Henry Ford
Footballguy
That's interesting. What's your basis for that statement? Are you just talking about actual knowledge of undocumented status?
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The Trump Years- Every day something more shocking than the last! (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter gussy
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SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
Because I view it a federalism issue. States have powers under the 10th amendment, that's indisputable. Local and state police can arrest who they like under state law but they are not obligated to enforce federal law. Pot might be another example.
Otoh they choose to cooperate on federal Rico and narcotics and other federal laws all the time. The Feds help a lot on gang violence. But if cities have too much crime on their hand and not enough jail space, isn't that up to them if they want to use their resources how they like?
Note I'd like such cooperation and I'd probably or might vote for a politician with a policy against my city being a sanctuary city, but I don't see it as actually being in any way *up to the federal government or in any way up to the rest of my state or the Feds what we do. It's up to us, the city.
Man of Constant Sorrow
Footballguy
Disagree.
Retraining is growing here. Not to the level we would hope...but growing.
The "jerk" is bigger than the "acceleration" imo.
But, one has to start somewhere.
However, I TOTALLY agree on the negative impact in regards to the admin's promise.
Ain't gonna happen...and the mind #### involved does much more damage than any "program" potentially conceived by this admin.
My opinion only...I run shallow in most things political.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Nah, you just think you do. In the view you're using for yourself 99.9% of US citizens run shallow.
As police, if they are aware that someone is wanted for a crime whether it be from another state or from the feds, there is a baic civic duty to them to inform and to some reasonable extent assist. There has to be some level of cooperation between agencies or it would be chaotic. This type of inter-agency fighting is not good for anyone and is the kind of dysfunctional relationship that allowed 9-11 to happen.
beavers
Footballguy
Your view is dysfunctional, IMHO. Each level of government should respect and cooperate with each other. Cities do not get to decide on who is or isn't a citizen or legal alien or illegal alien. That is a power that must reside at the federal level.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
It's not a matter of inter agency fighting, it's co-option of state resources to fund an otherwise unfunded federal agenda that's a problem.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Do you believe that the misdemeanor of undocumented entry to the US is on the level of murder? Do you think the FBI should arrest anyone they see littering?
Henry Ford
Footballguy
You should be aware undocumented immigration isn't a felony unless the immigrant has been previously deported. It's a federal misdemeanor. It's really not that big a deal. Precisely because this country really relies on undocumented immigrants and there's no legal pathway to entry for so many (especially from Mexico.)
Henry Ford
Footballguy
That's why people get upset when some call undocumented immigrants "illegals." It's like calling someone who never hurt anyone or stole anything but trespassed on his high school baseball diamond to sleep with a cheerleader a "criminal." Well, sure, trespass is a crime, but let's maybe tone down the hyperbole a touch, eh?
It has gone way beyond that. Police are being disciplined simply for informing ICE that a undocumented previously-convicted felon and deported is back in the country. If they are filling up jails for an extended period, you have a point. When it consists of a phone call, it is total BS.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
If the Feds would get their #### together and create a real immigration reform policy this wouldn't be an issue. But when local police inform about immigration it kills any chance of making headway on crime in immigrant communities. And we're all sick of that crime
ICE detained a woman while she was looking for a domestic violence restraining order last week. Unacceptable.
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Henry Ford
Footballguy
And I'm sympathetic about undocumented immigration. I am. But if a child can be placed on a waiting list at birth, be a blood relative of a legal resident, and not be able to go to high school in this country, it's not a reasonable opportunity to immigrate. So we're left with what we have. And then let's freak out like some guy crossing the border to bus tables is El Chapo? Relax, Elliot Ness. He's just some dude committing a misdemeanor who would gladly come here legally if he could.
There is unacceptable behavior on both sides. Whether you like it or not, things like sanctuary cities are what empowered people like Trump. It is not a winning issue to fight on.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
Totally on board with deporting anyone convicted of a non-immigration felony though. Even with our somewhat flawed legal system with respect to people of color.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I disagree. I think it isn't a winner right now like gay marriage wasn't a winning issue in 1984. Or like being against amnesty for illegal immigrants wasn't a winning issue in 1984. It'll shift. This country would fold up like a paper hat if it weren't for southern border immigrants. Temporarily, but it would be devastating.
