Job dilemma question for hiring personnel (1 Viewer)

[snogger]

Apologize in advanced for the tl;dr

This is a good position to be in, but tough decision to make and I'm hoping hiring managers/recruiters could help here.

I have a good job and enjoy what I do, but decided to see how marketable my skill set in Microsoft 365/Power Platform and SharePoint is so started exploring options.

Over the past two weeks I had multiple interviews with two separate consulting companies. After the 3rd interview today with one of the consulting companies they said they would reach out next week to possibly setup another interview.. Well, by the end of the day, they sent me an email stating they would like to extend an offer  ...

Here is where the dilemma comes in.

I had a 1st interview with a recruiter from a company that has a dream role they are looking to fill.. They are starting an intuitive to migrate off legacy apps to Microsoft 365/SharePoint/Power platform. I'd be in a senior leadership role with a ton of growth possibilities.

The benefits with this company are out of this world.. 5 weeks pto, pension, dollar to dollar 401(k) match up to 7%, 10% yearly bonus.. And when I mentioned what salary it would take to consider, they said "so, if we came in at (5k more then my minimum) how would that sound?  number 2..

Basically if I got this job, I see it as my last one before retirement in 10 to 15 years.

The problem here is the 2nd interview with this company may not happen until later next week, or early the next. And of course no guarantee they'd offer the position to me. But, the role is exactly what I want and know I could exceed at so I don't want to miss out on what might be my dream job.

so..... How do I handle the conversation on Monday with the consulting company who, if not for this other opportunity, I know I would enjoy, but probably not one I could see myself doing for the next 10+ years..

 

[ChiefD]

I would wait for the dream job. If you have basically 10 to 15 years to retirement, swing for the home run.

 

[gianmarco]

Wait for the second. And it's unfortunate you gave a number. My guess is they would have likely come in higher. 

 

[jobarules]

Can't you ask company #1 to move up the interview because you have an offer but you think they are a better mutual fit? 

If not, I'd still wait for dream job.

 

[snogger]

Wait for the second. And it's unfortunate you gave a number. My guess is they would have likely come in higher. 

Well, I gave them a ball park minimum to even consider leaving.. Which was 15k above what I'm making now..

The actual reply was...  if we offered "20k to 25k above what I currently make" would that work?  

 yea, I want to wait and, yea there seem to be plenty of opportunities out there for my skill set. At the same time I don't want to "burn bridges" .. Just not sure how to "delay" without shutting them out completely.

 

[gianmarco]

Well, I gave them a ball park minimum to even consider leaving.. Which was 15k above what I'm making now..

The actual reply was...  if we offered "20k to 25k above what I currently make" would that work?  

I understand.

I still think you shouldn't have given any number and just see what they say. My gut based on what you've provided is that you may have been offered even more if they started the negotiation. 

 

[snogger]

I would wait for the dream job. If you have basically 10 to 15 years to retirement, swing for the home run.

That is where I'm leaning, but as I just replied to another post, I don't want to burn the bridge with the consulting company as it is promising as well.

 

[snogger]

I understand.

I still think you shouldn't have given any number and just see what they say. My gut based on what you've provided is that you may have been offered even more if they started the negotiation. 

Well, still a chance to negotiate if they make an offer. Also, the 10% yearly bonus is not based on company profits, but on individual contribution, which I've never had any complaints in the companies I've worked for as I tend to exceed expectations based on reviews.  

 

[snogger]

Can't you ask company #1 to move up the interview because you have an offer but you think they are a better mutual fit? 

If not, I'd still wait for dream job.

This was a thought I had also... I did mention to him that I had a couple interviews prior to his, so he knows he wasn't the first... He stated this company usually likes to get 5 to 10 candidates before starting the interviews.. But maybe I have some leverage with this offer to get the interview moved up.

Guess it can't hurt to try

 

[TLEF316]

I'm a pretty conservative guy by nature,  but this feels like the right time to bet on yourself. 

Feel out the flexibility of the first offer, (I bet they'll give you the 10 days you need) but I'd just focus on knocking the dream interview out of the park.

 

[snogger]

I'm a pretty conservative guy by nature,  but this feels like the right time to bet on yourself. 

Feel out the flexibility of the first offer, (I bet they'll give you the 10 days you need) but I'd just focus on knocking the dream interview out of the park.

My thoughts also, thanks!

I'm in a good position where I don't HAVE to find a job, as my current work is rewarding and pretty stable..

