Both fumbles came on really good opportunistic plays by the defense. That happens. You don’t bench one of your best playmakers for that. Allen threw 2 picks and fumbled himself. You benching him? Davis let the ball go through his hands on that pick. You benching him too? There are certain guys that have been prone to fumbling due to poor technique. Cook isn’t one of those guys. But hey, team with all that talent is 5-5 cause McDumbass knows best.
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2024 Buffalo Bills (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter GroveDiesel
- Start date
themeistersinger
Footballguy
McDermott is definitely coaching for his job now. 12 men on the field is inexcusable. It would have been bad enough to lose to Denver if the kicker had simply made his kick against 11 men. But to give them a do over after a miss is mind boggling.
If they don't make the playoffs, I would fire him. If they do make the playoffs, they have to win at least one playoff game, or I would fire him.
If they don't make the playoffs, I would fire him. If they do make the playoffs, they have to win at least one playoff game, or I would fire him.
Godsbrother
Footballguy
Agreed. The 12-men was inexcusable because both teams knew the FG attempt was coming for several plays. They should have made sure that everyone knew who was supposed to be on the field.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
You're comparing Allen to Cook? Or, comparing a QB throwing a pick to an RB fumbling?
RBs get benched all the time. And, when you aren't elite, and your backup comes in and runs for 9 YPC, you are going to ride the pine a little longer than if the backup is not producing.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Some teams are consistently bracketing Diggs and Dorsey isn’t a good enough coordinator to scheme him open.
jvdesigns2002
Footballguy
The Bills have been a sloppy and underwhelming team for much of the season. I had high hopes for them, but they just don’t look right. The coaching has been sloppy, Allen seems to have regressed into a turnover machine, and the defense seems to have devolved. I’d love to see them somehow turn things around—but they are just not playing in a manner that would make anybody super confident in them.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Too little too late. This should not keep McDermott off the hot seat. IMO, Dorsey was not very good, but I do think that McDermott also shares some responsibility as I believe he absolutely meddled in what he wanted from the offense.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Hard to blame the defense when they lost Matt Milano, Tre White, DaQuan Jones, Rousseau is playing through a foot injury, Micah Hyde was out, Christian Benford was out.
That’s both starting CBs out, starting FS out, starting OLB out, starting DT out, starting DE playing gimpy. Honestly, they haven’t been great, but they’ve done more than could realistically be expected of them with as many injuries as they’ve had.
One of the worst coached teams in all of football. The lack of use of Cook all season for a 33 year old stiff, benching Cook for his 1st fumble all year when Allen turns the ball over 3 times a game for 2 years, not using Kincaid in the first half of the season, I can go on and on.
Mr. Peterson
Footballguy
Let’s hope Brady can turn this around.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
WOO! HOO!
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
Is there anything in Brady’s history that should make us think that’s possible?
ScottNorwood
Footballcutie
Hopefully, the new OC can utilize Fournette appropriately.
dickey moe
Fingerpicker
Norwood sighting!
Dizzy
Footballguy
What I saw was Diggs wide open on a crosser and watched the target go to/thru Kincaid (or maybe it was Davis) and into the waiting hands of a DEN DB.
Can't happen. Gotta feed the diva... every chance you get.
Dizzy
Footballguy
Somebody going into the furnace today for having 12 men on the field while having 3 consecutive downs of kneel-downs to count to 11.
The offensive coordinator lol
karl.Racki
Footballguy
wow.. Joe Brady moved up to OC.. His name has been linked to PSU OC job after they fired Mike Yurcich Sunday.
He’s not elite yet he’s averaging 5.1 YPC (good for 4th among RBs), and 2nd among RBs with 100+ attempts). And if you believe in PFF, 8th best rated among RBs with 100+ carries. But yeah, a 34 year old Murray that couldn’t get past a DE on a screen pass in the flat last night is the answer. Lol.
Cook fumbled his 1st ever carry in the NFL. Since then he didnt have a fumble until 1st play of game last night. HE got benched a whole quarter for that meanwhile, their QB leads the NFL in turnovers and throws at least one HORRIBLE hero ball INT a game and there is no accountability whatsoever there.
