War in Israel (2 Viewers)

[Todem]

https://twitter.com/Justin_Br0nk/status/1714352303082271215

For what it’s worth, this doesn’t look or sound quite like an air strike using the typical IAF 1000lb or 2000lb JDAM/Mk80 series to me. Incoming projectile sounds like it’s under power and the explosion frames visible look like largely propellant fire rather than HE detonation…

Obviously, however, it’s difficult to tell with any certainty based on a single camera angle at night with low resolution.

https://twitter.com/TreyYingst/status/1714358894749749360

IDF statement to Fox: “A hospital is a highly sensitive building and is not an IDF target. The IDF is investigating the source of the explosion and, like always, is prioritizing accuracy and reliability.”

Strike on Gaza Hospital Kills More Than 500

Palestinian health officials said more than 500 people were killed in an Israeli strike on a Gaza hospital, while Israel said the explosion was caused by a Palestinian rocket. The blast at Al-Ahli Arab Hospital was one of the deadliest single incidents of violence in the Gaza Strip, coming hours bef

www.wsj.com

Palestinian health officials said more than 500 people were killed in an Israeli airstrike on a Gaza hospital in one of the deadliest single incidents of violence in the strip—hours before President Biden was expected to visit Israel in a show of support. The attack on Al-Ahli Arab Hospital occurred as aid workers already warned of a looming humanitarian collapse in Gaza.

Israeli military spokesman Daniel Hagari said he is looking into what happened at the hospital. The explosion comes during a week of escalating Israeli bombing in Gaza, following Hamas’s attacks on Israel on Oct. 7.

I would wait for some more information. Regardless, a serious and tragic incident.

Israel is saying they didn't have planes in the area and hadn't targeted any hospitals. They also tossed out the stat that 30-40% of Hamas rockets fall back on Gaza bc of their poor aim and technology. But yeah, I'm sure more details will come out on this.

Hasn't stopped leaders from around the world from condemning Israel already.

It’s a joke.

 

[The Duff Man]

Would Hamas blow up a Gaza hospital if they felt it would limit Israel in their coming response? It feels like the answer is yes

 

[Todem]

https://twitter.com/IDF/status/1714370853465387395

View attachment 4303​

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Israel Defense Forces​

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@IDF​

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Following an analysis by the IDF's operational systems, a barrage of rockets was launched toward Israel, which passed in the vicinity of the hospital, when it was hit. According to intelligence information from a number of sources we have, Islamic Jihad terrorist organization is responsible for the failed rocket launch that hit the hospital.​

Great. Another terrorist organization joining into the fracas.

IT is going to be a total **** show folks......war sucks. And when your dealing with madmen like Jiahd terrorists.....lot’s of innocent people are going to die. The sooner we rid Gaza of Hamas the sooner it’s rebuilding can begin and hopefully....and I say this with realistic apprehension the peace process can restart for the 100th time.

 

[Todem]

Would Hamas blow up a Gaza hospital if they felt it would limit Israel in their coming response? It feels like the answer is yes

They will do anything....anything to destroy Israel.....and 1300 deaths at their hands proves that already.

This is such a dark chapter in mankind......the degree of malice, cold bloodiness and barbarism carried out is simply hard to digest and get over.

 

[DA RAIDERS]

Would Hamas blow up a Gaza hospital if they felt it would limit Israel in their coming response? It feels like the answer is yes

the answer is yes. and they'd do it to increase the pressure on israel. both in the media and from other arab nations/states. there are no morals in play. that has already been shown.

 

[facook]

non-religious group, Democratic Socialists of America, holding a pro-hamas rally.

Hundreds fill Times Square for rival protests over violence in Israel

Violence in the Middle East reverberated Sunday in Times Square, where pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli protesters came face to face during heated demonstrations.

www.nydailynews.com

using AAA logic, all socialists are pro-murder. socialism should die in America.

No comment on socialists as that's way too close to the political line.

