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Mortgage Rates (1 Viewer)

Don't Noonan said:
Not sure I follow you here so let's keep it simple.  Back in my day as a mortgage broker when I processed a refinance for a customer I charged 1%.  So for a $400,000 loan I made $4,000.  I had a buddy that always charged 2% and I thought that was crazy high.  He would charge 1% origination fee and then collect 1% from the lender (basically he hiked the rate up so he got paid under the table from the lender).  Are you saying that making 1.5% on a $400k loan is low to you??  That is $6,000.
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Keeping it simple = 1.5% is a low comp. 

To help put it in perspective. Retail routinely has a spread of 300 or more bps. I get offers of recruitment where they try to get me to move because they can charge more on government backed loans than I could if I wanted to. We are talking 400 bps spread. 

 
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Chadstroma said:
Keeping it simple = 1.5% is a low comp. 

To help put it in perspective. Retail routinely has a spread of 300 or more bps. I get offers of recruitment where they try to get me to move because they can charge more on government backed loans than I could if I wanted to. We are talking 400 bps spread. 
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Wow.  That seems crazy high to me.  Thanks

 
Chadstroma said:
Ask him about lender credits. 

I think this is one of those cases that your knowledge from before is tripping you up. You and the broker aren't talking about the same thing most likely. 
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I talked to him about lender credits.  For example, he quoted me 3.5% on a 30 year fixed cash out paying half a point.  He explained that he was taking some lender credit for comp in that scenario so he gets paid 1.5% net.

Look, I was in the business before and and there isn't much more work for a $460k loan and a $200k loan.  However if you are charging 1.5% on one loan you are getting paid almost $7k and the other $3k.  It seems with a larger loan going down to 1% makes sense.

 
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Don't Noonan said:
I talked to him about lender credits.  For example, he quoted me 3.5% on a 30 year fixed cash out paying half a point.  He explained that he was taking some lender credit for comp in that scenario so he gets paid 1.5% net.
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What state are you in? There are numerous factors to say whether that is a good quote or not but from what I know... it doesn't sound competitive to me. Send me a PM with your state, value, amount owed, cash out, credit score and zip code. Also, let me know the company you got that from (often times people think they are dealing with a broker and they are not). I can connect you to someone to shop against it. 

 
Chadstroma said:
What state are you in? There are numerous factors to say whether that is a good quote or not but from what I know... it doesn't sound competitive to me. Send me a PM with your state, value, amount owed, cash out, credit score and zip code. Also, let me know the company you got that from (often times people think they are dealing with a broker and they are not). I can connect you to someone to shop against it. 
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I will send you a PM but the guy I am talking to is a referral from you in AZ.  NEXA Mortgage.

 
Don't Noonan said:
I will send you a PM but the guy I am talking to is a referral from you in AZ.  NEXA Mortgage.
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🤔🤣

Yea, send me the info. And I will run it through and see what I am seeing. Like I said, there are some factors that can make that good or bad quote. I have seen some big swings on cash outs from just an eighth higher to three quarters higher rates on different days.  

 
I just sent an email to my guy that Chadstroma hooked me up with last fall. I figure it's worth seeing if I can drop my rate low enough to make another refi make sense. Thanks again to Chad for this thread!

 
Finally made a breakthrough with our jumbo Refi after running into dead ends with Wells Fargo and BofA.

Chase stepped up to the plate with a 2.8 !!

 
Refinancing with a local credit union. Locked in at 3.125% for a 15/15 ARM product that they offer. The rate can fluctuate a full 6% at year 15,  but we're intending to take most of the payment reduction and putting it back into the current mortgage so there should be little balance left if we make it 15 years into the loan. We're at 4% now, so a sizeable reduction in interest. 

 
Dragons said:
Refinancing with a local credit union. Locked in at 3.125% for a 15/15 ARM product that they offer. The rate can fluctuate a full 6% at year 15,  but we're intending to take most of the payment reduction and putting it back into the current mortgage so there should be little balance left if we make it 15 years into the loan. We're at 4% now, so a sizeable reduction in interest. 
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I don't even know what a 15/15 ARM is. 

 
Dragons said:
15 year fixed, adjusts once at 15 years for the duration.

