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Campingguys -- Any and all advice welcome for upcoming trip (1 Viewer)

IrishTwinkie said:
Oh, and I'll second the no cotton thing. NO COTTON! For anything. Ever. Get wicking materials. It will rain. Cotton is a heavy sponge that will never dry out and lose all insulation properties. No cotton.
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Thirded. Lightweight synthetics or wool. It will be cold at night so a lightweight compressible down jacket/sweater will be nice, and can double as a pillow.

Also bring extra duct tape for makeshift repairs and first aid.

 
break everything in now or its blister and friction burn city during the hike and bring athletic tape to put over blisters and friction burns take that to the bank brohan. 

 
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gianmarco said:
We are sending our 16 year old on a 3 week camping trip/excursion later this month. The trip is up in Wyoming and will include a variety of activities including climbing, hiking, rafting.

There's an extensive packing and equipment list which we've gone through and pretty much gotten at this point. As he's still on the slight side (115 pounds) and will be carrying a decent amount of weight (35-40 pounds to start each week that will go down each day), we tried to focus on getting things that were lightweight.

Anyway, as I have essentially no experience with camping, I'm open to any tips and tricks I can try and pass along for when he leaves. The camp group he will be with will be teaching them everything they need to know, no experience is necessary, but figured it wouldn't hurt to ask here.

One basic question I had with him traveling there was how to even send the backpack. It's a 70L pack. Do we pack it in a suitcase? Fill it with supplies and just check it in as is? Something else?

Will hang up and listen.
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Buy a very good pair of Boots/Hikers. Don't get anything with Soles molded directly on the bottom of the foot. The shoe should be comfortable and I would buy them now if you can. Have him break them in walking around the house and when comfortable enough have him take a lap or two around the neighborhood and see how he feels. Worst thing for a hiker is bad shoes. Make sure the Boots are well protecting the feet. Bring extra socks and if he feels a sock is wet he NEEDS TO REPLACE IT ASAP. Worst thing is having Blisters while hiking for numerous days. Make sure he has plenty of bug spray.

If he's allowed to carry a Swiss Army knife or something similar show him how to use it. Those come in handy. Widdle sticks for marshmallows and other things at night or carve a nice walking stick. Also if you are giving him canned items these things have a can opener on them. 

Make sure he has a good water bottle or some sort of hot cold mug. As someone said already drink when you can often. 

Have him practice carrying the pack around so he gets use to the weight carried

Carry some reachable/easy snacks. Granola and trail mix type stuff and bars are good. 

Binoculars are a good tool to have plus a compass

Are they allowed to bring their phones? I would make sure you give him a portable charger maybe two in case of emergency's. More then a few times I went camping before we had the phones we do now we wished we had them. 

Walkie Talkies were always a good thing to have too

If he knows what trails and stuff he's on have him look the map over, mark certain big points so he'll know where he is. if Possible if theres Youtube video of these trails have him watch those so he knows what type of environment he's in

Don't put your hand in any hole. No idea what might be in there from a predator or what

Poncho and an extra one for rain. 

Know where specific locations are such as restock is, ranger station etc. 

Bathing suit or clothing that he doesn't mind getting wet on the raft. Bring change of clothes for that

Wear jeans or cargo pants. Cargo pants or cargo shorts are great for these things because they have multiple size pockets you can put stuff in. I keep my knife, swiss army multipurpose tool and other things in there. If theres stuff from the pack he can hook onto cargo pants or put in pockets have him put those there instead of on the backpack. 

Make sure he has a first aid kit 

Have 1-2 hats maybe a bandana or something to wipe sweat away. 

Bring plenty of bug spray and do not wear body spray. Deodorant cool but the bugs are attracted to the body spray stuff. 

If he can't bring cell phone have a camera so he can take plenty of pictures. 

Finally have him walk a few miles each day. This isn't something you can cold turkey just do. 

 
gianmarco said:
Some great stuff so far, thanks guys.

First of all, he won't be carrying all of his equipment.  The camp leaders/counselors will be carrying stuff for the group that isn't needed to be carried individually.  I also think they'll take turns with some of it.

