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What party am I today? (1 Viewer)

R

Rich Conway

Footballguy
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.

These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives.  Maybe I'm still a left-leaning libertarian.  What party am I?

My Platform

* Legalize marijuana, commute all marijuana-related sentences
* Legalize most drug use generally
* Universal Basic Income
* Replace income taxes with value-added tax system, such as Fairtax
* (...reluctantly...) Universal Health Care
* Massive electronic privacy legislation, ideally stiffer than GDPR
* True transparency and anti-corruption efforts in government
* Significant transparency and anti-fraud efforts in business, especially including deterrence level punishment
* Ranked order voting, nationwide
* Online voting
* Criminal justice reform, including removal of perverse incentives like asset seizure
* End the practice of junk science in prosecutions (e.g. drug-sniffing dogs, burn patterns in arson cases, etc.)
* Ban fracking
* Ban multi-material packaging that can't be recycled (e.g. you can use cardboard or plastic for packaging, but not both for the same product.  No more pasta boxes with a plastic window!)
* Create incentives to reduce plastics, likely in the form of taxes on plastic use
* Create incentives to increase green energy, likely in the forms of taxes on non-renewable energy use
* Use the bully pulpit and US resources to slow/stop destruction of rain forests, poaching/overfishing of endangered animals
* Drastically revisit the practice of farm subsidies
* End the practice of five-month POTUS primary elections, especially with the same states in the same order every time

 
Not sure but I'm pretty much in line with a lot of this.  

I read the "Ban fracking" wrong and that was about to be a deal breaker.

 
Sounds like a good fit for whatever progressive party eventually spins out, but it may be a while.

For parties that exist now - Green. Of the two major parties - Democrat, but historically they've differed on a bunch of these issues.

Edit to add - I'm pretty sure Tulsi Gabbard is in on all of these

 
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Rich Conway said:
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.

These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives.  Maybe I'm still a left-leaning libertarian.  What party am I?

My Platform

* Legalize marijuana, commute all marijuana-related sentences
* Legalize most drug use generally
* Universal Basic Income
* Replace income taxes with value-added tax system, such as Fairtax
* (...reluctantly...) Universal Health Care
* Massive electronic privacy legislation, ideally stiffer than GDPR
* True transparency and anti-corruption efforts in government
* Significant transparency and anti-fraud efforts in business, especially including deterrence level punishment
* Ranked order voting, nationwide
* Online voting
* Criminal justice reform, including removal of perverse incentives like asset seizure
* End the practice of junk science in prosecutions (e.g. drug-sniffing dogs, burn patterns in arson cases, etc.)
* Ban fracking
* Ban multi-material packaging that can't be recycled (e.g. you can use cardboard or plastic for packaging, but not both for the same product.  No more pasta boxes with a plastic window!)
* Create incentives to reduce plastics, likely in the form of taxes on plastic use
* Create incentives to increase green energy, likely in the forms of taxes on non-renewable energy use
* Use the bully pulpit and US resources to slow/stop destruction of rain forests, poaching/overfishing of endangered animals
* Drastically revisit the practice of farm subsidies
* End the practice of five-month POTUS primary elections, especially with the same states in the same order every time
Click to expand...
The bold are a bit heavy-handed government from a libertarian persoective.  Of course, I've long been a left-leaning libertarian type and the Democrats are really the only party with significant overlap.  Seems like you would be strongly aligned with a candidate like Yang.  Pretty much all of your goals will go backwards with 4 more years of Trump.

 
Slapdash said:
The bold are a bit heavy-handed government from a libertarian persoective.  Of course, I've long been a left-leaning libertarian type and the Democrats are really the only party with significant overlap.  Seems like you would be strongly aligned with a candidate like Yang.  Pretty much all of your goals will go backwards with 4 more years of Trump.
Click to expand...
Oh trust me, I'm well aware of that part.  I can't imagine a single one of these aligns with Trump's beliefs.

