Several Cowboys & Texans Test Positive for COVID19 (1 Viewer)

[Cobbler1]

Things to consider

1) NFL doesn't get sole decision making power on whether an NFL season gets to happen or not. It's being played that way as a courtesy to the NFL and to appease the networks because of the massive revenue they generate for their host cities.

2) The NFL season is not going to happen. Period. Bank it. Discussion of such is merely window dressing for PR reasons. Everyone wants everyone else to feel as things will be back to normal soon ( they won't) and it keeps the NFL in the public "conversation"  That's it.

3) People are only looking at the actual games on Sunday, there is the NFL "lifestyle" to consider.  Availability to the media, dealing with the press, fan commitments, travel, esp travel, these all create a multiplier effect on possible risk. 

4) NFL Security does not have the man power to handle the logistics of running a season given the current climate/situation. Much of NFL Security's manpower is directed towards pre draft preparation and the Super Bowl and any international games in a nominal season, given this situation, it's simply too difficult to lay a framework for even a basic level of security/safety across  the league. Given the potential for public unrest, this makes it worse. NFL games also draw manpower from local law enforcement, that PR hit alone is shaky ( If cops , even off duty, are working an NFL game while their city burns down around it because of some incident)

5) Insurance is another problem. Insurance is always a problem. Then there is the multiplier effect of potential liability.

6) The networks won't green light a season. A diluted product and a lack of "cost/risk certainty" would be too much to bear. The NFL gets those billions from the networks, and they have a massive say in what goes on for something like this. We also don't get to dig deep into the particulars of the current agreement between the NFL and the networks and how what boils down to a Force Majeure situation will get sorted out, if at all.  Players and coaches would need to given some kind of opt out if a season ran, one with some type of amnesty, but what about service time and cap issues implied to that?

7) From a long term bargaining standpoint, the very weak NFLPA will use any opening, even if their players have to die to do it, to create leverage in any future labor war. you made us play and look who died and on and on and on. The labor conflict never really ends, everything is ammo for that fight for the money pie.

8 ) It would require an unprecedented level of cooperation between NFL owners and DeMaurice Smith and that's just not going to happen. Smith is the Theon Greyjoy of the league, wants to prove himself a little too much and is always looking to be disagreeable for the sake of being disagreeable, the Kapernick/Anthem situation withstanding as the major exception.

You are asking the wrong questions. People aren't upset at your views directly but they are waiting for you to start asking the right questions. Your posts are answers to questions that aren't relevant to whether an NFL season will happen or not. Logistics, the salary cap in place, liability, security, the networks, the labor struggle, insurance, these are the boring dry things that will push the situation in one direction versus another.

There will not be an NFL season this year. Period.

For most of these points why is this so much different than from MLB MLS NHL and NBA all of which are starting in July?

 

[DallasDMac]

I think you can't possibly run a sports organization unless everyone is getting tested more or less every day. I mean, one trainer could infect the whole team.

This is exactly why it shouldn't happen. What a tremendous waste of testing capacity.

 

[Cobbler1]

This is exactly why it shouldn't happen. What a tremendous waste of testing capacity.

Is lack of available testing still considered an issue?

 

[Dr. Octopus]

Is lack of available testing still considered an issue?

No. Most pharmacies offer it for free now.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

It’s not the exposure. It’s the ICUs filling up with 18-29 year-olds in AZ, FL, TX & other places that have relaxed restrictions. 

thats why it compares directly to NFL players, who as you point out average 26 years old. seems important.

Do we have proof that ICU's are filling up with 18-29 year olds?

 

[Ditka Butkus]

With recent evidence that up to 20 million may have already had it ...death rate at like .006 should we not treat it any different than flu season ?

 

[Cobbler1]

With recent evidence that up to 20 million may have already had it ...death rate at like .006 should we not treat it any different than flu season ?

Of course it should be treated vastly differently than the flu. Come on man.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

Of course it should be treated vastly differently than the flu. Come on man.

Why?...The CDC doesn't keep detailed accounts of influenza deaths only estimates, so who is to say the death rate from the flu is not much higher than they estimate from year to year. Also using their estimates again (if its good enough to use estimates for the flu it's good enough to use for corona virus) the death rate from the corona vs flu may be fairly comparable.

https://nypost.com/2020/06/25/getting-realistic-about-the-coronavirus-death-rate/

 

[Dr. Octopus]

With recent evidence that up to 20 million may have already had it ...death rate at like .006 should we not treat it any different than flu season ?

I don't know that we can call it "evidence" but yes the CDC now estimates that 20 million people have already had the virus which does put the death rate closer to flu levels. This is much more contagious than the flu however.

The problem is that it's become such a polarizing issue that people look at the extremes and not the real data.

Do we have proof that ICU's are filling up with 18-29 year olds?

There is no proof, because that was an inaccurate/emotional statement - which has been the problem in this thread with both sides.

Bottom line is the NFL is a multi-billion dollar business run by people astute enough to become billionaires. It's likely they are a lot smarter and more diligent than people posting half facts on a fantasy football message board. People putting percentages on if they will play are throwing darts and have no idea how much time and effort the league has put into it's plan for the  season. On the flip side anyone saying there is no issue and we'll see a full season is over simplifying the situation - as it's going to be a tough battle to make this work. This is a highly contagious virus that has harsh effects on certain demographics while also randomly effecting those outside of those demograhics - there are outliers. People are dying.