They also offer a 5/5 (5 years fixed, then fixed for every 5 years thereafter) and a 10/1 (10 years fixed, then adjusts yearly).
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Odd. Never seen that before. Your typical ARM is 5/1, 7/1, 10/1 etc. I don't even know what the purpose of a 15/15 is. Honestly, with rates as they are, unless you are confident you are moving out of the home in the time frame, I wouldn't mess with an ARM at all.  There are a ton of variables involved so no idea if 3.125% is a good or bad rate for you but I am able to get more than a few of my clients rates below 3 right now. I would shop yours around a bit for other options. Worst case, you spent a little time and effort to find out you got a great rate. Best, you save yourself more money. 

 
Chadstroma said:
Dragons said:
15 year fixed, adjusts once at 15 years for the duration.

They also offer a 5/5 (5 years fixed, then fixed for every 5 years thereafter) and a 10/1 (10 years fixed, then adjusts yearly).
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Odd. Never seen that before. Your typical ARM is 5/1, 7/1, 10/1 etc. I don't even know what the purpose of a 15/15 is
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Very weird. Although 15 years is about twice the legnth an average mortgage lasts, so it could just be a gimmick to gain share.

 
I got approved but I have to send a bunch of stuff again. One thing they want that I don’t have are my promissory notes for my mortgage and HELOC. (Just looked for them) I guess I need to call my current lenders to try to get them? Anyone else had to do this? I think I have everything else they asked for. 

 
NREC34 said:
I got approved but I have to send a bunch of stuff again. One thing they want that I don’t have are my promissory notes for my mortgage and HELOC. (Just looked for them) I guess I need to call my current lenders to try to get them? Anyone else had to do this? I think I have everything else they asked for. 
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That is standard. 

 
So who in here is doing cash out refi for 15 years in NJ and can get me under 3% without points?  Assume FBG level credit and under 70LTV.   Funny thing as I work for a bank and can't get good cash out rates from our in house, so outside I look.

 
The Big Guy said:
So who in here is doing cash out refi for 15 years in NJ and can get me under 3% without points?  Assume FBG level credit and under 70LTV.   Funny thing as I work for a bank and can't get good cash out rates from our in house, so outside I look.
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Cash out is ugly all around right now but us brokers have options. Not sure if they can get the under 3% but the 15 yr, high credit and low LTV might make it happen. 

And don't worry... I, my fellow brokers too, routinely do loans for bankers (one in process right now for a large bank mortgage loan officer). Reach out to me with a PM and your contact info, I can connect you to a broker in NJ. 

 
Big shoutout to @Chadstroma for helping me get financing for our new house. Knowledgeable dude and all around good guy. Highly recommend his services. We are now living the good life in one of the major covid hotspots thanks to him!  Lol. I kid (but not about living in a covid hotspot).
 

thanks Chad! Extra size package of balut on it’s way as a show of thanks (I kid again).  

 
My Chase jumbo story this week. 

3.25% no points 30 year fixed
3.125% half point 

Credit exceeds 800. 

Would require being designated as a pre-existing customer, which I'm not but dude said I could transfer some of my WF accounts over and that'd help.

JUST signed papers on $140k HELOC with WF so probably won't do anything for a while.

WF person said new mortgages are sub 3%, even 2.5%. Dayum.

 
snore said:
Big shoutout to @Chadstroma for helping me get financing for our new house. Knowledgeable dude and all around good guy. Highly recommend his services. We are now living the good life in one of the major covid hotspots thanks to him!  Lol. I kid (but not about living in a covid hotspot).
 

thanks Chad! Extra size package of balut on it’s way as a show of thanks (I kid again).  
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Two FBG closings today! That is a good Friday.

Glad to help out and get your mad dash south done. I love the message I got from your realtor "That's awesome and pretty sure an absolute first for me in 34 yrs of doing this. Don't get me wrong, I think the world of Snore too, but just curious how come? Are you guys tryin to get all my future business?" Kinda lets me know I am doing things right. 

Is the wife still giving you crazy looks for knowing the loan guy from FBG? 🤣

 
Sandeman said:
My Chase jumbo story this week. 

3.25% no points 30 year fixed
3.125% half point 

Credit exceeds 800. 

Would require being designated as a pre-existing customer, which I'm not but dude said I could transfer some of my WF accounts over and that'd help.

JUST signed papers on $140k HELOC with WF so probably won't do anything for a while.

