Ysatnaf_Gnik
Footballguy
What is the deal with elvis dumervil?
Is he projected to start?
Is he projected to start?
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Elvis Dumervil - Status? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Ysatnaf_Gnik
- Start date
Jene Bramel
Footballguy
There are some notes on Dumervil a few threads down from the Denver beat writers during minicamp a few days ago.
Dumervil was seeing first team snaps at OLB and in the nickel early in minicamp, but faces stiff competition from Ayers in the base defense. Ayers was already getting first time base defensive snaps by the end of the minicamp. My feeling continues to be that Dumervil will have a hard time as anything more than a situational rusher in this defense.
Dumervil was seeing first team snaps at OLB and in the nickel early in minicamp, but faces stiff competition from Ayers in the base defense. Ayers was already getting first time base defensive snaps by the end of the minicamp. My feeling continues to be that Dumervil will have a hard time as anything more than a situational rusher in this defense.
Ysatnaf_Gnik
Footballguy
That is what I thought...I wonder why Norton has him so high as of his last rankings....
Buffaloes
Footballguy
Doom has been real impressive this preseason coming off the edge. Seems he will be the Broncos most legitimate pass rusher. He's been able to use his usual speed rush off the edge but has had success with a bull rush too. That being said, it looks like he's playing as a stand up rusher on base defenses while kicking in as a traditional DE on passing downs. He's still listed as a DL in some leagues.
How valuable does he become if he remains listed as a DL in these leagues? I see an upside of 12+ sacks and maybe 60 solos. Does this seem about right?
How valuable does he become if he remains listed as a DL in these leagues? I see an upside of 12+ sacks and maybe 60 solos. Does this seem about right?
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HockeyScotty
Footballguy
I hate to be a bummer on my Broncos players, but the numbers you have for Parys Haralson seem in the ballpark for what I would expect from Dumervil(28-12-8.5). There is no guarantee that Doom will play all downs yet, and with Robert Ayers pushing him for "starting" time he could just end up being a pass-rush specialist, or gets moved over to the less-stats friendly SOLB position.
HockeyScotty
Footballguy
Technically Doom didn't "start" tonight, as they opened in a 3-4 alignment with Ayers at ROLB.
Doom played most of the first Arizona drive, however, especially in "obvious passing situations" which with Arizona does alot of. on 3rd and 10 he was RDE and Ayers was LDE. Woodyard played alot too as the nickel LB as well.
Doom played most of the first Arizona drive, however, especially in "obvious passing situations" which with Arizona does alot of. on 3rd and 10 he was RDE and Ayers was LDE. Woodyard played alot too as the nickel LB as well.
HockeyScotty
Footballguy
Should be noted that after the "starters" left the game, Ayers stayed in playing OLB, but no sign of Dumervil yet.
saintfool
Dead sexy
great game against a suspect opponent. he's going to have great games but the matchups really come into play.
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
If he's able sometimes to look like Suggs or Ware, then he's worth a serious look as a LB.
corpcow
Footballguy
The 7 tackles are encouraging, but you have to ask yourself how many times he (or anyone) will have 4 sacks? We know Dumervil can get after the QB and has done so in the past, but sacks and big plays have the biggest variable from week to week. If you get a OL that is struggling and get in his head, you can have a field day... see Osi vs. Winston, etc. (I say this having played DE in college and even a little OL at times. Sometimes you just get someone's number... and it's really tough to project 4 sacks forward).If he's DE eligible, I say DEFINITELY get him... as a LB... he obviously has a high ceiling but I think he also has a low floor. He is not, IMO, in the class of Ware or Harrison.If he's able sometimes to look like Suggs or Ware, then he's worth a serious look as a LB.
Buffaloes
Footballguy
Doom lined up against Joe Thomas too. The problem with blocking him is he is only about 5'11" but has the wing span of a guy maybe 6" taller and is very strong and quick off the edge. The bigger OL have a hard time bending and engaging a guy who has a lower center of gravity but can keep them at bay with his long arms. He was turning Orlando Pace like a turnstyle in preseason and should continue to have success in obvious passing downs. He's still playing down as a DE in some nickel and dime sets and it helps that he is still somehow DL eligible in some leagues.
thatguy
Footballguy
I think Dumervil could up sack and tackle numbers comparable to Woodley last season... And like Woodley, he'll have big games and he'll have games where he does very little. If you're in a league where he is still eligible at DE, he's a must own, but as a LB, he's borderline.
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thatguy
Footballguy
You're right. They all came against the right tackle, and they call came in a span of like 5 minutes. Had the game continued, it's possible he'd have beat him for a few more sacks. The guy had no answer to Dumervil's speed, he just beat him around the edge on each sack.
thatguy
Footballguy
I'm not sure. If I had to guess I'd say Haggan, but again that's just a guess. I wasn't following the personnel very closely.But yes, he was at LOLB for all 4 sacks.
