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*** OFFICIAL *** COVID-19 CoronaVirus Thread. Fresh epidemic fears as child pneumonia cases surge in Europe after China outbreak. NOW in USA (9 Viewers)

I've got quite a few events and flights coming up in the 2nd half of 2021. 3 flights to Florida alone (Tampa 2x and Daytona Beach for work). 

Also have arguably the riskiest possible event in 4 weeks: Black Keys are playing the Lyric Theater in Oxford, MS. An arena band PACKING IN an 800 person club on a misssissippi college campus. 

These are part of the reason I got the booster. I'm actually considering rolling the dice and going to the show. This is one of those "never will happen again" shows. 

We are pretty lucky to have these jabs 

 
jobarules said:
Doctors are just "checking boxes" by saying to get the vaccine. Of course everyone knows better including you. Name a single virus that we don't gain at least some form of natural immunity against. In the entire history of viruses are there any? It's common sense.
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jobarules said:
Isnt rabies fatal without a vaccine? How can someone get rabies twice?
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You said name a virus we don't get at least some form of natural immunity against. 

Rabies "checks that box".  There is no natural immunity to it because you die when you get it.

 
jobarules said:
Name a single virus that we don't gain at least some form of natural immunity against. In the entire history of viruses are there any?
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What do you mean by this?  There are a multitude of viruses that we can't fight off without significant help from drugs/treatments.  The first two that come to mind are EBOLA and HIV, but that might not be what you're talking about.

 
The Commish said:
What do you mean by this?  There are a multitude of viruses that we can't fight off without significant help from drugs/treatments.  The first two that come to mind are EBOLA and HIV, but that might not be what you're talking about.
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I'm talking about if you get sick from said virus AND SURVIVE (for those obtuse people like gianmarco), your body is immune to that same virus for some time in the future. Some viruses that immunity lasts a lifetime. Others that immunity wanes quickly.

 
[icon] said:
I've got quite a few events and flights coming up in the 2nd half of 2021. 3 flights to Florida alone (Tampa 2x and Daytona Beach for work). 

Also have arguably the riskiest possible event in 4 weeks: Black Keys are playing the Lyric Theater in Oxford, MS. An arena band PACKING IN an 800 person club on a misssissippi college campus. 

These are part of the reason I got the booster. I'm actually considering rolling the dice and going to the show. This is one of those "never will happen again" shows. 

We are pretty lucky to have these jabs 
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Can you elaborate a bit (if possible) on the process for already receiving a booster shot? Asking for a friend who's interested in getting one. 

 
jobarules said:
I'm talking about if you get sick from said virus AND SURVIVE (for those obtuse people like gianmarco), your body is immune to that same virus for some time in the future. Some viruses that immunity lasts a lifetime. Others that immunity wanes quickly.
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HIV fits that bill.  You get it and can't get rid of it.  It might not kill you but it will be with you until you die.  You can't get rid of it naturally.

 
Battersbox said:
This is all true. And it works both ways. I posted an interesting study in here yesterday and you subsequently stamped your feet and implied I was some right-wing troll that wants to post conspiracy theories on FB. Despite the fact that this study has been picked up by several thinkers across the spectrum as something with merit and deserving of further thought.

Dialogue is good, even if we have to suffer the crazies.
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The study you linked is interesting.  And I completely agree with you that it shouldn't be dismissed out of hand at all just because it suggests something that is opposite to current data and recommendations.  I'm sure we will see more about it soon and I look forward to seeing what we see/hear.

That said, a few caveats:

1)  It isn't peer reviewed yet.  We don't know if it will even make it to publication because there may be some severe flaws in the design or the numbers.

2)  It's a retrospective observational study.  There can certainly be some significant bias in that kind of study.  When I looked through it, the overall numbers of reinfections was incredibly small compared to the total number in each group.  And especially when looking at the unvaccinated.  It's very possible/likely that those that were previously infected simply weren't getting tested again.  So, if you have higher rates of testing for the vaccinated group, then those results aren't really telling us what they think they are telling us.  This is part of the reason that this kind of study and can be flawed and why it needs to be reviewed carefully with the right statistical analysis. 

3)  It goes against the results of the previous study that was put out (that was peer reviewed, IIRC).  So, that also means that we now need to see what others are showing if there's such a difference in results. 

 
jobarules said:
Not really. You cant RECOVER from HIV. I guess I should have used the word RECOVER instead of SURVIVE
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It seems like all your arguing is to point out that immunity is variable and we don't know what we don't know.  I'm not sure anybody has actually disagreed with that.  If that's not your point then I really have no clue why you've gone down this rabbit hole.