WF person said new mortgages are sub 3%, even 2.5%. Dayum.
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And as a bonus you will soon have three extra bonus HELOCs with WF! I hear they love that kind of stuff! 

(Sorry, I can't control myself to poke fun of them)

 
Chadstroma said:
Odd. Never seen that before. Your typical ARM is 5/1, 7/1, 10/1 etc. I don't even know what the purpose of a 15/15 is. Honestly, with rates as they are, unless you are confident you are moving out of the home in the time frame, I wouldn't mess with an ARM at all.  There are a ton of variables involved so no idea if 3.125% is a good or bad rate for you but I am able to get more than a few of my clients rates below 3 right now. I would shop yours around a bit for other options. Worst case, you spent a little time and effort to find out you got a great rate. Best, you save yourself more money. 
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I shopped with the guy you sent me for CT, he was very helpful in February for guiding me in the right direction to refinance now, but his best no point rate was ~3.50% when this option came on to my radar.

This 15/15 is definitely a strange product. Their corresponding 30 year fixed rate is 3.25% (which I can switch to before closing). I might do that, but the extra 1/8 reduction may realistically cost me nothing. We are not planning to move before 15 years, but I also hope to have not much left on the loan at that point. Not sure if it's doable, but would love to retire in 12-15 years and will want the loan paid off, or near paid off by then. Their 15 year fixed is 2.75%, but it's not the right time for us to lock into the extra payment.

 
Dragons said:
I shopped with the guy you sent me for CT, he was very helpful in February for guiding me in the right direction to refinance now, but his best no point rate was ~3.50% when this option came on to my radar.

This 15/15 is definitely a strange product. Their corresponding 30 year fixed rate is 3.25% (which I can switch to before closing). I might do that, but the extra 1/8 reduction may realistically cost me nothing. We are not planning to move before 15 years, but I also hope to have not much left on the loan at that point. Not sure if it's doable, but would love to retire in 12-15 years and will want the loan paid off, or near paid off by then. Their 15 year fixed is 2.75%, but it's not the right time for us to lock into the extra payment.
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Rates are different from then and now. I would double check with him if Feb was the last time you talked. Worst case, you have even more peace of mind that it is the right move and best you get a better deal. 

 
Chadstroma said:
Two FBG closings today! That is a good Friday.

Glad to help out and get your mad dash south done. I love the message I got from your realtor "That's awesome and pretty sure an absolute first for me in 34 yrs of doing this. Don't get me wrong, I think the world of Snore too, but just curious how come? Are you guys tryin to get all my future business?" Kinda lets me know I am doing things right. 

Is the wife still giving you crazy looks for knowing the loan guy from FBG? 🤣
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I still haven’t quite come clean with her on how I know you. Seems like a losing proposition to tell her you’re a dude I know from a fantasy football website!

 
So planning to buy a home around October for the first time. Figured this will be a place to ask. What's do you guys use to determine in a realtor is good? Also, what is a sign that I should stay away from a realtor?

 
Charlie Harper said:
So planning to buy a home around October for the first time. Figured this will be a place to ask. What's do you guys use to determine in a realtor is good? Also, what is a sign that I should stay away from a realtor?
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From the "manifesto" last posted a couple of pages ago... 

#23: When picking a good realtor find out these things about them: A) Do they do this as a full time job or is it a side gig or something they do when they are bored etc. You want a full time realtor for the experience and focus. Trust me. The exception on this would be a semi-retired realtor but honestly, they are usually ones to pass on as well. You want someone who knows the market, is sharp on negotiation and has good contacts. B) How long have they been doing the job. Experience counts for sure. But I rather go with a rookie doing it full time than someone been doing it 10 years as a part time gig. C) What is their availability. You want someone that will be available on your time tables and not theirs. D) How many houses have they sold or closed on? It will give you an idea about how productive they are. But keep in mind, someone who isn't as productive might be hungrier and more flexible to you versus someone who is doing tons of volume. 