People are so intent on "winning" their argument on here (once again on both sides) that they are making things up in here which is dangerous. The data is all out there. For now, wear a mask in public (if not for you but for others) try and social distance, wash your hands and be respectful of those that are taking this seriously. Hopefully we find a vaccine soon and this can all be a thing of the past. Personally I think the league will start on time, but can't say for sure they will finish. I sure hope they will for many reasons.

 

[Cobbler1]

Why?...The CDC doesn't keep detailed accounts of influenza deaths only estimates, so who is to say the death rate from the flu is not much higher than they estimate from year to year. Also using their estimates again (if its good enough to use estimates for the flu it's good enough to use for corona virus) the death rate from the corona vs flu may be fairly comparable.

https://nypost.com/2020/06/25/getting-realistic-about-the-coronavirus-death-rate/

You question the death rate of the flu which has been around for decades but readily accept a study on the coronavirus published like yesterday? Anyways CV has killed 120,000+ since April 1st. Less than 3 months. Outside of cold/flu season. With extreme social distancing measures in place. As noted by Dr O the infection rate is a substantial part of the equation.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

My Motto: If you are afraid of dying, you ain't living. Also  Nobody gets out alive.

I get it. If people have concerns or fears, then by all means stay home, isolate yourselves and protect those of yours that are vulnerable. I have absolutely no problem with that. But why should the people who don't have those same concerns have to live their lives like that? Anyone of us can lose our lives in any given manner. Each day could be our last. Do we really want to spend it afraid? Why shouldn't life go on as normal? Play Ball!

 

[Mongidig]

My Motto: If you are afraid of dying, you ain't living. Also  Nobody gets out alive.

I get it. If people have concerns or fears, then by all means stay home, isolate yourselves and protect those of yours that are vulnerable. I have absolutely no problem with that. But why should the people who don't have those same concerns have to live their lives like that? Anyone of us can lose our lives in any given manner. Each day could be our last. Do we really want to spend it afraid? Why shouldn't life go on as normal? Play Ball!

My motto: People with your motto is the reason why we are spiking in cases. This then leads to the continued slow down of the economy. At some point you are going to look around you and see that not much is open. At some point many people who previously weren't taking this seriously will be directly affected by Covid. You will probably look back on this one day and realize that if everyone took this seriously things could have returned to normal much sooner. This lack of seriousness may cause the cancellation of sports for 2020. We are supposed to be spiking in AZ through August. I don't know how the Cardinals are going operate. 

Until people get the message we are just gonna kick the can down the road. People are so concerned about their "Freedom of choice". What is the point if there is not much left to choose from. 

 

[Doug B]

I wonder how late into the year NFL could delay the season opening? How far into 2021 could they continue to play?

I have been speculating in my various league chats that the season won’t start until November. 

Pretty reasonable estimate. You could go with a 12-game regular season with one bye week (assuming the Super Bowl is pushed back three weeks to 2/28/2021).

 

[Ditka Butkus]

My motto: People with your motto is the reason why we are spiking in cases. This then leads to the continued slow down of the economy. At some point you are going to look around you and see that not much is open. At some point many people who previously weren't taking this seriously will be directly affected by Covid. You will probably look back on this one day and realize that if everyone took this seriously things could have returned to normal much sooner. This lack of seriousness may cause the cancellation of sports for 2020. We are supposed to be spiking in AZ through August. I don't know how the Cardinals are going operate. 

Until people get the message we are just gonna kick the can down the road. People are so concerned about their "Freedom of choice". What is the point if there is not much left to choose from. 

So magically if we stay in another 30 days this will go away? Closing things down, is actually kicking the virus down the road. Until there is a vaccine, every time you reopen it is going to spike. Let's all stay on house arrest indefinitely.

 

[Vandelay]

So magically if we stay in another 30 days this will go away? Closing things down, is actually kicking the virus down the road. Until there is a vaccine, every time you reopen it is going to spike. Let's all stay on house arrest indefinitely.

Italy was hit as hard as anyone initially.  They took lockdown seriously.  There are now 17,000+ active cases there compared to our 1,345,930.  See the difference?  Our lock down didn't take because half the country didn't execute the lock down. 

Unless people get the message (clearly they won't) cases will continue to soar and penatrate the sports bubble, which will lead to the cancelation of sports.

We will get to see the other sports leagues try to reopen first.  If they can't pull it off with players effectively in a bubble (NBA), hub cities with isolation (NHL), and an inherently socially distanced sport (MLB), the NFL has virtually no chance until a vaccine is created.

 

[Cobbler1]

Take an example from that list. What is Adam Silver proposing?

Two sites where players and coaches will entrench/play/live in a predesignated strong point where teams would play in close to total isolation. How large is an NBA roster? What are their equipment needs? What are the logistical requirements for the field of play?

NFL games are "events".  Each game, each snap, everything is critical in part because of the complexity to the logistical framework needed to make play possible.

People also don't pay just to see a team play, but the elite/signature athletes on said team. Are they going to play? What will the product be on the field even if they play? Adam Silver has said if the NBA season rolls around, if a player get sick, the season as to move forward no matter what. And if a player dies?  If a player gets sick then infects his family?

The only argument to be made from the perspective of the respective sports themselves is if they don't stand up and play now, the sport would be crushed entirely forever from a financial/social impact standpoint and long term recovery would not be possible. Also that the masses need distraction. But the risk/reward situation doesn't line up.

