I don't know about the salesman since we didn't get a cut but the finance guys cares. If you are financing through them all the interest goes to them. Unless you are talking the 0% loans. They just want to sellDo the salesmen prefer you finance or pay cash?
Overall they prefer you finance, but not much. Most banks are just playing a flat fee to F&I teams now. They throw 200-300 to the dealership for the loan origination and doing the paperwork. Too much competition for cheap money to hold rate.Do the salesmen prefer you finance or pay cash?
Wow i just got my fighting chance packet. This seems like a load of work to save.. What.. a grand?
FWIW, I've used Checkbook.com's CarBargain as a buyer using this same process in the past.I emailed several Honda dealerships in my area asking for the best out the door price, explaining I know the cars well and will simply come buy from whoever has the best offer, no test drive no nothin.
All replied, none will come close to even giving me a quote.
Good luck? A car that will be in high demand during a period of supply chain issues doesn't seem like you're going to sniff it even at invoice.Any tips for purchasing a new Nissan Z without paying way over invoice?
Yeah I know. Wishful thinking.Good luck? A car that will be in high demand during a period of supply chain issues doesn't seem like you're going to sniff it even at invoice.
Any tips for purchasing a new Nissan Z without paying way over invoice?
Have you seen this? It's a timeline on the release of the new Z, pretty cool I thought.
https://www.newnissanz.com/threads/2023-nissan-z-launch-timeline-revealed-production-media-first-drives-sales-start.1066/
I was driving through my local Ford dealership and I noticed they had the sticker price, ADM and all these BS fees tacked on the price of a badlands Bronco (I'm not interested in a Bronco but my eye wanders toward F-150's every now and then) but I spotted this insane markup of like $25,000 and I just cannot wrap my mind around this. I cannot believe people are just so damned stupid with their money that would do this. I don't care if you're a millionaire, unless you won the lottery, why would you waste your money this way? Look at this, scroll through this link, to my shock (and horror) these dealerships are right near me here in Indy. Brutal! Those are from 2021 but I'm STILL seeing markups like this on Broncos, come on people, don't piss away your hard earned money like this!
This x 1000I hate dealerships.
HFS on those up charges. I 100% don’t get it either. If those charges are there that means people have already paid them or else the dealership wouldn’t be selling anything.Have you seen this? It's a timeline on the release of the new Z, pretty cool I thought.
https://www.newnissanz.com/threads/2023-nissan-z-launch-timeline-revealed-production-media-first-drives-sales-start.1066/
I was driving through my local Ford dealership and I noticed they had the sticker price, ADM and all these BS fees tacked on the price of a badlands Bronco (I'm not interested in a Bronco but my eye wanders toward F-150's every now and then) but I spotted this insane markup of like $25,000 and I just cannot wrap my mind around this. I cannot believe people are just so damned stupid with their money that would do this. I don't care if you're a millionaire, unless you won the lottery, why would you waste your money this way? Look at this, scroll through this link, to my shock (and horror) these dealerships are right near me here in Indy. Brutal! Those are from 2021 but I'm STILL seeing markups like this on Broncos, come on people, don't piss away your hard earned money like this!
The dealership I work at is one of them that is not. Good luck getting a New vehicle unless you order and wait though. GM has been very stingy with giving us allocations for new units to be built and 95% of the vehicles we are ordering are sold. Every once in a while we will get a transport in that has a couple unsold units on it, but the vast majority are already sold when the transport brings them.There are very few dealerships these days not marking up new cars by thousands. But, I would call around, there may be some out there with more scruples.
The alternative is to order a Tesla. They don’t mark up as far as I know. They have been raising prices, but what you lock in at online is what you pay. Also look at Rivian and maybe Polestar who may be similar.
The dealership I work at is one of them that is not. Good luck getting a New vehicle unless you order and wait though. GM has been very stingy with giving us allocations for new units to be built and 95% of the vehicles we are ordering are sold. Every once in a while we will get a transport in that has a couple unsold units on it, but the vast majority are already sold when the transport brings them.
