DFS Scandals in E.F.F.E.C.T (1 Viewer)

[cstu]

FanDuel permanently bans employees from playing DFS for money amid inquiry

FanDuel spokesperson Justine Sacco told ESPN.com on Tuesday that the company's internal data showed that DraftKings employees won 0.3 percent of the money the company has awarded in its history. While Sacco wouldn't disclose the specific number, it is known the company has given out nearly $2 billion, which would put the DraftKings employees' winnings at around $6 million.

How many FTEs does DK employ? A couple hundred, maybe?

That works out to $30k per employee in one-off winnings. Even if a full quarter of them were in on this type of scam, that'd be $120,000 in gross payouts on average. Probably half of that or more in winnings. Per person.

That's one heck of a fringe benefit.

No doubt. It's a little hard to believe they're just that good. Or is it?

Not hard to believe. They do this full-time and have access to complex algorithms the average player doesn't have. It's like Aaron Rodgers against a high school team.

 

[dpeease]

I work in advertising and both FanDuel and DraftKings are clients of mine. Both have spent millions with us since the start of the football season. Long story short ...

I was in their offices with my co-workers having a meeting/negotiating the contracts and I tell them how I am a fantasy football nerd who spends way too much time reading about the NFL, constantly wins at least one fantasy title a year in very competitive leagues, and could tell you who the 3rd string RB is on all 32 teams in alphabetical order - But with that said, I have played DFS about 10 times in some high stakes leagues and can't seem to come close to cracking the top 50%. I ask them what advice they have and their VP of Marketing offers up this ...

"Don't play. It's not set up for you to win."

He then goes on to explain how teams of Wall Street professionals have left major firms and hedge funds and make their entire living now playing DFS spanning all sports (football, baseball, basketball, etc). They have offices with teams of people, data scientists, advanced algorithms, and thousands of lineups going each and every day and night.

All of the big money is won by computers with thousands of entries all using algorithms to hedge their bets and assure mass winnings.

/thread

 

[cstu]

Mr. Irrelevant, I get it.

Ive "invested" $50 in DFS, but only on the same basis as i might buy 3 powerball tickets when it gets over 100mil or as i might drop $50 on a blackjack table once every 5 years or so.

This thread, and the herd mentality media, want desperately to assume that no one walks through the door with their eyes open and that the existence of multi-entry options in DFS defines corruption. Further, calling DFS gambling is not that far from calling fantasy football gambling and that represents a threat to a pasttime that we all enjoy.

Im not trying to turn my lifesavings into a million dollars im simply trying to enjoy the chance to turn $5 into $10, $20 or more, and i dont appreciate the fascist villification of sites that allow me to enjoy this pasttime...with my eyes wide open.

Would you play roulette at a casino where you knew they were controlling where the ball lands?

 

[Squintz82]

I work in advertising and both FanDuel and DraftKings are clients of mine. Both have spent millions with us since the start of the football season. Long story short ...

I was in their offices with my co-workers having a meeting/negotiating the contracts and I tell them how I am a fantasy football nerd who spends way too much time reading about the NFL, constantly wins at least one fantasy title a year in very competitive leagues, and could tell you who the 3rd string RB is on all 32 teams in alphabetical order - But with that said, I have played DFS about 10 times in some high stakes leagues and can't seem to come close to cracking the top 50%. I ask them what advice they have and their VP of Marketing offers up this ...

"Don't play. It's not set up for you to win."

He then goes on to explain how teams of Wall Street professionals have left major firms and hedge funds and make their entire living now playing DFS spanning all sports (football, baseball, basketball, etc). They have offices with teams of people, data scientists, advanced algorithms, and thousands of lineups going each and every day and night.

All of the big money is won by computers with thousands of entries all using algorithms to hedge their bets and assure mass winnings.

/thread

Because this is remotely true

 

[Squintz82]

FanDuel permanently bans employees from playing DFS for money amid inquiry

FanDuel spokesperson Justine Sacco told ESPN.com on Tuesday that the company's internal data showed that DraftKings employees won 0.3 percent of the money the company has awarded in its history. While Sacco wouldn't disclose the specific number, it is known the company has given out nearly $2 billion, which would put the DraftKings employees' winnings at around $6 million.