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-baller
Footballguy
if I remember, I'll check out pff on that game later this week.
in the meantime, here's how they have his positional breakdowns for week one against cincy:
53 snaps (83% of total snaps)
rolb - 20
lolb - 11
sam - 3
will - 2
3 man fronts:
re - 7
le - 2
4 man fronts:
re - 3
le - 3
for 9 of his lolb snaps, haggan was rolb.
dj manned rolb on the other 2 snaps.
in the meantime, here's how they have his positional breakdowns for week one against cincy:
53 snaps (83% of total snaps)
rolb - 20
lolb - 11
sam - 3
will - 2
3 man fronts:
re - 7
le - 2
4 man fronts:
re - 3
le - 3
for 9 of his lolb snaps, haggan was rolb.
dj manned rolb on the other 2 snaps.
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Buffaloes
Footballguy
Nice find. Can you throw the link in here when you get a chance?
-baller
Footballguy
oops..sry -- I forgot that time....
http://profootballfocus.com/by_week.php?ta...eid=&stats=
you guys can thank jene on that link --- he's the one that tipped me off on it.
edit: if you want the positional breakdowns, it's the 'player participation' button.
there's lots of other good stuff in there, too, if you check out the various subcategories under the 'offense' and 'defense'.
http://profootballfocus.com/by_week.php?ta...eid=&stats=
you guys can thank jene on that link --- he's the one that tipped me off on it.
edit: if you want the positional breakdowns, it's the 'player participation' button.
there's lots of other good stuff in there, too, if you check out the various subcategories under the 'offense' and 'defense'.
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thatguy
Footballguy
I take this back... I rewatched the game and one of his 4 sacks did in fact come against Joe Thomas while he was lined up at ROLB.
thatguy
Footballguy
If he's eligible at DE, I think he will absolutely be a stud... In my MFL league he is listed as a LB, but that didn't stop an owner from picking him up this week (I expect him to be a free agent again soon as he simply can't keep up with traditional high tackle LBs).
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
Pretty much. I started him for the first time at LB after Lofa was inactive and he's pretty much a must-start until I see otherwise. I start four LB's, so that's become pretty much of a no-brainer at this point.Rushmore said:
burgundy and gold
Footballguy
Is this D for real? Who saw the game? Who's on the other side? Will this continue? Who's a more productive big play LB at this point?
Buffaloes
Footballguy
1.) Sure looks like it. Keep in mind, they have played the lowly Raiders and Browns as well as the Bengals. The only TD they have given up was at the end of a game in Cincy. They kept the Bengale out of the end zone for 58+ minutes.2.) I did3.) Mario Haggan, Robert Ayers and Darrell Reid have been playing OLB/DE too. Ayers seems to be in on passing downs.4.) Not sure, but this defense has play makers in the defensive backfield and the front 7 has held its own so far. It looks promising. Dumervil had 20 sacks and 10 forced fumbles one year in college (he played for Louisville) and he has been a very good pass rusher so far his career. He looks decent in space right now too.5.) Not sure.
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burgundy and gold
Footballguy
I'm so freakin pissed! I dropped Doom and Odom prior to the start of the season. I wouldve started Odom over Dewayne White but I doubt I wouldve had the nuts to start Doom. Managed to get Doom back. Has any who's seen him been inspired enough to make comparisons to the performances given by Ware or Harrison last year?
Lord Fantasy
Footballguy
How does he fare in the next three weeks when he faces Dallas, New England and San Diego?
If he blows up against these teams then we'll know he's for real?
If he blows up against these teams then we'll know he's for real?
Doom is causing havoc no one can doubt him. Imagine if they did the same for Freeney wow that would be sick. you better send a fullback to help because doom is going to run past ya no doubt
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
Yup. I benched him the first two weeks thinking he'd languish as a LB in my league. Now he's a must-start stud who I'm starting over guys like Tatupu and Gaither. Funny. I'm still skeptical as to how long it will last, but for now I'm happily riding the wave.
thatguy
Footballguy
I'm in the same boat in that I don't know how long it will last (I don't own him in any leagues). I posted earlier that he would absolutely be a stud DE, which was obvious, but that he would not remain a top tier LB. I figured he'd eventually slide down to the LB20ish range. Now, I'm not so sure. He looks nigh unstoppable. I still think that for him to remain a top tier LB, he'll have to log at least 10-12 more sacks going forward, but I'm starting to believe this is a realistic possibility. The guy is becoming a super star before our eyes, which is pretty cool.Yup. I benched him the first two weeks thinking he'd languish as a LB in my league. Now he's a must-start stud who I'm starting over guys like Tatupu and Gaither. Funny.Doom is causing havoc no one can doubt him. Imagine if they did the same for Freeney wow that would be sick. you better send a fullback to help because doom is going to run past ya no doubt
I'm still skeptical as to how long it will last, but for now I'm happily riding the wave.