Bad coaching 101
Bad coaching 101
Steve Tasker
Footballguy
Meh on the Dorsey firing. Too little, too late. Season's kaput. Maybe next year.
FarFromHome
Footballguy
Well. I guess the Bills front office response to most of us saying the coaching was bad last night was they agreed.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
McDermott is 67-40 as Head Coach
1st yr 9-7 then went 6-10
10, 13, 11, 13 wins the last 4 seasons and you all want to fire McD?
I think he might not even make the parking lot before he would be scooped up.
2 AFC Championship appearances, is that right?
4 seasons in a row with double digit wins, Mike McDaniel hasn't done it once yet.
1st yr 9-7 then went 6-10
10, 13, 11, 13 wins the last 4 seasons and you all want to fire McD?
I think he might not even make the parking lot before he would be scooped up.
2 AFC Championship appearances, is that right?
4 seasons in a row with double digit wins, Mike McDaniel hasn't done it once yet.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
Not the sane ones. Just the ones who forgot what a nightmare we lived through for 20 years rolling out a new HC every year or two.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I almost posted, "Didn't you all suffer thru 2 decades?"
But you answered my question
-I think the injuries sustained on defense would destroy a lot of teams.
Something does need to change on offense, they just don't look as explosive as they did early in the season
They had 3-4 game run where they ripped everyone including Miami.
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
That sums it up perfectly, IMO.
Unless McDermott was meddling with the offense (I don't believe he was) Dorsey should have been let go sooner. I still believe Diggs' blow up last year was because of Dorsey.
eighsse2
Footballguy
As a Bengals fan, I never wanted Marvin Lewis gone until his last year or two. Coaches aren't magicians.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
What percent of the offensive problems do you all think are on Josh Allen?
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
He runs the plays that are called in from above or the sidelines.
Where I see Alllen sometimes miss are on open receivers in the check downs or short areas where he could take whet the defense is giving him
The Duff Man
Footballguy
I say 30% Allen, 60% coaching and 10% “other”
The main problems as I see it.
- crappy passing schemes - then Allen makes poor decisions in those bad schemes. Change the plays and make things easier.
- Allen doesn’t take off anymore. I assume this has been instructed to him. Lots of examples all year where drives ended with an incompletion when a run gave them a shot at a first down. His rushing also opens up the pass.
- Not playing under centre despite ALL of the data showing they are way better under centre. 4/4 with a TD last night.
The reason? “Allen prefers shotgun”. WTF?! Grow some balls coach and TELL your player what the team is going to do.
FarFromHome
Footballguy
As a non Bills fan, but Kincaid owner, I hope a new scheme doesn't alter the targets he is getting. Keep him at 8 targets a game but maybe look for ways to get him open down field more. Ha ha
Athletic Supporter
Footballguy
Bills fire Ken Dorsey
Grigs Allmoon
Footballguy
This
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I'm glad that Dorsey is gone. That change needed to be made, and it seems pointless to wait until the end of the season.
We know that we're going to have a decent amount of roster turnover over the course of the next couple of seasons. That makes this offseason an opportune time to make a HC change if ownership thinks that McDermott has taken this team as far as he can. I wouldn't be opposed to that.
We know that we're going to have a decent amount of roster turnover over the course of the next couple of seasons. That makes this offseason an opportune time to make a HC change if ownership thinks that McDermott has taken this team as far as he can. I wouldn't be opposed to that.
IvanKaramazov
Footballguy
I think it's pretty obvious that Allen needs a coach who is willing and able to get in his face and provide some hard coaching. Daboll wasn't averse to that, but Dorsey seems to be. So I guess that's on Allen, in the sense that he needs a little more direction that we'd ideally like.
Other than that, it's kind of hard to see how any of this is Allen's "fault." The reason why there's a sense of urgency around this team is because we only have so many years of Prime Josh Allen.
I mean, you think this team would be more promising with a replacement-level QB under center?
rockaction
Footballguy
Trade you a guy who has only thrown one pick in his last four games for Josh Allen?
Deal?