But I will say, as individuals, these organizers are evil and should be shunned in polite society. I don't see how you plan a rally to cheer killing 250 kids.

I work with people exactly like this. I've typed up like six or seven posts along these lines and had to delete all of them for an assortment of reasons, but people should start listening seriously to people who use terms like "decolonization." This is not a fringe ideology in my world.

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

 

[Todem]

non-religious group, Democratic Socialists of America, holding a pro-hamas rally.

Hundreds fill Times Square for rival protests over violence in Israel

Violence in the Middle East reverberated Sunday in Times Square, where pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli protesters came face to face during heated demonstrations.

www.nydailynews.com

using AAA logic, all socialists are pro-murder. socialism should die in America.

No comment on socialists as that's way too close to the political line.

But I will say, as individuals, these organizers are evil and should be shunned in polite society. I don't see how you plan a rally to cheer killing 250 kids.

I work with people exactly like this. I've typed up like six or seven posts along these lines and had to delete all of them for an assortment of reasons, but people should start listening seriously to people who use terms like "decolonization." This is not a fringe ideology in my world.

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

Insane.

 

[SWC]

non-religious group, Democratic Socialists of America, holding a pro-hamas rally.

Hundreds fill Times Square for rival protests over violence in Israel

Violence in the Middle East reverberated Sunday in Times Square, where pro-Palestinian and pro-Israeli protesters came face to face during heated demonstrations.

www.nydailynews.com

using AAA logic, all socialists are pro-murder. socialism should die in America.

No comment on socialists as that's way too close to the political line.

But I will say, as individuals, these organizers are evil and should be shunned in polite society. I don't see how you plan a rally to cheer killing 250 kids.

I work with people exactly like this. I've typed up like six or seven posts along these lines and had to delete all of them for an assortment of reasons, but people should start listening seriously to people who use terms like "decolonization." This is not a fringe ideology in my world.

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

me too on twitter but i guess it doesnt surprise me just like todem keeps saying war is hell and civilians will die it is inevitable and all that so too is it that people will pick sides hell we have american politicans siding up with russia against ukraine it is just is a part of our insanely tribal current world regrettable as hell as it may be take that to the bank brohans

 

[Jayrod]

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

So I just spent 10 minutes reminding myself why I'm off of twitter. The sheer volume of misinformation is overwhelming.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Would Hamas blow up a Gaza hospital if they felt it would limit Israel in their coming response? It feels like the answer is yes

Well, yeah. As others have noted, they intentionally store arms in hospitals and schools for precisely this reason. Having a hospital destroyed is their biggest victory since their brave fight against the kids at that rave.

 

[Todem]

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

So I just spent 10 minutes reminding myself why I'm off of twitter. The sheer volume of misinformation is overwhelming.

Deleted my account after this War broke out.

Arm pit of the world.

 

[SWC]

Good grief, just stop the discussion on the $6 billion. It is a stupid and pointless argument which is the very definition of political and is completely derailing the thread. I'm not reporting it because I want this thread to survive, but enough already.

On a related note, who cares what percentage of the Gaza population supports Hamas? That's not at all relevant to the situation at hand.

disagree entirely bromigo elsewhere in this thread the hardliners who coincidentally are now telling people what they can and cannot discuss which seems you know sort of fundamentalist have repeated that innocents will be killed as collateral damage because israel is seeing red and the innocent children and women apparently didnt do enough to get rid of the jihadist adults with the guns and all that but i think that most of the rest of the world and history itself will care just what percentage of those killed if indeed there is a mass casualty of civilians either by war or by lack of access to basic necessities actually supported the reason they were being killed in sum just because the numbers might not flow into someones narrative and stay between the buoys of what some who imagine they are arbiters of thought say can be discussed doesnt mean they shouldnt be investigated and analyzed take that to the bank

 

[Jayrod]

Good grief, just stop the discussion on the $6 billion. It is a stupid and pointless argument which is the very definition of political and is completely derailing the thread. I'm not reporting it because I want this thread to survive, but enough already.