Bodyglide -- we already have that and already planned on having him use it.  We have the new shoes and he's breaking them in.  Starting today, he's walking 30 minutes each day while wearing the hiking boots and backpack on the treadmill at 15% grade.  I'll start adding weight over the next couple days as he gets used to wearing the pack. 

We still need to get some trekking poles.  We weren't sure one way or the other but it seems it might be good for him to have. 
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Also is this a professional group, something from school, etc? Curious how this trip came about. 

 
Rustoleum said:
”Water” - We were in New Mexico high desert (Philmont Scout Ranch) and an internal hydration bladder was a must, plus whatever Nalgene or other water bottles (a plain old Powerade bottle will do just fine). You won’t drink enough if you have to reach for your bottle and just pulling a sip off the bladder without having to stop or think about it is huge. Then you have one bottle for just water (and nothing else) and the other to mix flavored stuff in. Depending on your bear precautions, the “smellable” goes up in the bearline at night (or in canister) and you can keep just the water around in camp.

Sounds like an awesome trip!
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Definitely seconding the call for a hydration bladder.  Used to think they were pretty silly but got one a number of years ago for a backpacking trip in Joshua Tree and realized I was an idiot (most likely a dehydrated one at that).  That plus a water bottle for in camp should work just fine.  

If he's using hiking poles, you can wrap some duct tape around them and use that as a means of carrying some duct tape without throwing a big roll in the pack.  For my "bowl", I often use an empty Talenti ice cream container.  I like it because you it's pretty darn easy to clean - just put some water in it, screw the lid on tight, shake it up and either toss it or drink it (I choose drink it - more calories and more water).  

 
AAABatteries said:
Trekking poles can save you from a nasty fall or worse but lots of young(er) people - read in shape with good balance- don’t use them.  With that much weight on his back just one small misstep and he’ll potentially go down.  I’m old-ish so I’d use them without a pack, no chance with weight on my back I wouldn’t use them.  Also can become a weapon against an animal if needed.
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Imo, if you are carrying weight, especially that much of your body weight, i wouldn't use poles.

 
gianmarco said:
We are sending our 16 year old on a 3 week camping trip/excursion later this month. The trip is up in Wyoming and will include a variety of activities including climbing, hiking, rafting.

There's an extensive packing and equipment list which we've gone through and pretty much gotten at this point. As he's still on the slight side (115 pounds) and will be carrying a decent amount of weight (35-40 pounds to start each week that will go down each day), we tried to focus on getting things that were lightweight.

Anyway, as I have essentially no experience with camping, I'm open to any tips and tricks I can try and pass along for when he leaves. The camp group he will be with will be teaching them everything they need to know, no experience is necessary, but figured it wouldn't hurt to ask here.

One basic question I had with him traveling there was how to even send the backpack. It's a 70L pack. Do we pack it in a suitcase? Fill it with supplies and just check it in as is? Something else?

Will hang up and listen.
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Do you know what elevation they will be at? This is a big challenge to someone not used to it.

 
AAABatteries said:
Curious why you say that - the extra weight when not using them?  
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The weight of aluminum and carbon fiber poles is inconsequential IMO. But I also don't understand why poles would be less useful when carrying more weight; although I don't think a young guy will need them either way, I feel they are more helpful when carrying big weight.

 
Terminalxylem said:
The weight of aluminum and carbon fiber poles is inconsequential IMO. But I also don't understand why poles would be less useful when carrying more weight; although I don't think a young guy will need them either way, I feel they are more helpful when carrying big weight.
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Yeah - like I mentioned earlier, I totally get why younger people who are strong and more importantly very balanced wouldn't bother using them with lighter weight and good footing.  But with that much weight and if the trails are rocky then I don't know why someone wouldn't use them. 

 
gianmarco said:
How do you treat your stuff? Spray? Soak? Do you treat sleeping bag and other stuff too?

Wife would like as much details on this as possible. And does it wash off?
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I spray the outside of my clothes.  Hat, shirt (both short and long sleeve), pants (or shorts - I wear pants all year) and socks - basically anything that could be exposed.  I spray a solid covering on each side of the clothing and then air dry.  Ideally, I hang them before spraying then just leave to dry.  I am in tick country so I also spray the inside of my pant cuffs and waist a little bit.