 
I can agree with most of this, though I have questions about how some of them would be realized. I'm also not sure where I stand on a universal basic income, though minimum wage should be higher.

 
A progressive caucus preferring democrat (think AOC). Really the only discrepancy is the income tax thing.

 
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Joe Summer said:
I don't think the Republicans would let you in the door with that resume.
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I'm OK with that.  Wasn't it Reagan who noted (paraphrased for circumstances, obviously) that he didn't leave a party as much as the party left him?  There was a time when the GOP would have been in favor of a number of these things (not remotely all of them, obviously).

 
If those are your policy goals you should be voting for virtually all Democrats for the foreseeable future.  Not a perfect fit but pretty good.

Between @Rich Conway and @RedmondLonghorn and @Maurile Tremblay it feels like a lot of my favorite conservative posters from the old days have stopped being conservative.  And it's not just anti-Trump sentiment, although that's surely part of it.  About time for @IvanKaramazov to turn pinko already.

 
Da Guru said:
huthut said:
In an ideal world this would happen, and we would vote on candidates based on their ideas. Sadly we are stuck with this one. 
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I have always voted for the person running and not their party
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Absolutely.  But...

Sometimes in social situations (@fatguyinalittlecoat will understand this euphemism, as I believe his current situation is similar to mine) when political topics come up, one needs a shorthand way to describe one's views.  For the past several years, I've usually used "left-leaning libertarian", although I then usually have to explain the part about the small "l" in libertarian, now that the Libertarian party is mostly overrun by conservatives who are ashamed to be associated with the GOP.

 
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Da Guru said:
I have always voted for the person running and not their party.
Click to expand...
But at this point there are some many shibboleths that it does not matter. There is almost no mix and matching between the parties. What if you are pro-life and for strong gun control? To win a republican primary a republican HAS to be against gun control, while a democrat HAS to be pro-choice. This might not be the best example, but I hope the point is clear.

 
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Rich Conway said:
Absolutely.  But...

Sometimes in social situations (@fatguyinalittlecoat will understand this euphemism, as I believe his current situation is similar to mine) when political topics come up, one needs a shorthand way to describe one's views.  For the past several years, I've usually used "left-leaning libertarian", although I then usually have to explain the part about the small "l" in libertarian, now that the Libertarian party is mostly overrun by conservatives who are ashamed to be associated with the GOP.
Click to expand...
The joke I always heard about Libertarians is Republicans that know the age of consent in every state/country. Then again it is also Republicans that like weed. Basically Republicans but X.

 
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Rich Conway said:
Absolutely.  But...

Sometimes in social situations (@fatguyinalittlecoat will understand this euphemism, as I believe his current situation is similar to mine) when political topics come up, one needs a shorthand way to describe one's views.  For the past several years, I've usually used "left-leaning libertarian", although I then usually have to explain the part about the small "l" in libertarian, now that the Libertarian party is mostly overrun by conservatives who are ashamed to be associated with the GOP.
Click to expand...
My views have always crossed into both parties, that is why I have never really felt part of either party as there are things I like and dislike about both parties and the 2 party system were are in.

 
fatguyinalittlecoat said:
If those are your policy goals you should be voting for virtually all Democrats for the foreseeable future.  Not a perfect fit but pretty good.

Between @Rich Conway and @RedmondLonghorn and @Maurile Tremblay it feels like a lot of my favorite conservative posters from the old days have stopped being conservative.  And it's not just anti-Trump sentiment, although that's surely part of it.  About time for @IvanKaramazov to turn pinko already.
Click to expand...
It will swing back a bit when there are actual social program policies to debate.

 
Rich Conway said:
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.

These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives.  Maybe I'm still a left-leaning libertarian.  What party am I?