But, as you said, I decided to bet on myself and see if my skill set is in demand as I think it is...and apparently  it is  

 

[The Z Machine]

You roll the dice on the dream gig.  Stall company #1. Hell, you can even tell them you're interviewing at another place and want to finish that set of interviews first.  I think they'll respect that. 

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

I'm a pretty conservative guy by nature,  but this feels like the right time to bet on yourself. 

Feel out the flexibility of the first offer, (I bet they'll give you the 10 days you need) but I'd just focus on knocking the dream interview out of the park.

This is my thought as well. 10 days isn't a crazy ask. It is certainly worth a try.

 

[snogger]

Well, as they say..  "the plot thickens" ...

I had my yearly physical today and I have a Hernia which may require surgery.
As it isn't causing any issues, my doctor setup a console with the general surgeon to discuss options.

I plan on listening to the Consulting Companies offer on Monday and let them know I need a day or two to consider..

Say I call them back on Tuesday or Wednesday...
Would informing a potential new company that you might need minor surgery possibly eliminate me from consideration?

Secondly...
Do you think it would be wrong to use that as an excuse to delay a decision?

 

[The Z Machine]

Say I call them back on Tuesday or Wednesday...
Would informing a potential new company that you might need minor surgery possibly eliminate me from consideration?

Secondly...
Do you think it would be wrong to use that as an excuse to delay a decision?

It won't preclude you from getting hired.  I wouldn't use that as an excuse.  I would be upfront and tell them that you have another round of interviews scheduled in the coming week and you'd like to see that out before making a decision.  It's a risk, but a small one.  Company #1 might fill that role with someone else, but I'm 95% sure that they'll wait for you since they were quick with an offer.

 

[gianmarco]

Well, as they say..  "the plot thickens" ...

I had my yearly physical today and I have a Hernia which may require surgery.
As it isn't causing any issues, my doctor setup a console with the general surgeon to discuss options.

I plan on listening to the Consulting Companies offer on Monday and let them know I need a day or two to consider..

Say I call them back on Tuesday or Wednesday...
Would informing a potential new company that you might need minor surgery possibly eliminate me from consideration?

Secondly...
Do you think it would be wrong to use that as an excuse to delay a decision?

You're getting ahead of yourself. No need to discuss your health stuff at all. It's insignificant in the scheme of what's going on. It's an elective procedure and minor. Forget that's even going on and just deal with the job stuff first.

 

[Alex P Keaton]

Well, as they say..  "the plot thickens" ...

I had my yearly physical today and I have a Hernia which may require surgery.
As it isn't causing any issues, my doctor setup a console with the general surgeon to discuss options.

I plan on listening to the Consulting Companies offer on Monday and let them know I need a day or two to consider..

Say I call them back on Tuesday or Wednesday...
Would informing a potential new company that you might need minor surgery possibly eliminate me from consideration?

Secondly...
Do you think it would be wrong to use that as an excuse to delay a decision?

I wouldn’t discuss health stuff at all.  This is hernia surgery, not brain cancer surgery.  They don’t need to know.

As someone else said, tell them you are in the middle of another discussion and need to let that play out.  Consulting firms will get that you have options.  And they will never close the door on talent.  So let them wait.

 

[snogger]

 for all that replied.. I did call the consulting company and they are sending me their offer..

But, based on the call, this might be easier to decide to "swing for the fences" then I thought.

I never talked about current or expected salary with them. The offer coming from them is only about a $5k increase on what I make now, after my bonuses.
and it would be about 3 days less vacation and not sure on what their cost is for Health.
Not even close to something I'd consider leaving what I have now for.

Sure, I could probably try to negotiate more, but that is not my strong suit.
Had they come back with 10-20k more then my current salary that would have made things tougher.. 

I'm going to let them know I will review it and get back to them by the end of the week.

 

[snogger]

What a long, strange journey this has been over the last Month and a half.. and again, sorry for the upcoming tl;dr post. Grab a  

I ended up turning down the Consulting gig.. after the first interview the person stated he was looking for more of a .net / java developer which I definitely am not.. then the next thing I know they ask me to speak to one more person then offer me a position. Just didn't have a good feeling about them ..

I had Interviews with a different company and they also offered me a job..
Thing is, it wasn't until my last interview that I found our they were a Google shop, not a Microsoft shop.
The person I interviewed with wanted to get the VP's on board with what the Power Platform can do.
Felt that if we couldn't "sell" them on the potential there would be no Job security so turned that one down as well.

Now for what I thought was the Dream job.. Went through 3 different interviews over about a month.
After my 3rd interview the recruiter told me I had a 85% chance of getting the job but.. and there was a big BUT.. 