Once the permethrin dries it is bonded to the fabric and will stay on for ~2 months and several washings.  Normal rain or sweat will not impact it - the agitation in the washing machine is what breaks it down.

No need to spray the sleeping bag, and some poly or nylon fabrics will not absorb it anyway, but I do spray the outer mesh on my tarp tent and tent inner. 

I usually buy a bottle or 2 from Amazon every summer and treat the clothes I plan to wear regularly.

Side thought: look into a "sun shirt" with a hood if it will be hot and sunny there.  They are great in the summer to protect from sun and bugs while still being light weight - not a necessity, but still worth a look. 

 
I agree with the suggestion to bring duct tape.

If going into bear country, I don't agree with putting the tape on the poles. I do use poles, a 4 footed animal is more stable, they help with pacing and can help on descents/accents. However, duct tape is smell-able. if you put the tape on the poles, the poles will need to go up with the bear bag. Remember, any interaction with a bear is likely to lead to two losers, you and the bear. Just roll the tape up into a small roll, maybe 1/4 or 1/2inch diameter. You don't need a whole roll of it. If you don't like rolling it up, put it on the water bottle that will have the gatoraid/bug juice that gets sent up in the bear bag. The duct tape helps keeps the bottles straight.

 
Less than a week away.

Permethrin bought and applied to all clothes and gear. Thanks @Jaysus.

He's been doing 1 hour per day on the treadmill with 15% grade while wearing his hiking boots and his backpack with total 35 lbs of weight for the last 2 weeks. He said it's even starting to feel lighter.

Getting excited for him.  Thanks for all the help and advice in here.

 
Why would you put a piece of luggage into another piece of luggage? What’s the concern? I always pack my stuff in a backpack when we travel so my hands are free to carry everyone else’s ####. 

 
gianmarco said:
Less than a week away.

He's been doing 1 hour per day on the treadmill with 15% grade while wearing his hiking boots and his backpack with total 35 lbs of weight for the last 2 weeks. He said it's even starting to feel lighter.
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Good.  Now have him start doing 3 hours a day. 

 
gianmarco said:
Less than a week away.

Permethrin bought and applied to all clothes and gear. Thanks @Jaysus.

He's been doing 1 hour per day on the treadmill with 15% grade while wearing his hiking boots and his backpack with total 35 lbs of weight for the last 2 weeks. He said it's even starting to feel lighter.

Getting excited for him.  Thanks for all the help and advice in here.
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Sounds like you are excited for him but also a tad anxious.

You haven't mentioned any sort of apprehension over bears.

Their is a term called 'bear-anoid' but don't worry.

THIS must watch Dateline hardly ever happens.

 
Bracie Smathers said:
Sounds like you are excited for him but also a tad anxious.

You haven't mentioned any sort of apprehension over bears.

Their is a term called 'bear-anoid' but don't worry.

THIS must watch Dateline hardly ever happens.
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I'm not worried about bears. He'll be with an experienced group.

Just first time trip like this away from home for so long and mostly anxious about him enjoying the experience. I'll watch the link later.

 
gianmarco said:
I'm not worried about bears. He'll be with an experienced group.

Just first time trip like this away from home for so long and mostly anxious about him enjoying the experience. I'll watch the link later.
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Definitely watch and have your son watch if he isn't taking the threat of bears seriously.  

I hiked this exact same trail shown in the episode with a nephew two years ago.

He wasn't taking bear safety serious but after seeing the video he bought a $50 can of bear spray right before we took the hike and had it on him.

 
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Gian...super impressed your kid is doing this and pass along the kudos.  That pack weight is no joke.  I wonder how they handle kids that think it's sucks two days in?

 
E-Z Glider said:
Why would you put a piece of luggage into another piece of luggage? What’s the concern? I always pack my stuff in a backpack when we travel so my hands are free to carry everyone else’s ####. 
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My hiking backpack is all straps and carabiners dangling everywhere. I wouldn’t want to risk a luggage conveyor snagging or ripping one (or the hip belt) and causing me issues for the whole trip. 

