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Government Response To The Coronavirus (3 Viewers)

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The level of intellectual dishonesty on display here and nationally has been off the charts. It will be one of things I remember when looking back at this time once the crisis passes. 

 
Welcome to their safe space.....you’ve given it a tremendous effort to point out the inaccuracies and hypocrisy but I don’t think you will get anywhere. Fun to watch though. 😆
For the person that reported this post for "safe space", please pick something much more over the line.

No, "safe space" isn't really what we want. It's a jab, I get it. But on the "is it far enough over the line to ask the moderators to stop what they're doing and look at the report?", I"m going to say no.

Please let's focus on our own posting and do the best we can there. 

 
The U.S. was beset by denial and dysfunction as the coronavirus raged

The failure has echoes of the period leading up to 9/11: Warnings were sounded, including at the highest levels of government, but the president was deaf to them until the enemy had already struck.

The Trump administration received its first formal notification of the outbreak of the coronavirus in China on Jan. 3. Within days, U.S. spy agencies were signaling the seriousness of the threat to Trump by including a warning about the coronavirus — the first of many — in the President’s Daily Brief.

And yet, it took 70 days from that initial notification for Trump to treat the coronavirus not as a distant threat or harmless flu strain well under control, but as a lethal force that had outflanked America’s defenses and was poised to kill tens of thousands of citizens. That more-than-two-month stretch now stands as critical time that was squandered.

Trump’s baseless assertions in those weeks, including his claim that it would all just “miraculously” go away, sowed significant public confusion and contradicted the urgent messages of public health experts.

“While the media would rather speculate about outrageous claims of palace intrigue, President Trump and this Administration remain completely focused on the health and safety of the American people with around the clock work to slow the spread of the virus, expand testing, and expedite vaccine development," said Judd Deere, a spokesman for the president. "Because of the President’s leadership we will emerge from this challenge healthy, stronger, and with a prosperous and growing economy.”

But the president’s behavior and combative statements were merely a visible layer on top of deeper levels of dysfunction.

The most consequential failure involved a breakdown in efforts to develop a diagnostic test that could be mass produced and distributed across the United States, enabling agencies to map early outbreaks of the disease, and impose quarantine measure to contain them. At one point, a Food and Drug Administration official tore into lab officials at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, telling them their lapses in protocol, including concerns that the lab did not meet the criteria for sterile conditions, were so serious that the FDA would “shut you down” if the CDC were a commercial, rather than government, entity.

***

“This has been a real blow to the sense that America was competent,” said Gregory F. Treverton, a former chairman of the National Intelligence Council, the government’s senior-most provider of intelligence analysis. He stepped down from the NIC in January 2017 and now teaches at the University of Southern California. “That was part of our global role. Traditional friends and allies looked to us because they thought we could be competently called upon to work with them in a crisis. This has been the opposite of that.”

 
https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest

Slope on the graph of new deaths...basically a constant for almost 2 weeks now.  New cases has been turning slightly...which is good.  Will be interesting to see how it changes over the nest week or so...some cities still not at their peak here.  But that first graph is still very troubling...and showing it wasn't just a one or two day thing that some initially claimed.

 
Looks like the media and many posters in here got played by the fish tank cleaner lady. 

The woman who fed her husband a chemical used for cleaning fish tanks and blamed President Donald Trump for his death has a history of being anti-Trump, donating to Democratic politicians, and of sometimes violent conflict with her husband, from whom she at one point sought a divorce.

President Trump has highlighted medical research from recent weeks that show chloroquine, a drug typically used for anti-malarial purposes, may be an effective treatment for COVID-19, the disease caused by the novel coronavirus from China.

Shortly after the president began touting the potential of chloroquine, a story emerged of a woman and her husband who had ingested chloroquine — not the medical version, but the version that is used to clean fish tanks — and the husband died. National media pounced on the story, giving the woman a platform to blame the president's advice for her husband's death.

"Trump kept saying it was basically pretty much a cure," the woman told NBC News. "Oh my God. Don't take anything. Don't believe anything. Don't believe anything that the president says and his people. Call your doctor."

Even beyond the obvious problem with this story — that the woman and her husband were taking fish tank cleaner and not medicine — some details from the woman's past cast more doubt on her motive and her account of what really happened to her husband.

In 2001, the woman was arrested and accused of domestic abuse against her husband for an altercation during which she allegedly tried to hit him with a bird house while they were arguing about marriage counseling and potential divorce. She was reportedly found not guilty, but both parties admitted to police that the conflict occurred.

Court records from a 2015 court caseshow that the woman admitted in a deposition that she told her doctor in 2012 that she was "furious" all the time and "probably" wanted a divorce from her husband.

That same court case mentions that in 2004, when the woman was suffering from migraine headaches, stress, and anxiety, she sought out the counsel of at least three doctors before being diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder. This is notable in the context of her chloroquine claim, which is that she and her husband decided to consume fish tank cleaner because she heard the president mention the chemical's name on television.

The woman has a history of donating to Democratic politicians and causes. In 2016, she donated to the Hillary Clinton campaign. 

In 2017 and 2018, she donated $1,450 to the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee and $550 to the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee. Again, this is a woman who claims to have trusted President Trump so deeply that she ingested an unfamiliar chemical because she heard him mention it.
https://www.theblaze.com/news/woman-who-blamed-trump-for-her-husbands-chloroquine-death-is-dem-donor-who-was-once-charged-with-domestic-abuse-in-divorce-argument

 
https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest

Slope on the graph of new deaths...basically a constant for almost 2 weeks now.  New cases has been turning slightly...which is good.  Will be interesting to see how it changes over the nest week or so...some cities still not at their peak here.  But that first graph is still very troubling...and showing it wasn't just a one or two day thing that some initially claimed.
That is scary. No progress at all. Visually, we'll hit the peak in 20-30 days. Inaction, blame, deception, will all add up to many bodies that did not have to perish. Accountability? "I don’t take responsibility at all."

 
This is the entire WaPo article I linked above: https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2020/04/04/coronavirus-government-dysfunction/

I would encourage anyone with a subscription to click the link and read, and for those without a subscription - i think it is a worthwhile read.  It is the most complete (i.e. long) report I have seen that details the government's response from the day it first learned of the coronavirus - December 31, 2019 - to today.

I know some will immediately dismiss the WaPo as biased - but I think this particular article is written in a very neutral, matter-of-fact style.  It points out things the government did well, and it points out areas (not always with Trump) where the government failed.  It also notes issues stemming from China that played a role in inhibiting the US response (and how the US should have handled those Chinese issues).

This would be a good roadmap for any post-virus investigation in terms of identifying areas where we need to improve before the next pandemic.

