guitarmonkiy
Footballguy
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Peyton Manning (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter guitarmonkiy
- Start date
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Easy and predictable call
to Manning
to Manningguitarmonkiy
Footballguy
He's the first with three, correct?
Jason Wood
Zoo York
Nope, he ties that scrub guy who ruined New York's season this year. Some dude named Favre.
guitarmonkiy
Footballguy
Sorry, brainfart. Was thinking Favre had 2 for some reason. New Year's Eve alcohol still affecting the brain.Nope, he ties that scrub guy who ruined New York's season this year. Some dude named Favre.
Tau837
Footballguy
In addition to Manning and Favre, Jim Brown and Johnny Unitas each also won the AP NFL MVP award 3 times.
And the AP award began in 1957. Before that, the UPI NFL MVP award was the only NFL MVP award from 1948 to 1956 (though they did not actually award it in 1949, 1950, and 1952 for some reason). Otto Graham won 3 UPI NFL MVP awards over that span.
Of course, when Graham, Brown, and Unitas won their awards, there was a lot less competition, since there were many fewer teams in the league.
And the AP award began in 1957. Before that, the UPI NFL MVP award was the only NFL MVP award from 1948 to 1956 (though they did not actually award it in 1949, 1950, and 1952 for some reason). Otto Graham won 3 UPI NFL MVP awards over that span.
Of course, when Graham, Brown, and Unitas won their awards, there was a lot less competition, since there were many fewer teams in the league.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Here is how the voting went:
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
Peyton Manning 32
Michael Turner 4
Chad Pennington 4
James Harrison 3
Adrian Peterson 3
Philip Rivers 2
Kurt Warner 1
Chris Johnson 1
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ChrisCooleyFan
Footballguy
Why did he win the MVP? I think Westbrook, or Brees.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
You don't really man that. If he ever deserved an MVP, this was the year.
Captain Spaulding
Footballguy
Brees isn't on there because you've got to be amongst the top NFL teams to get the award.
Honestly though, I think the Colts mid/late season success is more directly linked to the return of Bob Sanders than Peyton doing his usual thing but what Sanders contributes on the field is more difficult to measure with statistics. He just makes plays when plays need to be made.
Honestly though, I think the Colts mid/late season success is more directly linked to the return of Bob Sanders than Peyton doing his usual thing but what Sanders contributes on the field is more difficult to measure with statistics. He just makes plays when plays need to be made.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
In 2006 I would agree with you, but Sanders has missed more time than you know, and when he did play he hasn't made that big of a difference this year.
RockHard
Footballguy
I agree, why is he any more deserving than Rivers?
guitarmonkiy
Footballguy
What do you guys think about Chad tying for second in the voting? I know it's a null point because Peyton won in a landslide, but does he deserve this much recognition? I realize he was great as a game manager and all but didn't the defense play a large part in their turnaround as well? I don't follow the Dolphins at all so I don't know much about how deserving he is, just curious.
The team threw alot more than you'd realize based on personnel. They actually seemed to get away from pounding the ball, and even the whole wildcat thing in favor of letting Pennington make plays with his arm. He actually threw for a career high in yardage, and posted the 2nd best passer rating of his career. Also, you consider his team was 1-15 a year ago, and now they're in the playoffs, and he's definitely a major factor in that. It's not completely undeserved he got that many votes.I know Warner had 2 bad games, and at the wrong time, but I was surprised he didn't do better in the voting. 4500 Yards and 30 TDs, while leading a Cardinals team that wasn't exactly a playoff regular back to the post season was worth more recognition IMO.
That's not to take anything away from Peyton. The Cardinals started well and finished so/so, the Colts had the uphill climb to deal with, and one of the best teams in football in their division. The Cardinals had a few of the worst. The Cardinals didn't have a great running attack, but the two teams finished 31st and 32nd in the league in rushing. Props and congratulations to Peyton for an amazing finish to the season.
Michael Fox Fan
Footballguy
If people really think this was the best option, then the NFL was devoid of stars this year. In any normal year, Manning wouldn't have been considered.