No sport will have the logistical complexity of the typical NFL game, even a heavily modified Adam Silver proposed version of it.

Will traditional type NFL games be possible?  I just don't see it. Could it be possible that the league tries to develop some type of modification in isolation that could start to unpack many of the problems in place? Maybe, but I'd have to see it first to believe it. What would be the quality of the end product? Would that product be worth the risk to the brand itself and it's long term future?

There is an old saying - "The Roman Army marches on it's stomach"

Meaning you can't fight if you can't feed and supply your men. For every Roman fighting man, you need many more to support his actual basic needs in the supply pipeline.

People are arguing here over death statistics. Whether the NFL season can happen is a logistical problem. Your niece has a piano recital and if you want people to show up, you need more chairs. Can you rent them? Can you buy them? Can you borrow them? How many do you need? When do you need them? An NFL is bigger, more exciting, but it's just a bigger version of your niece's piano recital that needs some more chairs.

I don’t see how NFL games are any more events than the other sports. They can reduce a lot of issues from your piano recital analogy by not having fans. The individual intricacies I can see- larger roster than NBA, more contact than baseball, etc. I don’t see a bunch of players willing to sit out a year. I still think the NFL will do what it takes to get teams on the field. Undoubtedly with players missing 2-3 weeks at a time when outbreaks occur. Public perception will be the biggest issue I think.

 

[Doug B]

So magically if we stay in another 30 days this will go away?

30 days would be enough IF the level of lockdown were draconian and civil rights were suspended for the duration. Would need MPs in the streets, one weekly outing per household, National Guard delivering food & medicines, etc. Would have to do it like Wuhan in January.

It's not magic -- it would be "starving" the virus of its hosts.

 

[Mongidig]

So magically if we stay in another 30 days this will go away? Closing things down, is actually kicking the virus down the road. Until there is a vaccine, every time you reopen it is going to spike. Let's all stay on house arrest indefinitely.

I'm not talking about locking down. I'm talking about being smart and wearing a mask, social distancing, washing hands and not attending big gatherings. It's seems that folks with your motto aren't willing to do this. If you are doing these things then I apologize for reading too much into your motto.

 

[Mongidig]

I don’t see how NFL games are any more events than the other sports. They can reduce a lot of issues from your piano recital analogy by not having fans. The individual intricacies I can see- larger roster than NBA, more contact than baseball, etc. I don’t see a bunch of players willing to sit out a year. I still think the NFL will do what it takes to get teams on the field. Undoubtedly with players missing 2-3 weeks at a time when outbreaks occur. Public perception will be the biggest issue I think.

I don't think public perception will be as big of a problem as you think. Football is huge and a big chunk of this country loves it. I know this sounds morbid but I think people will be used to the numbers regarding Corona by the time the season starts. I think the mindset will be there is no guarantee of a vaccine and this virus is not going away so we might as well learn to live with it. Hopefully by then more people will be onboard with keeping safe with regards to the virus.

There are two things that could put an end to a season. As of right now both are real possibilities. 

1) A massive second wave of Coronavirus during the normal flu season. 

2) People within the NFL dying from the virus.

 

[huthut]

It is like the lotto. Is it likely that I will win, no, but it is likely that someone will win. It will be hard to pick some specific player who will die from it, but it seems very possible that someone will die in the NFL assuming Covid continues to be around the players. This is not even keeping track of other health issues which might not be fatal but could end someones NFL career, whether it is due to blood clots or lung damage or something else.

 

[Mongidig]

If you cancel football this year because of Corona then should you also cancel next year if there is no vaccine? 

 

[barackdhouse]

30 days would be enough IF the level of lockdown were draconian and civil rights were suspended for the duration. Would need MPs in the streets, one weekly outing per household, National Guard delivering food & medicines, etc. Would have to do it like Wuhan in January.

It's not magic -- it would be "starving" the virus of its hosts.

This is absolutely correct. And would seem much closer to martial law and an Orwellian system than to conduct massive testing and contact tracing (which is still nowhere near adequate enough).  But people are freaking out over the contact tracing being an invasion of privacy. 

So either everybody wears their ####### mask (TO PROTECT OTHERS gosh darn IT) and we stamp this thing down, or we half ### it like we did already and destroy our economy even worse. So choose, would you rather have armed military enforcing these rules or would you rather tell someone on the phone who you've been in contact with?

People want it every damn which way except that of personal responsibility. Wear the masks and stop being selfish. It's not about you and your health and your fear or lack of it. You could be infecting people right now.

Ugh so sick of this ####. I have to explain to my kids that there are people out there that don't care about anyone but themselves. Always been that way but this ignorance is in our face all time. Masks are required by law now in Oregon in many counties and people still don't wear them. Most do but still.

 

[barackdhouse]

Here is a current article talking about how the hospitalizations in Texas are being driven by younger people. https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/06/26/884039381/houston-hospitals-are-seeing-surge-in-coronavirus-admissions?utm_medium=RSS&utm_campaign=nprblogscoronavirusliveupdates

 

[Joe Bryant]

This is absolutely correct. And would seem much closer to martial law and an Orwellian system than to conduct massive testing and contact tracing (which is still nowhere near adequate enough).  But people are freaking out over the contact tracing being an invasion of privacy. 