On a related note, who cares what percentage of the Gaza population supports Hamas? That's not at all relevant to the situation at hand.

disagree entirely bromigo elsewhere in this thread the hardliners who coincidentally are now telling people what they can and cannot discuss which seems you know sort of fundamentalist have repeated that innocents will be killed as collateral damage because israel is seeing red and the innocent children and women apparently didnt do enough to get rid of the jihadist adults with the guns and all that but i think that most of the rest of the world and history itself will care just what percentage of those killed if indeed there is a mass casualty of civilians either by war or by lack of access to basic necessities actually supported the reason they were being killed in sum just because the numbers might not flow into someones narrative and stay between the buoys of what some who imagine they are arbiters of thought say can be discussed doesnt mean they shouldnt be investigated and analyzed take that to the bank

I agree with this.

The numbers matter in terms of parsing out innocence and justification for retaliatory acts.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

We know Hamas' game is to maximize civilian deaths, even there own when they misfired one of their rockets going up over the hospital to land in Israel but end up taking out 500+ of their own in the process, then blaming Israel which never fired that rocket.

Its intent is to galvanize the Globe against Israel

-Israel's strategy is opposite or a 180 from that, they try NOT to HIT civilians or civilian targets
And yet after all of these dust ups and heinous acts, the outrage always builds towards Israel no matter what happens and especially in the Western Media

Can anyone explain Why?

 

[IvanKaramazov]

We know Hamas' game is to maximize civilian deaths, even there own when they misfired one of their rockets going up over the hospital to land in Israel but end up taking out 500+ of their own in the process but then blaming Israel which never fired that rocket.

Its intent is to galvanize the Globe against Israel

-Israel's strategy is opposite or a 180 from that, they try NOT to HIT civilians or civilian targets
And yet after all of these dust ups and heinous acts, the outrage always builds towards Israel no matter what happens and especially in the Western Media

Can anyone explain Why?

They're Jews, they're coded as white, and they're US allies. Of course certain people are going to reflexively view them as the bad guys no matter what. There's no mystery here.

 

[massraider]

Would Hamas blow up a Gaza hospital if they felt it would limit Israel in their coming response? It feels like the answer is yes

There's some video on Twitter where it appears one of their own rockets failed, and it hit the hospital. Awful.

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

Twitter has to be a mess right now. I’ve only checked my lists which are for topics like Stock Market, NY Jets, local music scene, fantasy football, etc. so I’ve avoided the assumed mess. I get news from AP app and whatever headlines and updates that make CNBC.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or Arabic countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

Twitter has to be a mess right now. I’ve only checked my lists which are for topics like Stock Market, NY Jets, local music scene, fantasy football, etc. so I’ve avoided the assumed mess. I get news from AP app and whatever headlines and updates that make CNBC.

I'm proud to say that Twitter feed has performed pretty well the past couple of weeks. For example, I'm reserving judgement on the hospital explosion, but my feed was ahead of (as far as I can tell) every mainstream media source on this one. My social media people very clearly outperformed the professionals at the New York Times, for instance. That's a common experience for me.

If there's on piece of advice I can give to people on navigating social media, it's to seek out people who are interested in getting their facts straight. Once upon a time, for me, that meant people who knew how to look at unemployment/jobs data and interpret them correctly without partisan cheerleading. Then it was people who could look at polling data without partisan cheerleading. Later on it meant people who could look at epidemiological data without partisan cheerleading. Now it's people who seek out on-the-ground information in a war zone without partisan cheerleading. A lot of these folks are highly ideological just like I am -- they just put a higher emphasis on "being right" than "my team wins."

The thing is, these people tend to get this stuff right not because they're experts, but because they're bright people who just practice good informational hygiene. A bunch of the people who I follow are the kind who will say things like "Obviously Hamas is evil, but let's be careful here -- they probably didn't decapitate all forty of those kids, probably just some" not because they like Hamas of course, but because they don't like to say things that turn out to be untrue and we could have known that if we had paid a little more attention.