I support the need for more immigrants, but it needs to be done in a fashion which promotes productive members of society to enter in a legal manner. You assume things will always progress. That is simply not true. Just one case of a murder(or imagine a terrorist act) because of some sanctuary city protected some known felon will become the poster child for much more harsh laws. Sanctuary cities are doing far more harm than good in the big scheme of things.
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msommer
Footballguy
I'm sure you've seen that China has stopped buying their coal. Poof, there goes their largest export and source of foreign funds.Even though @Rove! called me a "Blowhard" on International Affairs, I know more than he and his entire family on the topic.
I have thought the North Korean regime would have been long gone by now, especially in the age of mass communication and the innerwebs. What happened in Cuba is partially our fault, we chose to suppress diplomatic relations and the obvious olive branch that should have been extended 30 years ago. But North Korea...trucking North Korea is somewhat of an anomaly in the geopolitical sphere because of their isolation, their disdain, and their provocative international approach to everything they do.
I predicted Korea would be reunited long ago, and I was wrong. I've been right about a lot of other things at the expense of parrots like Rove, but there are no winners in these games. North Korea has to be dealt with in the most serious matter, they are an evil 40-fold more dangerous than Saddam Hussein ever was. This is not about war either, this is about taking measures to completely shut that regime down for good. And that has to be achieved via China, who NK receives 90% of their goods and services.
Seriously, put Israel/Palenstine on the back burner and look at NK first.
That's gotta hurt...
msommer
Footballguy
Chinas coal use, production and import are all dropping for the third straight year. The main origins of the imported coal are Australia, Indonesia and Mongolia in that order
Bruce Dickinson
Footballguy
Resistance Update...
We organized a time, place, and attendees for a Town Hall with one of our senators for Thursday night, but the senator won't show. So we'll still assemble, record the questions, and send video and written documentation of the Town Hall to the senator's office.
Going to see Bernie Sanders speak on Saturday night. There was a two-week window for tickets, and so many were requested the organizers changed the venue twice. They were expecting about 1500 to attend, but at least 4000 tickets will be distributed tomorrow for it. My daughter is especially excited about this - she recently was accepted into a new specialized study program for high school emphasizing the science, economics, and politics of green technologies, and she hopes to meet Bernie and thank him for being so passionate about environmental issues.
The first House election of 2017 is on April 11. It's Kansas District 4. It's a lot of rural territory in southern Kansas, but the election will be decided by the turnout in Wichita. There's a special election to replace Mike Pompeo, who vacated his seat when Trump named him director of the CIA. I've volunteered for candidate James Thompson, a civil rights attorney in Wichita who was selected as the Democrat nominee for the seat. Thompson hasn't held office before, but IMO he would make a great rep for Wichita and the entire state. He's a literal rags-to-riches story (his family was homeless for a while when he was a kid, but graduated high school, joined the Army, went to college on the GI Bill, went on to finish law school and is a practicing attorney) running on a platform of jobs (Wichita's big industry is aviation, Thompson wants to bring more diversity to the city's economy), education (getting educated got Thompson out of poverty, wants everyone to have the opportunities he had), and veteran care (Thompson is one of many former military in Wichita, VA cuts and neglect of veterans' services affect the city as a whole).
Thompson is the underdog in this race. The favorite is Republican Ron Estes. He's the state treasurer. It's fair to describe Estes as a "Sam Brownback clone". If you don't live in Kansas, you might have heard Brownback's name before as he is one of the worst governors in the country. The Kansas GOP seems to be grooming Estes for a potential gubernatorial bid and his House race is a big test. The thought of another Brownback being a good idea is absolutely baffling to me and it needs to be stopped. So even though I'm out of district, I've made the 2.5 hour drive to Wichita to meet Thompson and volunteer for his campaign.