 
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AAABatteries said:
It seems like all your arguing is to point out that immunity is variable and we don't know what we don't know.  I'm not sure anybody has actually disagreed with that.  If that's not your point then I really have no clue why you've gone down this rabbit hole.
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There's tons of people on these boards that seem to know everything and once conflicting data or news comes out challenge it immediately while sticking fingers in their ears shouting LALALALALALALA. THATS MY POINT

 
jobarules said:
Still waiting for someone to name a virus we don't gain some form of immunity from.
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Define you parameters. "Some form of immunity" is pretty meaningless, as a healthy immune system will always make an attempt at forming antibodies against an invasive pathogen. That's a form of immunity whether it succeeds or fails.

And some people are just genetically lucky and have a lower-than-normal number of certain receptors in their bodies that different pathogens use to infect. So, yeah, it's true that if a virus runs wild through a naive population (e.g. pre-industrial humans), some portion will have "some form of immunity" and survive in the end. So what of it? What is your fundamental point?

 
jobarules said:
There's tons of people on these boards that seem to know everything and once conflicting data or news comes out challenge it immediately ...
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What's the difference between "challenging" something and "questioning" something?

If a lone study aims to buck existing consensus, dang right it will be challenged. Doesn't mean more corroborating evidence won't be found and doesn't mean a new consensus can't be reached. But to start? Right out of the box? Yes, something aiming to pivot the consensus 180 degrees will face due resistance. And that's proper and fitting and the way things are done.

 
culdeus said:
jobarules said:
So I get the common cold, I infect my son with the common cold, he can now reinfect me with the same common cold?
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Yes, in time.  Waning immunity is a thing.  Especially for coronaviruses.  
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Every common-cold-causing virus is the same way, to boot. If you have a rhinovirus infection today, you probably won't get infected with the same one, say, two months after you got over it. But wait a few years? You could certainly be infected with the same virus again.

With the common cold, the point is kind of moot, though. Hundreds (if not thousands) of different types of viruses cause common-cold symptoms. It's more helpful to think of the common cold as a syndrome of symptoms than as a specific virus (or set of viruses).

 
jobarules said:
There's tons of people on these boards that seem to know everything and once conflicting data or news comes out challenge it immediately while sticking fingers in their ears shouting LALALALALALALA. THATS MY POINT
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Despite your unnecessary comment to me earlier, I'll respond to this.

This view of yours is wrong.  It's not that people here "seem to know everything".  It's that many of us here choose to follow the current recommendations as they come out from those that are qualified to make those recommendations.  We don't decide to ignore that advice because of a google search or a news story that comes out that conflicts with those recommendations. 

The reason is those that are making those recommendations are privy to all of those same news stories and studies and a lot more that you aren't able to see and take all of that into account when making those recommendations.

The reason I (and others here) say to get the vaccine even if you got Covid is because that's what the current recommendation is.  If they find evidence (i.e. from the recent Israel study) to suggest otherwise and they change their minds, then so will I.

I know that I don't know everything.  I also realize, despite my knowledge on these subjects, where to look for the right information and who to listen to.

 
jobarules said:
Isnt rabies fatal without a vaccine? How can someone get rabies twice?

Yep

https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn22130-natural-immunity-may-protect-peruvians-from-rabies/

You were wrong about something? HOW IS THAT POSSIBLE?
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This article is from 2012. Not a problem in and of itself, but I'd want to look for follow-up and see if these findings have been corroborated since and have held up over time.

But aside from that -- a virus infection like rabies for which a few dozen people worldwide have natural immunity, and otherwise has a 99.999% death rate ... that's close enough IMHO. It would be madness to eschew science and refuse rabies treatments in the event of exposure.

EDIT: Looking at that "natural immunity from rabies" 2012 article again ... it looks to me like it's the story of six lucky-as-F people who were likely exposed to an unknown small number of rabies virions. It's totally reasonable and expected that a healthy immune system can defeat even a very serious virus IF the exposure is small enough.

Now. What if that small exposure is a crazy rare thing? That it's much, much more typical (like 9,999 times out of 10,000) that the usual vectors (animal bites) instead send in millions of times more virions than the healthy immune system can be expected to handle? There's a reason rabies death rate is so high -- one way to couch it is that as a matter of statistics, dang near NO ONE obtains natural immunity after rabies exposure. That one in several thousand (or more) that might get that magic small "dose" of viral exposure and pull through in the end ... that's not something I want to hang my hat on.

