Electric Cars (Tesla and Others) (6 Viewers)

[New Binky the Doormat]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

 

[the moops]

Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be.

64%

 

[The General]

I think owning and electric commuter and a gas traveler is the best of both worlds.

Yes I know you can travel and plan with electric but when we drive over 8 hours we don't make a stop longer than probably 15 minutes

Yep. EV for daily commuter. Gas car for long trips stuff like skiing or hauling a boat or stuff like this.

 

[tommyGunZ]

I think owning and electric commuter and a gas traveler is the best of both worlds.

Yes I know you can travel and plan with electric but when we drive over 8 hours we don't make a stop longer than probably 15 minutes

Yep. EV for daily commuter. Gas car for long trips stuff like skiing or hauling a boat or stuff like this.

This is what my family has done since 2017. Looking forward to getting completely off of ICE vehicles with the next generation or two of mid-size SUV's with extended range. Honda and Toyota being so late to the game is annoying.

 

[fruity pebbles]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Yeah it all depends on your situation and what you plan to use it for. It’s definitely not great for everyone and every situation. If you live in a cold climate with long commutes or take a number of long trip, it’s not the best choice as your primary vehicle. Commuter car with easy access to charging and it’s hard to beat imo. I seldom drive more than 30-40 miles in a stretch, have free access to charging so I pay zero and qualified for the tax rebates bringing the price of a brand new car down to 20k. In the cold it’s more of a pita than a gas car but the benefits still outweighed the negatives. For me it was a cost/benefit equation, nothing more.

 

[Instinctive]

So highway driving is technically worse than city driving for EV? Interesting and wild imo. It's the opposite

Yeah. With regen braking you can drive around town using very little energy.

I wouldn't say very little. And it heavily depends on the weight of your foot.

All of this in temps between 20-60, average probably mid40s:
I get 3.3 mi/kWh naturally. When I focus on being better, I creep up towards 4. When I'm highway, I'm at around 3.5 using the auto drive/advanced cruise thing and going like 80mph.

I think a straight road around 50-55 on cruise would be best. Weather 60-80 outside.

I use much less energy going 25mph from stoplight to stoplight using one pedal driving vs driving on the highway on cruise control.

Really? The single most heavy loss of energy is taking the car from 0 mph to x mph.

Light foot and getting a bunch of that back with regen braking, yeah.

Interesting. Even with a very smooth and light foot, the physics would say that's relatively unlikely. The curve is such that a sustained speed (not a high one, because then drag overtakes it) should beat out stop and go, even with regen braking.

 

[tommyGunZ]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Was charging overnight in Indy not an option? Seems like plugging into a 120 volt outlet where ever you were staying would have mostly solved your issues and saved a lot of time.

 

[tommyGunZ]

So highway driving is technically worse than city driving for EV? Interesting and wild imo. It's the opposite

Yeah. With regen braking you can drive around town using very little energy.

I wouldn't say very little. And it heavily depends on the weight of your foot.

All of this in temps between 20-60, average probably mid40s:
I get 3.3 mi/kWh naturally. When I focus on being better, I creep up towards 4. When I'm highway, I'm at around 3.5 using the auto drive/advanced cruise thing and going like 80mph.

I think a straight road around 50-55 on cruise would be best. Weather 60-80 outside.

I use much less energy going 25mph from stoplight to stoplight using one pedal driving vs driving on the highway on cruise control.

Really? The single most heavy loss of energy is taking the car from 0 mph to x mph.

Light foot and getting a bunch of that back with regen braking, yeah.

Interesting. Even with a very smooth and light foot, the physics would say that's relatively unlikely. The curve is such that a sustained speed (not a high one, because then drag overtakes it) should beat out stop and go, even with regen braking.

Impossible to calculate the physics w/o knowing the topography. I live at sea level in coastal CA in a hilly neighborhood. At times I can run a few errands around my beach community in my i3 and get back home with very little energy lost due to regenerative braking when descending down hills. But when I drive North on interstate 15, my mileage is terrible.

 

[gianmarco]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Was charging overnight in Indy not an option? Seems like plugging into a 120 volt outlet where ever you were staying would have mostly solved your issues and saved a lot of time.

1. No, neither hotel where we stayed had EV charging. The 2023 ID.4 didn't come with a level 1 charger. And honestly, there wouldn't have been a practical way to use it even if we had it.