No where in the Job description, nor during any of the interviews, did they mention they were hoping to find someone that not only had Power Platform/SharePoint skills, but also had .net /java skills.
Sure enough, they decided that none of the candidates they interviewed had all the skills they wanted and decided they will relist after the 1st of the year.
 I never would have spent all that time had I known they wanted those skills.
If you want that, then add it to the listing.. Don't play with people's times and hopes.  

The good news in all of this was that I never stopped interviewing while I waited for the "Dream" job interviews to end.

I had 3 interviews with another company that is looking for someone to come in to lead and take the Power Platform to the next level.
They have some apps/Automations, but the skill sets are limited right now.
It's not a Manager role ( thank god), but a Lead role for the Power Platform so I'll still be doing the Development/training that I like, while also increasing the use of the Platform.

Today they offered me 20% more then what I make here.. Plus yearly Bonuses
Was able to get them to up PTO to the same I have now, and after 2 years it goes to "Unlimited".
Their 401(k) match is almost double what I get here.
The team that I'll be working with was easy to talk to, and since the company is located in North Carolina, my position is 100% remote..

Onto the next step in my Career starting January 10th  

 

[El Floppo]

that's fantastic news, snogger! Congrats!

 

[snogger]

that's fantastic news, snogger! Congrats!

 

[jobarules]

Dont take unlimited PTO

Admiral Akbar: ITS A TRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[snogger]

Dont take unlimited PTO

Admiral Akbar: ITS A TRAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yea, I know the pitfalls as I had that at my last job... Found myself taking less than before we went to unlimited... I won't let that happen again.

Reality is... I take 3 1/2 weeks during the summer and just burn the other PTO to use it up.

Who knows, maybe with this 20% raise, I'll actually go somewhere with the other week and a half.

Then all bets are off once I hit unlimited. 

 

[SWC]

congrats brohan it sounds like you are taking it to the bank

 

[snogger]

So.. This is going to sound funny coming from a 54 year old man but... How do you resign???

The last time I willing left a job since college was almost 30 years ago, and even then, my manager and I butted heads so badly, he was glad to see me go.

Since then, I worked multiple consultant gigs where contracts weren't renewed so I moved on to a new one.

I was laid off from my last company 3 years ago after being there 11 years which brought me here.

Oh, let me throw another wench into it...

My Manager left the Company last Friday, so I have to resign through a manager I just met Monday.

 

[Atomic Punk]

So.. This is going to sound funny coming from a 54 year old man but... How do you resign???

The last time I willing left a job since college was almost 30 years ago, and even then, my manager and I butted heads so badly, he was glad to see me go.

Since then, I worked multiple consultant gigs where contracts weren't renewed so I moved on to a new one.

I was laid off from my last company 3 years ago after being there 11 years which brought me here.

Oh, let me throw another wench into it...

My Manager left the Company last Friday, so I have to resign through a manager I just met Monday.

Don’t sweat it. Just rip the bandage off as professionally and respectfully as you can and off you go to your next gig!

Good luck man!

 

[ChiefD]

You write a resignation letter and sashay into your new bosses office and say you are submitting your letter of resignation.

Before you do that make sure you have deleted anything off your work computer that you may have put on there:

bookmarks

personal documents

browser history

browser cache and cookies

downloads

Make sure your personal effects from your desk are cleaned up and ready to go in case they walk you out that day. 

 

[Dan Lambskin]

So.. This is going to sound funny coming from a 54 year old man but... How do you resign???

The last time I willing left a job since college was almost 30 years ago, and even then, my manager and I butted heads so badly, he was glad to see me go.

Since then, I worked multiple consultant gigs where contracts weren't renewed so I moved on to a new one.

I was laid off from my last company 3 years ago after being there 11 years which brought me here.

Oh, let me throw another wench into it...

My Manager left the Company last Friday, so I have to resign through a manager I just met Monday.

“hey got a second…”

I’ve almost always done it in person, last few I have also written up a letter and printed it out and then emailed them a copy later 

last job my boss was on vacation and I couldn’t delay it so I just told another director who I was close with and then HR and emailed by boss.  He was kind of a #### anyway and I only worked for him for a few months after my cool boss was  let go.

definitely explain your reasoning though 

 

[Dan Lambskin]

You write a resignation letter and sashay into your new bosses office and say you are submitting your letter of resignation.

Before you do that make sure you have deleted anything off your work computer that you may have put on there:

bookmarks

personal documents

browser history

browser cache and cookies

downloads

Make sure your personal effects from your desk are cleaned up and ready to go in case they walk you out that day. 