So either everybody wears their ####### mask (TO PROTECT OTHERS gosh darn IT) and we stamp this thing down, or we half ### it like we did already and destroy our economy even worse. So choose, would you rather have armed military enforcing these rules or would you rather tell someone on the phone who you've been in contact with?

People want it every damn which way except that of personal responsibility. Wear the masks and stop being selfish. It's not about you and your health and your fear or lack of it. You could be infecting people right now.

Ugh so sick of this ####. I have to explain to my kids that there are people out there that don't care about anyone but themselves. Always been that way but this ignorance is in our face all time. Masks are required by law now in Oregon in many counties and people still don't wear them. Most do but still.

Yes. We're all sick of it. For this thread, please keep this to 100% football.

We have TONS of threads in our other forums where people take it the direction you did. Please take that to the other threads as there's tons of it. For here, please keep it to 100% NFL. Thanks. 

 

[DallasDMac]

No. Most pharmacies offer it for free now.

This is not even remotely true in many states. Walk in to a pharmacy in SA and ask for a COVID test and let me know how that goes. You are not just walking in off the street and getting a test.

CVS web site:

COVID-19 testing center

Appointment required

Referral not required

Tests limited to certain patients

 

[barackdhouse]

Yes. We're all sick of it. For this thread, please keep this to 100% football.

We have TONS of threads in our other forums where people take it the direction you did. Please take that to the other threads as there's tons of it. For here, please keep it to 100% NFL. Thanks. 

Yeah my bad I know better. 

 

[Deamon]

Things to consider

1) NFL doesn't get sole decision making power on whether an NFL season gets to happen or not. It's being played that way as a courtesy to the NFL and to appease the networks because of the massive revenue they generate for their host cities.

2) The NFL season is not going to happen. Period. Bank it. Discussion of such is merely window dressing for PR reasons. Everyone wants everyone else to feel as things will be back to normal soon ( they won't) and it keeps the NFL in the public "conversation"  That's it.

3) People are only looking at the actual games on Sunday, there is the NFL "lifestyle" to consider.  Availability to the media, dealing with the press, fan commitments, travel, esp travel, these all create a multiplier effect on possible risk. 

4) NFL Security does not have the man power to handle the logistics of running a season given the current climate/situation. Much of NFL Security's manpower is directed towards pre draft preparation and the Super Bowl and any international games in a nominal season, given this situation, it's simply too difficult to lay a framework for even a basic level of security/safety across  the league. Given the potential for public unrest, this makes it worse. NFL games also draw manpower from local law enforcement, that PR hit alone is shaky ( If cops , even off duty, are working an NFL game while their city burns down around it because of some incident)

5) Insurance is another problem. Insurance is always a problem. Then there is the multiplier effect of potential liability.

6) The networks won't green light a season. A diluted product and a lack of "cost/risk certainty" would be too much to bear. The NFL gets those billions from the networks, and they have a massive say in what goes on for something like this. We also don't get to dig deep into the particulars of the current agreement between the NFL and the networks and how what boils down to a Force Majeure situation will get sorted out, if at all.  Players and coaches would need to given some kind of opt out if a season ran, one with some type of amnesty, but what about service time and cap issues implied to that?

7) From a long term bargaining standpoint, the very weak NFLPA will use any opening, even if their players have to die to do it, to create leverage in any future labor war. you made us play and look who died and on and on and on. The labor conflict never really ends, everything is ammo for that fight for the money pie.

8 ) It would require an unprecedented level of cooperation between NFL owners and DeMaurice Smith and that's just not going to happen. Smith is the Theon Greyjoy of the league, wants to prove himself a little too much and is always looking to be disagreeable for the sake of being disagreeable, the Kapernick/Anthem situation withstanding as the major exception.

You are asking the wrong questions. People aren't upset at your views directly but they are waiting for you to start asking the right questions. Your posts are answers to questions that aren't relevant to whether an NFL season will happen or not. Logistics, the salary cap in place, liability, security, the networks, the labor struggle, insurance, these are the boring dry things that will push the situation in one direction versus another.

There will not be an NFL season this year. Period.

Not sure where you're going with this.  When did I say anything about if the season would be played or not?  I think it will happen, but you have valid points about why it may not, and I think there's a good possibility it won't.

My posts aren't supposed to be relevant to whether an NFL season will happen or not.  That's not what this thread is about.  This thread is about some Cowboys and Texans player getting Covid, and the effects on these players.  There's other threads on if the season will happen, logistics, salary cap, liability, etc. etc.  That wasn't the point of this thread so I'm trying to keep it on topic.. which is the effect of covid on those Cowboys and Texans players.

 

[Deamon]

I don't think public perception will be as big of a problem as you think. Football is huge and a big chunk of this country loves it. I know this sounds morbid but I think people will be used to the numbers regarding Corona by the time the season starts. I think the mindset will be there is no guarantee of a vaccine and this virus is not going away so we might as well learn to live with it. Hopefully by then more people will be onboard with keeping safe with regards to the virus.

There are two things that could put an end to a season. As of right now both are real possibilities. 

1) A massive second wave of Coronavirus during the normal flu season. 

2) People within the NFL dying from the virus.

