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QB Trey Lance, DAL (1 Viewer)

cloppbeast said:
Do you have to fill every thread with your nonsense? Dude almost threw two interceptions, in fact the dbs had their hands on the ball on two different occasions, yet you say "it's patently false he didn't make any bad decisions or bad throws". 

Look, I like Lance and think he'll be good. But why do you have to continue with this outrageousness all day long @Hot Sauce Guy?
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Personal attacks are frowned upon in the rules here. I just reported you and I am putting you on ignore.👍🏼

 
I counted 4 bad throws and 2 of them should have been intercepted.  

The kid definitely has some things to work on moving forward with these bad throws and pocket awareness.  I think the pocket awareness will come with time.  Hopefully he can figure out the passing windows are smaller in this league.

 
Trey Lance has amazing potential and a lot of people are going to see the highlights and think he should be starting right now. But he is still pretty unpolished and I don't think a team that wants to win a SB this year is ready to turn it over to him. Jimmy G is still the boring, safer option for a team that has a great defense and wants to run the ball a ton. 

 
Wise Old Owl said:
Trey Lance has amazing potential and a lot of people are going to see the highlights and think he should be starting right now. But he is still pretty unpolished and I don't think a team that wants to win a SB this year is ready to turn it over to him. Jimmy G is still the boring, safer option for a team that has a great defense and wants to run the ball a ton. 
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On the flip side of this, starting games might polish him up in a hurry. :shrug:  

 
Wise Old Owl said:
Maybe, I just think they are going to give Garoppolo a chance. If he struggles we could see Lance quickly, but I don't think they make the switch without Jimmy forcing their hand. 
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I agree - I’ve been #TeamGaroppolo forever. My hope is they start JimmyG and he shows well enough to build trade value.

i’ve said that here since Lance was drafted.

But Lance, warts and all, looks like he’s capable of taking the job. Whether it’s game 1 or game 8, I believe it will happen. He’s an electric player with a big arm. As someone else pointed out, on more than one occasion he was using his legs to buy time, and if he were give free range, he could have taken off running for easy 10+ yard pickups.

He’s already making multiple reads and he throws with more touch than JimmyG has on passes to the outside. 

And obviously y’all saw the 80 yard TD on a gorgeous pass. 

It’s apparent the tools are there. Like Thanos, Lance starting at some point this year feels inevitable. 

 
jtd13 said:
I think they should play him.and let him take his lumps. If it results in 10 losses, so be it. It's an investment.

Signed,

Dolphins fans
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i mean, if Tua can start, and Fields, and Lawrence & Wilson, I don’t see why Lance couldn’t. 
 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
i mean, if Tua can start, and Fields, and Lawrence & Wilson, I don’t see why Lance couldn’t. 
 
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The big difference is that the jags and jets don't think (or shouldn't think) they can win a SB this year. SF was just there with Jimmy, if they think they can get back there with Garoppolo, they are going to try to run that back.

It's similar to when the Ravens played Flacco for far too long. They wanted to give the old guy one last chance at getting back to high level form before they switched to the new era. I'm not sure it was the correct call, but I understand why they did it. 

 
Wise Old Owl said:
The big difference is that the jags and jets don't think (or shouldn't think) they can win a SB this year. SF was just there with Jimmy, if they think they can get back there with Garoppolo, they are going to try to run that back.

It's similar to when the Ravens played Flacco for far too long. They wanted to give the old guy one last chance at getting back to high level form before they switched to the new era. I'm not sure it was the correct call, but I understand why they did it. 
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They were there 2 years ago with Jimmy 

And in 4 seasons. Jimmy has delivered one winning record. Just to keep it real, he’s played 6, 3, 16, and 6 games.

Let’s not pretend he’s been great or reliable, because honestly he’s been neither. 

If we were talking about a dude who’d missed 1-2 games the last 4 years, sure - I’m with that mentality. But we aren’t. He’s been injured and at times ineffective. When he plays he’s been more game manager than difference maker.