I don't think my dealership is requiring a deposit but I am not sure (I am just a lowly Service Manager lol). You come in and build the vehicle they way you want, when we receive an allocation for the model you are looking to buy, we will place the order with your specs to be built. When the vehicle is delivered to the dealership, you are contacted and come in to fill out the paperwork and purchase. Have a trade is a bit of an issue because it is hard to give a trade value not knowing how long it will take to build and receive the vehicle and how many miles are put on the trade in during that time. I don't think we are requiring a deposit because if the vehicle comes in and you don't want it, it won't take very long to find someone that does in the current market.Personally I don’t care if I have to wait a year. Whats this process like? Ive never done a “preorder”. Do I just go and plop 5-10k down for a preorder?
I don’t think Nissan let’s you put in an order. We had deposits on a Nissan Leaf in 3 states and one came in after 2.5 months. They let us buy it at MSRP. Nissan also suspended their friends and neighbor programs (VPP).Personally I don’t care if I have to wait a year. Whats this process like? Ive never done a “preorder”. Do I just go and plop 5-10k down for a preorder?
This is very similar to most Ford stores.I don't think my dealership is requiring a deposit but I am not sure (I am just a lowly Service Manager lol). You come in and build the vehicle they way you want, when we receive an allocation for the model you are looking to buy, we will place the order with your specs to be built. When the vehicle is delivered to the dealership, you are contacted and come in to fill out the paperwork and purchase. Have a trade is a bit of an issue because it is hard to give a trade value not knowing how long it will take to build and receive the vehicle and how many miles are put on the trade in during that time. I don't think we are requiring a deposit because if the vehicle comes in and you don't want it, it won't take very long to find someone that does in the current market.
I bought an Infiniti QX60, Sensory Package a few weeks ago. When I say bought, I mean I added my name to a 40+ person waitlist and was told 4-6 months for delivery of the vehicle. Price at MSRP at that time, regardless of paying cash or financing.
My daughter just graduated from college and needs to get a new car. She has a job as a teacher - contract, decent credit (675 Experian which Chase calls "good"). The issue is that with inventories low, she's getting the runaround on the cars she wants. Either huge markups (hyundai - we're talking 20% over MSRP) or today Subaru guy told her the car is coming and she'd have to deposit $1,000 to "hold" it. No commitment on APR or out the door cost (need to wait until the car shows up on their lot - even though it's advertised already on Autotrader). She asked if she gets her money back if she doesn't end up liking the terms and his answer was yes if there's a medical emergency or death or something. Otherwise it would be up to his manager??
I told her to get to her bank and see if she can get a preapproval so she doesn't have to negotiate rates, and negotiate price once the car actually shows up. Any other suggestions for getting a decent deal on a new car in her situation? It's crazy to me that she knows exactly what she wants and what it should cost, and she can't even seem to get close to a deal without red flags popping up everywhere.
Unfortunately they hold the cards right now.Check markups.org to find dealers who charge over MSRP, and then don't shop there.
I recently bought a Toyota 4runner. In Charlotte (my general area), there are 4 Toyota dealers: two on this list charging markups and 2 that do not. Behind Charlotte, I found around 20 other dealers within 150 miles or so that do not.Unfortunately they hold the cards right now.
The car lots are 25% full here, mainly used also. It can be done, but it’s a lot more work now. I think the dealers selling at under list are few and far between when you are away from a metro area.I recently bought a Toyota 4runner. In Charlotte (my general area), there are 4 Toyota dealers: two on this list charging markups and 2 that do not. Behind Charlotte, I found around 20 other dealers within 150 miles or so that do not.
It just takes a bit of legwork. I used markups.org to eliminate any MSRP dealers from consideration.
I don't think you can find under list but at list - they are out there. It just takes some legwork...and getting out of the metro area certainly helps too.The car lots are 25% full here, mainly used also. It can be done, but it’s a lot more work now. I think the dealers selling at under list are few and far between when you are away from a metro area.
I'm curious if anyone here has used an auto broker or "car buying concierge" service?moleculo said:TL/DR: I was picky and did my shopping completely via the internet, which is not as easy as it should be.
My fleet averages 15.75. The 1975 280Z really swings it. Otherwise average 5.5Average U.S. vehicle is now a record 12.2 years old
Thanks for posting this.moleculo said:Below was my process for car shopping -
TL/DR: I was picky and did my shopping completely via the internet, which is not as easy as it should be.