#2 seems very unlikely.  #1 seems very likely... especially the way people are actually protesting wearing masks, and you have rallies of people chanting not to wear a mask.  It's mind blowing to me.  As this relates to football, this could really hurt the season from happening.  Cases among players was bound to happen, but now likely will be more prevalent.  There will be a lot of pressure for the league to 'do the right thing' once these numbers start flying through the roof. 

As for the topic of this forum, Total guess here, but I bet 30% of the players will have contracted the virus at some point this year (either before or after today).  They'll all be fine, but if they start spreading it to their family members it's not going to be good.

 

[Mongidig]

#2 seems very unlikely.  #1 seems very likely... especially the way people are actually protesting wearing masks, and you have rallies of people chanting not to wear a mask.  It's mind blowing to me.  As this relates to football, this could really hurt the season from happening.  Cases among players was bound to happen, but now likely will be more prevalent.  There will be a lot of pressure for the league to 'do the right thing' once these numbers start flying through the roof. 

As for the topic of this forum, Total guess here, but I bet 30% of the players will have contracted the virus at some point this year (either before or after today).  They'll all be fine, but if they start spreading it to their family members it's not going to be good.

Within #2 I'm including coaches, trainers, stadium personnel etc. I think it is unlikely a player will die. 

I would think any coaches with health issues would coach from a booth somewhere. I wouldn't doubt if they put restrictions on those employees who have health vulnerabilities. 

The NFL should run commercials now with its biggest stars promoting mask use. Maybe have teams give away team masks. They should go full court press to try to plead with people to act safe so that we can have a season.

 

[Deamon]

Within #2 I'm including coaches, trainers, stadium personnel etc. I think it is unlikely a player will die. 

I would think any coaches with health issues would coach from a booth somewhere. I wouldn't doubt if they put restrictions on those employees who have health vulnerabilities. 

The NFL should run commercials now with its biggest stars promoting mask use. Maybe have teams give away team masks. They should go full court press to try to plead with people to act safe so that we can have a season.

Ya I still don't think coaches/trainers/etc. will.  Not only because they are likely in low risk groups, but also they will likely all be tested daily (at least weekly), and given the top health care there is.  I'm not sure why they'd coach from a booth... if all the players were tested and negative before entering the stadium, there wouldn't be any risk of them standing on the sidelines would there? 

Agree 100% on your last point. 

 

[Mongidig]

Ya I still don't think coaches/trainers/etc. will.  Not only because they are likely in low risk groups, but also they will likely all be tested daily (at least weekly), and given the top health care there is.  I'm not sure why they'd coach from a booth... if all the players were tested and negative before entering the stadium, there wouldn't be any risk of them standing on the sidelines would there? 

Agree 100% on your last point. 

There could be false negatives. 

Would these tests identify the virus if the person is asymptomatic but not shedding the virus? Is it possible they get a negative test before the game but then become presymptomatic during the game thus making them infectious? 

I've heard them talking about not all of the coaches being out on the field. There must be a reason for that.

 

[Deamon]

There could be false negatives. 

Would these tests identify the virus if the person is asymptomatic but not shedding the virus? Is it possible they get a negative test before the game but then become presymptomatic during the game thus making them infectious? 

I've heard them talking about not all of the coaches being out on the field. There must be a reason for that.

I'm not sure on the science behind that and how the tests work.  I thought it would give positive even if asymptomatic but I could be wrong.

As for coaches, i think they would be fine on the field especially if they distanced.  But I guess the less people together the better, especially for perception of fans watching from home.  And probably wouldn't change much by being up there.

I like your mask idea.  NFL handing out logo'd masks would be a good investment.  Far greater chance of a season if ppl start taking this serious enough.

 

[Cobbler1]

I think you are minimizing what Adam Silver is proposing ( and it's honestly the only viable solution, if that at all)

What Silver is proposing is to built two self contained NBA mini-cities where NBA players will essentially live and work in two concentrated areas for most of the season. 

For the NFL to pull this off, they would need a football stadium. They'd need to accommodate players and their families in semi-permanent living situations, but also for the press, the camera crews, support staff, etc. They would need to establish security for this and to maintain it. You would need people to manage the equipment, maintenance the field, you'd need on site medical services for any possible contingency. You also have the kids of said players and coaches and whatnot. Now you must provide services and logistics to feed, school and secure those kids.

How does an NFL game typically manage it's security? NFL Security is present as a token force at every game. Each team has it's own individual security ( usually retired local law enforcement and the like) but those units are not designed for this kind of situation. Local law enforcement gets much of it's overtime from sporting events, but these agencies are already tapped from dealing with everything else. Lower level security is contracted out. But you cannot use these people to overcome the loss of more skilled/experienced/trained personnel up the chain who will no longer be present.

How does an NFL game typically manage it's equipment needs. You'll need expanded rosters to deal with projected attrition. Now you have to manage the transport of such equipment and ensure it meets safety protocols/standards to keep the players and everyone else safe.  There's a reason professional teams have their own air fleet. For the raw volume of equipment they have to move.

How can you isolate and house and feed and secure thousands of people in a situation like this?

You are talking "public perception" when teams will have problems just getting their gear to the site safely.

The people who believe an NFL season will happen routinely ignore the basics. How are you going to feed, house, secure and give medical care to thousands in isolation?

You don’t need to go through all that the NBA is doing. Hockey isn’t. MLB isn’t. You don’t need the typical security force on gameday if you don’t have fans. You think figuring out how to load/unload a bus or plane of equipment is going to stop the NFL from playing games? People can unload while spaced wearing masks. People can be tested then unload. Heck the NFL will buy 1000 gas masks or surgical PPE for their equipment guys before they’re punting on the season. I don’t think anyone is saying it’s going to happen routinely.

