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Shark Pool combined effort mock - Drafting now! (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter Andy Dufresne
- Start date
It was nice to see Alexander drop. I'd love to see that happen in the real one. If the Panthers get him and he performs well, that defense is going to be lights out. Still room in the 2nd and 3rd to grab S/DE help as well or maybe an OT. I'm still thinking that they believe in the OL (Williams/Remmers will battle in camp) even with the SB because they played so well all year except that 1 game and Von Miller was ridiculous, no one was blocking him, especially after Cotchery drops it and the officials still don't know what a catch is.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Think I prefer Conklin here (presuming Decker is gone.) But if Rankins falls this far it would be interesting to see what Quinn does.
Snorkelson
Footballguy
Well if history is any indicator, whoever the lions pick in the 2nd will fail. Just trade the 2nd, then we don't have to suffer thru titus young and Jordan Dizon. Yechhh. Leshoure, etc. bad picks in 2nd for years.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I liked our trade ups last year. DG waited till the dust settled on Day 1/Day 2 and then traded up near the top of Day 2/Day 3 to get the guys he really liked and wanted. I could see them doing it again this year. Hurney had some nice picks (like Norman in the 5th), but his trade ups were universally derided not because of the cost but because he went after players he reached for that did little or nothing and no one liked. He could have waited on most of them.
FunkyPlutos
Footballguy
This would be awesome, but I would be tempted to take Ragland if he is still there at this pick. Move Kendricks to the outside and the LB are set for quite some time!
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Ragland was considered as well. They don't seem to want Kendricks in the middle.
spider321
Footballguy
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Hmmm..Doesn't sound like either Jack's or Smith's medical rechecks went particularly well.
Get on the ball man, with half of round two's picks, you need to just stay in this thread. No wandering.
massraider
Footballguy
I still haven't seen the word 'nerve' used with Jaylon on this latest test. Rapaport is saying that word is he'll sit 2016, and be ready to go. Twitter is saying, OH NO, but everyone assumed that already.
Nerve damage implies he can't may not ever come back.
Did he have the retest yet? I hadn't noticed. I think from the combine that came up on him. I thought Jack's was fine, hence him always being in the top 5 of almost every mock.
ETA: Just read some of the articles. Seems to be differing opinions on both and while hard to glean it seems like the differing opinions on Jack are about how fast he is healing, not whether or not he plays 2016. It seems like the differing opinions on Smith are on the worse side, i.e. he's gone for 2016, but when does he come back healthy, if at all.
Jack likely stays top 10, but Smith could easily fall to the end of the 2nd/3rd, heck maybe even further if most teams think he won't recover.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Cowboys HAVE to take Dodd, right?
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Or Henry, I guess...
FUBAR
Footballguy
frankly though, if not for Murray the Titans probably would have taken Henry. Jerry would be thrilled.
With 2.05 / 36, the Baltimore Ravens select:
DE KEVIN DODD, CLEMSON
Well, I feel pretty dumb about that Elliott pick now. While RB and G are almost needs, the real needs are CB, LOT, EDGE and WR. We've seen 5 CB's, 6 probable OT's, 5 or 6 possible EDGE DE's or LB's and 4 WR's off the board. Still some interesting WR's but not excited about CB's or LOT's available. Dodd ended the year strong (3 sacks vs. Bama in NCG) and no off the field issues like Noah Spence.
DE KEVIN DODD, CLEMSON
Well, I feel pretty dumb about that Elliott pick now. While RB and G are almost needs, the real needs are CB, LOT, EDGE and WR. We've seen 5 CB's, 6 probable OT's, 5 or 6 possible EDGE DE's or LB's and 4 WR's off the board. Still some interesting WR's but not excited about CB's or LOT's available. Dodd ended the year strong (3 sacks vs. Bama in NCG) and no off the field issues like Noah Spence.
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FUBAR
Footballguy
good pick, could possibly go in the first. He was on our very short list as (one of the) BPA but wasn't really a need.