By the time Donald Trump proclaimed himself a wartime president — and the coronavirus the enemy — the United States was already on course to see more of its people die than in the wars of Korea, Vietnam, Afghanistan and Iraq combined.

The country has adopted an array of wartime measures never employed collectively in U.S. history — banning incoming travelers from two continents, bringing commerce to a near-halt, enlisting industry to make emergency medical gear, and confining 230 million Americans to their homes in a desperate bid to survive an attack by an unseen adversary.

Despite these and other extreme steps, the United States will likely go down as the country that was supposedly best prepared to fight a pandemic but ended up catastrophically overmatched by the novel coronavirus, sustaining heavier casualties than any other nation.

It did not have to happen this way. Though not perfectly prepared, the United States had more expertise, resources, plans and epidemiological experience than dozens of countries that ultimately fared far better in fending off the virus.

The failure has echoes of the period leading up to 9/11: Warnings were sounded, including at the highest levels of government, but the president was deaf to them until the enemy had already struck.

The Trump administration received its first formal notification of the outbreak of the coronavirus in China on Jan. 3. Within days, U.S. spy agencies were signaling the seriousness of the threat to Trump by including a warning about the coronavirus — the first of many — in the President’s Daily Brief.

And yet, it took 70 days from that initial notification for Trump to treat the coronavirus not as a distant threat or harmless flu strain well under control, but as a lethal force that had outflanked America’s defenses and was poised to kill tens of thousands of citizens. That more-than-two-month stretch now stands as critical time that was squandered.

Trump’s baseless assertions in those weeks, including his claim that it would all just “miraculously” go away, sowed significant public confusion and contradicted the urgent messages of public health experts.

“While the media would rather speculate about outrageous claims of palace intrigue, President Trump and this Administration remain completely focused on the health and safety of the American people with around the clock work to slow the spread of the virus, expand testing, and expedite vaccine development," said Judd Deere, a spokesman for the president. "Because of the President’s leadership we will emerge from this challenge healthy, stronger, and with a prosperous and growing economy.”

But the president’s behavior and combative statements were merely a visible layer on top of deeper levels of dysfunction.

The most consequential failure involved a breakdown in efforts to develop a diagnostic test that could be mass produced and distributed across the United States, enabling agencies to map early outbreaks of the disease, and impose quarantine measure to contain them. At one point, a Food and Drug Administration official tore into lab officials at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, telling them their lapses in protocol, including concerns that the lab did not meet the criteria for sterile conditions, were so serious that the FDA would “shut you down” if the CDC were a commercial, rather than government, entity.

Other failures cascaded through the system. The administration often seemed weeks behind the curve in reacting to the viral spread, closing doors that were already contaminated. Protracted arguments between the White House and public health agencies over funding, combined with a meager existing stockpile of emergency supplies, left vast stretches of the country’s health-care system without protective gear until the outbreak had become a pandemic. Infighting, turf wars and abrupt leadership changes hobbled the work of the coronavirus task force.

It may never be known how many thousands of deaths, or millions of infections, might have been prevented with a response that was more coherent, urgent and effective. But even now, there are many indications that the administration’s handling of the crisis had potentially devastating consequences.

National Guardsman Kevin Darrah, 25, has his mask fitted at the Javits Center in Manhattan on April 1. (Demetrius Freeman for The Washington Post)

Even the president’s base has begun to confront this reality. In mid-March, as Trump was rebranding himself a wartime president, and belatedly urging the public to help slow the spread of the virus, Republican leaders were poring over grim polling data that suggested Trump was lulling his followers into a false sense of security in the face of a lethal threat.

The poll showed that far more Republicans than Democrats were being influenced by Trump’s dismissive depictions of the virus and the comparably scornful coverage on Fox News and other conservative networks. As a result, Republicans were in distressingly large numbers refusing to change travel plans, follow “social distancing” guidelines, stock up on supplies or otherwise take the coronavirus threat seriously.

“Denial is not likely to be a successful strategy for survival,” GOP pollster Neil Newhouse concluded in a document that was shared with GOP leaders on Capitol Hill and discussed widely at the White House. Trump’s most ardent supporters, it said, were “putting themselves and their loved ones in danger.”

Trump’s message was changing as the report swept through the GOP’s senior ranks. In recent days, Trump has bristled at reminders that he had once claimed the caseload would soon be “down to zero.”

More than 7,000 people have died of the coronavirus in the United States so far, with about 240,000 cases reported. But Trump has acknowledged that new models suggest that the eventual national death toll could be between 100,000 and 240,000.

Beyond the suffering in store for thousands of victims and their families, the outcome has altered the international standing of the United States, damaging and diminishing its reputation as a global leader in times of extraordinary adversity.

“This has been a real blow to the sense that America was competent,” said Gregory F. Treverton, a former chairman of the National Intelligence Council, the government’s senior-most provider of intelligence analysis. He stepped down from the NIC in January 2017 and now teaches at the University of Southern California. “That was part of our global role. Traditional friends and allies looked to us because they thought we could be competently called upon to work with them in a crisis. This has been the opposite of that.”

This article, which retraces the failures over the first 70 days of the coronavirus crisis, is based on 47 interviews with administration officials, public health experts, intelligence officers and others involved in fighting the pandemic. Many spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive information and decisions.

Scanning the horizon

Public health authorities are part of a special breed of public servant — along with counterterrorism officials, military planners, aviation authorities and others — whose careers are consumed with contemplating worst-case scenarios.

The arsenal that they wield against viral invaders is powerful, capable of smothering a new pathogen while scrambling for a cure, but easily overwhelmed if not mobilized in time. As a result, officials at the Department of Health and Human Services, the CDC and other agencies spend their days scanning the horizon for emerging dangers.

The CDC learned of a cluster of cases in China on Dec. 31 and began developing reports for HHS on Jan. 1. But the most unambiguous warning that U.S. officials received about the coronavirus came Jan. 3, when Robert Redfield, the CDC director, received a call from a counterpart in China. The official told Redfield that a mysterious respiratory illness was spreading in Wuhan, a congested commercial city of 11 million people in the communist country’s interior.

Redfield quickly relayed the disturbing news to Alex Azar, the secretary of HHS, the agency that oversees the CDC and other public health entities. Azar, in turn, ensured that the White House was notified, instructing his chief of staff to share the Chinese report with the National Security Council.

From that moment, the administration and the virus were locked in a race against a ticking clock, a competition for the upper hand between pathogen and prevention that would dictate the scale of the outbreak when it reached American shores, and determine how many would get sick or die.

[In D.C. — a city defined by power — coronavirus has seized control]

The initial response was promising, but officials also immediately encountered obstacles.