Gentlemen, meet Zach Wilson, your new QB!
rockaction
Footballguy
And exactly. Well put.
themeistersinger
Footballguy
I think Diggs' blow up was a combo of Dorsey and Allen. Allen had started to make mistakes forcing the ball into coverage. So the coaches (probably including both Dorsey and McDermott) told him to stop doing that and take the progressions as designed in the play. So Diggs would make some kind of crazy move to get open, and Allen wasn't looking at him, because he wasn't the first or second read. And Diggs didn't get the ball and the Bills lost badly.
I don't think it's fair to call Diggs a Diva, at least not as bad of one as many wide outs. If the Bills win and he doesn't get a target, I don't think that upsets him. But if the Bills lose and he's not getting a target, then he flies off the handle.
Honestly, pretty close to 0%. Not saying he's perfect, no player is, but he's easily one of the NFL's best players. I would however say at least 75% of the success is on him. He and Diggs have carried this offense all season, and it blows my mind that people think Allen is the problem in any way. Even the turnovers aren't really his fault or that bad. He's had some of the worst luck I've seen this year, where his WRs keep tipping catchable balls to the defense. Of his 11 INT's, I'd say 5 are Allen's fault. Bills offense in general has had awful luck, they've fumbled 8 times and lost 7 of them (Cook's dribble last night being the exception) league average is roughly 50%.
Replace Josh Allen with a league average starter, and change nothing else, and this team is picking in the top-3. Defensive injuries have hurt a ton, the time of possession has been mind blowing these last few weeks, as the defense simply can't get off the field.
The play calling has been generally uncreative, and some of the usage of certain players (Cook is the obvious one, but I'd throw Shakir in there too) has been less than ideal. Will firijg Dorsey help? Maybe/maybe not.
massraider
Footballguy
@minakimes
Bills offense thru week 10:
3rd in DVOA
1st in success rate
3rd in EPA/play
4th in QBR
3rd in yds/play
2nd in 3rd down conversion %
3rd in red zone efficiency
Scapegoat Dorsey
Bills offense thru week 10:
3rd in DVOA
1st in success rate
3rd in EPA/play
4th in QBR
3rd in yds/play
2nd in 3rd down conversion %
3rd in red zone efficiency
Scapegoat Dorsey
Mr. Peterson
Footballguy
Disagree with a couple of these points. Allen has made some bad reads and bad throws. A decent portion of this is on him.
And no way would we be picking on the top 3. Without Allen we would just run more and the offense would do enough to help out the D that is more than holding its own despite all the injuries. This team is loaded with talent and it’s not just Josh.
RenegadeRoy
Footballguy
10th in the AFC (5-5 record tied with the Raiders and the Colts).
One can point at stats all day but what matters are the Ws and Ls. The Bills simply were not producing on offense like they should have been.
Terell Owens was like that in his time with the 49ers. He was called selfish but he never complained when they were winning about not getting the ball but frustrated when they lost and throwing the ball to inferior WRs. I get that.
massraider
Footballguy
Then fire everyone. it's everyone's job to win games. Maybe the guys who don't have stats that show they are doing a decent job.
Unless, of course, it was Dorsey's decision to drop passes, throw picks, and have too many men on the field.
Give some credit to defenses getting better. Scoring is down. Should Mahomes produce more than 19 and 9 points versus the Broncos? This is not the same DEN defense that gave up 70 points to Miami. And matchups matter. Dorsey is an easy scapegoat, maybe Allen and everyone play better, less unlucky TOs or better playcallying, but it's a logical move without downside since McDermott is coach of the defense. Firing the ST coach would also put people on notice
King of the Jungle
Footballguy
Head’s fall when things go wrong. People love to place the blame on one thing because it is convenient to just point a finger in one direction. Defense is not the same due to injuries. New pay caller struggled to find rhythm in the offense. So many times something was working and then they seemed to go away from it. Allen does not seem to have the same killer instinct. This may be to injury (my guess…something seems off with him) or just losing confidence (whether it with system or just with the compiling errors). Turnovers, some random and some in which could have been prevented. The little things add up to the big thing. Not too late for a turnaround as it is a team full of talent, but the offense will need to carry them this year. The pieces are there to to do it, maybe Dorsey leaving will be the springboard.
DropKick
Footballguy
Love me some TO