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting wenteyton Manning 32Michael Turner 4Chad Pennington 4James Harrison 3Adrian Peterson 3Philip Rivers 2Kurt Warner 1Chris Johnson 1
Moe Green
Footballguy
Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting went
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting went
Jason Wood
Zoo York
This gets back to debating who you think SHOULD win the MVP versus acknowledging as fans what players usually DO win. I can understand arguing that Manning didn't have the best year, but the AP MVP award almost always goes to a top player [usually QB] on one of the top offenses on one of the best teams. Is that fair since it's an individual award? Probably not, but it's always been that way. The Chargers were a sub-.500 team until the last game of the year, a QB from that kind of team has no shot at winning the MVP award.
1) The MVP award isn't a reward for star power2) Peyton Manning is about as big a star as the NFL has [name another guy with his endorsement deals]3) Manning was one of the best QBs on one of the best teams in the league, of course he would be considered every year. The only QBs that were on part with him played for 2nd tier or non-contending teams [Rivers included], what's the surprise here?
Statistically?Consider, Rivers team is 8-8, in the AFC West. Peyton's is 12-4--in the AFC South. That says alot.I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting went
AnonymousBob
Footballguy
He deserved it this season.
Rivers, Pennington and a couple of other players were also deserving but I can't understand why people believe Manning didn't earn it this year.
Rivers, Pennington and a couple of other players were also deserving but I can't understand why people believe Manning didn't earn it this year.
GroveDiesel
Footballguy
I can't believe that Chris Johnson got a vote. Guy had a great rookie season and was an exciting player on a great team, but he's not even close to being an MVP candidate. Heck, the defensive line deserved a vote more than Johnson.
Tau837
Footballguy
Posted this a few days ago:Statistically?Consider, Rivers team is 8-8, in the AFC West. Peyton's is 12-4--in the AFC South. That says alot.I agree that Peyton Manning is a better player than Philip Rivers. But Rivers had a better season in 2008 than Peyton Manning did. Period.Please. Go find a codepink rally.At least two voters were able to see past the ESPN highlight reels and vote for the player who had the best year and led his team to the playoffs almost singlehandedly....Here is how the voting went
twitch
Footballguy
Manning would have gotten my vote. He was a worthy candidate. But if Im a Philip Rivers fan, Im a little p'd. All the guy did was keep that team afloat and have a spectacular season. And he got TWO votes and no invite to the Pro Bowl ??! No respect whatsoever. He'll get his chance tomorrow to make a fitting statement.
bryhamm
Footballguy
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
I thought Pennington's MVP chances were overrated, so the fact that he got any votes, to me, seems a little crazy, but a lot of people were on his bandwagon and ready to give him most of the credit for the Dolphins turnaround, so I was not at all surprised that he got a few votes.
How was this not a normal year? More to the point, what is a normal NFL year?
Kleck
Footballguy
Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Favre split one of his with Sanders...Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.
Kleck
Footballguy
How could I forget Sanders 1997 season? Good catch, it's tied at 2.5.Favre split one of his with Sanders...Manning split the one with McNair so it's really like 2.5.
Mario Kart
Footballguy
Manning:
4th in completions
5th in attempts
3rd in percentage
6th in passing yards
8th in yards per game
5th in touchdowns
4th in 1st downs
5th in passer rating
The media darling wins another won. No good reason Manning wins this. No division title so the Brees naysayers have nothing to say about not winning the division. Stat wise Manning should not have won.
4th in completions
5th in attempts
3rd in percentage
6th in passing yards
8th in yards per game
5th in touchdowns
4th in 1st downs
5th in passer rating
The media darling wins another won. No good reason Manning wins this. No division title so the Brees naysayers have nothing to say about not winning the division. Stat wise Manning should not have won.
big_donkey
Footballguy
I agree. The person that voted for Johnson should not be allowed to vote again, EVER.
gonzobill5
Footballguy
Love Manning, can't stand Rivers, but I can't see how any of those claims in bold don't fit Phillip Rivers. Top player? check. QB? check. Top offense? check. Top team? check. (hey, they won their division and have just about as good a shot at the super bowl as Peyton's team does!)
Mr. Mojo
Footballguy
I thought Pennington being tied for second was ridiculous. That team won without individual stars.Warner, Brees or Turner should have been higher.