2. Charging in Indy wouldn't have changed much at all. We didn't need to make the 2nd stop on the way to Indy but, having the peace of mind to arrive with a decent charge being our first time and the incoming weather, it was worth the extra 30-40 minutes to do on the way there. Once in Indy, we didn't have to drive much. Without getting into too much specifics, we stayed in one hotel the first night, then had to move to another hotel for the next 2 nights. The 2nd hotel was half a mile from the event we were attending and just walked at that point (I did drive that once to avoid the weather, but that was negligible). Even driving to dinner was only 5 minutes away.

3. Given the temps and decreased range, even if I had fully charged the night before we left and took off with 100% battery, I still would have had to make both stops.

The only thing an overnight charger would have saved was the time I went out Sunday morning specifically to go charge. I had the whole morning free anyway so it really wasn't that big of a deal.

 

[beer 30]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

 

[tommyGunZ]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Was charging overnight in Indy not an option? Seems like plugging into a 120 volt outlet where ever you were staying would have mostly solved your issues and saved a lot of time.

1. No, neither hotel where we stayed had EV charging. The 2023 ID.4 didn't come with a level 1 charger. And honestly, there wouldn't have been a practical way to use it even if we had it.

2. Charging in Indy wouldn't have changed much at all. We didn't need to make the 2nd stop on the way to Indy but, having the peace of mind to arrive with a decent charge being our first time and the incoming weather, it was worth the extra 30-40 minutes to do on the way there. Once in Indy, we didn't have to drive much. Without getting into too much specifics, we stayed in one hotel the first night, then had to move to another hotel for the next 2 nights. The 2nd hotel was half a mile from the event we were attending and just walked at that point (I did drive that once to avoid the weather, but that was negligible). Even driving to dinner was only 5 minutes away.

3. Given the temps and decreased range, even if I had fully charged the night before we left and took off with 100% battery, I still would have had to make both stops.

The only thing an overnight charger would have saved was the time I went out Sunday morning specifically to go charge. I had the whole morning free anyway so it really wasn't that big of a deal.

Doubtful that it's worth it to you at this point, but if you find a Level 1 charger on craigslist or Facebook marketplace for cheap ($50?), could be worth it. When I first got my i3 I traveled a bit for local youth softball tournaments and local hotels will usually let you plug into a wall outlet if you have an extension cord.

 

[tommyGunZ]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

 

[belljr]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

i'm in the .08%!!!! lol 105 miles round trip when i go in

 

[gianmarco]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

Absolutely. We are just in season now for a handful of these road trips, but the rest of the time, range is a complete non issue. Plug in at home, never have to worry about it.

Also, keep in mind, this was literally like worst case scenario with it being our first time and the dead of winter with the worst weather. If we did this in the summer, having done this now, this trip is done with 1 stop, charging half hour and grabbing lunch while we do so.

 

[gianmarco]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Was charging overnight in Indy not an option? Seems like plugging into a 120 volt outlet where ever you were staying would have mostly solved your issues and saved a lot of time.

1. No, neither hotel where we stayed had EV charging. The 2023 ID.4 didn't come with a level 1 charger. And honestly, there wouldn't have been a practical way to use it even if we had it.

2. Charging in Indy wouldn't have changed much at all. We didn't need to make the 2nd stop on the way to Indy but, having the peace of mind to arrive with a decent charge being our first time and the incoming weather, it was worth the extra 30-40 minutes to do on the way there. Once in Indy, we didn't have to drive much. Without getting into too much specifics, we stayed in one hotel the first night, then had to move to another hotel for the next 2 nights. The 2nd hotel was half a mile from the event we were attending and just walked at that point (I did drive that once to avoid the weather, but that was negligible). Even driving to dinner was only 5 minutes away.

3. Given the temps and decreased range, even if I had fully charged the night before we left and took off with 100% battery, I still would have had to make both stops.

The only thing an overnight charger would have saved was the time I went out Sunday morning specifically to go charge. I had the whole morning free anyway so it really wasn't that big of a deal.

Doubtful that it's worth it to you at this point, but if you find a Level 1 charger on craigslist or Facebook marketplace for cheap ($50?), could be worth it. When I first got my i3 I traveled a bit for local youth softball tournaments and local hotels will usually let you plug into a wall outlet if you have an extension cord.

Yeah, I know. I initially had one before I installed the level 2 charger but returned it. I might look into one, but honestly, I'm unlikely to ever really need it or use it. But I did think about having one for this trip.

 

[Chaos34]

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

No need to apologize. People considering EVs need to read this stuff. I probably read over 100 "trip reports" like yours before taking the plunge. I have a 22 Model Y (awd long range). I was looking hard at Mach Es and ID.4s. Both were kind of hard to find and selling for premiums, so I chose the Y based on availability, price, and range (330 miles). It was a demo with just under 1k miles on it. I also owned two hybrids going back to 2013.

