RNC Votes to Stop Working with the Commission on Presidential Debates (1 Viewer)

[The Commish]

Can you give me some examples of Conservative cancel culture, Conservative mobs confronting Liberals in public and showing up at their houses, and Conservative suppression of speech and censorship?

Well yeah....tons.  You can go back to the Dixie Chicks.  You can look at how Romney, Cheney, Kinzinger have been treated.  You can go to parler.com (or any of those "conservative" sites you want to pick).  You can look at the events in Virginia.  If we are to believe the thread here on Trump's new site (never been there other than to see how hackable it is) it has a bunch of that sort of culture too.  I can give you multiple stories of people here showing up at houses of school board officials and a laundry list of books/publications that have been "banned".  My state alone has had over 200 different bannings of material.  

This kind of thing has gone on for generations with a myriad of different labels and it's not unique to one group over another.  Look passed the cute labels and it's rather obvious to see.

 

[the moops]

I'd rather watch the WNBA instead of a presidential debate.

You should. WNBA is some of the best basketball to watch. A real team sport with solid fundamentals

 

[Punxsutawney Phil]

I can't imagine Biden in debates in a few years.

 

[roadkill1292]

If I were King of the Democrats, I'd completely overhaul the way my party did primaries and debates both.

Republicans are probably right for getting out of the nearly purposeless debates but, as usual, for all the wrong reasons. More "unfairness" weak sauce from the people who champion unfairness for a living.

 

[The Z Machine]

The GOP whines about fairness about as much as my 8 year old twins. 

 

[Sand]

The GOP whines about fairness about as much as my 8 year old twins. 

By that standard we need Bill Cosby as a debate moderator.  

 

[Snotbubbles]

Begin with why the chairman of the RNC was rigging it against the GOP.

In one debate cycle, the Democratic candidate was furnished with questions prior to the debate.  In the next debate cycle, the Republican's and Democrats negotiated a list of debate topics and the selected moderator scrapped the topics and asked questions that were previously debated (I don't think it was a coincidence that those previous topics were favorable to the Democrats, like COVID) and did not ask questions on topics that were negotiated that were unfavorable to Democrats (like foreign policy).  This is where we see the bias questions.  You place the blame on the Commission (regardless of its composition) for failure to to act and modify debate rules to eliminate this bias.

 

[Amused to Death]

In one debate cycle, the Democratic candidate was furnished with questions prior to the debate. 

This happened during the primary before a town hall with Bernie Sanders. Does it have anything to do with the CPD?

 

[BladeRunner]

You should. WNBA is some of the best basketball to watch. A real team sport with solid fundamentals

Said no one ever. 

 

[2Squirrels1Nut]

Well yeah....tons.  You can go back to the Dixie Chicks.  You can look at how Romney, Cheney, Kinzinger have been treated.  You can go to parler.com (or any of those "conservative" sites you want to pick).  You can look at the events in Virginia.  If we are to believe the thread here on Trump's new site (never been there other than to see how hackable it is) it has a bunch of that sort of culture too.  I can give you multiple stories of people here showing up at houses of school board officials and a laundry list of books/publications that have been "banned".  My state alone has had over 200 different bannings of material.  

This kind of thing has gone on for generations with a myriad of different labels and it's not unique to one group over another.  Look passed the cute labels and it's rather obvious to see.

Off the top of my head 

NFL

Starbucks

Nike

Keurig

Their sin was/is fighting for equality.  With the exception of Starbucks who had the audicity of printing Happy Holidays on their cups so that their customers who practice other religions could be included. 

Then there's the NYT/Wash Post/AP/ABC/CBS/NBC/BBC/Aljeezera and every other legitimate news organization on the planet with the THOUSANDS of people employed there who are all working together to suppress the "real" news.   This is a mainstream Trump republican view.  It's unbelievable so many people can be tricked into believing that all of these people can keep this secret. Not to mention that they are competitors of each other fighting for shrinking advertising dollars. 

 

[ekbeats]

In order...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Kaepernick
https://miro.medium.com/max/1400/1*8XU3sY_mbNlSFoUz1vccKQ.jpeg
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/30/books/book-ban-us-schools.html

Alright, so the second one is a bit tongue in cheek. Cancel culture has existed forever, they just called it different things before. Shunning, blackballing, ostracizing, banishing, disowning, and probably a bunch more. Powerful people (regardless of political affiliation) are just annoyed that it's not only them choosing who is cancelled anymore. Yay democracy?

As for suppression of free speech and censorship, I mean...I'm pretty sure it was a conservative who blurred out Elvis' junk.

I don't disagree with Kaepernick.  That's a very good example of a Conservative cancel, so good job there.

The second one is not at all appropriate.  