 
BassNBrew said:
I'd ditch hiking boots for trail shoes unless you're expecting extended sub-freezing weather.  Light and dry quicker.
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I prefer the ankle support of a boot, and some nice strong structure on the sole, especially over uneven or rocky terrain, but that’s a personal choice.  I think trail shoes are something you “graduate” to after you get some experience under your belt.

 
Rustoleum said:
I prefer the ankle support of a boot, and some nice strong structure on the sole, especially over uneven or rocky terrain, but that’s a personal choice.  I think trail shoes are something you “graduate” to after you get some experience under your belt.
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Part of the trip is a summit attempt of Grand Teton. He needs boots. Plus, they are already broken in.

 
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Rustoleum said:
I prefer the ankle support of a boot, and some nice strong structure on the sole, especially over uneven or rocky terrain, but that’s a personal choice.  I think trail shoes are something you “graduate” to after you get some experience under your belt.
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I'm a trekking pole guy which probably sways my opinion.  That additional boot ankle support is offset by the benefit of being able to feel the terrain with trail shoes.  If I'm taking 20000 steps in a day I would prefer benefit of not having to pick up an additional .5 pound weight each step.

 
BassNBrew said:
I have a pad like this that I would give you but time might be an issue.  https://www.sierra.com/ultralight-inflatable-sleeping-pad~p~25fkc/?utm_source=Google&utm_medium=OrganicShopping&utm_campaign=GoogleShopping&utm_term=Ultralight_Inflatable_Sleeping_Pad&currency=USD&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIj9ucsZ-c8QIVc2tvBB3HUAGUEAYYBCABEgJRpvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds&codes-processed=true#specsSection

Maybe not an issue for a kid but any sleep an improvement yields benefits the next day.
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BassNBrew said:
For those on a budget, i have on of these bags and am a huge fan.  https://www.amazon.com/Hyke-Byke-Power-Sleeping-Backpacking/dp/B06X95PNS5/ref=sr_1_11?crid=2FRUUVLMOCI1G&dchild=1&keywords=ultra+lightweight+sleeping+bag&qid=1623849248&sprefix=ultra+light%2Caps%2C200&sr=8-11

With a 30 degree version you can easily be under 2 lbs.  Best yet they pack up to 6 in x 9 in.
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We ended up getting the Kelty Cosmic 20 sleeping bag. It's super lightweight. We also got a super lightweight but high insulated sleeping pad for him. He should be comfortable. 

But, appreciate thinking of helping out.

 
@gianmarco I hope you don't mind the hijack but wanted some opinions on a backpack.  Thoughts on this?

https://www.gossamergear.com/products/mariposa-60-lightweight-backpack?rfsn=2112677.0ed80

I currently have a Deuter 36+10 https://www.rei.com/rei-garage/product/182934/deuter-futura-pro-36-pack-mens

and having been doing trips up to four days.  Space is getting tight and it only has been working when I hike with my son and one can take the food while the other packs the tent.  It's a challenge packing up and would prefer not to have to solve a puzzle every morning.

 
BassNBrew said:
@gianmarco I hope you don't mind the hijack but wanted some opinions on a backpack.  Thoughts on this?

https://www.gossamergear.com/products/mariposa-60-lightweight-backpack?rfsn=2112677.0ed80

I currently have a Deuter 36+10 https://www.rei.com/rei-garage/product/182934/deuter-futura-pro-36-pack-mens

and having been doing trips up to four days.  Space is getting tight and it only has been working when I hike with my son and one can take the food while the other packs the tent.  It's a challenge packing up and would prefer not to have to solve a puzzle every morning.
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I am a big fan of Gossamer Gear... I am going to pick up the G4-20 when it goes on sale for Christmas. 

 
gianmarco said:
Part of the trip is a summit attempt of Grand Teton. He needs boots. Plus, they are already broken in.
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This whole thing is awesome. I did a 12 day backpacking trip with my son a couple years ago. 

He needs layers of clothes but he doesn't need a bunch of different outfits.  The less he carries the better.  Just have enough clothes for hot, cold, wet. Teenage boys don't change clothes often (at least mine didn't), so he doesn't need a ton of clothes.