On Jan. 6, Redfield sent a letter to the Chinese offering to send help, including a team of CDC scientists. China rebuffed the offer for weeks, turning away assistance and depriving U.S. authorities of an early chance to get a sample of the virus, critical for developing diagnostic tests and any potential vaccine.

China impeded the U.S. response in other ways, including by withholding accurate information about the outbreak. Beijing had a long track record of downplaying illnesses that emerged within its borders, an impulse that U.S. officials attribute to a desire by the country’s leaders to avoid embarrassment and accountability with China’s 1.3 billion people and other countries that find themselves in the pathogen’s path.

China stuck to this costly script in the case of the coronavirus, reporting Jan. 14 that it had seen “no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission.” U.S. officials treated the claim with skepticism that intensified when the first case surfaced outside China with a reported infection in Thailand.

A traveler wearing a mask to protect against the coronavirus walks past the Beijing railway station on Jan. 17. (Mark Schiefelbein/AP)

A week earlier, senior officials at HHS had begun convening an intra-agency task force including Redfield, Azar and Anthony S. Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases. The following week, there were also scattered meetings at the White House with officials from the National Security Council and State Department, focused mainly on when and whether to bring back government employees in China.

U.S. officials began taking preliminary steps to counter a potential outbreak. By mid-January, Robert Kadlec, an Air Force officer and physician who serves as assistant secretary for preparedness and response at HHS, had instructed subordinates to draw up contingency plans for enforcing the Defense Production Act, a measure that enables the government to compel private companies to produce equipment or devices critical to the country’s security. Aides were bitterly divided over whether to implement the act, and nothing happened for many weeks.

On Jan. 14, Kadlec scribbled a single word in a notebook he carries: “Coronavirus!!!”

Despite the flurry of activity at lower levels of his administration, Trump was not substantially briefed by health officials about the coronavirus until Jan.18, when, while spending the weekend at Mar-a-Lago, he took a call from Azar.

Even before the heath secretary could get a word in about the virus, Trump cut him off and began criticizing Azar for his handling of an aborted federal ban on vaping products, a matter that vexed the president.

At the time, Trump was in the throes of an impeachment battle over his alleged attempt to coerce political favors from the leader of Ukraine. Acquittal seemed certain by the GOP-controlled Senate, but Trump was preoccupied with the trial, calling lawmakers late at night to rant, and making lists of perceived enemies he would seek to punish when the case against him concluded.

In hindsight, officials said, Azar could have been more forceful in urging Trump to turn at least some of his attention to a threat that would soon pose an even graver test to his presidency, a crisis that would cost American lives and consume the final year of Trump’s first term.

But the secretary, who had a strained relationship with Trump and many others in the administration, assured the president that those responsible were working on and monitoring the issue. Azar told several associates that the president believed he was “alarmist” and Azar struggled to get Trump’s attention to focus on the issue, even asking one confidant for advice.

Within days, there were new causes for alarm.

Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar speaks during a White House briefing on the coronavirus on Jan. 31. (Jabin Botsford/The Washington Post)

On Jan. 21, a Seattle man who had recently traveled to Wuhan tested positive for the coronavirus, becoming the first known infection on U.S. soil. Then, two days later, Chinese authorities took the drastic step of shutting down Wuhan, turning the teeming metropolis into a ghost city of empty highways and shuttered skyscrapers, with millions of people marooned in their homes.

“That was like, whoa!,” said a senior U.S. official involved in White House meetings on the crisis. “That was when the Richter scale hit 8.”

It was also when U.S. officials began to confront the failings of their own efforts to respond.

Azar, who had served in senior positions at HHS through crises including the 9/11 terrorist attacks and the outbreak of Bird Flu in 2005, was intimately familiar with the playbook for crisis management.

He instructed subordinates to move rapidly to establish a nationwide surveillance system to track the spread of the coronavirus — a stepped-up version of what the CDC does every year to monitor new strains of the ordinary flu.

But doing so would require assets that would elude U.S. officials for months — a diagnostic test that could accurately identify those infected with the new virus and be produced on a mass scale for rapid deployment across the United States, and money to implement the system.

Azar’s team also hit another obstacle. The Chinese were still refusing to share the viral samples they had collected and were using to develop their own tests. In frustration, U.S. officials looked for other possible routes.

A biocontainment lab at the University of Texas medical branch in Galveston had a research partnership with the Wuhan Institute of Virology.

Kadlec, who knew the Galveston lab director, hoped scientists could arrange a transaction on their own without government interference. At first, the lab in Wuhan agreed, but officials in Beijing intervened Jan. 24 and blocked any lab-to-lab transfer.

Deputy national security adviser Matthew Pottinger, left, and national security adviser Robert O’Brien listen during a White House coronavirus briefing on Jan. 31. (Jabin Botsford/The Washington Post)

There is no indication that officials sought to escalate the matter or enlist Trump to intervene. In fact, Trump has consistently praised Chinese President Xi Jinping despite warnings from U.S. intelligence and health officials that Beijing was concealing the true scale of the outbreak and impeding cooperation on key fronts.

The CDC had issued its first public alert about the coronavirus Jan. 8, and by the 17th was monitoring major airports in Los Angeles, San Francisco and New York, where large numbers of passengers arrived each day from China.

But in other ways, the situation was already spinning out of control, with multiplying cases in Seattle, intransigence by the Chinese, mounting questions from the public, and nothing in place to stop infected travelers from arriving from abroad.

Trump was out of the country for this critical stretch, taking part in the annual global economic forum in Davos, Switzerland. He was accompanied by a contingent of top officials including national security adviser Robert O’Brien, who took an anxious trans-Atlantic call from Azar.

Azar told O’Brien that it was “mayhem” at the White House, with HHS officials being pressed to provide nearly identical briefings to three audiences on the same day.

Azar urged O’Brien to have the NSC assert control over a matter with potential implications for air travel, immigration authorities, the State Department and the Pentagon. O’Brien seemed to grasp the urgency, and put his deputy, Matthew Pottinger, who had worked in China as a journalist for the Wall Street Journal, in charge of coordinating the still-nascent U.S. response.

But the rising anxiety within the administration appeared not to register with the president. On Jan. 22, Trump received his first question about the coronavirus in an interview on CNBC while in Davos. Asked whether he was worried about a potential pandemic, Trump said, “No. Not at all. And we have it totally under control. It’s one person coming in from China. . . . It’s going to be just fine.”

Spreading uncontrollably

The move by the NSC to seize control of the response marked an opportunity to reorient U.S. strategy around containing the virus where possible and procuring resources that hospitals would need in any U.S. outbreak, including such basic equipment as protective masks and ventilators.

But instead of mobilizing for what was coming, U.S. officials seemed more preoccupied with logistical problems, including how to evacuate Americans from China.