5Rings
Lurker
The 49er depth chart is terrible, thanks to years of wasted 2nd and 3rd round picks by Balke (who should have been let go instead of Harbaugh, but I digress...).
There is quality 1st round DT talent available, but in our 3-4, our nose is a glorified space eater and I can't justify the investment with so many other holes. WR needs help, but my two top WRs are Torrey Smith clones. Its tempted to take a medical flyer on a LB, but those "first round values" haven't worked out for us real well lately (Lattimore, Brandon Thomas). I think outside of QB (round 1), our weakest area is CB. Its time for an infusion of talent.
The 5 Time Super Bowl Champion San Francisco 49ers select
At the last minute, the Ghost of Bill Walsh floats into the draft room, slaps Balke upside the head, and says "You are going to be the worst team in the league next year. Draft with 2017 in mind". Joe Montana walks in the door, picks up the card, scratches off Artie Burns name, and writes in another Golden Domer.
2.37 LB Jaylon Smith Notre Dame
There is quality 1st round DT talent available, but in our 3-4, our nose is a glorified space eater and I can't justify the investment with so many other holes. WR needs help, but my two top WRs are Torrey Smith clones. Its tempted to take a medical flyer on a LB, but those "first round values" haven't worked out for us real well lately (Lattimore, Brandon Thomas). I think outside of QB (round 1), our weakest area is CB. Its time for an infusion of talent.
The 5 Time Super Bowl Champion San Francisco 49ers select
At the last minute, the Ghost of Bill Walsh floats into the draft room, slaps Balke upside the head, and says "You are going to be the worst team in the league next year. Draft with 2017 in mind". Joe Montana walks in the door, picks up the card, scratches off Artie Burns name, and writes in another Golden Domer.
2.37 LB Jaylon Smith Notre Dame
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Nice pick. Considering the Giants acquired an additional 2 from Indy in a trade back, Smith was in serious consideration at 2.9.
FUBAR
Footballguy
Curious to see what TEN does with the booty (trade, not call kindAndy Dufresne said:).
spider321
Footballguy
Hell, the Rams should have just come over at 3am and bent over. It would have been more respectable than what the Titans did to them in the trade.Curious to see what TEN does with the booty (trade, not call kind
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Bob Magaw
Footballguy
You realize they moved up from 15 and not, oh, 2 or something?
2012 WAS exchanges firsts, throws in an additional TWO firsts (2013 and 2014) and ONE second (2012) TO MOVE FROM 4 TO 2.
2016 LA exchanges firsts, throws in an additional TWO seconds (2016, one of which was like found money from the Bradford trade), ONE first (2017, so valued more like a second today) and TWO thirds (2016 and 2017, again, so the second valued more like a fourth) TO MOVE FROM 15 TO 1.
RG3 was a highly touted prospect. But some scouts are very high on Wentz, he is gaining momentum in the process (we'll see if LA takes Wentz what CLE does, and if they really wanted Goff), Mayock has been saying for a while he has similar physical tools and athletic upside to Luck, and many of the intangibles that made Luck the anti-Manziel, IQ (Wentz high school valedictorian and 4.0 GPA), hard work, competitive, grounded with a healthy sense of priorities, and leadership, that made us think he was wired right, had the right stuff and the "It" factor, Wentz has as well. Mayock has also come around recently and now thinks Wentz (and Goff) could eventually end up being better than Winston and Mariota from the more highly touted QB class of '15.
Before seeing what Wentz does, or who TEN even drafts, probably premature and hasty to make such an extreme call, by 2-3 years.
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5Rings
Lurker
I don't think LA had a choice. LA fans are the most fickle of any sports town and they need to put a winner on the field sooner rather than later.
I personally love the move, as I think it sets them back years...but that's based off my amateur and probably wrong opinion that Wentz is meh. We'll see...even for a LA hater, its too soon for me to say SOSAR.