 

[Cobbler1]

I don't think public perception will be as big of a problem as you think. Football is huge and a big chunk of this country loves it. I know this sounds morbid but I think people will be used to the numbers regarding Corona by the time the season starts. I think the mindset will be there is no guarantee of a vaccine and this virus is not going away so we might as well learn to live with it. Hopefully by then more people will be onboard with keeping safe with regards to the virus.

There are two things that could put an end to a season. As of right now both are real possibilities. 

1) A massive second wave of Coronavirus during the normal flu season. 

2) People within the NFL dying from the virus.

I think it’s a public perception issue if a state is being hit hard (hi Arizona and Fla) and has to roll back their opening. Reduced gathering sizes, closes nonessential businesses, is seeing hospital surges. Now the NFL could have trouble justifying to some people why they get to gather and play games. Or if a team is hit with an outbreak- 15 players test positive. Then there’s reports of those players out at a club and the club reports an outbreak. Fair or not the NFL will come under fire. And if an older coach or staff member gets a bad case and ends up on a vent the NFL will come under fire for that too. I find these scenarios more likely than players not playing for their own safety or a player actually getting hospitalized.

 

[Mongidig]

I'm not sure on the science behind that and how the tests work.  I thought it would give positive even if asymptomatic but I could be wrong.

As for coaches, i think they would be fine on the field especially if they distanced.  But I guess the less people together the better, especially for perception of fans watching from home.  And probably wouldn't change much by being up there.

I like your mask idea.  NFL handing out logo'd masks would be a good investment.  Far greater chance of a season if ppl start taking this serious enough.

I think there needs to be a drastic attitude change in general regarding the virus. It will be crucial for the potential for an NFL season. Many people are not listening to the federal or local government. I do think many will listen to athletes. This is the reason athletes are used so much in commercials. I think the major sports should create a massive campaign to try to get more people on board. They need to change the attitude of "you can't tell me what to do"  to a more "That sounds cool" type of thing. 

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

There is no proof, because that was an inaccurate/emotional statement - which has been the problem in this thread with both sides.

actually no it was not. It was something they mentioned on the news, which is what I said in a following post. 

it had nothing to do with emotion other than disgust that people aren’t taking COVID seriously enough. 
 

Bottom line is the NFL is a multi-billion dollar business run by people astute enough to become billionaires. It's likely they are a lot smarter and more diligent than people posting half facts on a fantasy football message board. People putting percentages on if they will play are throwing darts and have no idea how much time and effort the league has put into it's plan for the  season. On the flip side anyone saying there is no issue and we'll see a full season is over simplifying the situation - as it's going to be a tough battle to make this work. This is a highly contagious virus that has harsh effects on certain demographics while also randomly effecting those outside of those demograhics - there are outliers. People are dying.

People are so intent on "winning" their argument on here (once again on both sides) that they are making things up in here which is dangerous. The data is all out there. For now, wear a mask in public (if not for you but for others) try and social distance, wash your hands and be respectful of those that are taking this seriously. Hopefully we find a vaccine soon and this can all be a thing of the past. Personally I think the league will start on time, but can't say for sure they will finish. I sure hope they will for many reasons.

I honestly couldn’t care less about “winning or losing” - I care about accuracy.

and the point has been made several times in here that NFL players aren’t at risk because they average 26 years old.

”Dr. Bruce Dart of the Tulsa Health Department said half of the current COVID-19 hospitalizations are people under 50 years old. The 18-50 age group accounts for 70% of new cases, he said.”

ICUs in AZ, TX, OH & FL are reporting a spike in 18-35 year old otherwise healthy adults being hospitalized. 

Here’s a 17 year old in FL who died 3 days ago.

https://t.co/SCUbdSEkJs

outlier? Hardly. 
 

per Dr Scott Gottleib, MD:

”When we see data showing in hospital mortality for Covid patients aged 35-44 of almost 5% we should keep in mind — that’s exceptionally high; especially since criteria for admission is generally just an oxygen saturation below 93%. Many of these young people are otherwise healthy”

5% mortality.

and with ICUs becoming overloaded, that mortality rate will increase due to lack of available beds/equipment.

maybe the NFL has a stash of ventilators so that’s not a problem? Regardless, math is math. The assertion by some that NFL players aren’t at risk because they’re average 26 years old & in good health is a fallacy. It is not based in anything but wishful thinking & assumption from early data that we now know to be flawed/false.

this is a football topic about NFL players. Apples to apples: they are at risk. The mortality rate is the same for them as for other healthy 18-35 year olds.

NBA & MLB are now backing off some due to outbreaks. NFL is sure to follow. I agree with posters who’ve said NFL is biding their time to not kill the cash cow too early. 

I’m done beating this dead horse. I’m becoming more and more skeptical that we will have any major league sports this year, including football. The United States isn’t comparable to the soccer leagues in the EU, since they actually took this pandemic seriously & have now banned travel from the US. So we can’t even look to soccer for inspiration. It’s simply not analogous. 

i hope everyone in here wears a mask whenever possible, keeps social distancing, washes their hands. Stays home as much as possible. I’ve now lost 3 people to this awful disease - all in good health, none over the age of 50. It’s an awful way to go and I wouldn’t wish it on any of you. 