 
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[icon] said:
Grace Under Pressure said:
Can you elaborate a bit (if possible) on the process for already receiving a booster shot? Asking for a friend who's interested in getting one. 
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Posted upthread but I basically just filled out the form on cvs.com, went in, signed some form on a tablet, and she jabbed me. No questions really. 
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This varies state to state. The Louisiana process definitely has an ID check, insurance submission, and a medical database check involved.

In theory, it's supposed to be possible to get a vaccine in Louisiana without self-identifying documents. In practice ... if you don't present like someone who probably doesn't have typical citizen records (i.e. you better speak broken English, to start), you're gonna get grilled. And likely denied.

 
jobarules said:
There's tons of people on these boards that seem to know everything and once conflicting data or news comes out challenge it immediately while sticking fingers in their ears shouting LALALALALALALA. THATS MY POINT
Click to expand...


I guess we just see things differently - scientific or medical consensus in the moment and then modifying or changing that based on new data isn't the same as someone not wanting to listen to people saying the vaccines don't work, masks are worthless, etc.  I think the vast majority of folks in this thread, no matter where they fall on things would say that this is an ever moving and changing situation.  What that means is we should all educate ourselves in the areas that impact us.  What it doesn't mean is you (not you, you) shouldn't get the vaccine because we can't be 100% certain or that you should get a booster because they said 6 months and somebody said 8 months.  Very, very few people are saying somebody should blindly just inject themselves with boosters or eat horse parasite meds.

 
[icon] said:
Posted upthread but I basically just filled out the form on cvs.com, went in, signed some form on a tablet, and she jabbed me. No questions really. 
Click to expand...
Pretty much the same here in my county in Florida.  I'm caregiver for my brother in law who has Down's Syndrome, a history of blood clots, and chronic kidney disease.  I checked with his physician and they said they'd most likely just take him if I just showed up, but I wanted to be sure.  Filled out some forms online and have 1300 appt today.  I don't know if it matters, but we're also going back to the same location he got his original 2 shots from.

 
AAABatteries said:
I guess we just see things differently - scientific or medical consensus in the moment and then modifying or changing that based on new data isn't the same as someone not wanting to listen to people saying the vaccines don't work, masks are worthless, etc.  I think the vast majority of folks in this thread, no matter where they fall on things would say that this is an ever moving and changing situation.  What that means is we should all educate ourselves in the areas that impact us.  What it doesn't mean is you (not you, you) shouldn't get the vaccine because we can't be 100% certain or that you should get a booster because they said 6 months and somebody said 8 months.  Very, very few people are saying somebody should blindly just inject themselves with boosters or eat horse parasite meds.
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We have posters on these boards getting boosters well before the currently recommended 8 month time frame. Nobody bats an eye.

 
jobarules said:
We have posters on these boards getting boosters well before the currently recommended 8 month time frame. Nobody bats an eye.
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That's fair - I definitely raised an eyebrow at icon's post but didn't take time to research it.  I would agree that I would not sign-up for a booster until I have a clearer picture.  I would assume he did the same.

 
AAABatteries said:
That's fair - I definitely raised an eyebrow at icon's post but didn't take time to research it.  I would agree that I would not sign-up for a booster until I have a clearer picture.  I would assume he did the same.
Click to expand...
Yep. Israeli Efficacy and safety data came out glowing, which prompted me to get the booster. 

8mo was the first guess... efficacy determined the refined optimal timeline. 6 months will be the global standard...

Not particularly concerned if any busybodies think i got it too early. :lol:  It's the right timeline and upcoming guidance will prove that out. Many in this thread have been well ahead of the curve since January 2020.  

 
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My wife is eligible for a booster now since she is immunocompromised.  We initially got J&J, and not sure which booster to get.  Her instructions from the doctor are not very clear either.  They basically say there is not a lot of data out there on J&J and boosters and that it is up to the pharmacy to determine if she can get a booster other than J&J.  

Should she be shopping for a Moderna/Pfizer booster or get another J&J at this point?  Or just do whatever the pharmacy says? 

Part of me just wants to get two shots of Moderna and forget we ever got J&J.  

 
jobarules said:
Still waiting for someone to name a virus we dont gain some form of immunity from.
Click to expand...
Yeah, this is dumb. Assuming you have a functioning immune system, it will function as an immune system and develop immunity. The question is… will it be enough to protect you from death? And in many cases, the answer is no.