I personally love the move, as I think it sets them back years...but that's based off my amateur and probably wrong opinion that Wentz is meh. We'll see...even for a LA hater, its too soon for me to say SOSAR.
spider321
Footballguy
Sorry Magaw. I know that as a Rams' fan you have to try to justify it to yourself.
No team should ever trade that much unless they KNOW, for a fact, they are getting the next John Elway/Peyton Manning.
Wentz ain't Elway. Wentz ain't Manning.
I'll just agree to disagree since I know I can't compete with your War and Peace style long-winded posts. lol
No team should ever trade that much unless they KNOW, for a fact, they are getting the next John Elway/Peyton Manning.
Wentz ain't Elway. Wentz ain't Manning.
I'll just agree to disagree since I know I can't compete with your War and Peace style long-winded posts. lol
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Bob Magaw
Footballguy
We didn't have QBs as good as Kaepernick and Gabbert, our hands were tied.
Seriously, good luck his year and in the future (maybe you get Goff at #7?), you were gracious in defeat the few times the Rams beat the 49ers in recent years. Personally I like the competition, even though we haven't won in any kind of sustained way like SF, SEA and ARI in recent years (actually more than a decade), if we ever do, it will be more gratifying in a competitive environment. If we emerge from the NFC West and make the playoffs, we will be battle tested for the playoffs and can say we excelled in one of the best, if not the best divisions in the NFL.
If God forbid, the 49ers all expired simultaneously from licking envelopes like George's fiancé in Seinfeld, I wouldn't be happy that we than had a clearer path to divisional success.
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massraider
Footballguy
Board mock drafts are very chill, and very fun. Quit being a #### with every one of your posts.
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
No need to apologize, or to assume condescendingly and patronizingly (like me saying you being a hater you can't help hatchet jobs, which I'm not, just comparing your tone and approach, its OK to agree to disagree) I wasn't just breaking down the trade value chart and comparing to the relative scale of the 2012 trade, pointing out going up from 15 to 1 is a lot different than 4 to 2.
The bottom line, are they better with no QB and less than a handful of first/second round picks in the next two drafts, or with a QB? That is a question you couldn't possibly answer yet, which is why I think it is hasty and premature to make such an extreme call.
IMO, you are missing the point. Wentz doesn't have to be Elway, he just needs to make the Rams better OVERALL and ON BALANCE, than they would have been without him. If he is the ignition switch that turns over an otherwise useless motor, he absolutely could be worth it. At any rate, I'll stand by it's ridiculously early to call.
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spider321
Footballguy
mass, when I come across as a ****, it's usually just me messin' with people to generate discussion. Though, that probably isn't very obvious on a message board. lol
You're just a ####.
If I were a Rams' fan I'd be looking for ways to justify the trade to myself, too.
Heck, I'm still trying to convince myself that the Panthers' turnstile O-line in the Super Bowl was a fluke. lol
...and I apologize, Magaw, I honestly didn't mean any personal offense to you.
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Bob Magaw
Footballguy
Accepted. Just maybe say what you think, good or bad trade, without mind reader-type of motive attribution, don't assume people aren't just doing what you are doing, assuming you are ALSO just calling it like YOU see it, without some kind of surreptitious/nefarious agenda.
If the Rams whiff on Wentz (could be Goff), and can't get over the hump to over .500 and making the playoffs in the next few years (I probably cut them slack in 2016 with a rookie QB, but how does he look, is he developing, are they improving overall?), Fisher and Snead will likely be gone, and I won't be defending them. It will be time to hit the reset button at GM/HC, too. But if it is successful, than this will go down as a good trade, and far from the Deliverance/Pulp Fiction homage you are making it out to be in a somewhat extremist fashion, imo (in fairness, you are far from the only poster down on the trade that think Fisher and Snead blundered egregiously, just using some more colorful descriptive terms ).