I've spent a decade getting better at hypermiling.

I regularly say things like, I'm done spinning my wheels. No more speeding tickets for me. I'm too old to be in a hurry. Since Thanksgiving, I've made 2 250 mile trips (500 back and forth). And two 350 mile trips. Vegas and Tahoe twice. A few 2 hr rides to LA. I hypermile. The 2nd trip to Tahoe was in 10 degree weather and there's some serious grades on the way. It's through the Sierra mountains, starts at 1800 feet, ends at 6500. Instead of a long stop (hour +) in Bishop and a very quick one in Carson City, I had two long stops and the 2nd one wasn't Carson City. I had to stop short. Cold temps obviously hurt range.

Here's a quick Reddit on mastering hypermiling. I could have found a much more thorough link, but that just popped up first. It makes a big difference. Reported ranges are longer than reality for all EVs unless you're optimizing the way you drive. Even then the range figures are tough to achieve. For me by far the best range optimizer on long rides has been finding a truck or RV travelling close to the best speed and drafting. I did this for most of the trip to Vegas recently and could have easily made the 330 mile range on that charge.

 

[Nugget]

My MachE would show around 235 miles at a full charge late this summer. At -10°F, I showed 77 miles with a 70% charge, but my daughter had left it on max heat. I’d guess I lost half of my usable range this past week.

This is my 2nd EV and at this point I won’t take it on a trip over 75 miles one way. Charging stations are not reliable enough for I-35 or I-70 yet. I own more than 1 car so this is not an issue for me.

 

[Courtjester]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

This where I am at as well. I don't want to think about building in 30-45 minutes in just to go see my daughter. I have been in Teslas and they are amazing and I wouldn't mind owning one, but I can't help but think the current offerings of EV's are the Betamax of cars. I believe we are going to see some huge advancements in some other technology come along here in the near future that is going to make us look back at these cars and laugh. Even the most ardent EV supporter has to admit, we don't the infrastructure and the battery producing capabilities to sustain a huge uptick in the sales of EV's as things currently stand.

One question I do have because I have heard that if you get in any kind of accident, no matter how small, in an EV that impacts the body where the battery is located, insurance companies tend to immediately look to total the vehicle vs anything else. I don't know if anyone else has heard that.

 

[tommyGunZ]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

This where I am at as well. I don't want to think about building in 30-45 minutes in just to go see my daughter. I have been in Teslas and they are amazing and I wouldn't mind owning one, but I can't help but think the current offerings of EV's are the Betamax of cars. I believe we are going to see some huge advancements in some other technology come along here in the near future that is going to make us look back at these cars and laugh. Even the most ardent EV supporter has to admit, we don't the infrastructure and the battery producing capabilities to sustain a huge uptick in the sales of EV's as things currently stand.

One question I do have because I have heard that if you get in any kind of accident, no matter how small, in an EV that impacts the body where the battery is located, insurance companies tend to immediately look to total the vehicle vs anything else. I don't know if anyone else has heard that.

Again, 99.2% of Americans drive less than 100 miles daily. Virtually all of the newer EVs have double to triple that range right now.

For most Americans in the market for a newer vehicle, buying an EV is absolutely the smartest move fiscally.

 

[fruity pebbles]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

This where I am at as well. I don't want to think about building in 30-45 minutes in just to go see my daughter. I have been in Teslas and they are amazing and I wouldn't mind owning one, but I can't help but think the current offerings of EV's are the Betamax of cars. I believe we are going to see some huge advancements in some other technology come along here in the near future that is going to make us look back at these cars and laugh. Even the most ardent EV supporter has to admit, we don't the infrastructure and the battery producing capabilities to sustain a huge uptick in the sales of EV's as things currently stand.

One question I do have because I have heard that if you get in any kind of accident, no matter how small, in an EV that impacts the body where the battery is located, insurance companies tend to immediately look to total the vehicle vs anything else. I don't know if anyone else has heard that.

Again, 99.2% of Americans drive less than 100 miles daily. Virtually all of the newer EVs have double to triple that range right now.

For most Americans in the market for a newer vehicle, buying an EV is absolutely the smartest move fiscally.

Was for me, atleast I hope. My used Lexus averaged about 4k a year in gas, maintenance and repairs. If I can get five trouble free years out of my EV it’ll pay for itself.

 

[The General]

I

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

Absolutely. We are just in season now for a handful of these road trips, but the rest of the time, range is a complete non issue. Plug in at home, never have to worry about it.