The competition shouldn’t be as distant as people assume. Lance is breathing down his neck, IMO. 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
They were there 2 years ago with Jimmy 

And in 4 seasons. Jimmy has delivered one winning record. Just to keep it real, he’s played 6, 3, 16, and 6 games.

Let’s not pretend he’s been great or reliable, because honestly he’s been neither. 

If we were talking about a dude who’d missed 1-2 games the last 4 years, sure - I’m with that mentality. But we aren’t. He’s been injured and at times ineffective. When he plays he’s been more game manager than difference maker.

The competition shouldn’t be as distant as people assume. Lance is breathing down his neck, IMO.
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As a wise old owl once said, the 49ers think they can win a SB...   Lance doesn't have a great deal of experience - even at the college level.  I suspect it could be bad for Trey personally and the 49ers as a team to throw him in the mix too soon.  Obviously, things could change as the season progresses but I'd have Lance carry a clipboard.

 
Lance's value may never be lower...the last boxscore was a gift from the fantasy gods if you are a believer in Lance.

 
Futeki said:
Die?

I'd rather delay the inevitable until it becomes more palatable.
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:lmao:

The quote is meant to help with the process of decision-making.

If you know you plan on breaking up with someone, don't wait, do it now. Hate your job and want to eventually leave? Start looking for a new one now, not "the start of next year". Draft a top 3 QB and to eventually replace your current QB? Just do it now.

 
Summer Wheat said:
Lance will eventually be a good QB but is very raw.  I expect some big plays as well as big tunrovers this season when he plays.
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Reading the tea leaves a bit, Shanahan probably feels similarly and doesn't want to put him in there until he feels that Lance can minimize mistakes. And as long as Jimmy G is capably guiding the offense.

 
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tombonneau said:
:lmao:

The quote is meant to help with the process of decision-making.

If you know you plan on breaking up with someone, don't wait, do it now. Hate your job and want to eventually leave? Start looking for a new one now, not "the start of next year". Draft a top 3 QB and to eventually replace your current QB? Just do it now.
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There's also a risk of ruining a QB if he's thrown in before he's ready (David Carr etc.) Not that I'm saying that applies in this situation, but there's a potential negative effect from throwing someone into the game who's clearly not there yet. 

 
tombonneau said:
:lmao:

The quote is meant to help with the process of decision-making.

If you know you plan on breaking up with someone, don't wait, do it now. Hate your job and want to eventually leave? Start looking for a new one now, not "the start of next year". Draft a top 3 QB and to eventually replace your current QB? Just do it now.
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I could see waiting til your lease is up to break up with the gf, save some money.

 
foxco said:
There's also a risk of ruining a QB if he's thrown in before he's ready (David Carr etc.) Not that I'm saying that applies in this situation, but there's a potential negative effect from throwing someone into the game who's clearly not there yet. 
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I tend to lean toward what you are saying being true, but there's a reasonable argument on the other side that QBs who have it will take some lumps and grow. And those that don't will be ruined. You just speed up the process for both by playing them from go. Hard (impossible?) to prove either case definitively.

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
They were there 2 years ago with Jimmy 

And in 4 seasons. Jimmy has delivered one winning record. Just to keep it real, he’s played 6, 3, 16, and 6 games.

Let’s not pretend he’s been great or reliable, because honestly he’s been neither. 

If we were talking about a dude who’d missed 1-2 games the last 4 years, sure - I’m with that mentality. But we aren’t. He’s been injured and at times ineffective. When he plays he’s been more game manager than difference maker.

The competition shouldn’t be as distant as people assume. Lance is breathing down his neck, IMO. 
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Eh, I don't think he's been as bad (when healthy at least) as you are making out. And sometimes having a guy drafted to replace you can light a fire you didn't know existed - I recall Brees/Rivers having this dynamic (not saying I think Jimmy = Brees, just similar in this regard).