In Washington, then-acting chief of staff Mick Mulvaney and Pottinger began convening meetings at the White House with senior officials from HHS, the CDC and the State Department.

The group, which included Azar, Pottinger and Fauci, as well as nine others across the administration, formed the core of what would become the administration’s coronavirus task force. But it primarily focused on efforts to keep infected people in China from traveling to the United States even while evacuating thousands of U.S. citizens. The meetings did not seriously focus on testing or supplies, which have since become the administration’s most challenging problems.

The task force was formally announced on Jan. 29.

“The genesis of this group was around border control and repatriation,” said a senior official involved in the meetings. “It wasn’t a comprehensive, whole-of-government group to run everything.”

The State Department agenda dominated those early discussions, according to participants. Officials began making plans to charter aircraft to evacuate 6,000 Americans stranded in Wuhan. They also debated language for travel advisories that State could issue to discourage other travel in and out of China.

On Jan. 29, Mulvaney chaired a meeting in the White House Situation Room in which officials debated moving travel restrictions to “Level 4,” meaning a “do not travel” advisory from the State Department. Then, the next day, China took the draconian step of locking down the entire Hubei province, which encompasses Wuhan.

That move by Beijing finally prompted a commensurate action by the Trump administration. On Jan. 31, Azar announced restrictions barring any non-U.S. citizen who had been in China during the preceding two weeks from entering the United States.

Trump has, with some justification, pointed to the China-related restriction as evidence that he had responded aggressively and early to the outbreak. It was among the few intervention options throughout the crisis that played to the instincts of the president, who often seems fixated on erecting borders and keeping foreigners out of the country.

But by that point, 300,000 people had come into the United States from China over the previous month. There were only 7,818 confirmed cases around the world at the end of January, according to figures released by the World Health Organization — but it is now clear that the virus was spreading uncontrollably.

Pottinger was by then pushing for another travel ban, this time restricting the flow of travelers from Italy and other nations in the European Union that were rapidly emerging as major new nodes of the outbreak. Pottinger’s proposal was endorsed by key health-care officials, including Fauci, who argued that it was critical to close off any path the virus might take into the country.

This time, the plan met with resistance from Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin and others who worried about the impact on the U.S. economy. It was an early sign of tension in an area that would split the administration, pitting those who prioritized public health against those determined to avoid any disruption in an election year to the run of expansion and employment growth.

Those backing the economy prevailed with the president. And it was more than a month before the administration issued a belated and confusing ban on flights into the United States from Europe. Hundreds of thousands of people crossed the Atlantic during that interval.

A wall of resistance

While fights over air travel played out in the White House, public health officials began to panic over a startling shortage of critical medical equipment including protective masks for doctors and nurses, as well as a rapidly shrinking pool of money needed to pay for such things.

By early February, the administration was quickly draining a $105 million congressional fund to respond to infectious disease outbreaks. The coronavirus threat to the United States still seemed distant if not entirely hypothetical to much of the public. But to health officials charged with stockpiling supplies for worst-case-scenarios, disaster appeared increasingly inevitable.

A national stockpile of N95 protective masks, gowns, gloves and other supplies was already woefully inadequate after years of underfunding. The prospects for replenishing that store were suddenly threatened by the unfolding crisis in China, which disrupted offshore supply chains.

Much of the manufacturing of such equipment had long since migrated to China, where factories were now shuttered because workers were on order to stay in their households. At the same time, China was buying up masks and other gear to gird for its own coronavirus outbreak, driving up costs and monopolizing supplies.

In late January and early February, leaders at HHS sent two letters to the White House Office of Management and Budget asking to use its transfer authority to shift $136 million of department funds into pools that could be tapped for combating the coronavirus. Azar and his aides also began raising the need for a multibillion-dollar supplemental budget request to send to Congress.

Yet White House budget hawks argued that appropriating too much money at once when there were only a few U.S. cases would be viewed as alarmist.

Joe Grogan, head of the Domestic Policy Council, clashed with health officials over preparedness. He mistrusted how the money would be used and questioned how health officials had used previous preparedness funds.

Azar then spoke to Russell Vought, the acting director of the White House Office of Management and Budget, during Trump’s State of the Union speech on Feb. 4. Vought seemed amenable, and told Azar to submit a proposal.

Azar did so the next day, drafting a supplemental request for more than $4 billion, a sum that OMB officials and others at the White House greeted as an outrage. Azar arrived at the White House that day for a tense meeting in the Situation Room that erupted in a shouting match, according to three people familiar with the incident.

A deputy in the budget office accused Azar of preemptively lobbying Congress for a gigantic sum that White House officials had no interest in granting. Azar bristled at the criticism and defended the need for an emergency infusion. But his standing with White House officials, already shaky before the coronavirus crisis began, was damaged further.

White House officials relented to a degree weeks later as the feared coronavirus surge in the United States began to materialize. The OMB team whittled Azar’s demands down to $2.5 billion, money that would be available only in the current fiscal year. Congress ignored that figure, approving an $8 billion supplemental bill that Trump signed into law March 7.

But again, delays proved costly. The disputes meant that the United States missed a narrow window to stockpile ventilators, masks and other protective gear before the administration was bidding against many other desperate nations, and state officials fed up with federal failures began scouring for supplies themselves.

In late March, the administration ordered 10,000 ventilators — far short of what public health officials and governors said was needed. And many will not arrive until the summer or fall, when models expect the pandemic to be receding.

“It’s actually kind of a joke,” said one administration official involved in deliberations about the belated purchase.

Inconclusive tests

Although viruses travel unseen, public health officials have developed elaborate ways of mapping and tracking their movements. Stemming an outbreak or slowing a pandemic in many ways comes down to the ability to quickly divide the population into those who are infected and those who are not.

Doing so, however, hinges on having an accurate test to diagnose patients and deploy it rapidly to labs across the country. The time it took to accomplish that in the United States may have been more costly to American efforts than any other failing.

“If you had the testing, you could say, ‘Oh my god, there’s circulating virus in Seattle, let’s jump on it. There’s circulating virus in Chicago, let’s jump on it,’ ” said a senior administration official involved in battling the outbreak. “We didn’t have that visibility.”

The first setback came when China refused to share samples of the virus, depriving U.S. researchers of supplies to bombard with drugs and therapies in a search for ways to defeat it. But even when samples had been procured, the U.S. effort was hampered by systemic problems and institutional hubris.

Among the costliest errors was a misplaced assessment by top health officials that the outbreak would probably be limited in scale inside the United States — as had been the case with every other infection for decades — and that the CDC could be trusted on its own to develop a coronavirus diagnostic test.

The CDC, launched in the 1940s to contain an outbreak of malaria in the southern United States, had taken the lead on the development of diagnostic tests in major outbreaks including Ebola, Zika and H1N1. But the CDC was not built to mass-produce tests.