Also, keep in mind, this was literally like worst case scenario with it being our first time and the dead of winter with the worst weather. If we did this in the summer, having done this now, this trip is done with 1 stop, charging half hour and grabbing lunch while we do so.

I haven‘t dealt with this type of weather and long distances but in some of the reading I have done they mention that using even a level 1 charger (know you don’t have one but maybe worth looking into at least) and preconditioning the battery helps quite a bit. The battery getting below a certain temp for too long is the issue.

You kind of have to nerd out a bit on these cars for stuff like this and check out forums to see if it works and even then just some trial and error.

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare. Sorry man.

 

[the moops]

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare.

A nightmare? He was inconvenienced for a couple hours. I say pffft

I took an Amtrak to Chicago that was delayed 3.5 hours then broke down on the tracks for 3 hours, then was delayed another 2 hours getting there. And the liquor car ran out of booze. That's a nightmare

 

[Jobber]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Highway speeds are not great for range. EVs can drive all day long if you’re in the city. Also, the cabin heat kills battery quickly as well. For trips like this, crank up the heated seats and wheel and take it a bit easy on the heater.

 

[Bob Sacamano]

Effin' nerds. I just drive. When necessary, I plug it in.

 

[culdeus]

Effin' nerds. I just drive. When necessary, I plug it in.

Seriously.

Driving 15 over the limit up to 85 and just stop. Done Dallas to Florida and back in a M3 and two other 600 mile trips.

SC coverage is so good in Texas there's no real stress zones and most are 250kw which can easily go 20-80 in 25 min.

 

[gianmarco]

I

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

Absolutely. We are just in season now for a handful of these road trips, but the rest of the time, range is a complete non issue. Plug in at home, never have to worry about it.

Also, keep in mind, this was literally like worst case scenario with it being our first time and the dead of winter with the worst weather. If we did this in the summer, having done this now, this trip is done with 1 stop, charging half hour and grabbing lunch while we do so.

I haven‘t dealt with this type of weather and long distances but in some of the reading I have done they mention that using even a level 1 charger (know you don’t have one but maybe worth looking into at least) and preconditioning the battery helps quite a bit. The battery getting below a certain temp for too long is the issue.

You kind of have to nerd out a bit on these cars for stuff like this and check out forums to see if it works and even then just some trial and error.

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare. Sorry man.

No, it wasn't a nightmare at all.

It was extra time, for sure, but it never felt excessive because of how it was broken up. We found things to do to be efficient and honestly it was a nice change of pace to not be in a rush to get there as quickly as possible. I also have never been a fan of cruise control and never really used it and I had it for most of the trip along with assist steering and it was kind of nice. And we were never worried about running out of battery which is what I was most concerned about when we first left. Would the chargers be working? Full? There were zero issues with that. Combined with the fact that it was all free was a bonus.

It was an experience. The more I'm reading here and elsewhere, I guess the decreased range is just what it is under those conditions. Given this was literally worst case conditions, I'm not deterred from doing it again. Already planning next week's trip. I just recognize it takes some planning and understanding of how to make it work. Worst case, I'll Turo a car if I don't think I can make it work timewise.

 

[New Binky the Doormat]

I

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

Absolutely. We are just in season now for a handful of these road trips, but the rest of the time, range is a complete non issue. Plug in at home, never have to worry about it.

Also, keep in mind, this was literally like worst case scenario with it being our first time and the dead of winter with the worst weather. If we did this in the summer, having done this now, this trip is done with 1 stop, charging half hour and grabbing lunch while we do so.

I haven‘t dealt with this type of weather and long distances but in some of the reading I have done they mention that using even a level 1 charger (know you don’t have one but maybe worth looking into at least) and preconditioning the battery helps quite a bit. The battery getting below a certain temp for too long is the issue.

You kind of have to nerd out a bit on these cars for stuff like this and check out forums to see if it works and even then just some trial and error.

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare. Sorry man.

No, it wasn't a nightmare at all.

It was extra time, for sure, but it never felt excessive because of how it was broken up. We found things to do to be efficient and honestly it was a nice change of pace to not be in a rush to get there as quickly as possible. I also have never been a fan of cruise control and never really used it and I had it for most of the trip along with assist steering and it was kind of nice. And we were never worried about running out of battery which is what I was most concerned about when we first left. Would the chargers be working? Full? There were zero issues with that. Combined with the fact that it was all free was a bonus.