 

[CletiusMaximus]

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

Twitter has to be a mess right now. I’ve only checked my lists which are for topics like Stock Market, NY Jets, local music scene, fantasy football, etc. so I’ve avoided the assumed mess. I get news from AP app and whatever headlines and updates that make CNBC.

"Jordan" is trending for two completely different reasons.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Iran Warns Of 'Pre-emptive Action' Against Israel

Iran warned Monday of a possible "pre-emptive action" against Israel "in the coming hours", as Israel readies for a ground offensive on the Gaza Strip.

www.barrons.com

Why would anyone want to warn anyone about a pre-emptive strike unless they were never going to actually follow thru?
Why would the United States even allow them to speak this way towards the world?

President George H.W. Bush Announces Persion Gulf War 1-16-91

25th Anniversary. Watch American History TV on C-SPAN3

www.youtube.com

Jan 16th, 1991

There was no weighing in with the American people, it was just done and then announced after it started.
I would have already targeted the Nuke Plants
No questions asked

 

[unckeyherb]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

Israeli Lt Col. on CNN right now saying they not only have the UAV data, but also hacked/bugged audio recordings of the other side admitting that it was a misfired rocket from their side and that they are aware of that. Says audio recording will be released within the hour.

 

[Gr00vus]

Israeli Lt Col. on CNN right now saying they not only have the UAV data, but also hacked/bugged audio recordings of the other side admitting that it was a misfired rocket from their side and that they are aware of that. Says audio recording will be released within the hour.

No one's going to believe that who doesn't want to.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complicated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

 

[Gr00vus]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

 

[unckeyherb]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

There's more Palestinians in Jordan than there are in Gaza.

 

[(HULK)]

Good grief, just stop the discussion on the $6 billion. It is a stupid and pointless argument which is the very definition of political and is completely derailing the thread. I'm not reporting it because I want this thread to survive, but enough already.

On a related note, who cares what percentage of the Gaza population supports Hamas? That's not at all relevant to the situation at hand.

I agree. It's some sort of method of determining how innocent Palestinian civilians are I guess? I dunno, that's not math people should be doing. If you're not in Hamas but you "support" Hamas you're still a civilian and Israel and it's allies should be seeking to minimize your chances of death while dealing with Hamas. If people got targeted for death because of their poor opinions, we'd all be targeted for death IMO

 

[Todem]

Israeli Lt Col. on CNN right now saying they not only have the UAV data, but also hacked/bugged audio recordings of the other side admitting that it was a misfired rocket from their side and that they are aware of that. Says audio recording will be released within the hour.

For a week there was people (not saying here) debating whether Hamas beheaded babies or simply burned them.

Yet it only took a NY minute with the Hamas propaganda machine and peoples inherent prejudices against jews and Israel to blame Israel’s IDF for bombing a hospital.

This world……I am so disheartened about all of this and how people around this small world are now showing what they are.

 

[Gr00vus]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

There's more Palestinians in Jordan than there are in Gaza.

Right, it's also as close as they can be given it's unlikely Egypt is going to take them in.

 

[(HULK)]

I'm seeing more and more of it through social media.

So I just spent 10 minutes reminding myself why I'm off of twitter. The sheer volume of misinformation is overwhelming.

I deleted the app about 4 months ago. It stopped being useful IMO

 

[(HULK)]

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

Twitter has to be a mess right now. I’ve only checked my lists which are for topics like Stock Market, NY Jets, local music scene, fantasy football, etc. so I’ve avoided the assumed mess. I get news from AP app and whatever headlines and updates that make CNBC.

I'm proud to say that Twitter feed has performed pretty well the past couple of weeks. For example, I'm reserving judgement on the hospital explosion, but my feed was ahead of (as far as I can tell) every mainstream media source on this one. My social media people very clearly outperformed the professionals at the New York Times, for instance. That's a common experience for me.