The CDC’s success had fostered an institutional arrogance, a sense that even in the face of a potential crisis there was no pressing need to involve private labs, academic institutions, hospitals and global health organizations also capable of developing tests.

Yet some were concerned that the CDC test would not be enough. Stephen Hahn, the FDA commissioner, sought authority in early February to begin calling private diagnostic and pharmaceutical companies to enlist their help.

But when senior FDA officials consulted leaders at HHS, Hahn, who had led the agency for about two months, was told to stand down. There were concerns about him personally contacting companies regulated by his agency.

At that point, Azar, the HHS secretary, seemed committed to a plan he was pursuing that would keep his agency at the center of the response effort: securing a test from the CDC and then building a national coronavirus surveillance system by relying on an existing network of labs used to track the ordinary flu.

In task force meetings, Azar and Redfield pushed for $100 million to fund the plan, but were shot down because of the cost, according to a document outlining the testing strategy obtained by The Washington Post.

Relying so heavily on the CDC would have been problematic even if it had succeeded in quickly developing an effective test that could be distributed across the country. The scale of the epidemic, and the need for mass testing far beyond the capabilities of the flu network, would have overwhelmed Azar’s plan, which didn’t envision engaging commercial lab companies for up to six months.

The effort collapsed when the CDC failed its basic assignment to create a working test and the task force rejected Azar’s plan.

On Feb. 6, when the World Health Organization reported that it was shipping 250,000 test kits to labs around the world, the CDC began distributing 90 kits to a smattering of state-run health labs.

Almost immediately, the state facilities encountered problems. The results were inconclusive in trial runs at more than half the labs, meaning they couldn’t be relied upon to diagnose actual patients. The CDC issued a stopgap measure, instructing labs to send tests to its headquarters in Atlanta, a practice that would delay results for days.

The scarcity of effective tests led officials to impose constraints on when and how to use them, and delayed surveillance testing. Initial guidelines were so restrictive that states were discouraged from testing patients exhibiting symptoms unless they had traveled to China and come into contact with a confirmed case, when the pathogen had by that point almost certainly spread more broadly into the general population.

The limits left top officials largely blind to the true dimensions of the outbreak.

In a meeting in the Situation Room in mid-February, Fauci and Redfield told White House officials that there was no evidence yet of worrisome person-to-person transmission in the United States. In hindsight, it appears almost certain that the virus was taking hold in communities at that point. But even the country’s top experts had little meaningful data about the domestic dimensions of the threat. Fauci later conceded that as they learned more their views changed.

At the same time the president’s subordinates were growing increasingly alarmed, Trump continued to exhibit little concern. On Feb. 10, he held a political rally in New Hampshire attended by thousands where he declared that “by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away.”

The New Hampshire rally was one of eight that Trump held after he had been told by Azar about the coronavirus, a period when he also went to his golf courses six times.

A day earlier, on Feb. 9, a group of governors in town for a black-tie gala at the White House secured a private meeting with Fauci and Redfield. The briefing rattled many of the governors, bearing little resemblance to the words of the president. “The doctors and the scientists, they were telling us then exactly what they are saying now,” Maryland Gov. Larry Hogan (R) said.

That month, federal medical and public health officials were emailing increasingly dire forecasts amongst themselves, with one Veterans Affairs medical adviser warning, ‘We are flying blind,’” according to emails obtained by the watchdog group American Oversight.

Later in February, U.S. officials discovered indications that the CDC laboratory was failing to meet basic quality-control standards. On a Feb. 27 conference call with a range of health officials, a senior FDA official lashed out at the CDC for its repeated lapses.

Jeffrey Shuren, the FDA’s director for devices and radiological health, told the CDC that if it were subjected to the same scrutiny as a privately run lab, “I would shut you down.”

On Feb. 29, a Washington state man became the first American to die of a coronavirus infection. That same day, the FDA released guidance, signaling that private labs were free to proceed in developing their own diagnostics.

Another four-week stretch had been squandered.

Life and death

One week later, on March 6, Trump toured the facilities at the CDC wearing a red “Keep America Great” hat. He boasted that the CDC tests were nearly perfect and that “anybody who wants a test will get a test,” a promise that nearly a month later remains unmet.

He also professed to have a keen medical mind. “I like this stuff. I really get it,” he said. “People here are surprised that I understand it. Every one of these doctors said, ‘How do you know so much about this?’ ”

In reality, many of the failures to stem the coronavirus outbreak in the United States were either a result of, or exacerbated by, his leadership.

For weeks, he had barely uttered a word about the crisis that didn’t downplay its severity or propagate demonstrably false information. He dismissed the warnings of intelligence officials and top public health officials in his administration.

At times, he voiced far more authentic concern about the trajectory of the stock market than the spread of the virus in the United States, railing at the chairman of the Federal Reserve and others with an intensity that he never seemed to exhibit about the possible human toll of the outbreak.

In March, as state after state imposed sweeping new restrictions on their citizens’ daily lives to protect them — triggering severe shudders in the economy — Trump second-guessed the lockdowns.

The common flu kills tens of thousands each year and “nothing is shut down, life & the economy go on,” he tweeted March 9. A day later, he pledged that the virus would “go away. Just stay calm.”

Two days later, Trump finally ordered the halt to incoming travel from Europe that his deputy national security adviser had been advocating for weeks. But Trump botched the Oval Office announcement so badly that White House officials spent days trying to correct erroneous statements that triggered a stampede by U.S. citizens overseas to get home.

“There was some coming to grips with the problem and the true nature of it — the 13th of March is when I saw him really turn the corner. It took a while to realize you’re at war,” Sen. Lindsey O. Graham (R-S.C.) said. “That’s when he took decisive action that set in motion some real payoffs.”

Trump spent many weeks shuffling responsibility for leading his administration’s response to the crisis, putting Azar in charge of the task force at first, relying on Pottinger, the deputy national security adviser, for brief periods, before finally putting Vice President Pence in the role toward the end of February.

Other officials have emerged during the crisis to help right the United States’ course, and at times the statements of the president. But even as Fauci, Azar and others sought to assert themselves, Trump was behind the scenes turning to others with no credentials, experience or discernible insight in navigating a pandemic.

Foremost among them was his adviser and son-in-law, Jared Kushner. A team reporting to Kushner commandeered space on the seventh floor of the HHS building to pursue a series of inchoate initiatives.

One plan involved having Google create a website to direct those with symptoms to testing facilities that were supposed to spring up in Walmart parking lots across the country, but which never materialized. Another centered an idea advanced by Oracle Chairman Larry Ellison to use software to monitor the unproven use of anti-malaria drugs against the coronavirus pathogen.