It was an experience. The more I'm reading here and elsewhere, I guess the decreased range is just what it is under those conditions. Given this was literally worst case conditions, I'm not deterred from doing it again. Already planning next week's trip. I just recognize it takes some planning and understanding of how to make it work. Worst case, I'll Turo a car if I don't think I can make it work timewise.

completely get it.

just saying it's not for me.

what you just described is a f'n hellscape for me - and probably for a lot of people ...

city trips ...great ...long trips????

nfw

 

[BlackCrowes]

It is interesting how different people can be on long road trips. I like to stop every few hours and stretch my legs, get a drink, etc. others won’t stop if their hair is on fire.

 

[the moops]

It is interesting how different people can be on long road trips. I like to stop every few hours and stretch my legs, get a drink, etc. others won’t stop if their hair is on fire.

Yea, we have two dogs, so we stop and eat a picnic lunch and let them run or at least stop and get them for a walk. A 45 minute stop to get gas and eat and get out of the car every few hours is expected at this point. Wish that every rest area (weird federal law as to why charging stations aren't allowed on interstate rest stops - super weird and dumb) and truck stop had a charging station. Our family would gladly drive 4 hours, stop for 45 minutes to an hour and do another 3 hours.

 

[The General]

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare.

A nightmare? He was inconvenienced for a couple hours. I say pffft

I took an Amtrak to Chicago that was delayed 3.5 hours then broke down on the tracks for 3 hours, then was delayed another 2 hours getting there. And the liquor car ran out of booze. That's a nightmare

yeah that’s worse.

 

[The General]

I

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

tks - good to know this stuff

this sounds horrible for me ...I want to get to where I'm going and the idea of having to stop that much AND wait to charge AND plan on where/when to stop ...f a bunch of that

it's a non-starter for me

Appreciate the info @gianmarco, good stuff and real life insight into owning an EV in a less than desirable climate for these vehicles. As @New Binky the Doormat states, it's not for me in the current state for a long trip. I'd absolutely use one around town but driving down to see my daughter an 1 1/2 hours away doubles or triples the time of the trip. Just doesn't work for me.

I'm also an old curmudgeon and just not seeing the value in these as they stand today. For all of you championing these, rock on! I'm more of a hydrogen kind of guy instead of wasting time and material developing a temporary fix but if this turns into the "it" of the future, great! I don't think it will be but that's me. I'll be long gone before this makes an impact in the world.

gianmarco's post sums up the challenges of long trips in EVs, but the reality is 99.2% of daily car trips in America are less than 100 miles per day. So EVs absolutely work for most families, 99% of the time.

Absolutely. We are just in season now for a handful of these road trips, but the rest of the time, range is a complete non issue. Plug in at home, never have to worry about it.

Also, keep in mind, this was literally like worst case scenario with it being our first time and the dead of winter with the worst weather. If we did this in the summer, having done this now, this trip is done with 1 stop, charging half hour and grabbing lunch while we do so.

I haven‘t dealt with this type of weather and long distances but in some of the reading I have done they mention that using even a level 1 charger (know you don’t have one but maybe worth looking into at least) and preconditioning the battery helps quite a bit. The battery getting below a certain temp for too long is the issue.

You kind of have to nerd out a bit on these cars for stuff like this and check out forums to see if it works and even then just some trial and error.

Your trip certainly sounds like a nightmare. Sorry man.

No, it wasn't a nightmare at all.

It was extra time, for sure, but it never felt excessive because of how it was broken up. We found things to do to be efficient and honestly it was a nice change of pace to not be in a rush to get there as quickly as possible. I also have never been a fan of cruise control and never really used it and I had it for most of the trip along with assist steering and it was kind of nice. And we were never worried about running out of battery which is what I was most concerned about when we first left. Would the chargers be working? Full? There were zero issues with that. Combined with the fact that it was all free was a bonus.

It was an experience. The more I'm reading here and elsewhere, I guess the decreased range is just what it is under those conditions. Given this was literally worst case conditions, I'm not deterred from doing it again. Already planning next week's trip. I just recognize it takes some planning and understanding of how to make it work. Worst case, I'll Turo a car if I don't think I can make it work timewise.

It will only be easier after this one.

 

[beer 30]

For most Americans in the market for a newer vehicle, buying an EV is absolutely the smartest move fiscally.

I think folks in colder climates would disagree. Notwithstanding the Chicago event this week, virtually all of our locations in Canada have returned their EV's because they just don't cut it in the cold. Whether they travel Toronto exclusively or try to go outside the city where it becomes rural real quick. That's a whole country where the tech doesn't work right now.

 

[culdeus]

For most Americans in the market for a newer vehicle, buying an EV is absolutely the smartest move fiscally.

I think folks in colder climates would disagree. Notwithstanding the Chicago event this week, virtually all of our locations in Canada have returned their EV's because they just don't cut it in the cold. Whether they travel Toronto exclusively or try to go outside the city where it becomes rural real quick. That's a whole country where the tech doesn't work right now.