Unless Lance plays absolutely lights out, I'd think it makes more sense to give Jimmy one more shot. Maybe he surprises and you end up with a very tradeable asset. If he flops or breaks down, then bring Lance in then, hopefully with a bit less pressure having already seen a number of NFL games from the bench, and without feeling like he needs to outperform Jimmy, at least compared to the pressure to do that by starting on opening day.

 
Jimmy’s problem is his lack of anticipation, much in the same ilk of an Alex Smith. He needs more time to process before he lets it go and that split second is often the difference of a completion and an incompletion. This is something that can’t be taught unfortunately, it’s an instinct and feeling thing that you either have or not.

While having both qbs is a good problem to have, I will reel back on rushing Trey to start day one. Stay the course and let Jimmy start the first quarter of the season and reassess. No harm in this thinking unless we are losing games. 
 

Trey turned 21 in may, so he’s a real green 21. With lack of live competition the last year, it might very well best suit him to soak up the game and observe the speed of the game from the sidelines. But I absolutely believe he’s ready. They know he can improvise, run around and make plays - they don’t need opposing teams seeing that right now. I think there was a concerted effort to having him “play in a box” and develop the timing and pocket awareness that he needs to develop at this level. Work on your weaknesses. Shanahan is absolutely being coy and suppressing Trey’s full arsenal.

If you’re armchair quarterbacking and looking only at the box score in what is by design, then I think those will be sorely burned as Trey Lance is the best quarterback in this draft, hands down. If you don’t see it, watch the tape, tape don’t lie. What he has over all the other guys is aptitude, being able to learn at a higher frequency than others. That’s why we are enamored with his ceiling. It’s high as hell.

 
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Let's not forget, although dreamily handsome, Jimmy has only won 68% of his games for SanFran. He's lost almost 1/3 of his games. The proven joke of an mma fighter Conner McGregor even wins more often.

And you don't even want to know the 49ers record when Jimmy boy doesn't play. 

Frankly it's ridiculous we're talking about this, in fact. He couldn't even win a championship against 2nd year starter Patrick Mahomes of all people, with a 4th quarter lead. And it's not like coach shanahan has a history of blowing super bowl advantages or anything. 

Now before you say something stupid like, 'hey, the quarterback isn't the only guy on the team or whatever, so it's not all Jim's fault' consider the stats. In his only full season Jimmy didnt even throw for more yards than Jameis Winston and could only beat Aaron Rodgers by a single td pass. 8.2 ypa? Give me a break, the single season record is 8.9.

JG apologists around here aren't thinking rational about this.

 
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LawFitz said:
Eh, I don't think he's been as bad (when healthy at least) as you are making out. And sometimes having a guy drafted to replace you can light a fire you didn't know existed - I recall Brees/Rivers having this dynamic (not saying I think Jimmy = Brees, just similar in this regard).
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never said he was bad.

I said he was a game manager. And it’s exactly what he’s been, for the 2 seasons worth of games he’s managed to play in 4 seasons. 

I don’t disagree that competition is a good motivator. But JimmyG is no Brees nor Rivers. His ceiling is 70% of those guys. And that’s the problem. If he’s “good Jimmy”, he can get you there. But he won’t drive the car. He’ll be a passenger. 

LawFitz said:
Unless Lance plays absolutely lights out, I'd think it makes more sense to give Jimmy one more shot. Maybe he surprises and you end up with a very tradeable asset. If he flops or breaks down, then bring Lance in then, hopefully with a bit less pressure having already seen a number of NFL games from the bench, and without feeling like he needs to outperform Jimmy, at least compared to the pressure to do that by starting on opening day.
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I’m a “chips fall where they may” guy myself. If JimmyG starts, I’ll hope he doesn’t suck so that he can build his trade value.

Of JimmyG stumbles, I’m virtually certain that Lance can step into that starting offense and drive it like he stole it. He passes my eye-test.

it’s not about whether JimmyG is bad. It’s that Lance is in all likelihood better. 