I would add to this their personality and focus. I hate jerks, self absorbed egotists and people who are not genuine and will avoid them. There seems to be a lot of these in that profession for some reason. You want to get an idea of whether they are going to expect to show you 5 houses and have you pick one or are willing to help you search. Now, you don't want to be the dingbat seeing 100 homes either but if you haven't found the right home on the first outing are they going to work for their commission or start pushing you. I wouldn't sign a exclusive contract either. If they are good then they will earn their commission. If they aren't you should be able to move to another that is working for you (but you don't want to drop someone that is putting in hard work for you either.... remember, this is their livelihood... they don't make money until you buy the home. If you change, change for a real good reason but you should be able to change if you feel the need). 

 
The Big Guy said:
So who in here is doing cash out refi for 15 years in NJ and can get me under 3% without points?  Assume FBG level credit and under 70LTV.   Funny thing as I work for a bank and can't get good cash out rates from our in house, so outside I look.
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I'm doing 4 refinance loans right now for a big mortgage broker in town and I expect that number to jump and this is fairly common for me.  And the people from this office do extremely well for themselves and they can probably close a loan a little faster then I can, just can't touch the rates.

And personally I'm on the other side when I do a loan meaning I have to go take a loan from an outside source like you did and at  take a considerably worse deal. Well I don't have to, but  if I did the loan through my bank it would be to much of an invasion of my privacy.

 
Closed on my refi with American Federal at my home yesterday.  2.875 30 year no cash out.  Low closing costs and around 30 days or so to close.

I imagine they may sell my loan but I really don’t care.  Overall pretty happy with the process and result.

Thanks Chad and others for advice along the way and good luck to all.

 
So....a couple of questions for the experts around here. Wife and I are considering a move to lake country in central Minnesota (Brainerd area) early next year - hinging on her being able to work from home full-time, which should be approved here in a month or so.

Our house here in KC will sell pretty quick, so we will have a good sized down payment for a place up there. Both of us have excellent credit. Was looking for some feedback on a couple of things:

1. Right now we put all of our expenses on a credit card for the Costco cash back, and then pay it off each month. Do we want to change this pattern over the next 6 months before we apply for our next mortgage, or do brokers understand that people do this all the time these days. Because otherwise we carry zero credit card debt. We also only have one car payment, and no other recurring payments of any kind.

2. For application purposes, I'll more than likely be employed here in KC when we apply for the mortgage, but will not be once I leave my job here. I'm guessing they won't factor my income in at all then, but don't know for sure. My wife makes enough that based on mortgage calculators we will be able to qualify for the budget we need, but just wondering how to present that to the mortgage broker. 

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.

 
ChiefD said:
So....a couple of questions for the experts around here. Wife and I are considering a move to lake country in central Minnesota (Brainerd area) early next year - hinging on her being able to work from home full-time, which should be approved here in a month or so.

Our house here in KC will sell pretty quick, so we will have a good sized down payment for a place up there. Both of us have excellent credit. Was looking for some feedback on a couple of things:

1. Right now we put all of our expenses on a credit card for the Costco cash back, and then pay it off each month. Do we want to change this pattern over the next 6 months before we apply for our next mortgage, or do brokers understand that people do this all the time these days. Because otherwise we carry zero credit card debt. We also only have one car payment, and no other recurring payments of any kind.

2. For application purposes, I'll more than likely be employed here in KC when we apply for the mortgage, but will not be once I leave my job here. I'm guessing they won't factor my income in at all then, but don't know for sure. My wife makes enough that based on mortgage calculators we will be able to qualify for the budget we need, but just wondering how to present that to the mortgage broker. 

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
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1. Brokers understand that this is a normal occurrence but it can be a potential issue. It can impact you in two different ways. First, your utilization rate will impact your credit score. In general, you want to be 5-10% of a utilization rate on your credit cards. If you stay in the under 10% even with the use of your card then you are fine. The second part it could impact is the min payment due will reflect on your application and be factored into your Debt to Income Ratio. This may not be an issue but if you are pushing your qualified amount it could make a difference. If the DTI was an issue you could pay it off and show proof of payment to reflect. 

2. If you are making a move and then will look for work later with no income to source and your wife can qualify on her income then I would just apply under her name for the loan. If you want to be added to title, you can request that. 

 
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So I'm looking to pay off my mortgage note.  Looks like, from what I see in my payoff statement, that they want me to wire it.  I'm pretty (intensely) uncomfortable with shooting a ton of money over wire like that.  Safe to do?  

The other option was a cashier's check mailed off.  Uh, yeah, ain't doing that one, for sure.