LFP chemistry seemed to move forward this topic but stalled for a few reasons. Long term there may need to be cold temp packs or even hybrid packs where not all the cells need to be warmed. Right now a lot of range loss is simply using batteries to heat batteries.

 

[the moops]

I think folks in colder climates would disagree.

Cold as hell here in the twin cities. I have a 9 mile commute though so an EV works just fine for us. As with most things it depends on circumstances and lifestyle

 

[ghostguy123]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

 

[beer 30]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

 

[ghostguy123]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

 

[beer 30]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

Yea that's the thing, they experience rolling brownouts every year now and you're adding more pressure to a grid that is tapped out now along with reducing the input to said grid.

 

[Instinctive]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

Yea that's the thing, they experience rolling brownouts every year now and you're adding more pressure to a grid that is tapped out now along with reducing the input to said grid.

Theoretically, having 1-2 100kW battery packs in every home would help with the brownout issue.

 

[ghostguy123]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

Yea that's the thing, they experience rolling brownouts every year now and you're adding more pressure to a grid that is tapped out now along with reducing the input to said grid.

Theoretically, having 1-2 100kW battery packs in every home would help with the brownout issue.

Yep. Get those kids back to the mines!!!!

 

[Instinctive]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

Yea that's the thing, they experience rolling brownouts every year now and you're adding more pressure to a grid that is tapped out now along with reducing the input to said grid.

Theoretically, having 1-2 100kW battery packs in every home would help with the brownout issue.

Yep. Get those kids back to the mines!!!!

I mean the cars themselves. If you're going to go all electric you need to be able to use the cars as battery packs and go V2G. Cars add elec to grid during peaks, charge off peaks, leveling out demand for power.

 

[culdeus]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Without additional exploration already planned the 94MMbd Crude capacity cuts to the 40MMbd range by then which is maybe overestimating the strength of the reserves. There is a finite crude capacity out there, and using it to get to shake shack is probably not sustainable. The Saudis may at some point as shocking as it sounds, run out. When that happens the world will enter a crisis. I suppose the crisis could be either we use the crude and the world burns up, or we use the crude and run out and the world starves.

 

[massraider]

The Saudis may at some point as shocking as it sounds, run out

Yeah, the Arab world isn't trying to make the Middle East a holiday spot because they love foreigners. And they aren't getting involved in sports because they love soccer or golf.

 

[the moops]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........

1) There are plenty of people that have only EV's
2) They are less efficient in colder climates, but they are hardly "crap"
3) The batteries don't die fast
4) Chargers work in cold temperatures - this Chicago thing appears to be way overblown too from a terribly sourced article that quoted like 2 people

 

[culdeus]

Let's discount the C02 aspect of everything. In a world where crude is a finite resource (it is). You can:
A) Use crude only in applications where there is no realistic alternative, sustaining our lifestyle for 200+ years.
B) ***** because you can't stand to get out of your car for more than 15 minutes on a 8hr drive you take once a year, and in 10,20, 30 years wonder why all of a sudden we are saddling horses.

The world in which we use crude to commute single humans 100 miles a week must stop, whether you like it or you hate the current tech doesn't change it.

 

[Chaos34]

Yet another example of how electric cars are important and will be quite useful....,.but they can NOT be the only type of vehicle. These cars are crap in the super cold. The batteries die fast the chargers won't work........
Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

Think so but they are usually the trend setters and then other like minded states jump on board. My question is, how they gonna power all those vehicles? They can't do it now with the comparatively small amount of EV's they have and are actively tearing down hydroelectric dams.

Interesting strategy Cotton, let's see how it works out.

My favorite was maybe a few years ago when they announced the only electric vehicle by 2035 thing, then within days asked people to stop using electricity due to excessive need.
It was rather embarrassing.

Yea that's the thing, they experience rolling brownouts every year now and you're adding more pressure to a grid that is tapped out now along with reducing the input to said grid.

no rolling blackouts in 22 and 23. brownouts are a non-issue and an ambiguous term. It's basically a lower voltage supply in mild climate coastal regions, but nobody is losing their lights and ac. i'm not suggesting the risk is gone. more drought, another heatwave like 2021 and the risk is high, but the grid has been stable for a long time. planned blackouts have been minimal for 20 years. a few in 12, 14 and 21.