Ah yes this for sure…I’ve had a company cell phone last few and I wipe that thing CLEAN

 

[Dan Lambskin]

Also forgot the job where I came back from a week of paternity leave

boss - how’s the baby

me - great.  Got a second…

first one was the hardest, I was super nervous, boss was a really great guy.  He was thrilled for me so I was really grateful and it kind of took the edge off any other time I had to do it

 

[snogger]

You write a resignation letter and sashay into your new bosses office and say you are submitting your letter of resignation.

Before you do that make sure you have deleted anything off your work computer that you may have put on there:

bookmarks

personal documents

browser history

browser cache and cookies

downloads

Make sure your personal effects from your desk are cleaned up and ready to go in case they walk you out that day. 

Already sent all info I need to my personal email.. I forgot to mention, we've been working from home the last two years so no desk to clean. Also, my new manager lives in Pennsylvania so it will be by Teams meeting.

No chance of them walking me out as there are at least 5 projects I have to hand off to those left behind.

 

[snogger]

“hey got a second…”

I’ve almost always done it in person, last few I have also written up a letter and printed it out and then emailed them a copy later 

last job my boss was on vacation and I couldn’t delay it so I just told another director who I was close with and then HR and emailed by boss.  He was kind of a #### anyway and I only worked for him for a few months after my cool boss was  let go.

definitely explain your reasoning though 

Just mentioned it will be through a Teams meeting as my new manager is in Pennsylvania. Already have my notes written down on my "why".

The only possible hang up would be that my first Manager, who got promoted to Director a year ago, might come at me trying to get me to stay.  

 

[snogger]

Also forgot the job where I came back from a week of paternity leave

boss - how’s the baby

me - great.  Got a second…

first one was the hardest, I was super nervous, boss was a really great guy.  He was thrilled for me so I was really grateful and it kind of took the edge off any other time I had to do it

Like I said, this is the first time I've resigned in almost 30 years.. And that one I couldn't wait to leave. 

This one is different.. I work with a great group of people, but just felt "trapped" with no growth opportunities.

I know the move I'm making is right for my career, but I feel, I guess "guilty"?? 

The Team counts on me for a lot of things and will be beyond shocked that I am leaving... Should be an interesting time once I give my notice.

 

[Sand]

So.. This is going to sound funny coming from a 54 year old man but... How do you resign???

Manager left the Company last Friday, so I have to resign through a manager I just met Monday.

That sure makes it easy.  "Hi, I'm snogger, remember me?  I wanted to welcome you to our group with my resignation letter."

 

[snogger]

That sure makes it easy.  "Hi, I'm snogger, remember me?  I wanted to welcome you to our group with my resignation letter."

  .. It's going to be awkward as it will be our first, and probably only, one-on-one meeting.

"Welcome to our team.. Btw the way   "

 

[belljr]

It's going to be awkward dumping on his desk via zoom

 

[xulf]

  .. It's going to be awkward as it will be our first, and probably only, one-on-one meeting.

"Welcome to our team.. Btw the way   "

Be sure to tell him that you're leaving because of him.

 

[[icon]]

Congrats Snogger! Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy. 

Just be straightforward when resigning. Stress that you enjoyed your time at X. You value your working relationship with the team. However sometimes an offer comes along that is too hard to pass up. Thank them very much for everything they've done, and if they need anything once you leave, please contact you at Y. 

When I left my last role for my current one, it was tough... they were a small company so I had gotten very close with the CEO. One of the founders was a college buddy of mine. 

They asked about money... I spoke vaguely and inflated the number a bit. I mentioned the work from home flexibility and vacation time for work/life balance. They actually offered me WFH flexibility when nobody else in the company had that right, then said he was pretty sure he could get me a small equity stake to stay. I thanked them profusely for the offer but didn't feel right getting benefits/flexibility that nobody else in the company had... he said let him worry about fallout/dissent among other employees. 

The point is, even with that hard of a run, it still wasn't tooo hard to stick to my guns... and it never turned contentious. Don't be nervous... go do your thing and be kind. This likely isn't the first time they've had to deal with folks leaving and won't be the last.  

 

[gianmarco]

Be sure to tell him that you're leaving because of him.

 

[snogger]

Congrats Snogger! Couldn't have happened to a nicer guy. 

Just be straightforward when resigning. Stress that you enjoyed your time at X. You value your working relationship with the team. However sometimes an offer comes along that is too hard to pass up. Thank them very much for everything they've done, and if they need anything once you leave, please contact you at Y. 

When I left my last role for my current one, it was tough... they were a small company so I had gotten very close with the CEO. One of the founders was a college buddy of mine. 