And any fatal pathogen could be viral, bacterial, or protozoan. Your immune system doesn’t care where it came from. 

 
https://apnews.com/article/lifestyle-health-education-florida-coronavirus-pandemic-1908088a0b5c5b02d89fd7e007822408

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Judge blocks Florida governor’s order banning mask mandates

By TERRY SPENCER and CURT ANDERSON13 minutes ago

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. (AP) — Florida school districts can legally require their students to wear masks to prevent the spread of COVID-19, a judge ruled Friday, saying Gov. Ron DeSantis overstepped his authority when he issued an executive order banning such mandates.

Leon County Circuit Judge John C. Cooper agreed with a group of parents who claimed in a lawsuit that DeSantis’ order is unconstitutional and cannot be enforced. The governor’s order gave parents the sole right to decide if their child wears a mask at school.

Cooper said DeSantis’ order “is without legal authority.”

His decision came after a three-day virtual hearing, and after 10 Florida school boards voted to defy DeSantis and impose mask requirements with no parental opt-out. Cooper’s ruling will not go into effect until it is put into writing, which the judge asked the parents’ lawyers to complete by Monday.

Cooper said that while the governor and others have argued that a new Florida law gives parents the ultimate authority to oversee health issues for their children, it also exempts government actions that are needed to protect public health and are reasonable and limited in scope. He said a school district’s decision to require student masking to prevent the spread of the virus falls within that exemption.

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The law “doesn’t ban mask mandates at all,” Cooper said during a two-hour hearing that was conducted online because of the resurgent pandemic. “It doesn’t require that a mask mandate must include a parental opt-out at all.”

The judge also noted that two Florida Supreme Court decisions from 1914 and 1939 found that individual rights are limited by their impact on the rights of others. For example, he said, adults have the right to drink alcohol but not to drive drunk, because that endangers others. There is a right to free speech, but not to harass or threaten others or yell “fire” in a crowded theater, he said.

“We don’t have that right because exercising the right in that way is harmful or potentially harmful to other people,” Cooper said. He added that the law “is full of examples of rights that are limited (when) the good of others ... would be adversely affected by those rights.”

 
Scoresman said:
My wife is eligible for a booster now since she is immunocompromised.  We initially got J&J, and not sure which booster to get.  Her instructions from the doctor are not very clear either.  They basically say there is not a lot of data out there on J&J and boosters and that it is up to the pharmacy to determine if she can get a booster other than J&J.  

Should she be shopping for a Moderna/Pfizer booster or get another J&J at this point?  Or just do whatever the pharmacy says? 

Part of me just wants to get two shots of Moderna and forget we ever got J&J.  
Click to expand...


I do not believe J&J has been approved for any booster at this time -- for immunocompromised or otherwise.  

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
I do not believe J&J has been approved for any booster at this time -- for immunocompromised or otherwise.  
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That's what I thought.

This is the language from her doctor verbatim.  "While there is not enough data about the additional J&J vaccine dose, in our opinion there is minimal risk in receiving the additional vaccine dose."

 
[icon] said:
Yep. Israeli Efficacy and safety data came out glowing, which prompted me to get the booster. 

8mo was the first guess... efficacy determined the refined optimal timeline. 6 months will be the global standard...

Not particularly concerned if any busybodies think i got it too early. :lol:  It's the right timeline and upcoming guidance will prove that out. Many in this thread have been well ahead of the curve since January 2020.  
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Sure, and I know you research your stuff.  I will definitely be in line to get the booster somewhat soon.

 
jobarules said:
The Commish said:
HIV fits that bill.  You get it and can't get rid of it.  It might not kill you but it will be with you until you die.  You can't get rid of it naturally.
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Not really. You cant RECOVER from HIV. I guess I should have used the word RECOVER instead of SURVIVE
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I can't figure out what point you're trying to make.  Is it that we produce antibodies for viruses that we get and those antibodies are "immunity of some sort"? 

If so, the "of some sort" makes it so vague, no answer will be sufficient, not to mention dependent on each individual's immune system.  We can show plenty of places where a person gets a virus, their immune system produces antibodies, but they aren't nearly enough in number to "recover" or "survive" said virus.

 
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Someone smarter than me needs to explain my states numbers.

Daily new cases per 100k are going up.

Infection rate (Ro) going down 

Positive test rate going down 

 
Leeroy Jenkins said:
I just got a bunch of powercomm kn95s …..
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Those do seem to be a trusted brand for KN95s, so you should be fine.