This election is taking place in the Koch brothers' back yard and Estes will probably win. But I'm helping Thompson out anyway because it's the right thing to do and the short election cycle is ripe for an upset given how poorly the new president has performed so far.
Sharing all this in the hope that you reading this can find a way to get involved that is comfortable to you. Take the 60 seconds to call your representatives and voice your support or opposition of their actions. Ask for Town Halls. Go to them. Vote. And stand up for the rights of others to vote.
We organized a time, place, and attendees for a Town Hall with one of our senators for Thursday night, but the senator won't show. So we'll still assemble, record the questions, and send video and written documentation of the Town Hall to the senator's office.
Going to see Bernie Sanders speak on Saturday night. There was a two-week window for tickets, and so many were requested the organizers changed the venue twice. They were expecting about 1500 to attend, but at least 4000 tickets will be distributed tomorrow for it. My daughter is especially excited about this - she recently was accepted into a new specialized study program for high school emphasizing the science, economics, and politics of green technologies, and she hopes to meet Bernie and thank him for being so passionate about environmental issues.
The first House election of 2017 is on April 11. It's Kansas District 4. It's a lot of rural territory in southern Kansas, but the election will be decided by the turnout in Wichita. There's a special election to replace Mike Pompeo, who vacated his seat when Trump named him director of the CIA. I've volunteered for candidate James Thompson, a civil rights attorney in Wichita who was selected as the Democrat nominee for the seat. Thompson hasn't held office before, but IMO he would make a great rep for Wichita and the entire state. He's a literal rags-to-riches story (his family was homeless for a while when he was a kid, but graduated high school, joined the Army, went to college on the GI Bill, went on to finish law school and is a practicing attorney) running on a platform of jobs (Wichita's big industry is aviation, Thompson wants to bring more diversity to the city's economy), education (getting educated got Thompson out of poverty, wants everyone to have the opportunities he had), and veteran care (Thompson is one of many former military in Wichita, VA cuts and neglect of veterans' services affect the city as a whole).
Thompson is the underdog in this race. The favorite is Republican Ron Estes. He's the state treasurer. It's fair to describe Estes as a "Sam Brownback clone". If you don't live in Kansas, you might have heard Brownback's name before as he is one of the worst governors in the country. The Kansas GOP seems to be grooming Estes for a potential gubernatorial bid and his House race is a big test. The thought of another Brownback being a good idea is absolutely baffling to me and it needs to be stopped. So even though I'm out of district, I've made the 2.5 hour drive to Wichita to meet Thompson and volunteer for his campaign.
This election is taking place in the Koch brothers' back yard and Estes will probably win. But I'm helping Thompson out anyway because it's the right thing to do and the short election cycle is ripe for an upset given how poorly the new president has performed so far.
Sharing all this in the hope that you reading this can find a way to get involved that is comfortable to you. Take the 60 seconds to call your representatives and voice your support or opposition of their actions. Ask for Town Halls. Go to them. Vote. And stand up for the rights of others to vote.
Man of Constant Sorrow
Footballguy
I know very little about this Bruce,
But, I like what you elaborate upon. I hope your daughter continues with her admirable involvement. We need this very much from our youth. She appears to be very qualified and intelligent...things which I aspire towards.
Further, I like Bernie.
Also, James Thompson sounds like someone I could support. Thanks for supplying the road map & directions.
I cannot promise that I will call my rep, but I DO promise that I will do the research that you guide me towards. Then, I very well may call my rep.
But yet China is planning on increasing coal usage by 19 percent over the next 5 years. Coal still accounts for 80 percent of China's energy. So while economic slowdown has reduced consumption, it is just a temporary trend and china will continue to be by far the biggest polluter and still growing through at least 2025.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
apalmer
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
SHIZNITTTT
Footballguy
So my cousin was at a Mitch McConnell event in a very small town in Kentucky last night were a lot of people were protesting. http://www.courier-journal.com/story/news/politics/mitch-mcconnell/2017/02/21/protesters-greet-sen-mitch-mcconnell-heated-questions/98188380/ if this is happening of all places Kentucky the RNC better tread carefully.
