daily life, and maybe protesting or speaking up SM or around here is not something they have time for or are comfortable doing. That doesn't mean they accept what's going on.
supermike80
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
He has never said, as claimed, that someone is racist simply because they're white.
supermike80
Footballguy
Countdown till squish or sho says "He didnt say WORD FOR WORD" what you said. Just wait.
supermike80
Footballguy
dkp993
Footballguy
Absolutely, perspective and personal experience are a MF’er. I think we would all be better off if we could practice daily trying to understand other peoples perspectives.
*(For clarity sake I wasn’t making a comment on your statement or perspective it was a comment to the general “we”)
crackattack
Footballguy
Then what is he implying in those links? To me he's implying whites and the royals can't help but to being racist. It's built in to where they live, or history or "whiteness". Like he said. It's right there in his own words. If you want to do semantics, fine, he didn't explicitly say if your white then you're racist. But its heavily implied.
squistion
Footballguy
But he didn't specifically say that. It was an inference that was drawn that I don't agree with.
supermike80
Footballguy
Dude..There is no chance I would ever have a discussion with you or Sho. Whatever you say I tend to agree with immediately and without hesitation.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
Could you be more condescending?
Others have noted changes in the workplace, with bosses and the like. I was curious if that's what he was talking about. Sure my question could have been more specific.
supermike80
Footballguy
crackattack
Footballguy
supermike80
Footballguy
I dont have tolerance for games. If you legitimately don't know what I'm talking about, then stay out of the conversation. Sorry. No patience for that kind of garbage. If you wanna have a legit conversation, I'm down. If you wanna discuss what the meaning of the word "is" is, well I just don't want to play.
supermike80
Footballguy
Im 99% sure its the same person actually.I know. I have sho on ignore for that very reason. Maybe I should update the list
squistion
Footballguy
I could live with that.I know. I have sho on ignore for that very reason. Maybe I should update the list
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
The funny thing is, I wasn't conversing with you there or asking you that question. Feel free to pass over my posts or add me to your ignore list.
supermike80
Footballguy
squistion
Footballguy
Words have meaning. I seriously doubt that Don Lemon thinks that Chris Cuomo, Anderson Cooper or the other white people he works with at CNN are racists.
supermike80
Footballguy
Well as we know, not only do they have meaning but they better be said TWICE..Or it wont be accepted here by some.
squistion
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
I am not going to argue that, but at the bare minimum if those quotes are accurate, he is contradictory:
"It depends on the nutrients in the soil. So if you grew up in America, you came out of American soil. Considering the history of this country ... how can you not be racist? How can you not have racial blindspots, how can you not see that the factory reset in America is whiteness?"
"Listen, white people are so scared right now to do anything, to talk about anything, to broach these conversations. They’re sort of frozen because who wants to be called a racist, right? Who wants people to think that they have a racial blindspot?" he said.
crackattack
Footballguy
That was my point. He's saying it. Just in the "unconscious bias" sort of way. It's his own words. Can't help but be racist because of "whiteness", or where one is born, or because of history or hereditary reasons. It's nonsense.
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Insein
Footballguy
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
IMO we have gone a bit too far the other way. The bottom line is people wanting change and wanting people to be empathetic to their lives and experiences also have to be willing to take a deep breath and reflect that back on the other person. I guess what I am saying I think that part of what Lemon and others are saying is correct - we have biases. That is natural and that doesn't make us racists. There could be all sorts reasons for that like has been discussed in the thread - not growing up around any PoC, maybe having a bad encounter with somebody, growing up with bigoted family members, and dozens of other factors largely out of our control. We need to keep that in mind, which is why I think people have that very visceral reactions to that message of we are all racists. We need to get better on focusing more on if we continually act on our biases. Maybe that made more sense in my head, sorry if that's the case.
In the end, too much has been taken away from people's intent in their words and actions and our forgiveness and understanding is eroding too. It started down that path a bit with "micro aggressions" and the like. If I accidently bump into you, you probably aren't going to cry foul and claim that I hit you. Now if I accidently say a wrong phrase or word, that same standard doesn't seem to apply as much and it's all about how that phrase made somebody feel.
I am still optimistic that the pendulum will swing back the other way a bit, but I understand that there seem to be many in here that don't share that feeling.
Shula-holic
Footballguy
I think it's worse than muted. I think when every story becomes about race it creates more racists. When people are grouped by race and viewed as positive or negative for those reasons alone and not on their value as individuals, what other outcome is there?
djmich
Footballguy
Linking this article on substack from John McWhorter (sorry, its rather long). I think it is thought provoking and imo the thinking helps to bridge some of the big gaps that often exist when people talk about race.
Specifically, the gap between "we as a society have removed much of the racist obstacles of the past" and "there are still hurdles keeping black people...black children is where he focuses...from achieving on par with whites".
The common cry to is to point out that existing systemic racism, white supremacy, whatever you want to call it is the cause...and understandably you have a generation of white people today, raised to judge people on the content of their character, saying "wtf" thats not me.
That doesn't mean racism doesnt exist today. But McWhorter attributes much of todays gap to racist practices from the past that although the actual racism is now largely gone has resulted internal norms within the black community that create major obstacles. The net is that the issues and solutions are complex.
Specifically, the gap between "we as a society have removed much of the racist obstacles of the past" and "there are still hurdles keeping black people...black children is where he focuses...from achieving on par with whites".
The common cry to is to point out that existing systemic racism, white supremacy, whatever you want to call it is the cause...and understandably you have a generation of white people today, raised to judge people on the content of their character, saying "wtf" thats not me.
That doesn't mean racism doesnt exist today. But McWhorter attributes much of todays gap to racist practices from the past that although the actual racism is now largely gone has resulted internal norms within the black community that create major obstacles. The net is that the issues and solutions are complex.
gianmarco
Footballguy
White teacher's racism revealed on Zoom call
This is why we still hear about it. For every one teacher (or whoever) that makes a mistake like this and leaves their camera off, there are certainly others who think/feel the same way but don't leave the camera running.
This is why we still hear about it. For every one teacher (or whoever) that makes a mistake like this and leaves their camera off, there are certainly others who think/feel the same way but don't leave the camera running.
djmich
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
Of course that's awful. And it's another part of it. But most everyone wants to say "yeah, but those acts of racist violence don't happen very often. But in everyday life, racism doesn't exist nearly as much".
Yet, in California, we see where a "trusted" member of society, a teacher, holds these kinds of views. And this teacher was actually doing a good thing by Zooming with the student after school and working with him. But, with that viewpoint, that bias will undoubtedly influence her teaching and her grading and her expectations and it's why we see studies that show that black students perform differently and are treated differently. I think we can agree she's not the only one (just the one we found out about). And her influence is with multiple children, year after year, along with any others like her.
So, for those that are tired of hearing about racism, this is what that student and every other minority student she has taught has dealt with without even knowing about it.
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