After I bought my first batch of KF94s I got last year, I realized I should have gotten adjustable straps. So next time I went on Amazon and found a well-reviewed mask that had those straps. But if I had been looking for KN95s, it would have added an extra layer of stress as I would have needed to verify that it was a legit brand.

 
belljr said:
Someone smarter than me needs to explain my states numbers.

Daily new cases per 100k are going up.

Infection rate (Ro) going down 

Positive test rate going down 
Click to expand...


How are they calculating the positive rate? 7/14/21-day average? overall (whole pandemic timeframe)? 

I ask because in looking at our state numbers that I record daily, the overall was around ~5% which had come down considerably since the winter/spring. Then Delta hit. We are almost back up to 6% overall, because the daily number of positives is high enough to bring the whole thing up.  Our daily positive rate for the last few weeks has been in the 8-12% range. Prior to the first week of July it was in the 2-4%. Crystal clear when Delta took hold here. 

 
AAABatteries said:
Sure, and I know you research your stuff.  I will definitely be in line to get the booster somewhat soon.
Click to expand...
How does one go about getting a booster? 

I'm travelling to Europe in September, the southwest in October, the Pacific west in November, and Louisiana for Thanksgiving.  Intuitively it seems like erring on the side of a somewhat-early booster would make a lot of sense under the circumstances.  (This is purely an "abundance of caution" thing -- I don't plan on cancelling any of these trips unless they're cancelled for me).

 
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IvanKaramazov said:
How does one go about getting a booster? 

I'm travelling to Europe in September, the southwest in October, the Pacific west in November, and Louisiana for Thanksgiving.  Intuitively it seems like erring on the side of a somewhat-early booster would make a lot of sense under the circumstances.  (This is purely an "abundance of caution" thing -- I don't plan on cancelling any of these trips unless they're cancelled for me).
Click to expand...
Right now, when I go on CVS.com, these are the only options available. I guess you can lie and say you have a weakened immune system like icon did. I doubt they can check or confirm that.

Tell us what you need

Your vaccine options depend on what you need. Tell us if you need to start vaccination (I've never received a vaccine before), or if you only need to schedule a second or extra dose (I've already received at least one dose).

If you've already received the first dose, you may schedule just a second dose.

You may also schedule an extra dose if you have a weakened immune system (immunocompromised) and are fully vaccinated with Pfizer or Moderna.

Extra dose eligibility is based on current CDC guidelines and may change in the near future.

What do you need? (required)

I need to start vaccination

I only need to schedule a second dose.

I need to schedule an extra dose (weakened immune system only)
Click to expand...

 
IvanKaramazov said:
How does one go about getting a booster? 

I'm travelling to Europe in September, the southwest in October, the Pacific west in November, and Louisiana for Thanksgiving.  Intuitively it seems like erring on the side of a somewhat-early booster would make a lot of sense under the circumstances.  (This is purely an "abundance of caution" thing -- I don't plan on cancelling any of these trips unless they're cancelled for me).
Click to expand...


No clue - from a little digging it seems like maybe we are a few weeks away from it being a little more official and maybe something that you can sign-up for.

 
Apologies if this is a Honda, the thread moves fast. Interesting approach.

Mexican researchers say they created facemask that neutralizes COVID-19

MEXICO CITY, Aug 26 (Reuters) - Researchers at the National Autonomous University of Mexico (UNAM) have created a facemask using silver and copper nanolayers that neutralizes SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19, the university's official gazette said on Thursday.

UNAM is calling the triple-layered antimicrobial facemask SakCu; Sak means silver in Mayan and Cu is the chemical symbol for copper.

To test the mask, researchers took drops with the virus from COVID-19-positive patients at the Hospital Juarez in Mexico and placed them on the silver-copper film deposited in polypropylene.

UNAM said that if the viral concentration was high, the virus disappeared by more than 80% in about eight hours and if the viral load was low, in two hours none of the virus RNA was detected.

The research was led by UNAM's Materials Research Institute. It has not been peer reviewed.

 
Example of some Covid numbers for hospitalized patients

Seeing these same numbers across multiple hospital systems, but just for a point of reference of how well the vaccines are working.

As of August 27, 2021, Wellstar Health System is caring for 668 COVID-19 patients – that's an increase of 27 patients from yesterday's cases of 641.

Of the current cases, 613 are unvaccinated. A total of 153 people are in the ICU (148 unvaccinated) and a total of 116 people are on ventilators (113 unvaccinated).

Protect yourself, our community, and help slow the spread. To find a vaccination site near you, visit https://www.vaccines.gov/. Find updates and information on COVID-19 at Wellstar by visiting wellstar.org/COVID19.

 
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