My Platform

* Legalize marijuana, commute all marijuana-related sentences
* Legalize most drug use generally
* Universal Basic Income
* Replace income taxes with value-added tax system, such as Fairtax
* (...reluctantly...) Universal Health Care
* Massive electronic privacy legislation, ideally stiffer than GDPR
* True transparency and anti-corruption efforts in government
* Significant transparency and anti-fraud efforts in business, especially including deterrence level punishment
* Ranked order voting, nationwide
* Online voting
* Criminal justice reform, including removal of perverse incentives like asset seizure
* End the practice of junk science in prosecutions (e.g. drug-sniffing dogs, burn patterns in arson cases, etc.)
* Ban fracking
* Ban multi-material packaging that can't be recycled (e.g. you can use cardboard or plastic for packaging, but not both for the same product.  No more pasta boxes with a plastic window!)
* Create incentives to reduce plastics, likely in the form of taxes on plastic use
* Create incentives to increase green energy, likely in the forms of taxes on non-renewable energy use
* Use the bully pulpit and US resources to slow/stop destruction of rain forests, poaching/overfishing of endangered animals
* Drastically revisit the practice of farm subsidies
* End the practice of five-month POTUS primary elections, especially with the same states in the same order every time
Click to expand...
I'm with you on most of that list. I re-registered as a Democrat (switching from No Party Preference) a little while ago. None of the parties are a perfect fit for me. I think libertarians get some things right that both liberals and conservatives miss (e.g., appropriate attention to public choice theory), and liberals get some things right that both libertarians and conservatives miss (e.g., appropriate levels of social welfare support). Conservatives get plenty of things right as well (e.g., opposition to central planning), but it's hard to think of things they get right that both liberals and libertarians miss. All the issues I can think of where conservatives are out on their own island are issues that I think they're wrong about (e.g., "traditional family values" as an excuse for ostracizing non-conformists).

Complicating things a bit is that libertarian, liberal, and conservative ideologies don't map perfectly onto the Libertarian, Democratic, and Republican Parties. The Libertarian Party is mostly nuts, and in any case is electorally irrelevant. Meanwhile, the Democratic and Republican Parties are owned by special interests in disturbing ways. (Here's an example.) Neither major party, on the whole, can be considered all that principled, IMO.

But if I'm going to choose the least bad fit for me, I'm pretty convinced it's currently the Democratic Party.

 
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Rich Conway said:
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.
Click to expand...
https://www.isidewith.com/

See for yourself.

 
Rich Conway said:
Absolutely.  But...

Sometimes in social situations (@fatguyinalittlecoat will understand this euphemism, as I believe his current situation is similar to mine) when political topics come up, one needs a shorthand way to describe one's views.  For the past several years, I've usually used "left-leaning libertarian", although I then usually have to explain the part about the small "l" in libertarian, now that the Libertarian party is mostly overrun by conservatives who are ashamed to be associated with the GOP.
Click to expand...
Dude I think strategically you gotta say you’re liberal, that’s where all the action is.  Happens to be true for me but not everyone is that lucky.

 
Rich Conway said:
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.

These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives.  Maybe I'm still a left-leaning libertarian.  What party am I?

My Platform

* Legalize marijuana, commute all marijuana-related sentences
* Legalize most drug use generally
* Universal Basic Income
* Replace income taxes with value-added tax system, such as Fairtax
* (...reluctantly...) Universal Health Care
* Massive electronic privacy legislation, ideally stiffer than GDPR
* True transparency and anti-corruption efforts in government
* Significant transparency and anti-fraud efforts in business, especially including deterrence level punishment
* Ranked order voting, nationwide
* Online voting
* Criminal justice reform, including removal of perverse incentives like asset seizure
* End the practice of junk science in prosecutions (e.g. drug-sniffing dogs, burn patterns in arson cases, etc.)
* Ban fracking
* Ban multi-material packaging that can't be recycled (e.g. you can use cardboard or plastic for packaging, but not both for the same product.  No more pasta boxes with a plastic window!)
* Create incentives to reduce plastics, likely in the form of taxes on plastic use
* Create incentives to increase green energy, likely in the forms of taxes on non-renewable energy use
* Use the bully pulpit and US resources to slow/stop destruction of rain forests, poaching/overfishing of endangered animals
* Drastically revisit the practice of farm subsidies
* End the practice of five-month POTUS primary elections, especially with the same states in the same order every time
Click to expand...
Far left Democrat