They asked about money... I spoke vaguely and inflated the number a bit. I mentioned the work from home flexibility and vacation time for work/life balance. They actually offered me WFH flexibility when nobody else in the company had that right, then said he was pretty sure he could get me a small equity stake to stay. I thanked them profusely for the offer but didn't feel right getting benefits/flexibility that nobody else in the company had... he said let him worry about fallout/dissent among other employees. 

The point is, even with that hard of a run, it still wasn't tooo hard to stick to my guns... and it never turned contentious. Don't be nervous... go do your thing and be kind. This likely isn't the first time they've had to deal with folks leaving and won't be the last.  

   !!!!

It shall be interesting.. I am waiting for my background check to clear with the other company. Once that happens then it becomes "Official" Official and then I'll put in my notice.

Still hope that happens this week as the only other team member that manages the SharePoint environment with me is on PTO the next two weeks.

Want him to know he REALLY needs to take it easy during his vacation, as once he gets back, he and I will have one week to review projects that I need to hand off before I leave and he is stuck as the lone Admin until they hire someone. 

 

[Keerock]

   !!!!

It shall be interesting.. I am waiting for my background check to clear with the other company. Once that happens then it becomes "Official" Official and then I'll put in my notice.

Still hope that happens this week as the only other team member that manages the SharePoint environment with me is on PTO the next two weeks.

Want him to know he REALLY needs to take it easy during his vacation, as once he gets back, he and I will have one week to review projects that I need to hand off before I leave and he is stuck as the lone Admin until they hire someone. 

What company is doing the BGC?  Do they do it on their own or hire it out?

ETA... Congrats!

 

[snogger]

   !!!!

It shall be interesting.. I am waiting for my background check to clear with the other company. Once that happens then it becomes "Official" Official and then I'll put in my notice.

Still hope that happens this week as the only other team member that manages the SharePoint environment with me is on PTO the next two weeks.

Want him to know he REALLY needs to take it easy during his vacation, as once he gets back, he and I will have one week to review projects that I need to hand off before I leave and he is stuck as the lone Admin until they hire someone. 

What company is doing the BGC?  Do they do it on their own or hire it out?

ETA... Congrats!

 

Some company by the name of "HireRight" is doing the background check.

Not that it should find anything, but didn't want to put in my notice until it was officially official .. 

 

[Keerock]

 

Some company by the name of "HireRight" is doing the background check.

Not that it should find anything, but didn't want to put in my notice until it was officially official .. 

I work there... that's why I asked  

Please let me know your impressions of the process.

 

[Foosball God]

I work there... that's why I asked  

Please let me know your impressions of the process.

Or if snogger needs to bury a certain, ahem, indiscretion from his past.

 

[Nick Vermeil]

I work there... that's why I asked  

Please let me know your impressions of the process.

:updatesnotebook:

 

[snogger]

 

Some company by the name of "HireRight" is doing the background check.

Not that it should find anything, but didn't want to put in my notice until it was officially official .. 

I work there... that's why I asked  

Please let me know your impressions of the process.

Only thing I can say so far is it needs a "Go faster" button 

1 week out now since I completed my part.

 

[Keerock]

Only thing I can say so far is it needs a "Go faster" button 

1 week out now since I completed my part.

Our customers have SLA options... but a week it generally the longest timeframe... depending on options of course.  If they are doing the full panel of checks, it can take longer.  Drug testing is usually the longest as we usually farm out that work.

 

[snogger]

Our customers have SLA options... but a week it generally the longest timeframe... depending on options of course.  If they are doing the full panel of checks, it can take longer.  Drug testing is usually the longest as we usually farm out that work.

Turns out the report came back Wednesday, but the person who it went to was out till today...

The process was easy, but if I could recommend one thing it would be that the submitter gets an email letting them know the report is complete and has been sent.

Oh.. And it is official, I put in my notice today and start the next step in my career on Monday, January 10th.

I received two high end 24" LCD screens and a Notebook from the new company so well prepared 3 weeks out.

 

[[icon]]

Turns out the report came back Wednesday, but the person who it went to was out till today...

The process was easy, but if I could recommend one thing it would be that the submitter gets an email letting them know the report is complete and has been sent.

Oh.. And it is official, I put in my notice today and start the next step in my career on Monday, January 10th.

I received two high end 24" LCD screens and a Notebook from the new company so well prepared 3 weeks out.

Congratulations buddy. 

That's hell of a red carpet they're rolling out... got your workstation 3 weeks early? I think they like ya  

Cheers!