I am a season ticket holder for the Chargers and for the life of me - why is everyone so high on Rivers? They backed into the playoffs - if it weren't for a total collapse by Denver this team would be on the golf course right now. They barely finished .500 in what is probably the worst division in football. (NFC West might have a say way in that)
The Chargers went into this season with what was supposed to be the best young team in the NFL and Rivers failed to get them wins against powder puff opponents.
I have respect for Manning and for sure the right guy won the award. The only thing Rivers could complain about is missing the pro bowl.
Tomorrow though, I think we could see two very unlikely teams start very unlikely marches toward the Superbowl. Look out - Chargers / Arizona SB!
Everyone says it has been a weird season - well Chargers / Cardinals SB would be fitting.
The Chargers went into this season with what was supposed to be the best young team in the NFL and Rivers failed to get them wins against powder puff opponents.
I have respect for Manning and for sure the right guy won the award. The only thing Rivers could complain about is missing the pro bowl.
Tomorrow though, I think we could see two very unlikely teams start very unlikely marches toward the Superbowl. Look out - Chargers / Arizona SB!
Everyone says it has been a weird season - well Chargers / Cardinals SB would be fitting.
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gonzobill5
Footballguy
They are top 12 and no one can argue that. Put it another way - take the 34 writers who voted for either manning or rivers, and ask them who's going to win this weekend. You think 32 pick the colts? So, if all else is even (and it isn't), and it just comes down to who is on a better team (which it shouldn't) I'm not certain these guys picked the right one.
gonzobill5
Footballguy
Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.
gonzobill5
Footballguy
Since the bye week they haven't lost to a single non-playoff team. Here's a list of teams with a better record
NE*
NYJ*
Chi
TB*
*SD beat these teams in the regular season
NE*
NYJ*
Chi
TB*
*SD beat these teams in the regular season
gonzobill5
Footballguy
Actually, that is the definition I would go by, since the top 12 make the playoffs. What's your criteria?Who's "equal" is a better question. And furthermore... when you say you are a 'top team', that never means #12.Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.Not in '08 anyhow.
A 'top team' is a handfull of representatives. SD is a borderline playoff team on the right side of the border.
I think both of your statements above are true, if you say specifically that Rivers had a better season statistically. Manning was not a stat monster this year, there is no question about it, but the guy had no pre-season and was clearly far from the normal Peyton Manning during that first month of so of the season. He still somehow kept that team afloat. I am not sure that what he did under the circumstances is not a more impressive season that Rivers even given the stats, but obviously it is a highly subjective thing (which the stats are not).
JohnnyU
Footballguy
It will all be clear after tomorrow night.
Chicago Hooligan
Footballguy
This is like Steely Dan winning Album of the Year. I defy anyone to feel strongly about it.
gonzobill5
Footballguy
They made the playoffs & won their division what more do you want? Is it really necessary to look beyond these facts when the whole point in the argument revolves around deciding an MVP - not who is truly the best team. Should we compare where the colts and chargers offenses and defenses rank leaguewide? Should we compare common opponents or SOS? Should we compare the 08 Chargers to the teams of previous MVP candidates? If I had the vote, I wouldn't have cast it for Rivers. But given the criterion posted previously, there is NO reason that he should have been crossed off the list.Bro... bill5... the #16/17 teams are the very definition of average/mediocre in the NFL.SD sits at #12. They are much closer to mediocre then to being the top team in the regular season.... for the purposes of the MVP award. Im not saying anything in regards to winning the Lombardi, they certainly at least have a chance. But as far the regular season MVP award, no. Their record/finish in the regular season does NOT equal a "top team" and does not add anything to Rivers MVP merit. His stats do, though.Actually, that is the definition I would go by, since the top 12 make the playoffs. What's your criteria?Who's "equal" is a better question. And furthermore... when you say you are a 'top team', that never means #12.Who's better that isn't in the playoffs?I can. They may be one of the 12 playoff teams, but that doesnt make them top 12.Just as if Denver had made the playoffs at 8-8, they wouldnt be top 12, they would just be one of the 12 playoff teams. They certainly were NOT a 'top team' when it came to discussing MVP merit. No way, no how. He gets merit for them being playoff team, thats about it on that scale.They are top 12 and no one can argue that.Not in '08 anyhow.
A 'top team' is a handfull of representatives. SD is a borderline playoff team on the right side of the border.
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