 

[Joe Bryant]

no rolling blackouts in 22 and 23. brownouts are a non-issue and an ambiguous term. It's basically a lower voltage supply in mild climate coastal regions, but nobody is losing their lights and ac. i'm not suggesting the risk is gone. more drought, another heatwave like 2021 and the risk is high, but the grid has been stable for a long time. planned blackouts have been minimal for 20 years. a few in 12, 14 and 21.

Are you saying grid reliability is a non-issue?

Are articles like this wrong? E&E news by Politico: https://3.basecamp.com/3689551/buckets/2997658/messages/6907124533

Grid monitor warns of blackout risks as coal plants retire​

Rolling blackouts are a rising threat across the U.S. as aging power grids collide with extreme weather, rising electricity demand and a shift to cleaner fuels, the nation’s top grid monitor warned Wednesday.

In a report, the North American Electric Reliability Corp. said most regions of the country face growing risks of inadequate electricity supplies during periods of extreme cold and heat over the coming decade. Major wind and solar power projects that could serve metropolitan areas aren’t being built fast enough as power companies shut down old coal plants.

 

[BobbyLayne]

Is California the only state that is passing laws to ban gas fueled cars by 2035 or something like that?

California was first, New Jersey in 2021 (?), Vermont, New York, Washington and Oregon in 2022, then Massachusetts, Virginia, Rhode Island and Maryland in 2023. Think that's everyone who is committed to new gas car phaseouts by 2035.

 

[Chaos34]

no rolling blackouts in 22 and 23. brownouts are a non-issue and an ambiguous term. It's basically a lower voltage supply in mild climate coastal regions, but nobody is losing their lights and ac. i'm not suggesting the risk is gone. more drought, another heatwave like 2021 and the risk is high, but the grid has been stable for a long time. planned blackouts have been minimal for 20 years. a few in 12, 14 and 21.

Are you saying grid reliability is a non-issue?

Are articles like this wrong? E&E news by Politico: https://3.basecamp.com/3689551/buckets/2997658/messages/6907124533

Grid monitor warns of blackout risks as coal plants retire​

Rolling blackouts are a rising threat across the U.S. as aging power grids collide with extreme weather, rising electricity demand and a shift to cleaner fuels, the nation’s top grid monitor warned Wednesday.

In a report, the North American Electric Reliability Corp. said most regions of the country face growing risks of inadequate electricity supplies during periods of extreme cold and heat over the coming decade. Major wind and solar power projects that could serve metropolitan areas aren’t being built fast enough as power companies shut down old coal plants.

Mostly I was just pushing back on the comment about California with some facts, but...

I don't trust alot of reporting on the topic, Joe. It is so politicized, and terms like "rising threat" are sensationalizing a minor issue: Planned blackouts. I do follow the science pretty closely. 15 years ago I explained solar potential here with some effort and got mocked and laughed at while being 100% correct at the time. I just shrugged and dropped it. Solar costs are right where I said they'd be.

So do I think grid reliability is a non-issue? Meh, mostly yeah. Fun for the politicians and media to go on about from different perspectives, I s'pose. We're too slow improving infrastructure, modernizing the grid, and improving storage while efficiency and diverse energy sources are on the rise. We'll be fine. Extreme weather events are more problematic than planned conservation. Texas and California have the biggest risks. Florida and the Northeast have weather issues knocking out power occasionally. Think of EVs and the grid like Field of Dreams. If manufacturers build them the electricity will come. Capitalism at work. When something is in high demand money finds a way to supply it.

As always the right answer, the science based answer, is nuclear power. The future is unknown, but I'm not worried about our energy supply.

 

[jabarony]

So, we are a month and a half into ownership of our VW ID.4. It's a 2023 AWD and the reported range is supposed to be 275 miles. This is our first venture into owning an EV so have been learning stuff as we go. First of all, we did install the level 2 charger at home (hardwired, 50amp and can deliver just over 11kwh) and, even without a lot of city driving, I couldn't imagine not having it.

We've also learned how brutal the cold weather is for performance and efficiency. Now, I'm actually going to reach out to our dealership because I think our numbers are downright atrocious even factoring that in, but basically, prior to our road trip, that range is 200 miles, AT BEST. And that's driving in Eco mode, using 1 pedal driving, etc.

So, we attempted our first road trip this past weekend. We weren't on a huge time crunch that allowed us to give it a shot. Our destination (Indy) is 250 miles away. With VW, we get 30 minutes of free charging at Electrify America stations (and more, which I'll get to). On the way there, there is a station 115 miles away in Effingham, IL. Then there's another one in Terra Haute about 70 miles away and then Indy is another 70 miles away. The plan was to hit the first station and see how things went.