The 3rd example involves the issuance of las and regulations about what children should and should not be exposed to.  I guess that is censorship, but it falls within the legal realm (ie - it's democratic and people vote on it) and is the type of regulation that is not only necessary, but has been around forever.  What I object to is a group of people that use nasty tactics to coerce a company into doing something just because they don't agree with a political idea that is held by many people.  You guys know what I'm talking about here.  And you also know that this really isn't a both sides issue.  Yes you can find select examples of it being done by Conservatives, but it is much more a Liberal phenomenon in today's day and age.  Even Liberals acknowledge it and are concerned by it.  

 

[the moops]

You should. WNBA is some of the best basketball to watch. A real team sport with solid fundamentals

Said no one ever. 

You should give it a try. May help you with your anger issues

 

[ekbeats]

Well yeah....tons.  You can go back to the Dixie Chicks.  You can look at how Romney, Cheney, Kinzinger have been treated.  You can go to parler.com (or any of those "conservative" sites you want to pick).  You can look at the events in Virginia.  If we are to believe the thread here on Trump's new site (never been there other than to see how hackable it is) it has a bunch of that sort of culture too.  I can give you multiple stories of people here showing up at houses of school board officials and a laundry list of books/publications that have been "banned".  My state alone has had over 200 different bannings of material.  

This kind of thing has gone on for generations with a myriad of different labels and it's not unique to one group over another.  Look passed the cute labels and it's rather obvious to see.

I would agree that in the past (10-30 years ago) censorship was more often perpetrated by Conservatives.  I'd even go further and say that in the 90's in particular, Conservative intolerance was so bad that it often led to violence (McVeigh, abortion clinic terrorism).  It's one of the reasons I was a proud Liberal back then.  But all that changed - dramatically - in the last 10 years.  Liberals are now much more intolerant and at times even fascistic with the way they treat Conservatives.  Cancel culture, intimidation, showing up at people's houses... It's not even close in scope.  But hey, if you see it differently that's cool.  Probably not worth debating if it is 50/50 or 80/20.  As long as we all agree it's crappy and that we should be more tolerant of opposing views them I'm good.  Problem is, we have a few Liberals in here who actually think it is good.

 

[ekbeats]

The GOP whines about fairness about as much as my 8 year old twins. 

Agree, it's annoying.  But it's also true.  The 2020 debates weren't remotely close to fair and even handed.  The Moderators became actively involved in debating against Trump.  It's funny, fairness and equal treatment should be something that people are capable of evaluating objectively through their own bias, but these days that's in short supply.  We actually have people in here who are convinced that the MSM doesn't have a Liberal bias.  So yeah, complaining, arguing and whining is a complete waste of time and energy.  We agree on that.

 

[BladeRunner]

You should give it a try. May help you with your anger issues

Anger issues?  Did the emoji with the tongue sticking out lead you to believe I had anger issues? 

Because if it did, then you either don't know emojis or you're trying to gaslight me.  Which one is it?

 

[The Commish]

I would agree that in the past (10-30 years ago) censorship was more often perpetrated by Conservatives.  I'd even go further and say that in the 90's in particular, Conservative intolerance was so bad that it often led to violence (McVeigh, abortion clinic terrorism).  It's one of the reasons I was a proud Liberal back then.  But all that changed - dramatically - in the last 10 years.  Liberals are now much more intolerant and at times even fascistic with the way they treat Conservatives.  Cancel culture, intimidation, showing up at people's houses... It's not even close in scope.  But hey, if you see it differently that's cool.  Probably not worth debating if it is 50/50 or 80/20.  As long as we all agree it's crappy and that we should be more tolerant of opposing views them I'm good.  Problem is, we have a few Liberals in here who actually think it is good.

Well....in my view, I don't care about it one way or the other.  I see 99% of what's labeled "wokism" etc as merely ideas being rejected in the market place of ideas.  I don't have a problem with that at all.  Problem is, people can't handle rejection like adults anymore so they mislabel things to make themselves feel better rather than having a personal "come to Jesus" moment that they might have actually gotten something wrong or hold a view contrary to the majority.  And, of course, it ebbs and flows.  I was merely pointing out the things we were saying didn't just apply to liberals.  Both "sides" do this sort of thing and do it often.

If, by some miracle, the country could get on the same page and have a standard definition for this stuff and then we took a look back through this country's history comparing the "sides", I'm rather confident it'd be pretty close to 50/50.  These groups aren't nearly as different as they like to believe.

 

[ekbeats]

Well....in my view, I don't care about it one way or the other.  I see 99% of what's labeled "wokism" etc as merely ideas being rejected in the market place of ideas.  I don't have a problem with that at all.  Problem is, people can't handle rejection like adults anymore so they mislabel things to make themselves feel better rather than having a personal "come to Jesus" moment that they might have actually gotten something wrong or hold a view contrary to the majority.  And, of course, it ebbs and flows.  I was merely pointing out the things we were saying didn't just apply to liberals.  Both "sides" do this sort of thing and do it often.