If there's on piece of advice I can give to people on navigating social media, it's to seek out people who are interested in getting their facts straight. Once upon a time, for me, that meant people who knew how to look at unemployment/jobs data and interpret them correctly without partisan cheerleading. Then it was people who could look at polling data without partisan cheerleading. Later on it meant people who could look at epidemiological data without partisan cheerleading. Now it's people who seek out on-the-ground information in a war zone without partisan cheerleading. A lot of these folks are highly ideological just like I am -- they just put a higher emphasis on "being right" than "my team wins."

The thing is, these people tend to get this stuff right not because they're experts, but because they're bright people who just practice good informational hygiene. A bunch of the people who I follow are the kind who will say things like "Obviously Hamas is evil, but let's be careful here -- they probably didn't decapitate all forty of those kids, probably just some" not because they like Hamas of course, but because they don't like to say things that turn out to be untrue and we could have known that if we had paid a little more attention.

I deleted the app because it was constantly sending me notifications of tweets for people that I did not follow, and who were posting conspiracy type stuff. I got sick of it.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

There's more Palestinians in Jordan than there are in Gaza.

Is that how we determine the appropriateness of asylum with other refugees? I honestly have no idea.

 

[Brunell4MVP]

One side is chanting "death to America" the other side is not. That's really all I need to know. We could give Hamas and iran total control the entire middle east and they'd still be chanting death to America. Unless you want our country (USA, not America as they chant) fighting off this mess for thousands of years, there's only one side to be on.

 

[parasaurolophus]

agree. It's some sort of method of determining how innocent Palestinian civilians are I guess? I dunno, that's not math people should be doing. If you're not in Hamas but you "support" Hamas you're still a civilian and Israel and it's allies should be seeking to minimize your chances of death while dealing with Hamas. If people got targeted for death because of their poor opinions, we'd all be targeted for death IMO

Minimize civilian casualties while still carrying out military operations in the best interests of Israel.

Sometimes civilians will be killed and you can't exactly notify them all the time, since you know, you are still trying to get an enemy that has broken international law by hiding among civilians and building military facilities within civilian buildings.

It is not actually a war crime to kill civilians when the military is hiding among them. Contrary to what all the pro Palestine talking heads want to say.

 

[(HULK)]

agree. It's some sort of method of determining how innocent Palestinian civilians are I guess? I dunno, that's not math people should be doing. If you're not in Hamas but you "support" Hamas you're still a civilian and Israel and it's allies should be seeking to minimize your chances of death while dealing with Hamas. If people got targeted for death because of their poor opinions, we'd all be targeted for death IMO

Minimize civilian casualties while still carrying out military operations in the best interests of Israel.

Sometimes civilians will be killed and you can't exactly notify them all the time, since you know, you are still trying to get an enemy that has broken international law by hiding among civilians and building military facilities within civilian buildings.

It is not actually a war crime to kill civilians when the military is hiding among them. Contrary to what all the pro Palestine talking heads want to say.

Yes, I'm well aware of that aspect.

I'm just saying it feels like the whole looking at polls to judge support for Hamas in the civilian population is wrong headed.

 

[unckeyherb]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

There's more Palestinians in Jordan than there are in Gaza.

Is that how we determine the appropriateness of asylum with other refugees? I honestly have no idea.

Well, think about it this way, the top refugee accepting countries are Greece, Belgium and Germany. I'm sure you've read about the cultures and customs of Syrian refugees not really meshing well with the cultures of Germany, for instance. If assimilation is not possible (and its not. Only in America is that truly possible) Jordanians look the same, speak the same, worship the same god, have the same customs. Assimilation is not necessary, they ALREADY ARE. Of course that's the most appropriate answer.

 

[Terminalxylem]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Thanks for the detailed response. Depending on the political and economic circumstances of the receiving country, I’m sure its far more complocated.