The fact he is training on a treadmill is good, but I'd get him out on some rocky terrain to work those small stabilizing muscles in the ankles.  (Its kind of like trail running versus road running.) 

Strongly encourage you to get him closed toed sandals for around camp...like a crocs.  You don't want him in flip flops and break a toe stumbling on a rock at camp. 

Recommend hiking poles as well. You don't need to spend a fortune, just something that is collapsible. 

Definitely needs camelback that he can put in his pack and sip water from while hiking. 

If he is going somewhere in elevation, make sure he has hat and gloves.  Good for those frosty mornings. 

I'll keep thinking about anything else, this late in the game that may make a difference.

 
SteelCurtain said:
This whole thing is awesome. I did a 12 day backpacking trip with my son a couple years ago. 

He needs layers of clothes but he doesn't need a bunch of different outfits.  The less he carries the better.  Just have enough clothes for hot, cold, wet. Teenage boys don't change clothes often (at least mine didn't), so he doesn't need a ton of clothes.

The fact he is training on a treadmill is good, but I'd get him out on some rocky terrain to work those small stabilizing muscles in the ankles.  (Its kind of like trail running versus road running.) 

Strongly encourage you to get him closed toed sandals for around camp...like a crocs.  You don't want him in flip flops and break a toe stumbling on a rock at camp. 

Recommend hiking poles as well. You don't need to spend a fortune, just something that is collapsible. 

Definitely needs camelback that he can put in his pack and sip water from while hiking. 

If he is going somewhere in elevation, make sure he has hat and gloves.  Good for those frosty mornings. 

I'll keep thinking about anything else, this late in the game that may make a difference.
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Yeah, getting him out on rocky terrain ain't happening, plus he leaves in 3 days.  I spoke with someone from the camp yesterday and she said with what he's done already will put him pretty far ahead of most everyone else that goes typically.  Hopefully that's the case and he'll enjoy it from the start.

They have a pretty specific packing list and warn to make sure you have everything on it but don't bring extra.  They do this a lot.

Wife got him a pair of Teva shoes for camp. 

We got the trekking poles recommended earlier in the thread. 

I'll look into the camelbak.  I need to call them back today and see how they typically manage water and stuff and see what they recommend.

Hat and gloves already there, he'll be getting up to almost 14,000 ft during the summit attempt.

 
AAABatteries said:
One of the essential pieces of equipment for this old guy is a pair of old, lightweight flip-flops.  After hiking all day the last thing I want to do is where hiking boots at camp all evening.  I normally just hang them off a carabiner on my pack.  When he takes his socks off make sure he lays them out to dry (I'm assuming he won't carry more than one extra pair.

I want to stress again - that's a lot of weight for a kid to carry.  Fill his pack with heavy books or weights and let him get used to carrying it.  I think the recommendation is to be around 20% of your body weight.  He's going to be at 35% if he's carrying 40lbs @ 115.
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Good stuff here. Camp shoes are essential. Nice to see later on that he's training with the pack weight in advance. That'll be huge. 

AAABatteries said:
Has he pooped in the woods before?  One trick there is to lean your back against a tree.  Dig the hole first - find a sturdy stick to deal with it once done so you don't get crap on your trowel.  When he digs the hole, keep the dirt in a pile close by, don't fling the dirt away.  Take the TP off the roll for easier packing.  Don't bury the TP - haul it out with your gear, pack extra large ziplocks for that.
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Why? Camp TP is quite biodegradable. 

STEADYMOBBIN 22 said:
 .45 longslide, with laser sighting.
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Lasers slow down target acquisition RDS FTW ;)  

gianmarco said:
Less than a week away.

Permethrin bought and applied to all clothes and gear. Thanks @Jaysus.

He's been doing 1 hour per day on the treadmill with 15% grade while wearing his hiking boots and his backpack with total 35 lbs of weight for the last 2 weeks. He said it's even starting to feel lighter.

Getting excited for him.  Thanks for all the help and advice in here.
Click to expand...
This is brilliant. 16yo's are full of energy anyway, but with the weight of the pack this is very smart and will reap big rewards on the trails. 