Buffaloes
Footballguy
Thatguy, did you see the move he made on Flozell last week when he tried a speed rush, stopped on a dime looking like he was going to fall and somehow managed to cut in front of Adams to make a sack on Romo before Romo escaped the pocket? Doom's athleticism is ridiculous. Maybe I'm just being a homer, but I think he has the opportunity to reach Demarcus Ware and James Harrison's 2008 status as stud LBs in fantasy leagues this year. It's becoming more and more apparent that Nolan is moving him around and putting him in great position to rush the passer on obvious passing downs too.
thatguy
Footballguy
Yup, that was a sick move. You're right, his athleticism is incredible. And yes, every week he seems to edge closer and closer to reaching Ware/Harrison status. I posted after his 4 sack game that I thought he'd finish with a stat line more comparable to Woodley's last season, but he'll easily surpass that. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility that he'll log 20 total sacks.
thatguy
Footballguy
Something interesting of note:
Coming into the season, Dumervil trailed only Mario Williams for most career sacks among players from the '06 draft class. Now, 4 weeks into their 4th season, Doom and Mario are tied with 32.5 sacks each (Mario has played in 52 games to Dumervil's 49). That's pretty damn impressive.
Coming into the season, Dumervil trailed only Mario Williams for most career sacks among players from the '06 draft class. Now, 4 weeks into their 4th season, Doom and Mario are tied with 32.5 sacks each (Mario has played in 52 games to Dumervil's 49). That's pretty damn impressive.
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djmich
Footballguy
I've been fairly skeptical of Elvis because he is pretty light on the tackles and you just can't count on two sacks every game. For me, a sack and four tackles every game is not a LB1, and I don't think he can keep up two sacks a game.
For as well as Dumervil has been playing, DJ Williams is only 2pts behind him in my league scoring.
If he's going to stay top 10 or even top 15 he'll need to add some more forced fumbles, fumble recoveries etc. Only one FF with 8 sacks is not enough.
For as well as Dumervil has been playing, DJ Williams is only 2pts behind him in my league scoring.
If he's going to stay top 10 or even top 15 he'll need to add some more forced fumbles, fumble recoveries etc. Only one FF with 8 sacks is not enough.
Maroney=Sped
Footballguy
Well said. This has been my thought too. He's had "too many" big plays for me to believe that he can maintain this.
No body can maintain that pace he will end up with 19 sacks but if you have a low sack fantasy league (less then 4pts a sack) then doom would be a second to third tier lb or a top tier de, but if you have hight points for sacks (5 or more) doom is a top tier lb and the best de in the gameHe cant maintain this. He is on a 32 sack pace.
thatguy
Footballguy
2 more sacks for Mr. Dumervil and another very solid performance, with 4 tackles and a FF. Currently on pace for ~26 sacks. Most likely won't maintain that pace, but 20 still looking very realistic. Along with Willis, Harrison, and Allen is easily one of the early favorites for DPOY.
Kool-Aid Larry
Footballguy
I'd say his status is totally awesome.
corpcow
Footballguy
I had him signed at near-league-minimum and sold him this offseason for Troy Polamalu and an upgrade in picks in the 3rd round (which, in fairness, did net Bernard Scott). (This is on MFL so he was not DL eligible, otherwise I migth have kept him). Of course, it's skewed somewhat since Troy hasn't really stayed healthy, but I miffed on this one 
Still, if I had him, Lofton and Harrison - three of the top 5 LBs - and Timmons/Levy/Burnett as my LB4, damn...
Still, if I had him, Lofton and Harrison - three of the top 5 LBs - and Timmons/Levy/Burnett as my LB4, damn...
thatguy
Footballguy
What are sacks worth in your league? Must be quite a lot for Doom to be top 5. In my MFL league he was 21st coming into this week and in fact even after his big week 11 is just 21st in PPG (3 points per sack, 1 point per solo, 0.5 point per assist, etc.).corpcow said:I had him signed at near-league-minimum and sold him this offseason for Troy Polamalu and an upgrade in picks in the 3rd round (which, in fairness, did net Bernard Scott). (This is on MFL so he was not DL eligible, otherwise I migth have kept him). Of course, it's skewed somewhat since Troy hasn't really stayed healthy, but I miffed on this one
corpcow
Footballguy
Sorry, you're right, he dropped down to LB17 after last week because of a couple of low scoring league. As you figured, I was looking at overall rankings now which include his week 12 and obviously he's one of the few who have that. Curiously, my league uses the same scoring (1pt solo, 0.5 pts per asst, 3:1 on all big plays). Must be some other minor thing like PDs or something, because LB17 and LB21 are separated by just 2 pts... then again, the difference between LB17 and LB5 is less than 10 pts.What are sacks worth in your league? Must be quite a lot for Doom to be top 5. In my MFL league he was 21st coming into this week and in fact even after his big week 11 is just 21st in PPG (3 points per sack, 1 point per solo, 0.5 point per assist, etc.).corpcow said:I had him signed at near-league-minimum and sold him this offseason for Troy Polamalu and an upgrade in picks in the 3rd round (which, in fairness, did net Bernard Scott). (This is on MFL so he was not DL eligible, otherwise I migth have kept him). Of course, it's skewed somewhat since Troy hasn't really stayed healthy, but I miffed on this one