If the Rams whiff on Wentz (could be Goff), and can't get over the hump to over .500 and making the playoffs in the next few years (I probably cut them slack in 2016 with a rookie QB, but how does he look, is he developing, are they improving overall?), Fisher and Snead will likely be gone, and I won't be defending them. It will be time to hit the reset button at GM/HC, too. But if it is successful, than this will go down as a good trade, and far from the Deliverance/Pulp Fiction homage you are making it out to be in a somewhat extremist fashion, imo (in fairness, you are far from the only poster down on the trade that think Fisher and Snead blundered egregiously, just using some more colorful descriptive terms
).
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Borden
Footballguy
I think that trade was a business decision as much as anything. It gets the team in the news and people in LA something to talk about already. Plus, when they draft the kid from Cal to QB their team they might grab a decent chunk of fans that were mostly college fans. How many PR events and news things do you think Goff and Gurley are going to be at? Goff's first name is going to "The First Overall Pick from the University of California" Fisher and Snead were probably told to make this happen or they're done. And they may as well. Because they'll be the first on the chopping block if this year doesn't result in a playoff appearance.
Grahamburn
Footballguy
2.8 Tampa Bay Buccaneers select:
Noah Spence, DE/LB, Eastern Kentucky
Noah Spence, DE/LB, Eastern Kentucky
Bob Magaw
Footballguy
You could be right.
1) I can accept straightforwardly and at face value they did this for football reasons. After all, not too controversial to suggest they needed to reboot their QB position. But sure, given a move to the new/old city that skipped a generation of fans, with a looming Hard Knocks appearance (which just got a lot more interesting), the surge of publicity and marketing/advertising potential surrounding the trade can't hurt, and being congnizant of not upstaging Kobe's moment shows they have a sense of both showmanship and media savvy. They didn't HAVE to address the position this way. But if QBs like Osweiler and the WAS franchise tag could cost $20 million per year, they are also relatively untested and could fail. If the Rams had gone that route, maybe they can't re-sign Barron, or CB Johnson, or Ogletree, Brockers, etc., maybe a few of them, which hurts their D. This way, they get a cost controlled contract for the next half decade at the most expensive position. If he hits, that is one of the Crown Jewels in a roster architecting portfolio.
2) Many think Goff. Many think Wentz. We just don't know. I'll be surprised and a little disappointed if it isn't Wentz. For football reasons. But while on the subject, there are few storylines Hollywood likes more than rags to riches and underdog stories, and the NDSU FCS product fits them to a tee.
3) Kroenke has been a pretty hands off, non-meddlesome owner (albeit the stakes have been raised in LA). At any rate, not sure they needed to be told. I think they knew their record since 2012 hasn't been good enough.
4) I don't know if this move necessarily buys them a lot of time, but it could some. I don't think failure to make the playoffs with a rookie QB spells certain termination, especially if he shows promise and progress. But at some point soon, they do need to translate all the moves into tangible W-L improvements, agreed.
1) I can accept straightforwardly and at face value they did this for football reasons. After all, not too controversial to suggest they needed to reboot their QB position. But sure, given a move to the new/old city that skipped a generation of fans, with a looming Hard Knocks appearance (which just got a lot more interesting), the surge of publicity and marketing/advertising potential surrounding the trade can't hurt, and being congnizant of not upstaging Kobe's moment shows they have a sense of both showmanship and media savvy. They didn't HAVE to address the position this way. But if QBs like Osweiler and the WAS franchise tag could cost $20 million per year, they are also relatively untested and could fail. If the Rams had gone that route, maybe they can't re-sign Barron, or CB Johnson, or Ogletree, Brockers, etc., maybe a few of them, which hurts their D. This way, they get a cost controlled contract for the next half decade at the most expensive position. If he hits, that is one of the Crown Jewels in a roster architecting portfolio.
2) Many think Goff. Many think Wentz. We just don't know. I'll be surprised and a little disappointed if it isn't Wentz. For football reasons. But while on the subject, there are few storylines Hollywood likes more than rags to riches and underdog stories, and the NDSU FCS product fits them to a tee.
3) Kroenke has been a pretty hands off, non-meddlesome owner (albeit the stakes have been raised in LA). At any rate, not sure they needed to be told. I think they knew their record since 2012 hasn't been good enough.