 

[Mongidig]

I think it’s a public perception issue if a state is being hit hard (hi Arizona and Fla) and has to roll back their opening. Reduced gathering sizes, closes nonessential businesses, is seeing hospital surges. Now the NFL could have trouble justifying to some people why they get to gather and play games. Or if a team is hit with an outbreak- 15 players test positive. Then there’s reports of those players out at a club and the club reports an outbreak. Fair or not the NFL will come under fire. And if an older coach or staff member gets a bad case and ends up on a vent the NFL will come under fire for that too. I find these scenarios more likely than players not playing for their own safety or a player actually getting hospitalized.

If we see extreme negative results it will certainly kill the public perception. The NBA is starting up in a state that is one of the epicenters of the outbreak. I realize they are playing in a bubble, but I would have figured there would be more public outcry about this. I think by the time the NFL season rolls around, people are going to be over this virus psychologically. People are selfish and they want their football. I think we are going to be used to the daily infections and deaths. I'm of course assuming we are not seeing astronomical spikes or a massive second wave. This is why we need to start now to get the numbers down.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

This is not even remotely true in many states. Walk in to a pharmacy in SA and ask for a COVID test and let me know how that goes. You are not just walking in off the street and getting a test.

CVS web site:

COVID-19 testing center

Appointment required

Referral not required

Tests limited to certain patients

Most in my State, sorry. and yes it’s by appointment, not sure why that changes anything.

 

[Cobbler1]

I think there needs to be a drastic attitude change in general regarding the virus. It will be crucial for the potential for an NFL season. Many people are not listening to the federal or local government. I do think many will listen to athletes. This is the reason athletes are used so much in commercials. I think the major sports should create a massive campaign to try to get more people on board. They need to change the attitude of "you can't tell me what to do"  to a more "That sounds cool" type of thing. 

Mack Brown said yesterday: “If you want to have a football season, wear a mask”. Of course the first comment is some moron saying he loves football but he loves his FREEDOM and his COUNTRY more.
 

IT’S A F****ing MASK NOT A STRAITJACKET

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

IT’S A F****ing MASK NOT A STRAITJACKET

Amen. This is the only country in the world that wearing a mask has become a controversy. It’s madness.

 

[Vandelay]

If we see extreme negative results it will certainly kill the public perception. The NBA is starting up in a state that is one of the epicenters of the outbreak. I realize they are playing in a bubble, but I would have figured there would be more public outcry about this. I think by the time the NFL season rolls around, people are going to be over this virus psychologically. People are selfish and they want their football. I think we are going to be used to the daily infections and deaths. I'm of course assuming we are not seeing astronomical spikes or a massive second wave. This is why we need to start now to get the numbers down.

The US just recorded the two highest days of new cases since this whole virus began on Thursday and Friday.  There already is a massive second wave.  With roughly 75 days until the season is supposed to start, things are getting much worse.  I sure hope they figure it out but a delay (at minimum) seems inevitable right now.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

actually no it was not. It was something they mentioned on the news, which is what I said in another post.
it had nothing to do with emotion other than disgust that people aren’t taking COVID seriously enough

Cases have been going up for younger people since they’re the ones going out, but they’re still not getting all that sick for the most part. The issue is they pass it on to others. So yes hospitalizations are going up but it’s only indirectly being triggered by 19-35 year olds. They are not flooding ICUs.

 

[Mongidig]

The US just recorded the two highest days of new cases since this whole virus began on Thursday and Friday.  There already is a massive second wave.  With roughly 75 days until the season is supposed to start, things are getting much worse.  I sure hope they figure it out but a delay (at minimum) seems inevitable right now.

I would be shocked if they played more than 12 games. I could see playing 4 or 5 games and then having to shutdown during a second wave for a month or two. 

 

[Cobbler1]

Cases have been going up for younger people since they’re the ones going out, but they’re still not getting all that sick for the most part. The issue is they pass it on to others. So yes hospitalizations are going up but it’s only indirectly being triggered by 19-35 year olds.

It’s also a pretty big stretch to go from the 19-28 range initially discussed to “Under 50”. 15-34 has 864 deaths listed by the CDC. 35-54 has over 7000. And yes the younger ages being exposed more and becoming a larger and larger portion of the recent case numbers will result in more of them in the hospital than before. But that doesn’t mean they are being affected individually any worse than before.

 

[Dr. Octopus]

I would be shocked if they played more than 12 games. I could see playing 4 or 5 games and then having to shutdown during a second wave for a month or two. 

Since the CDC estimates 20MM have already had it this may be the second wave. That’s obviously just trying to look at it from a positive expectation. I don’t know what to expect.

Im going to continue to be optimistic from an NFL perspective. With the money at stake I think they’ll have a plan. But I wouldn’t be shocked if they don’t play a game either. It’s not fun to think  about that though, and if we believed that why be on a Fantasy Football message board at all?

 

[Mongidig]

actually no it was not. It was something they mentioned on the news, which is what I said in a following post. 

it had nothing to do with emotion other than disgust that people aren’t taking COVID seriously enough. 
 

I honestly couldn’t care less about “winning or losing” - I care about accuracy.

and the point has been made several times in here that NFL players aren’t at risk because they average 26 years old.