When we left on Friday morning, temps were in the 40's but were going to be dropping quickly throughout the day and hitting single digits by the next day. Luckily we didn't have to do a ton of driving in Indy so I just needed to get there. Hit the first station in Effingham with about 44% left (started at 100%). Not bad. Was able to get up to 85% with a 29 minute charge. What I read was that some people could unplug and finish the whole transaction and you could start again with a new free 30 minutes. So, I gave it a shot and sure enough it worked. This was huge for the trip. Did another 5ish minutes, got it just over 90% and continued on. Got to Terra Haute and decided I would charge here as well so I could have a decently full battery in Indy and possibly even make it back to Terra Haute without having to worry about charging in Indy. But, we could have made it to Indy without this stop. Did a 30 minute and then 10 minute charge and got it up to 99% and arrived in Indy. In the end, this added about 2 hours to our 4 hour drive. Not ideal but it wasn't terrible. We were able to eat during one of our stops. Did some shopping at Walmart for a couple things for the other.

Arrived in Indy, had a little driving to do, but my range of 90 miles started going downhill REALLY fast even with just a little bit of driving. There was no way I would make the 70 miles back to Terra Haute without charging first. So, Sunday morning, which I had free, I headed over to an Electrify America station about 15 minutes away. It was brutally cold (-3 F) and it took forever to charge. Ended up having to do two 30 minute sessions plus another 8 minutes to get it up to 95%. And the range the car was showing at this point was 166 miles. WTF??!! Basically a full battery and it's showing just over 50% of the range of what it should be. Now, I know it's cold, but this is basing it on our drive over here. On the way to Indy, we actually kept the heat off for most of the trip (we were comfortable and I wanted to get a feel for the range) and had it on cruise control so the car would be as efficient as possible, driving about 72mph most of the way. I know highway driving isn't the most efficient, but we tried to maximize the best we could.

Seeing that, I knew we were going to have to make both stops on the way back as well. I ended up driving about 28 miles from that charge (the 15 minutes back to the hotel plus extra going out to dinner, etc) and when we were leaving to drive back yesterday, the battery was down to 63% and showed a range of 104 miles. Needless to say, something is wrong with our battery or these temps are wreaking havoc on the EV.

We had to stop at both stations. 1 hour of charging at first station, 40 minutes of charging at second station (95%). Arrived home with 40 miles of range left :(

So, we ended up being fine. It didn't cost us anything. But it certainly added significant time and the range was completely decimated for whatever reason. I've tried to look up if these frigid temps should affect it as much as it did and, while it should definitely be lower, this seems excessive.

That said, as someone who normally drives to do road trips as quickly as possible, the stops every hour to hour and a half with breaks made the overall trip not as bad as I would have expected. Watched a couple shows during our stops, able to eat, and since we didn't have huge time constraints, we just kind of went with it. But, it's definitely not for everyone, and when on a tighter schedule, I wouldn't want to risk it.

Feel free to share thoughts on any of the above or ask anything. Sorry for the long post.

Was charging overnight in Indy not an option? Seems like plugging into a 120 volt outlet where ever you were staying would have mostly solved your issues and saved a lot of time.

1. No, neither hotel where we stayed had EV charging. The 2023 ID.4 didn't come with a level 1 charger. And honestly, there wouldn't have been a practical way to use it even if we had it.

2. Charging in Indy wouldn't have changed much at all. We didn't need to make the 2nd stop on the way to Indy but, having the peace of mind to arrive with a decent charge being our first time and the incoming weather, it was worth the extra 30-40 minutes to do on the way there. Once in Indy, we didn't have to drive much. Without getting into too much specifics, we stayed in one hotel the first night, then had to move to another hotel for the next 2 nights. The 2nd hotel was half a mile from the event we were attending and just walked at that point (I did drive that once to avoid the weather, but that was negligible). Even driving to dinner was only 5 minutes away.

3. Given the temps and decreased range, even if I had fully charged the night before we left and took off with 100% battery, I still would have had to make both stops.

The only thing an overnight charger would have saved was the time I went out Sunday morning specifically to go charge. I had the whole morning free anyway so it really wasn't that big of a deal.

Doubtful that it's worth it to you at this point, but if you find a Level 1 charger on craigslist or Facebook marketplace for cheap ($50?), could be worth it. When I first got my i3 I traveled a bit for local youth softball tournaments and local hotels will usually let you plug into a wall outlet if you have an extension cord.

Definitely get a level 1 EVSE to keep in your vehicle just in case. It’s like having a small gas can. You’ll never know when you need it.

Definitely do your best to NOT add an extension cord into the mix. You’re adding resistance to the line and run the risk of overheating. Especially as cord, EVSE, etc age.