4) I don't know if this move necessarily buys them a lot of time, but it could some. I don't think failure to make the playoffs with a rookie QB spells certain termination, especially if he shows promise and progress. But at some point soon, they do need to translate all the moves into tangible W-L improvements, agreed.
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massraider
Footballguy
Two months ago, a top 15 mock pick. I am constantly marvelling at draft buzz/stock.
Nice pick.
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JetMaxx
Footballguy
2.40 The New York Giants select Cody Whitehair, OG, Kansas St.
I'm very pleased to add the best OG in this draft to the OL. He will push Pugh or Jerry from day 1.
NFL.com:
NFL COMPARISON
Zack Martin
BOTTOM LINE
With his combination of functional strength and body control, Whitehair might be one of the safest offensive linemen in the entire draft. He will almost assuredly be bumped inside to guard, but could be considered at center as well. He has the confidence and talent to start right away and his run blocking should improve as he gets more comfortable firing out from a three-point stance. Whitehair has the ability to be a very good starter with a ceiling that could reach the all-pro level.
1.18 Shaq Lawson, DE
2.9 Cody Whitehair, OG
2.17 from Indy
3.1 from Tenn
I'm very pleased to add the best OG in this draft to the OL. He will push Pugh or Jerry from day 1.
NFL.com:
NFL COMPARISON
Zack Martin
BOTTOM LINE
With his combination of functional strength and body control, Whitehair might be one of the safest offensive linemen in the entire draft. He will almost assuredly be bumped inside to guard, but could be considered at center as well. He has the confidence and talent to start right away and his run blocking should improve as he gets more comfortable firing out from a three-point stance. Whitehair has the ability to be a very good starter with a ceiling that could reach the all-pro level.
1.18 Shaq Lawson, DE
2.9 Cody Whitehair, OG
2.17 from Indy
3.1 from Tenn
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5Rings
Lurker
Cal is not local to LA. I don't think fans are going to react to a kid from Cal the same way they would USC or UCLA. In fact, Cal being NorCal, there might be folks how don't like him for that....just sayin
Ugh. Only had 3 picks before me and 2 of them are 2 guys I wanted. I know it's a mock and I'm picking for a team I don't like but darn it I wanted to do well!
Borden
Footballguy
You're thinking like a rational person who follows football, not a PR/sales/business person. There's probably lots who will think that trade was stupid and a bad move. And that might be a negative.
You're right about USC/UCLA but they will still sell him as a "local boy" regardless. You think that the talking heads of the NFL and other networks won't being saying things like this? I can hear what Mayock is going to say already. "Yep. This is what we expected. I really like this pick. He's a local kid with accuracy and will fit with what the Rams are trying to do..."
I'm not trying to say this has nothing to do with football but it was an opportunity and they are seizing it.
Ben & Jerry's
Footballguy
OK, I am hoping that some of Suh's mean streak rubs off on him to make him give 110% every play, but at this point, I have to go potential and take:
2.42 Miami Dolphins
Robert Nkemdiche DT - Ole Miss
Let's put it this way, if he plays to his potential, he and Suh will be a monster due in the middle of that defense. We'll add another young edge rusher and guard in the next two rounds, but I can't pass up a 1st round talent to pair with Suh. It sure will make Byron Maxwell better.
Overall, I like Apple and Nkemdiche for a 1st/2nd round haul. I am pretty sure that based on their current off season that they won't do this good in the real thing.
2.42 Miami Dolphins
Robert Nkemdiche DT - Ole Miss
Let's put it this way, if he plays to his potential, he and Suh will be a monster due in the middle of that defense. We'll add another young edge rusher and guard in the next two rounds, but I can't pass up a 1st round talent to pair with Suh. It sure will make Byron Maxwell better.
Overall, I like Apple and Nkemdiche for a 1st/2nd round haul. I am pretty sure that based on their current off season that they won't do this good in the real thing.
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