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Ignoramus
Footballguy
Yeah, the Moose-Lamb thing is because of their backward religious beliefs. Ours is on account of Freedom!
Righetti
Footballguy
Ignoramus
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
I had another event to go to but I see from social media many of my neighbors went to Jerry Nadler's town hall. Our district was redrawn four years ago; it's the west Side of Manhattan and gentrified potions of western Brooklyn. As I mentioned in this thread earlier, on November 8 my voting precinct (one avenue sized block) went for Hillary 1170-20. In the primary, she crushed Bernie 2:1. We've had a democratic Rep for over a century, and Nadler (in his 13th term) has about as much chance of losing his seat as timschochet has of leaving the FFA. So good on them for exercising their civic duty, but going to his town hall would be like sending a mission trip to Lynchburg, VA.
James Daulton
Footballguy
It seems like Dems have been woken up and are motivated to remove Trump and his ilk. Still gotta keep the energy up for the next four years, but it's off to a great start.
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Righetti
Footballguy
This is spot on, coal is done and there is no amount of lip service a politician can give it to bring it back. This is one those issues ( like migrant workers) which makes no sense in reality. Coal is an inefficient way of getting energy, there are better ways and we're not going to go backwards. This is place where the business model (one that the GOP claims to embrace) has told you it's done for, but they want some a federal government subsidy to keep it afloat (something they claim to hate)
Migrant workers are a similar argument, the guy from Guatemala is not taking the job of some 60 year old guy in the RustBelt, he's picking strawberries at $4/hour.
G
Guest
Guest
I actually agree with this. The corollary, though, is that there are other issues of national concern that have to be regulated at the federal level such as environmental issues. Leaving it up to the states isn't feasible. The movement is to regulate at the global level recognizing that even the national level is too local.
fatness
Footballguy
So, you have no basis for "If local police find illegals in the course of their normal police work, they are obligated to inform the feds."
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Typical though. Where was all this energy 6 months ago? When it actually could have mattered?
What they need to do is not let the likes of Hillary dominate the party. This was such a layup. Now we've got Trump. Why? People were too lazy and self involved to vote.
James Daulton
Footballguy
Well, better to change now then never at all. But I share you sentiments wholeheartedly.
Righetti
Footballguy
But Joe SixPack in Toledo told me that those guys are taking good paying American jobs. Joe SixPack doesn't have a job and wouldn't be caught dead picking berries and would go ape-#### if he found out his strawberry pancakes at IHOP just jumped in price by $5 but he doesn't seem to be able to connect the dots in this game of 3D checkers
Sabertooth
Footballguy
Yeah, that's my thought on the immigrants. People are going to be pissed when the price of everything on the outer edge of their supermarket doubles in price.
Stealing our jobs? Not likely.
Righetti
Footballguy
I provided a basis for it. You may disagree and be of the belief that it is wonderful various levels of government work against each other in pissing matches which results in criminals being let free.
Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Do you support allowing police, time and resources permitting, to detain illegal aliens the police come across in the normal performance of their duties and sharing that arrest information with federal authorities allowing them 24 hours in which to determine whether deportation actions are warranted?
G
Guest
Guest
It's nice how Donald Trump getting elected is all the fault of the Democrats. And not the Republican voters who elected him in the primaries or the people who voted for him, wasted their vote by going third party, or simply stayed home in the general.
Dear World: I'm sorry that my party nominated someone who was merely eminently qualified but failed to stroke your desire to have a beer with your president. Please list all of your other life mistakes that are my fault.
TIA
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Ditkaless Wonders
Footballguy
Would you support increasing your federal taxes to add federal magistrates, marshals, detention officers, holding facilities and transportation to timely take custody of alleged illegal aliens from local authorities and to process them in a fashion currently approved by federal legislation and by court precedent?
Sabertooth
Footballguy
What I laugh at are people on disability with the Trump bumper sticker on their 1996 Sunfire.
shader
Footballguy
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