So far, the plans have failed to come close to delivering on the promises made when they were touted in White House news conferences. The Kushner initiatives have, however, often interrupted the work of those under immense pressure to manage the U.S. response.

Anthony S. Fauci, left, director of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, attends a White House briefing with President Trump on April 1. He is one of the core members of the administration’s coronavirus task force. (Jabin Botsford/The Washington Post)

Current and former officials said that Kadlec, Fauci, Redfield and others have repeatedly had to divert their attentions from core operations to contend with ill-conceived requests from the White House they don’t believe they can ignore. And Azar, who once ran the response, has since been sidelined, with his agency disempowered in decision-making and his performance pilloried by a range of White House officials, including Kushner.

“Right now Fauci is trying to roll out the most ambitious clinical trial ever implemented” to hasten the development of a vaccine, said a former senior administration official in frequent touch with former colleagues. And yet, the nation’s top health officials “are getting calls from the White House or Jared’s team asking, ‘Wouldn’t it be nice to do this with Oracle?’ ”

If the coronavirus has exposed the country’s misplaced confidence in its ability to handle a crisis, it also has cast harsh light on the limits of Trump’s approach to the presidency — his disdain for facts, science and experience.

He has survived other challenges to his presidency — including the Russia investigation and impeachment — by fiercely contesting the facts arrayed against him and trying to control the public’s understanding of events with streams of falsehoods.

The coronavirus may be the first crisis Trump has faced in office where the facts — the thousands of mounting deaths and infections — are so devastatingly evident that they defy these tactics.

After months of dismissing the severity of the coronavirus, resisting calls for austere measures to contain it, and recasting himself as a wartime president, Trump seemed finally to succumb to the coronavirus reality. In a meeting with a Republican ally in the Oval Office last month, the president said his campaign no longer mattered because his reelection would hinge on his coronavirus response.

“It’s absolutely critical for the American people to follow the guidelines for the next 30 days,” he said at his March 31 news conference. “It’s a matter of life and death.”
 
That is scary. No progress at all. Visually, we'll hit the peak in 20-30 days. Inaction, blame, deception, will all add up to many bodies that did not have to perish. Accountability? "I don’t take responsibility at all."
Well progress on the rate of new infections...the rate of new deaths lags...so, while still scary (especially seeing some other charts...Ill try to find...but the one I had been shown was just for Tennessee on when we expect the peak and that you really don't want to need hospital care in the next 10 days or so)...the slow flattening of the new cases hopefully will continue that trend and the rate of new deaths will follow.

 
Maybe because of drive up testing. I know they have a site at the convention center in Orange County and one in the Villages in Lake County.
Palm Beach has one at the Ballpark of the Palm Beaches that's by appointment, I believe. Martin, St. Lucie, and Indian River counties are also offering testing at the hospitals there.

 
Florida has more than double the number of people and more large cities. In Michigan, the illness is pretty much concentrated in 2 neighboring counties. Also where did you get those numbers? I read something recently critical of Michigan because maybe a week ago they stopped reporting the numbers for negative tests so that number might not be accurate. 
Link

“The data isn’t perfect. Since the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention hasn’t yet begun publicly releasing the number of people who have been tested, The COVID Tracking Project is pulling data from state health departments, which can vary in the way they report tests and infections.”

 
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Link

“The data isn’t perfect. Since the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention hasn’t yet begun publicly releasing the number of people who have been tested, The COVID Tracking Project is pulling data from state health departments, which can vary in the way they report tests and infections.”
Interesting, here is the story I saw

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/voices-chad-livengood/why-did-michigan-stop-reporting-negative-covid-19-tests-its-complicated

 
The Trump administration received its first formal notification of the outbreak of the coronavirus in China on Jan. 3. Within days, U.S. spy agencies were signaling the seriousness of the threat to Trump by including a warning about the coronavirus — the first of many — in the President’s Daily Brief.
Spy agencies you say?  No wonder he listened to China (he listened to them before he didn't listen to them, because everyone knows they're liars). 

Probably need to know what Putin told him to really get to the bottom of things.

 
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https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest

Slope on the graph of new deaths...basically a constant for almost 2 weeks now.  New cases has been turning slightly...which is good.  Will be interesting to see how it changes over the nest week or so...some cities still not at their peak here.  But that first graph is still very troubling...and showing it wasn't just a one or two day thing that some initially claimed.
Maybe the new cases flattening is good news, but it may just be we're maxed out on testing -- which has also flatlined.

 
Looks like the media and many posters in here got played by the fish tank cleaner lady. 
I actually posted this in the conspiracy thread a few days ago, as Parasoph raised it. I'm not sure if the supposed conspiracy is the media trying to frame Trump for misleading duped adherents or if the conspiracy is the idea the woman supposedly was trying to murder her husband. As someone else pointed out, these appear to be just insanely stupid people.

 
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By mid-January, Robert Kadlec, an Air Force officer and physician who serves as assistant secretary for preparedness and response at HHS, had instructed subordinates to draw up contingency plans for enforcing the Defense Production Act, a measure that enables the government to compel private companies to produce equipment or devices critical to the country’s security.
- I think the American people have the right to know about and see every briefing the President got about coronavirus.

 
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On the same day Larry Kudlow said coronavirus was “contained” on Feb. 25th, Trump’s campaign spox made an even more bold claim.

“We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here..and isn't it refreshing when contrasting it with the awful presidency of President Obama."

Files this under: "Things that don't age well'

 
Safe space? People have been asking for Trump supporters to actually engage in real discussion.  For that...get mocked in the MAGA thread where any negative post is labeled trolling (most of the time by you).

Now...anything bout this actual topic?
THE SAFETY ZONE GRRR

 
Maybe the new cases flattening is good news, but it may just be we're maxed out on testing -- which has also flatlined.
Yes...also hoping its not just a temporary lull and people in the middle of the country not yet hit hard start relaxing and then it hit there...places less equipped to handle mass infections.

Definitely a worry.

 
Just got the phone with my 72 year old mother. Said she talked to her sister who thinks this whole virus thing is way overblown and an attempt by the democrats and CNN to make Trump look bad. Feel a little bad now about ripping her a new one and calling her sister a moron. Wish I could take my aunt into our ICU and see the patients we have on ventilators, restrained so they don’t rip the breathing tube out. Unfortunately, living in Florida, I think she’ll realize her stupidity very soon. 

 
On the same day Larry Kudlow said coronavirus was “contained” on Feb. 25th, Trump’s campaign spox made an even more bold claim.

“We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here..and isn't it refreshing when contrasting it with the awful presidency of President Obama."

Files this under: "Things that don't age well'
https://twitter.com/KFILE/status/1246454626905468931

May the lawsuits flourish.

 
Spy agencies you say?  No wonder he listened to China (he listened to them before he didn't listen to them, because everyone knows they're liars). 