As expensive as new cars are these days, I wanted something that I will be happy with for 20 years. I bought my last truck in 2005 and only got rid of it because the transmission broke twice - I wasn't going to replace it a second time. That means, I am not the kind of guy who needs a new vehicle every 5 years or so, so I might as well get exactly what I want, including trim and color. I settled on a Toyota 4runner, TRD off-road premium, in blue, with minimal other add-on features. This process would have been much easier if I was willing to settle for white, silver, grey or black, or if I was willing to pay thousands extra for things like running boards or blacked out logos and wheels.
I poked around some other forums for info on how this works these days. On 4runners.com, I found a link listing every Toyota dealer in the country. I narrowed that down to dealers within 100 miles of me, and filtered that list to exclude anyone charging over MSRP. I was left with about 20 dealers.
I quickly learned that dealers don't have what they show on their web page. The vehicles they list are probably pre-sold, if they even exist. Lots are empty, but they can't exactly that their web pages be empty, can they? You can't trust the web pages for availability at all - you have to work with an actual dealer.
I went on toyota.com and built my vehicle. At the end of the process, you can email your build to your local dealer (based on your zip code). I changed my zip code so I could send my build to all 20 of these dealers. This process puts you in contact with the internet sales specialist at each dealership, and not a typical lot guy. The internet guys are more tech savvy and capable of working with you over email. I specifically left my phone number and address blank for this step - I want communication only over email until we are close to a deal, and I didn't want to be ignored because I'm not local.
I suppose I should mention that I made a new email address for this process - I used protonmail.com. That gave me a separate app that would alert me immediately if something popped up, but also I can throw it away when I'm done with this.
I got a ton of responses of dealers asking when I can come in and take a look. Ugh, no, just tell me if you have exactly what I want. I got a lot of , "would you consider this truck that is completely different?", "We just got this used vehicle that doesn't match your requirements. When can you come in and take a look?" "Wouldn't you prefer we text you?" I get it. Dealers jobs is to get you to close, and the easiest way to do that is get you on property and appeal to emotion, and they can only sell what they have.
Email only made it a lot easier to cut through all of that. It takes some time. Eventually I found some dealers willing to do a "custom order", but I later learned that really means they will take my deposit and try to do a dealer swap with no target date. This could end up being a 6-12 month endeavor, but they would never say that.
After a week or so of that, I figured out that all of the dealers I had communicated with are in the same sales region. If they are going to do dealer swaps, they are all competing from the same pool. So I opened up my search to include Tennessee and Virginia, both in different sales territories, just because they have different pools to swap with.
Finally I found what I was looking for: a dealer in Virginia had an unclaimed allocation of exactly what I want, on a freighter inbound from Japan. It was maybe 6 weeks out from being on the lot. A little back and forth, I was even able to get them to knock $500 off, and I put down my deposit. This is the only opportunity you have to negotiate so be careful here.
The dealer wanted to tack on $800 for sanitizing due to COVID. I get it - they are using whatever tricks they can to make money. I told them that we didn't need that because COVID was over and he knocked it down to $300. Ugh. I hate these games but it's better than the $2500 "market adjustment" other dealers were asking. And I got it all in writing. Toyota actually raised the MSRP by $350 between this stage and when I took delivery so having this documented saved me more.
Closing was a pain in the ###. The finance people pressured me to use their bank, and then the hard sell on extended warranty, paint warranty and lifetime service contracts. It was about $10k they tried to upsell me on. No thanks.
It was a big hassle and it's not easy but it is possible to find what you want at MSRP. You just have to wade thru the typical dealer BS.
In my opinion, absolutely. The legwork is more about availability though. Its a lot easier if you are less picky. Had I wanted a black, silver, or grey 4runner, and was open to different trim packages, it would have been much easier.I get that it's a pain in the butt to do some of this legwork, but saving 5-10 grand+ is worth the legwork, no?
Hmm, that surprised me a bit, but I guess the prices have made more people say nope, I’m not paying $30k for a 5 year old Civic. My son’s cars are 11/12 but mine is 7 and my wife’s is almost 2. I guess we do average 8, but honestly, I’d say we are on the old side for our area. Hopefully, all will keep going strong for a while. Have a third son so my car will likely go to him or my oldest, since it’s the nicest but I think I’d like to get a wee bit longer with only 1 payment.Average U.S. vehicle is now a record 12.2 years old