 
Rustoleum said:
My hiking backpack is all straps and carabiners dangling everywhere. I wouldn’t want to risk a luggage conveyor snagging or ripping one (or the hip belt) and causing me issues for the whole trip. 
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Id remove the carabiners, but every backpack has straps. They just ask you to clip them all and pull them tight when you check them. Tons of people do this every day.

 
Do they still make backpack covers for air travel? I have one for an old Lowe Alpine internal frame pack I still use from time to time.

 
Can I ask for details on this trip?  I love WY and the Tetons and I think a trip like this would be awesome, but I'm also an overweight middle-aged man.  

 
Poke_4_Life said:
Can I ask for details on this trip?  I love WY and the Tetons and I think a trip like this would be awesome, but I'm also an overweight middle-aged man.  
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I am now also an overweight middle aged man, but when I lived in Wyoming I was fit and in my late 20s. Even then the altitude took getting used to. If you want to do something like this plan some time to adjust before starting to hike.

 
Drunken Cowboy said:
I am now also an overweight middle aged man, but when I lived in Wyoming I was fit and in my late 20s. Even then the altitude took getting used to. If you want to do something like this plan some time to adjust before starting to hike.
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Yeah, I've spent time in the greater Yellowstone/Teton a few times.  It definitely takes me a good day plus to adjust to the altitude.  Even then, the hiking is harder than it seems it should be.

 
Haven’t been able to read through the whole thread, but I always take 2 pairs of boots or shoes. Can’t tell you how many times the people I’m with are trying to dry their stuff out while I just throw on fresh footgear and am comfortable. I personally never worried much about pack weight- there’s stuff that is responsible to bring (first aid etc), stuff you absolutely need (tent/bag/food etc) and things you maybe want. My brother would him and haw about not needing this or that; you should have a limit but it’s up to you what fills up that limit. 

 
BassNBrew said:
I'm a trekking pole guy which probably sways my opinion.  That additional boot ankle support is offset by the benefit of being able to feel the terrain with trail shoes.  If I'm taking 20000 steps in a day I would prefer benefit of not having to pick up an additional .5 pound weight each step.
Click to expand...
I have a pair of Inov8 Roclite G 345 GTX boots. They are a cross between trail runners and hiking boots. They provide ankle support but are very light compared to my previous hiking boots.

 
Poke_4_Life said:
Can I ask for details on this trip?  I love WY and the Tetons and I think a trip like this would be awesome, but I'm also an overweight middle-aged man.  
Click to expand...
It's actually a camp for kids of various ages. He's in the high school group. This is one of several trips they do, including international trips. But they are based there in WY. However, it's not something for adults.

 
BassNBrew said:
Gian...super impressed your kid is doing this and pass along the kudos.  That pack weight is no joke.  I wonder how they handle kids that think it's sucks two days in?
Click to expand...
I did Philmont twice in scouts.  The answer is they redistribute the weight.  Second time I went there were a few younger scouts who could barely handle their own stuff, but the "group" items made it too heavy so us older scouts and the leaders split the stuff up.

Other than things already mentioned, I would add bring some bandanas to help with sweat in your eyes.  I brought a frisbee instead of a plate, can still eat off of it and then you have something to do during the down times in camp.  A small notebook/journal to write things down.  Last year I was cleaning out my closet at my parents house and found mine.  Reading back what I had written was a trip down memory lane.  Tons of stuff I completely forgot, but once I started reading I could immediately picture the things as they happened.

 
So, I have a CamelBak pack that I wear when I run long and it's hot. But I don't see how that would work for a hiking trip while wearing a backpack.

Any recommendations on a specific CamelBak size/style that works for hiking with a large backpack? Does it just go inside the backpack? Wear it separately?

 
gianmarco said:
So, I have a CamelBak pack that I wear when I run long and it's hot. But I don't see how that would work for a hiking trip while wearing a backpack.

Any recommendations on a specific CamelBak size/style that works for hiking with a large backpack? Does it just go inside the backpack? Wear it separately?
Click to expand...
I am anti-water bladder for anything other than day hikes.  Smart water bottles are the way to go for backpacking. 

 
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