”Dr. Bruce Dart of the Tulsa Health Department said half of the current COVID-19 hospitalizations are people under 50 years old. The 18-50 age group accounts for 70% of new cases, he said.”

ICUs in AZ, TX, OH & FL are reporting a spike in 18-35 year old otherwise healthy adults being hospitalized. 

Here’s a 17 year old in FL who died 3 days ago.

https://t.co/SCUbdSEkJs

outlier? Hardly. 
 

per Dr Scott Gottleib, MD:

”When we see data showing in hospital mortality for Covid patients aged 35-44 of almost 5% we should keep in mind — that’s exceptionally high; especially since criteria for admission is generally just an oxygen saturation below 93%. Many of these young people are otherwise healthy”

5% mortality.

and with ICUs becoming overloaded, that mortality rate will increase due to lack of available beds/equipment.

maybe the NFL has a stash of ventilators so that’s not a problem? Regardless, math is math. The assertion by some that NFL players aren’t at risk because they’re average 26 years old & in good health is a fallacy. It is not based in anything but wishful thinking & assumption from early data that we now know to be flawed/false.

this is a football topic about NFL players. Apples to apples: they are at risk. The mortality rate is the same for them as for other healthy 18-35 year olds.

NBA & MLB are now backing off some due to outbreaks. NFL is sure to follow. I agree with posters who’ve said NFL is biding their time to not kill the cash cow too early. 

I’m done beating this dead horse. I’m becoming more and more skeptical that we will have any major league sports this year, including football. The United States isn’t comparable to the soccer leagues in the EU, since they actually took this pandemic seriously & have now banned travel from the US. So we can’t even look to soccer for inspiration. It’s simply not analogous. 

i hope everyone in here wears a mask whenever possible, keeps social distancing, washes their hands. Stays home as much as possible. I’ve now lost 3 people to this awful disease - all in good health, none over the age of 50. It’s an awful way to go and I wouldn’t wish it on any of you. 

I think the 17 year old dying is the definition of an "outlier" considering the youngest person to die before him in Florida was 22. 

The increase numbers of younger people being hospitalized makes sense given the packed bars, house parties, protests, rallies etc. I wonder if the increased mortality of these younger patients is due to them getting higher viral loads. Many of the activities that I listed above have these people screaming and yelling and spending long periods of time in big group settings. I also would suspect that many of these people are less likely to seek treatment right away thinking they are young so they should be alright. This delay may be causing their worsened health situation. Compare this to NFL players who are being tested every day and whom's  health is their career. There will be no delay in treatment for these players and they will have access to the best medical services and technology.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

They are not flooding ICUs.

all ages are, and more still will be. 70% of new admissions are under 50. This is a massive failure to contain. And what we see now is from infections 1-2 weeks ago. Which means what we see next week & the week after will likely be worse. 

it is what it is. I hope you and yours manage to avoid it. 

 

[wgoldsph]

The US just recorded the two highest days of new cases since this whole virus began on Thursday and Friday.  There already is a massive second wave.  With roughly 75 days until the season is supposed to start, things are getting much worse.  I sure hope they figure it out but a delay (at minimum) seems inevitable right now.

It's not a second wave.  We've never finished the first one because we refused to wear masks and quarantine long enough.

 

[Cobbler1]

I think the 17 year old dying is the definition of an "outlier" considering the youngest person to die before him in Florida was 22. 

The increase numbers of younger people being hospitalized makes sense given the packed bars, house parties, protests, rallies etc. I wonder if the increased mortality of these younger patients is due to them getting higher viral loads. Many of the activities that I listed above have these people screaming and yelling and spending long periods of time in big group settings. I also would suspect that many of these people are less likely to seek treatment right away thinking they are young so they should be alright. This delay may be causing their worsened health situation. Compare this to NFL players who are being tested every day and whom's  health is their career. There will be no delay in treatment for these players and they will have access to the best medical services and technology.

I don’t think we have evidence of this yet. The increased mortality amongst younger people that is. The deaths relative to the case count have been dropping likely due to a larger portion of younger people getting exposed and getting tested. Of course there is a lag and the next couple weeks will be noteworthy to see if the deaths do end up spiking up as well. You’d think they’d have to go up some just from pure volume capturing more people with comorbidities. And of course we’ll have no way to know how many younger people with no symptoms simply aren’t getting tested and won’t be accounted for any time soon. There was a lot of buzz early on about viral load playing a significant role in the severity of case so that is an interesting point you raise.

 

[Hot Sauce Guy]

I think the 17 year old dying is the definition of an "outlier" considering the youngest person to die before him in Florida was 22. 

The increase numbers of younger people being hospitalized makes sense given the packed bars, house parties, protests, rallies etc. I wonder if the increased mortality of these younger patients is due to them getting higher viral loads. Many of the activities that I listed above have these people screaming and yelling and spending long periods of time in big group settings. I also would suspect that many of these people are less likely to seek treatment right away thinking they are young so they should be alright. This delay may be causing their worsened health situation. Compare this to NFL players who are being tested every day and whom's  health is their career. There will be no delay in treatment for these players and they will have access to the best medical services and technology.

Or maybe it’s just a deadly virus with significantly higher morality than the flu & it won’t matter at all whether NFL players are healthier or seek treatment faster because for the % who are impacted to the point that they require hospitalization it’s already a very high risk situation.

Unfortunately we just don’t know.

man, just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in.