In your opinion, what country(ies) most rightfully should accept them? Maybe Iran, but they’re not even Arabic.

I'd start with Jordan.

Why?

There's more Palestinians in Jordan than there are in Gaza.

Is that how we determine the appropriateness of asylum with other refugees? I honestly have no idea.

Well, think about it this way, the top refugee accepting countries are Greece, Belgium and Germany. I'm sure you've read about the cultures and customs of Syrian refugees not really meshing well with the cultures of Germany, for instance. If assimilation is not possible (and its not. Only in America is that truly possible) Jordanians look the same, speak the same, worship the same god, have the same customs. Assimilation is not necessary, they ALREADY ARE. Of course that's the most appropriate answer.

I have no idea what’s happening to Syrian refugees in Europe, but your point is taken.

I also don’t know how well a developing world country like Jordan can accommodate several hundred thousand+ refugees, even if the cultures mesh well. Seems like some of the wealthier Arabic countries would be better suited to help out.

 

[ChicoCat]

One side is chanting "death to America" the other side is not. That's really all I need to know. We could give Hamas and iran total control the entire middle east and they'd still be chanting death to America. Unless you want our country (USA, not America as they chant) fighting off this mess for thousands of years, there's only one side to be on.

This.
As an American, I don't particularly feel the need to be the old woman in that parable "The woman and the snake".

 

[dickey moe]

Here is another article on the neighboring Arab nations refusing to take on Palestinian refugees.

What are the reasons for the continued refusal by essentially every single Arabic nation on the planet? Is there not one willing to take these people in? If not, why not?

All the neighboring countries have taken Palestinian refugees in the past - do you think they should continue to do so, without limitations?

Do you think there are legitimate reasons why this wave of refugees might be treated a little differently?

Do all Islamic and/or countries have a responsibility to aid these refugees? Do we hold other religions or ethnicities to this standard?

I don’t have answers to any of those questions.

There are quite a few Arab countries that share the same viewpoints as Hamas and refuse to recognize Israel as a Jewish State. They are very supportive of the things that Hamas does right up until it requires that they help the actual people of Gaza.

There ain't many that take in refugees. Here are some Palestinian asylum applications and acceptances numbers from 2022 in Arab countries:

Libya, 416 applied, 0 accepted
Algeria, 42 applied, 0 accepted
Yemen, 18 applied, 0 accepted
Tunisia, 15 applied, 0 accepted
Morocco, 5 applied, 5 accepted

Those are just the ones to which that Palestinians apply. Other Arab countries like, Bahrain, Egypt, Iraq, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, Oman, Qatar, SA, Somalia, Sudan, Syria, UAE aren't even listed-I assume because the Palestinians don't bother trying.

So, yes, I think there could be more refugees taken in than the 5 listed above. Any country that supports Hamas, and therefore the bad thing that happen to the people of Gaza should have some responsibility, yes.

Take home message for residents of Gaza: HEAD TO MOROCCO

 

[ignatiusjreilly]

Interesting historical thread. I try to follow this stuff pretty closely, but I didn’t know a lot of what he discusses here

 

[BassNBrew]

WHO says 64 hospitals attacked since Russian invasion of Ukraine​

Prompting protests in throughout the Middle East and North Africa where chants of death to the United States and England broke out.

 

[Phil Elliott]

One side is chanting "death to America" the other side is not. That's really all I need to know. We could give Hamas and iran total control the entire middle east and they'd still be chanting death to America. Unless you want our country (USA, not America as they chant) fighting off this mess for thousands of years, there's only one side to be on.

Minor point, most people in Europe/Mideast refer to "America" and not the US in both positive and negative contexts.

 

[Desert_Power]

He’s no fan of Hamas but he is incensed that hospitals and schools in Gaza have been hit with bombs and children are dead,

Have hospitals been bombed?