Probably need to know what Putin told him to really get to the bottom of things.
Would be hard to believe our spy agencies didn’t know about the seriousness of the virus at about the same time China did.

 
On the same day Larry Kudlow said coronavirus was “contained” on Feb. 25th, Trump’s campaign spox made an even more bold claim.

“We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here..and isn't it refreshing when contrasting it with the awful presidency of President Obama."

Files this under: "Things that don't age well'
That stance mirrors Fauci at the time. What did you expect Trump's people to say? If the top experts were saying the seasonal flu is more of a concern, (yes Fauci said that) did you expect Trump to stand up and tell everyone to panic? Oh, that's right you probably didn't take a look at those Fauci quotes. Nevermind.

For everyone else...

Trump is screwing this up more today imo, by not mandating made at home masks and face coverings in public. The medicinal masks on the market should be restricted to sales to health providers.

As with worldwide disasters of this scope, there is so much blame to go around. It's a cascade of deceit and errors made that goes something like this in order of sequence: China - WHO - experts - European leaders - US leaders (Trump included) - general public. Anyone could take their bias and write an article (cough, cough WaPo) that lists all the mistakes made by a single entity without putting into context the info that entity was working off of. Heck, someone could write a compelling yet very misleading article listing all the mistakes and blame that should rest on the American public. But that would be pretty misguided now wouldn't it? I mean the public was being told by everyone's favorite expert that this was no bigger concern that the flu just 6 weeks ago. And in the meantime we've had the surgeon general and Fauci follow this sequence when it comes to masks: Useless - Don't wear because they could do more harm than good - They can't hurt -  We recommend them if you want to wear one.

A simpleton looks at all of this and tries to tell you one person is to blame.

Anyone who tries to pin all the blame on one person simply should be ignored right now. I'll go so far as to say that China is the worst offender but that doesn't mean the blame stops there. After all, there are countries very close to China who went the mask route in spite of what China was saying and they fared much better. If only our experts in the US weren't so wrong about this early on. And now Trump is stubbornly poo-pooing the need for everyone to wear masks in public. I get the theory that they're trying to fend off a run on masks that would take them away from health care workers. But just as simple of a fix would be something similar to these proclamations governors are drawing up at a moment's notice. Ban public sales and distribution of manufactured masks and mandate the public only venture outside once they've fashioned a home made face covering. For the slap happy that want to rush in to call me a Trump supporter, that's the 4th time in this post alone that I'm laying blame at his feet. I even put those 4 instances in italics to make it easier for you.

 
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On the same day Larry Kudlow said coronavirus was “contained” on Feb. 25th, Trump’s campaign spox made an even more bold claim.

“We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here..and isn't it refreshing when contrasting it with the awful presidency of President Obama."

Files this under: "Things that don't age well'
That stance mirrors Fauci at the time.
That's false. Fauci never said the coronavirus was contained.

Also, the Fauci interview that you guys keep trying to push -- the one where you and Don't Noonan conveniently edited out the words "right now" -- was on January 21st, MORE THAN A MONTH before Trump's spokesperson said "We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here".

 
Guys, WHO CARES at this point.  None of you are moving any other of you off your positions.  Leave it be and let your vote at the ballot box talk. Move on please. There is plenty to talk about that is happening right now, no one can change what did or didn’t happen 2 months ago.   

 
That's false. Fauci never said the coronavirus was contained.

Also, the Fauci interview that you guys keep trying to push -- the one where you and Don't Noonan conveniently edited out the words "right now" -- was on January 21st, MORE THAN A MONTH before Trump's spokesperson said "We will not see diseases like the coronavirus come here".
I didn't edit a damn thing, knock it off. I posted an entire article and copied and pasted direct from the article which had the quotes. You're a total disgrace to honesty . It's all there for everyone if they actually want the truth. Fauci said this is less of a concern than the seasonal flu. Kudlow following up by saying the situation was contained, is not an egregious juxtaposition based on that. and I'll remind you that Fauci said this about containment...

It isn’t something the American public needs to worry about or be frightened about. Because we have ways of preparing and screening of people coming in [from China].”
saying on Feb. 18 that the “hypothetical danger of coronavirus” to America was “just minuscule” compared to the “real and present danger” of the seasonal flu.

 
Guys, WHO CARES at this point.  None of you are moving any other of you off your positions.  Leave it be and let your vote at the ballot box talk. Move on please. There is plenty to talk about that is happening right now, no one can change what did or didn’t happen 2 months ago.   
If you don’t vigorously swat down the lies and misinformation you end up where we are.

 
That stance mirrors Fauci at the time. What did you expect Trump's people to say? If the top experts were saying the seasonal flu is more of a concern, (yes Fauci said that) did you expect Trump to stand up and tell everyone to panic? Oh, that's right you probably didn't take a look at those Fauci quotes. Nevermind.

For everyone else...

Trump is screwing this up more today imo, by not mandating made at home masks and face coverings in public. The medicinal masks on the market should be restricted to sales to health providers.

As with worldwide disasters of this scope, there is so much blame to go around. It's a cascade of deceit and errors made that goes something like this in order of sequence: China - WHO - experts - European leaders - US leaders (Trump included) - general public. Anyone could take their bias and write an article (cough, cough WaPo) that lists all the mistakes made by a single entity without putting into context the info that entity was working off of. Heck, someone could write a compelling yet very misleading article listing all the mistakes and blame that should rest on the American public. But that would be pretty misguided now wouldn't it? I mean the public was being told by everyone's favorite expert that this was no bigger concern that the flu just 6 weeks ago. And in the meantime we've had the surgeon general and Fauci follow this sequence when it comes to masks: Useless - Don't wear because they could do more harm than good - They can't hurt -  We recommend them if you want to wear one.

A simpleton looks at all of this and tries to tell you one person is to blame.

Anyone who tries to pin all the blame on one person simply should be ignored right now. I'll go so far as to say that China is the worst offender but that doesn't mean the blame stops there. After all, there are countries very close to China who went the mask route in spite of what China was saying and they fared much better. If only our experts in the US weren't so wrong about this early on. And now Trump is stubbornly poo-pooing the need for everyone to wear masks in public. I get the theory that they're trying to fend off a run on masks that would take them away from health care workers. But just as simple of a fix would be something similar to these proclamations governors are drawing up at a moment's notice. Ban public sales and distribution of manufactured masks and mandate the public only venture outside once they've fashioned a home made face covering. For the slap happy that want to rush in to call me a Trump supporter, that's the 4th time in this post alone that I'm laying blame at his feet. I even put those 4 instances in italics for you to make it easier to spot.
The Federal government has abdicated its responsibility to lead and provide the states and local governments with the resources they need to respond to the largest pandemic in 100 years.  Their response has been to issue guidelines (no national order), deny any responsibility to assist in acquiring and distributing supplies (we don't have the masks to cover everyone, or the ventilators), refuse to invoke, commit, or coordinate the enormous resources and power at their disposal (Eliminating pandemic response teams, refusing to invoke War Powers, not mobilizing the military supply chain, refusing to treat this as a national emergency), and minimize the extent of the issue itself (countless examples of Trump lying to us since January).  The buck stops with the President - He has said as much in the past.  We elected him to lead us, and he's just not doing his job because he doesn't want the responsibility.  It's simple accountability - He owns it. 