 
Sand said:
So I'm looking to pay off my mortgage note.  Looks like, from what I see in my payoff statement, that they want me to wire it.  I'm pretty (intensely) uncomfortable with shooting a ton of money over wire like that.  Safe to do?  

The other option was a cashier's check mailed off.  Uh, yeah, ain't doing that one, for sure.
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No PayPal option? What kind of rinky dink outfit you dealing with here?

 
Sand said:
So I'm looking to pay off my mortgage note.  Looks like, from what I see in my payoff statement, that they want me to wire it.  I'm pretty (intensely) uncomfortable with shooting a ton of money over wire like that.  Safe to do?  

The other option was a cashier's check mailed off.  Uh, yeah, ain't doing that one, for sure.
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Yes, wires are extremely safe. The only thing you want to do is make triple sure that the wire instructions you get are legit. 

There is a big scam going around the last couple of years where the bad guys hack into lenders, title companies, realtors, etc email and send wire instructions to the victims. These victims think it is the legit and send the money. Once a wire is sent to these bad guys the money is pretty much gone. It is extremely hard to claw back the funds. 

Other than that and making an error in the wire instructions (wrong account number for example- but most of the time if that happened the wire would bounce back) then a wire transfer is the safest way to transmit funds. 

The other draw backs are it costs $$$ and you have to go into a branch and do the wire itself. Depending on your bank/CU usually upwards of $30. 

If you mailed a cashiers check, I would NOT send it via regular mail. I would send it with a tracking number. UPS/Fed Ex ground or whatever the equivalent of USPS is so you can track the package. 

With it being Wells Fargo, I wonder if you could take the cashiers check to a Wells Fargo branch and they could submit it for you. All the banks I worked for in the past were able to do that and it all went through contracted secured couriers so that is another option. 

 
Chadstroma said:
Yes, wires are extremely safe. The only thing you want to do is make triple sure that the wire instructions you get are legit. 

There is a big scam going around the last couple of years where the bad guys hack into lenders, title companies, realtors, etc email and send wire instructions to the victims. These victims think it is the legit and send the money. Once a wire is sent to these bad guys the money is pretty much gone. It is extremely hard to claw back the funds. 

Other than that and making an error in the wire instructions (wrong account number for example- but most of the time if that happened the wire would bounce back) then a wire transfer is the safest way to transmit funds. 

The other draw backs are it costs $$$ and you have to go into a branch and do the wire itself. Depending on your bank/CU usually upwards of $30. 

If you mailed a cashiers check, I would NOT send it via regular mail. I would send it with a tracking number. UPS/Fed Ex ground or whatever the equivalent of USPS is so you can track the package. 

With it being Wells Fargo, I wonder if you could take the cashiers check to a Wells Fargo branch and they could submit it for you. All the banks I worked for in the past were able to do that and it all went through contracted secured couriers so that is another option. 
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I've seen the scams in the news, mostly when buying.   I'm looking into WF for instructions, not looking at something that was sent.  So safe, I guess.

Not worried about the transmittal money - like buying Turbotax every year, that's money well spent.

I'll call Wells to see if they'll let me walk in.  I'd feel much better handing something to an actual person and getting a physical receipt.  Thanks for the suggestion and the note back here - much appreciated!

 
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https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/09/wells-fargo-mortgages-bank-tells-new-clients-they-need-1-million-to-qualify-for-jumbo-refi.html?__source=sharebar|facebook&par=sharebar&fbclid=IwAR3Z_QQolAmXvHFKynVn08dewCccMQ0nbTHpTN3Va_DDiTc8me8KHvVmTsU

Readers digest version: Wells Fargo now requires $1MM in cash assets to refi a Jumbo loan with them. 

This is more shocking than Chase requirements of 80% LTV and 720 credit scores as Chase has for a long time not really wanted to do mortgages while Wells has for many years been aggressive. 

This may be a result of the sanctions on them from the multiple scandals over theast few years coupled with COVID but it also seems to be a general further shift with banks (specially larger banks) moving to only the most pristine mortgage loans. A kind of attitude of "Well, of you are the best of the best mortgage clients, I guess we will do the loan for you and charge you more for the hassle of your business". 

This also seems to be in line with the usual approach of jumbo for banks where they see that as a way to gain your business in wealth management and other areas and will use the jumbo as a loss leader. 

 
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