If, by some miracle, the country could get on the same page and have a standard definition for this stuff and then we took a look back through this country's history comparing the "sides", I'm rather confident it'd be pretty close to 50/50.  These groups aren't nearly as different as they like to believe.

Being rejected in the marketplace of ideas? That’s not at all what’s happening. What’s happening today is that colleges, the media, and certain liberal companies are rejecting things that are often times reasonable and very much in the main stream of conservative thought.   And it’s the way things are being rejected and canceled. Small groups of radical elements are launching coordinated attacks on companies and bullying them into submission.  Many times it’s sheer coercion and intimidation. The fact you can’t see that trend is very troubling.

 

[Amused to Death]

Off the top of my head 

NFL

Starbucks

Nike

Keurig

Disney.

I wonder how many of the people boycotting Disney watched the NBA playoffs on ESPN tonight.

 

[The Commish]

Being rejected in the marketplace of ideas? That’s not at all what’s happening. What’s happening today is that colleges, the media, and certain liberal companies are rejecting things that are often times reasonable and very much in the main stream of conservative thought.   And it’s the way things are being rejected and canceled. Small groups of radical elements are launching coordinated attacks on companies and bullying them into submission.  Many times it’s sheer coercion and intimidation. The fact you can’t see that trend is very troubling.

Again....I'm not saying these things aren't happening.  What I am saying is they aren't happening nearly as much as people want to believe.  People intentionally conflate them in a effort to avoid admitting to themselves that their idea was wrong.  For example, when people claim they are being "censored" because they say hydroxychloroquine is helpful in battling COVID, that's completely inaccurate.  They are being rejected because their position is simply wrong by just about any/every measure you could come up with.

To the bold, I don't know why one would feel it troubling.  As "conservatives" sprint to the fringe, it stands to reason that anyone running in the opposite direction or even just standing still would increase scrutiny and question the reasonableness of that thought.  I will agree that companies have given WAY too much power to what they perceive as squeaky wheels.  That seems to have changed drastically in the last decade.  

 

[ekbeats]

Again....I'm not saying these things aren't happening.  What I am saying is they aren't happening nearly as much as people want to believe.  People intentionally conflate them in a effort to avoid admitting to themselves that their idea was wrong.  For example, when people claim they are being "censored" because they say hydroxychloroquine is helpful in battling COVID, that's completely inaccurate.  They are being rejected because their position is simply wrong by just about any/every measure you could come up with.

To the bold, I don't know why one would feel it troubling.  As "conservatives" sprint to the fringe, it stands to reason that anyone running in the opposite direction or even just standing still would increase scrutiny and question the reasonableness of that thought.  I will agree that companies have given WAY too much power to what they perceive as squeaky wheels.  That seems to have changed drastically in the last decade.  

Dude - I have a list of over 1,000 such incidents, and that's just the high profile issues that have been published.  I posted it about a year ago and ended up getting suspended because some people on here got butt-hurt about its length, even though they specifically asked for it.  So no, I don't agree at all with the bolded because the facts don't support it.

 

[BladeRunner]

Dude - I have a list of over 1,000 such incidents, and that's just the high profile issues that have been published.  I posted it about a year ago and ended up getting suspended because some people on here got butt-hurt about its length, even though they specifically asked for it.  So no, I don't agree at all with the bolded because the facts don't support it.

The problem is those on the left look at each incident as ONE incident and never tie any of them together.  So, to them, it's only "one or a few" incidents.  When you step back like you, I and others do you not only see that it's many more than just the "anecdotal" evidence those on the left like to say it is, but also evidence of a larger and increasing pattern.  If they admit that there is truth to what we are saying, then that means they were wrong and THAT is the problem. 

It is plain as day if you're willing to open your eyes.

 

[ren hoek]

Bring back The League of Women Voters!

Seriously 

These debates are a joke and both parties are the same 

 

[The Commish]

Dude - I have a list of over 1,000 such incidents, and that's just the high profile issues that have been published.  I posted it about a year ago and ended up getting suspended because some people on here got butt-hurt about its length, even though they specifically asked for it.  So no, I don't agree at all with the bolded because the facts don't support it.

Of course they do.  You're trying to tell me that a list of the calibur you provided can't be done against "the right"?  If anyone had the energy and dedication to do this sort of thing in that context, you'd likely not have to go beyond the dates of Obama's first term to have a equally valid list.  You look at the history of this country and it's relatively easy to show these "incidents" and how evenly they are spread between the "sides".  To your list, there were some legit issues in it no question.  Not all the "examples" were of equal merit and many of them fell exactly into that category I was referring to as not actual censorship but rather people whining that their idea got rejected en masse.  Even if we concede your list is 100% spot on, there are MILLIONS more claims out there of something similar that you would reject from your list.  That's my point.  Claims vs legitimacy in grievance isn't close.