How many FTEs does DK employ? A couple hundred, maybe?That works out to $30k per employee in one-off winnings. Even if a full quarter of them were in on this type of scam, that'd be $120,000 in gross payouts on average. Probably half of that or more in winnings. Per person.

That's one heck of a fringe benefit.

Not remotely correct. It's only a few employees that play big, and they should be able to do that. They were frontiers in the DFS space and were high-stakes players on Fanduel before Draftkings existed.

PetrGibbons is one of the most well-known pros in DFS and has been crushing high-stakes for years. He's a leading writer in the game theory space, a frequent contributor to Rotogrinders, and builds his own predictive models. He probably is responsible for 90% of the winnings on Fanduel from Draftkings employees by himself.

As a key employee of Draftkings I'm sure he has a % of the company, or bonus plan based on performance of the company, and sure as hell wouldn't risk that based on cheating with another company.

This whole thing stinks as a run-around for anti-DFS proponents. Nothing illegal was done here. Fanduel ownership percentages are available to anyone entered in a contest the moment lineups lock (unlike Draftkings, where the game has to start).

Someone actually gets it

 

[cstu]

New York AG starts investigation.

 

[cstu]

This is on reddit from a user name mcalvert85.

mcalvert85- 27 points 3 hours ago*

So I’ve held back from posting for a couple of days as I emailed DK directly to get their perspective but since they completely ignored my emails to people that usually responded within minutes in the past, I wanted to share two observations (one direct and one indirect but obvious) of intentional misuse of proprietary information by DK employees. I’ll preface this by saying I played nearly 9,000 paid contests this year through Oct 1. I had some decent scores but overall am not a profitable player nor do I play for a living. I originally alluded to this 19 days ago before the DK scandal so this isn’t exactly new but I’d like to elaborate in detail.

1. VIP DraftKings Event – in July, I was invited to a VIP event August 8. Here is a link to the invite Dk rented out an incredible box at the nats game and invited a lot of big action players. Everyone was awesome but during my introduction to their Head of VIP Services who I won’t out by name here, we began discussing general game theory and it came out I had faded Strasburg who was returning from the DL. Said VIP rep thought that was a gutsy play and checked his phone saying Strasburg was “pretty chalk” in tourney play that night. This was a few minutes before 7:05 and given that I hadn’t told him what contests I was playing in, broadly applied to ownership across the board. If that wasn’t sketchy enough, said rep mentioned casually how he and many others play on fanduels and other dfs sites. At that point, I went back to my seat feeling like a total moron and realizing that it was pretty obvious that with insider information and “VIP” connections to top players in a loosely regulated forum, guys like me were f’ed in the long run.

2. Rick Sawyer For the month of July, I was challenged 5 or more times a day everyday by a mysterious player named Rick Sawyer who I had never played on Fanduel, where I had a very very small and spread out sample size. He’d challenge me to baseball matches every day heads up and eventually I had to create a flow in g-mail to mark his emails as auto-read as they became so spammy. When I googled Rick Sawyer to my surprise, I was led to a “business planning manager” from DRAFTKINGS. That’s right, folks… a guy on the inside at DraftKings was pegging my play on their channel as sub-optimal (or even worse, viewing my lineups and assuming he could stack against them on FD) and hunting me on a competitor site when I didn’t even play heads up much or have a meaningful bankroll. I eventually emailed my VIP manager at DraftKings when I put two and two together and the #### stopped.

d

mcalvert85 11 points an hour ago*

Just spoke to Matt Kalish, co founder of DK

Maintains that employees can’t see internal information prior to games starting. Thinks that employee, who plays on fanduel, might have looked at rostered %. Only way this works is if there were afternoon games that day (I think there were). I still don’t have an explanation for why he would have said he shouldn’t have looked at that in front of me though.

Looking into the direct issue of an internal player attempting to repeatedly snipe me and agreed that it sounded uncalled for and not in good faith.

 

[massraider]

FanDuel permanently bans employees from playing DFS for money amid inquiry

FanDuel spokesperson Justine Sacco told ESPN.com on Tuesday that the company's internal data showed that DraftKings employees won 0.3 percent of the money the company has awarded in its history. While Sacco wouldn't disclose the specific number, it is known the company has given out nearly $2 billion, which would put the DraftKings employees' winnings at around $6 million.