That’s what my friend says. I can’t find any evidence of it but i do know the hospitals face a terrible situation trying to evacuate sick and injured- and their morgues are filled to the brim:

Gaza’s Hospitals Face ‘Impossible’ Choices With Israel Evacuation Order

As a widely anticipated ground invasion looms, hospitals in Gaza City said they had no way to evacuate thousands of sick and injured patients.

www.nytimes.com

Well this sucks: https://www.reuters.com/world/middl...ike-hospital-gaza-health-ministry-2023-10-17/

 

[KGB]

One side is chanting "death to America" the other side is not. That's really all I need to know. We could give Hamas and iran total control the entire middle east and they'd still be chanting death to America. Unless you want our country (USA, not America as they chant) fighting off this mess for thousands of years, there's only one side to be on.

I dont follow politics. but this determines my side pretty easy.

 

[facook]

Grain of salt, of course. Not everything we read is a fact, especially on Twitter right now.

Twitter has to be a mess right now. I’ve only checked my lists which are for topics like Stock Market, NY Jets, local music scene, fantasy football, etc. so I’ve avoided the assumed mess. I get news from AP app and whatever headlines and updates that make CNBC.

I'm proud to say that Twitter feed has performed pretty well the past couple of weeks. For example, I'm reserving judgement on the hospital explosion, but my feed was ahead of (as far as I can tell) every mainstream media source on this one. My social media people very clearly outperformed the professionals at the New York Times, for instance. That's a common experience for me.

If there's on piece of advice I can give to people on navigating social media, it's to seek out people who are interested in getting their facts straight. Once upon a time, for me, that meant people who knew how to look at unemployment/jobs data and interpret them correctly without partisan cheerleading. Then it was people who could look at polling data without partisan cheerleading. Later on it meant people who could look at epidemiological data without partisan cheerleading. Now it's people who seek out on-the-ground information in a war zone without partisan cheerleading. A lot of these folks are highly ideological just like I am -- they just put a higher emphasis on "being right" than "my team wins."

The thing is, these people tend to get this stuff right not because they're experts, but because they're bright people who just practice good informational hygiene. A bunch of the people who I follow are the kind who will say things like "Obviously Hamas is evil, but let's be careful here -- they probably didn't decapitate all forty of those kids, probably just some" not because they like Hamas of course, but because they don't like to say things that turn out to be untrue and we could have known that if we had paid a little more attention.

I deleted the app because it was constantly sending me notifications of tweets for people that I did not follow, and who were posting conspiracy type stuff. I got sick of it.

It's not awesome, but I agree with Ivan....I've gotten accurate info WAY ahead of American "news" by following boots on the ground reporters. Including folks from CNN, Fox, and Al Jazeera. Some people actually still care about truth and not just spin.

 

[parasaurolophus]

This video and also the photos sure seem to paint a pretty clear picture that this was Hamas.

Also if you watch when he zooms in, that clearly looks like unspent solid fuel burning off. Notice the almost oozing fiery drips.

 

[rockaction]

I'm just going to chime in and say that as soon as world opinion was firmly on the side of Israel and the Islamic world was stuck dithering about Hamas's actions, I could have told you like clockwork a hospital would mysteriously go up in flames in Gaza. Even my somewhat apolitical family members snort at that tactic now. We all know what is going on and who is responsible. Anybody seriously quibbling with the IDF or assigning them blame about bombing a "hospital" needs their priors checked rather than their credentials.

 

[TripItUp]

One side is chanting "death to America" the other side is not. That's really all I need to know. We could give Hamas and iran total control the entire middle east and they'd still be chanting death to America. Unless you want our country (USA, not America as they chant) fighting off this mess for thousands of years, there's only one side to be on.

Minor point, most people in Europe/Mideast refer to "America" and not the US in both positive and negative contexts.

I've traveled a fair amount in the middle east and I can confirm this to be true. I have not been to afghanistan/Iran/Iraq, where I'm sure opinions are not so positive.