Go ahead and blame China and/or the WHO, but where does that get us now?  Does it get ventilators to NYC?  Does it get PPE to the doctors and nurses?  Does it get tests to the communities without shelter in place that are going to become the next hot spot?  There are immediate actions that need to happen NOW, and our federal government needs to act.  There has been some assistance, albeit grudgingly, but they could be doing SO much more for us.

 
Guys, WHO CARES at this point.  None of you are moving any other of you off your positions.  Leave it be and let your vote at the ballot box talk. Move on please. There is plenty to talk about that is happening right now, no one can change what did or didn’t happen 2 months ago.   


This.

You two guys drop it and stop ruining this thread. Move on.

 
You're darn right more could be done right now. That's why I said, I'd place more blame at the Trump administration for current decisions than past ones. I'm just so beat down right now. Intellectual honesty is damn near extinct. Ugh

 
This.

You two guys drop it and stop ruining this thread. Move on.
Unbelievable. I'm posting facts, sharing far more info on what's going on, trying to help understand how fruitless (and dangerous) it is to blame one person, and one guy gets to derail it by following me around with a lie. We get tossed in the same bin. Any consideration of the precedent that sets?

 
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Just got the phone with my 72 year old mother. Said she talked to her sister who thinks this whole virus thing is way overblown and an attempt by the democrats and CNN to make Trump look bad. Feel a little bad now about ripping her a new one and calling her sister a moron. Wish I could take my aunt into our ICU and see the patients we have on ventilators, restrained so they don’t rip the breathing tube out. Unfortunately, living in Florida, I think she’ll realize her stupidity very soon. 
Unfortunately, I think you're right. The hammer may drop on FL in the next 7-14 days, and with the delayed response and the high risk population we have here I'm afraid it will be bad. Fingers crossed it isn't, but I can't think we'll be spared what China, Italy and NY experienced.

 
I didn't edit a damn thing, knock it off. I posted an entire article and copied and pasted direct from the article which had the quotes. You're a total disgrace to honesty . It's all there for everyone if they actually want the truth. Fauci said this is less of a concern than the seasonal flu. Kudlow following up by saying the situation was contained, is not an egregious juxtaposition based on that. and I'll remind you that Fauci said this about containment...
Video of the comment... begins @ :48 seconds - this is the link originally from Don't Noonan.

Please watch and listen to the portion before responding. Fauci says one thing, the attributed quote below the video says another things, and you, @Mr Anonymous quoted something else. Would you agree with that statement I just typed out?

Fauci in the video: "Obviously you need to take it seriously and do the kinds of things the CDC and the Department of Homeland Security are doing. But, this is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States, right now, should be worried about. - January 21st, 2020

Fauci was quoted as saying, in the article: "This is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States should be worried about right now,” Dr. Fauci told Newsmax’s Greg Kelly on January 21.

Don't Noonen linked to an article where the quote attributed to Fauci was: “This is not a major threat to the people of the United States and this is not something that the citizens of the United States should be worried about right now,” Dr. Fauci told Newsmax’s Greg Kelly on January 21.

- I used this @Don't Noonan response because he used the January 21st date in a post of his at which time he later linked to the article above.

You, @Mr Anonymous linked to a different article than the one Don't Noonen alluded to and then later linked in response to @timschochet. So, in all the hubbub, that began on page 218, Tim and Don't Noonen were having a discussion about a certain article and a certain quote when you chimed in with a different article and a different argument altogether. So, by looking back at page 218, it was you, @Mr Anonymous who got riled up over a quote that had you read the article @Don't Noonan linked to, you would see the contention, rightfully so, by everyone else. So, in conclusion, it would appear to be your fault that you didn't read the article that @Don't Noonan linked up which is the origination of the conversation begun on page 218.

 
I don't know if I'm allowed to defend myself but I shared my link before Don't Noonan even shared a link. What Tim responded to was something DN shared off what he heard on TV. I shared my link which had the quotes DN was paraphrasing by his own admission. I shared my link in direct response to Tim to show that Fauci did indeed say those things which even he no longer disputes. I didn't edit anything. I shared the entire RealClearPolitics article and the quotes therein. You're taking things out of order to mislead and condemn me. And that's pretty crappy.

 
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I don't know if I'm allowed to defend myself but I shared my link before Don't Noonan even shared a link. What Tim responded to was something DN shared off what he heard on TV. I shared my link which had the quotes DN was paraphrasing by his own admission. I shared my link in direct response to Tim to show that Fauci did indeed say those things which even he no longer disputes. I didn't edit anything. I shared the entire RealClearPolitics article and the quotes therein. You're taking things out of order to mislead and condemn me. And that's pretty crappy.
So put that in your mirror and talk about today. I offered a suggestion a few posts up.

 
I don't know if I'm allowed to defend myself but I shared my link before Don't Noonan even shared a link. What Tim responded to was something DN shared off what he heard on TV. I shared my link which had the quotes DN was referring to. I shared that in direct response to Tim to show that Fauci did indeed say those things which he even no longer disputes. I didn't edit anything. I shared the entire RealClearPolitics article and the quotes therein. You're taking things out of order to condemn me and that's pretty crappy.
The original conversation Tim and Don't Noonan were having was between them two. Noonan said something, Tim didn't think it was accurate, Noonan found where he heard it and replied to Tim. Noonan never acknowledged you within the conversation he and Tim were having. Noonan linked the appropriate article for their discussion.

You began a different discussion with Tim, which, per the posts, Tim presumed you were discussing the same article, ie quote, Noonan was having with Tim. You posted an article from a different website, a different time frame, and a different time altogether. The quote Noonan and Tim were discussing is not even in the article you posted. The only quote from Jan. 21, from your linked article has a link within that quote which goes to a totally different article that did not come into play on page 218-219.

Go read page 218 again if you think I'm taking things out of order. It's not crappy of me to simply go back and see, in real time, how the discussion ran. Throughout that page, Noonan never quoted you and unless he wrote your name in a post, never acknowledged you either. His discussion was with Tim and, again, you chimed in from left field putting your two-cents in when you weren't even on the same topic.

 
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