 
Don't Noonan said:
Far left Democrat
Click to expand...
I did note "These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives."  Some of these stances likely don't fit the far left, though.  My thought that we should enact legislation to make GDPR look like child's play wouldn't be a big hit with most Democrats (or Republicans), I imagine.  FairTax certainly isn't a far left position.

 
Rich Conway said:
I did note "These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives."  Some of these stances likely don't fit the far left, though.  My thought that we should enact legislation to make GDPR look like child's play wouldn't be a big hit with most Democrats (or Republicans), I imagine.  FairTax certainly isn't a far left position.
Click to expand...
I wouldn't read too much into it. I believe your position is likely slightly left of center on some issues, but definitely not far left.

 
Rich Conway said:
I did note "These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives."  Some of these stances likely don't fit the far left, though.  My thought that we should enact legislation to make GDPR look like child's play wouldn't be a big hit with most Democrats (or Republicans), I imagine.  FairTax certainly isn't a far left position.
Click to expand...
The opinion you're responding to is someone who is an admitted straight-line walking Republican hyper-partisan. It would seem as if that party somehow (*cough hardore right-wing media cough*) nurtures more individuals of that mindset than one would think possible in today's world.

Truth is, very few of us fall directly into the platform of any of the current parties, whether they be Republican,  Democrat,  or any of the other smaller or fringe parties out there. I try not to get too bogged down in it, as my personal ideology fluctuates a lot between several of them, and none of the parties appeal much to me. Sadly in 2020 USA, I'm forced to vote against things far more often than I vote for things.

 
Herb said:
The opinion you're responding to is someone who is an admitted straight-line walking Republican hyper-partisan. It would seem as if that party somehow (*cough hardore right-wing media cough*) nurtures more individuals of that mindset than one would think possible in today's world.

Truth is, very few of us fall directly into the platform of any of the current parties, whether they be Republican,  Democrat,  or any of the other smaller or fringe parties out there. I try not to get too bogged down in it, as my personal ideology fluctuates a lot between several of them, and none of the parties appeal much to me. Sadly in 2020 USA, I'm forced to vote against things far more often than I vote for things.
Click to expand...
Speak for yourself.  That would be like me calling you a hyper partisan Democrat.

 
Don't Noonan said:
Speak for yourself.  That would be like me calling you a hyper partisan Democrat.
Click to expand...
So far, this has been a very calm thread with actual discussion and no partisanship.  Literally the only two posts in the entire thread that have been argumentative and non-thoughtful were the two of yours.  If you'd like to have an actual discussion and offer thoughtful commentary, great.  If you just want to name call, then I'd ask you politely to stay out of my thread.  Thanks.

 
Rich Conway said:
I've been voting since the 80s.  I've likely posted here longer than some of you have been alive.  My politics have changed over time, partly due to changes in my thinking over time, partly due to changes in the parties, and partly due to changes in the world.  I've given myself a number of political labels over time.  I've called myself a Republican.  I've called myself a libertarian (small L).  I've called myself a left-leaning libertarian (again, small L).  I've called myself an independent.

These days, I think I may identify most closely with progressives.  Maybe I'm still a left-leaning libertarian.  What party am I?