 
Teezee said:
If you’re armchair quarterbacking and looking only at the box score in what is by design, then I think those will be sorely burned as Trey Lance is the best quarterback in this draft, hands down. If you don’t see it, watch the tape, tape don’t lie. What he has over all the other guys is aptitude, being able to learn at a higher frequency than others. That’s why we are enamored with his ceiling. It’s high as hell.
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Sometimes you can just tell. Lance is the truth. I’m sold.

Game 1, game 4, game 8 a Lance is inevitable. He’ll force the issue. 

 
cloppbeast said:
Let's not forget, although dreamily handsome, Jimmy has only won 68% of his games for SanFran. He's lost almost 1/3 of his games. The proven joke of an mma fighter Conner McGregor even wins more often.

And you don't even want to know the 49ers record when Jimmy boy doesn't play. 

Frankly it's ridiculous we're talking about this, in fact. He couldn't even win a championship against 2nd year starter Patrick Mahomes of all people, with a 4th quarter lead. And it's not like coach shanahan has a history of blowing super bowl advantages or anything. 

Now before you say something stupid like, 'hey, the quarterback isn't the only guy on the team or whatever, so it's not all Jim's fault' consider the stats. In his only full season Jimmy didnt even throw for more yards than Jameis Winston and could only beat Aaron Rodgers by a single td pass. 8.2 ypt? Give me a break, the single season record is 8.9.

JG apologists around here aren't thinking rational about this.
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I’ve long been a JimmyG apologist and I’ll plant my flag. Lance is the truth. 

And while I’m not often a “look What they spent to get him!” guy, I have to point out - hey look what they spent to get him.

Add a coach like Shanny to the mix and holy shirtballs that’s a combination for success.

Thanos will play. He’s inevitable. 

 
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Hot Sauce Guy said:
I’ve long been a JimmyG apologist and I’ll plant my flag. Lance is the truth. 

And while I’m not often a “look What they spent to get him!” guy, I have to point out - hey look what they spent to get him.

Add a coach like Shanny to the mix and holy shirtballs that’s a combination for success.

Thanos will play. He’s inevitable. 
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The decision makers have tied their future to Lance. But that doesn’t mean they rush him out there before they’re confident he’s ready to play. 
I have Lance in a super flex where I really need him to start but I’m not expecting him to play until after their bye week. 

 
-OZ- said:
The decision makers have tied their future to Lance. But that doesn’t mean they rush him out there before they’re confident he’s ready to play. 
I have Lance in a super flex where I really need him to start but I’m not expecting him to play until after their bye week. 
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Oh, I’ve said a few times it is unlikely it’s week 1. I think I said by week 8. 

Still…inevitable. I envy your share & wish I had one. 

 
Good to see Lance bounce back from a rough early start and do well but not too well. At this point, can’t imagine he’ll be starting for a bit and maybe non-sharks will let him slip a bit in drafts.

 
I wasn't impressed with any of it.  Hoping Garapollo gets the nod for this season so we can use the playmakers on this team.

 
Just watched the “highlights”. It was a hot mess, but Lance still looked better than “high & outside” JimmyG. 

Didn’t clear anything up & the only takeaway is the Niners defense is legit. 

 
matuski said:
I wasn't impressed with any of it.  Hoping Garapollo gets the nod for this season so we can use the playmakers on this team.
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I'm not seeing it either.  Will be interesting to see how he progresses through the years (or not).

 
For those that say they aren't seeing it, you do realize that the 49ers aren't showing any of what is his possible best attribute correct? I am in the camp that he should start week 1 as I don't think he is any more mistake prone than Jimmy is. If Jimmy was a good game manager and didn't turn the ball over it would be a different story but he is not. There really isn't anything that Jimmy does better than Trey IMO. 

 
tvaldivi said:
For those that say they aren't seeing it, you do realize that the 49ers aren't showing any of what is his possible best attribute correct? I am in the camp that he should start week 1 as I don't think he is any more mistake prone than Jimmy is. If Jimmy was a good game manager and didn't turn the ball over it would be a different story but he is not. There really isn't anything that Jimmy does better than Trey IMO. 
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Jimmy's better looking.

 
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