My Platform

* Legalize marijuana, commute all marijuana-related sentences
* Legalize most drug use generally
* Universal Basic Income
* Replace income taxes with value-added tax system, such as Fairtax
* (...reluctantly...) Universal Health Care
* Massive electronic privacy legislation, ideally stiffer than GDPR
* True transparency and anti-corruption efforts in government
* Significant transparency and anti-fraud efforts in business, especially including deterrence level punishment
* Online voting
* Criminal justice reform, including removal of perverse incentives like asset seizure
* End the practice of junk science in prosecutions (e.g. drug-sniffing dogs, burn patterns in arson cases, etc.)
* Ban fracking
* Ban multi-material packaging that can't be recycled (e.g. you can use cardboard or plastic for packaging, but not both for the same product.  No more pasta boxes with a plastic window!)
* Create incentives to reduce plastics, likely in the form of taxes on plastic use
* Create incentives to increase green energy, likely in the forms of taxes on non-renewable energy use
* Use the bully pulpit and US resources to slow/stop destruction of rain forests, poaching/overfishing of endangered animals
* Drastically revisit the practice of farm subsidies
Click to expand...
I either fully support or can easily be convinced to support all of this.  I only erased like 3 of your things that I just can't,  like ranked voting.

I, too, have no party.

 
Yankee23Fan said:
I either fully support or can easily be convinced to support all of this.  I only erased like 3 of your things that I just can't,  like ranked voting.

I, too, have no party.
Click to expand...
Curious to me that the two you removed seem like the simplest and easiest items, with no particular downsides.  For example, I can see the argument that "banning fracking will cause an increase in US energy prices, harming our economy compared to other nations".  I disagree with that argument, and believe that even if true, the environmental benefits outweigh the negatives anyway, but I can still understand the argument.

I'm trying to think of an argument against ranked order voting.  The best I've got is that it could lead to viable third parties, and there's some inherent value in a two-party system.  That argument assumes there's some inherent value in a two-party system that I'm missing, though, so it doesn't get me very far.

Similarly, I'm unclear on the downsides of shortening the POTUS primary season, and reordering the primaries each term.

 
Like a lot of us GB, you have no party any longer.  Though, as of today, you'd be most welcomed by the Democrats.  If you aren't a "fall in line" type, the GOP has very little interest in you.  You'll probably even be seen as "far left" by many who still actually identify with the party.  That sprint to the right has been an amazing thing to watch.

 
Well https://www.isidewith.com/says Republican, Constitution and Libertarian for me. Says my view on issues are 79% Rep, 78% Constitution and 77% Libertarian. Changed some since the last time I took it Republican and Libertarian have switched spots.

 
Rich Conway said:
So far, this has been a very calm thread with actual discussion and no partisanship.  Literally the only two posts in the entire thread that have been argumentative and non-thoughtful were the two of yours.  If you'd like to have an actual discussion and offer thoughtful commentary, great.  If you just want to name call, then I'd ask you politely to stay out of my thread.  Thanks.
Click to expand...
Well this is not true.  I have not been argumentative at all.  I simply corrected a poster who was aggressively wrong who tried calling me out.  You asked people what you should be classified as and I gave you my opinion.  Your views are extreme left with exception to fair tax.  Sorry this hurts your feelings.

 
This is a great list and interesting reading, but I think most voters vote on the basis of 3-5 top priority values.

I also think most people if they went 20-30 deep on their values list would have a range of conservative, liberal, libertarian and demsoc/socialist values ranging from core to aspirational.

 
Yankee will come around on election alternatives to first past the post, he's too smart not to (he may already have and I'm just reading things that aren't there).

Rich, you should support the Fair Representation Act since it will likely provide you with many more choices than either Column A or Column B.

 
Republicans are going to be the old Democrats. And the old Democrats who have shifted further left are going to be the Progressives. Throw whatever labels you want on it, but that's where this is headed. The tags will still be R and D but the positioning for both will have shifted left. Don't flip out on me either, because I'm not saying I automatically have a problem with it. Republicans are going to mirror a lot of where Obama was during his Presidency in short order. Obama himself is going to have to shift his views further left to even be considered a Democrat anymore and it's apparent he already has begun to. Bill Clinton's Presidency is looking downright 2020 Republican at this point.

 
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