How many FTEs does DK employ? A couple hundred, maybe?That works out to $30k per employee in one-off winnings. Even if a full quarter of them were in on this type of scam, that'd be $120,000 in gross payouts on average. Probably half of that or more in winnings. Per person.

That's one heck of a fringe benefit.

Not remotely correct. It's only a few employees that play big, and they should be able to do that. They were frontiers in the DFS space and were high-stakes players on Fanduel before Draftkings existed.

PetrGibbons is one of the most well-known pros in DFS and has been crushing high-stakes for years. He's a leading writer in the game theory space, a frequent contributor to Rotogrinders, and builds his own predictive models. He probably is responsible for 90% of the winnings on Fanduel from Draftkings employees by himself.

As a key employee of Draftkings I'm sure he has a % of the company, or bonus plan based on performance of the company, and sure as hell wouldn't risk that based on cheating with another company.

This whole thing stinks as a run-around for anti-DFS proponents. Nothing illegal was done here. Fanduel ownership percentages are available to anyone entered in a contest the moment lineups lock (unlike Draftkings, where the game has to start).

Oh, once lineups lock, we can all see the data? Hey, I guess it's an even playing field then.

 

[Soulfly3]

@JasonLaCanfora 1h1 hour ago
Goodell says he draws a distinction between fantasy football and daily fantasy. Says states determine legality and "we follow the law"...

‏@JasonLaCanfora 1h1 hour ago
Says NFL has taken no equity position in any daily fantasy companies. Says biggest concern is something that would influence outcome of game

 

[Wadsworth]

ESPN has just wiped itself clean. They no longer have any of that crap littering the site. I think anyone who thinks this isn't blowing up is kidding themselves. These are probably the same types who spend time semantically arguing that Jared Fogle isn't a child molester over on the FFA.

Where there is smoke there's fire......

Usually. But this story has gotten in front of any proof at this point. Clearly there needs to be some investigation, but two people having success does not prove wrong doing. The Larry Brown article posted earlier is a good example. He seems to suggest that Ethan having success means he is cheating. It is not uncommon for a top level player to go on a run, Ethan is a top level player. He might just be on a heater.

We don't have the FULL data set yet to say with 100% certainty he is winning at a rate that far exceeds expected over a long enough period of time. Thankfully the NYAG requested that data from Fanduel so we will have it. However we have have part of a data set.Where do you get the idea that Ethan is a top level player? 93 out of 105 of his big wins have come since working at DK AND he has been playing since 2013. If that doesn't scream statistical outlier not sure what does.

From Larry Brown Sports:

83 from FanDuel, between Oct. 2014-present. All but 5 came in 2015

10 were from Fantasy Feud, all between April-July 2015

6 from DraftKings, all between Nov-Dec, 2013 before he worked for them

1 from DraftStreet in Nov. 2013

Click my sig link. My RG profile will say basically the same thing but at much lower levels because I do not play the same volume. Mostly from Fanduel, almost all big wins are in 2015, etc. I have been playing daily for 3 years but did not have more than a few big wins until this year. This industry as a whole has ballooned recently, so for many players the majority of their success if going to be recent.

I clicked your link. I see a big win in a few NBA contests on April 1st. A big win in a couple MLB contests on September 12th. There are a couple others in there on random dates. Congrats, I'm sure that's been great for you.

All that is nothing close to what this guy's success rate was in MLB during August. Not even remotely approaching "basically the same thing".

Ethan plays many times the number of events at many times the entry fees. I have taken the money off every big win and keep my bankroll and method steady. It is not the same, but is the same pattern that Brown mentioned. If I was rolling over winnings into higher dollar contests and increasing activities It would look more similar if I got on a heater. McJester, Maxdulary,eHafner and many other top level players have had similar run of success. If you are playing thousands or 10s of thousands of dollars a day and have a good run it looks like Ethan.

 

[ourmanflint]

people have screenshots of people's lineups changing after the games started which fan duel insists is due to lag or some lame excuse from these super users pushing out thousands of lineups just before game time.

Seen this happen once with my own eyes. But only once... that I noticed.

I think we're all very foolish if we think there isn't a TON of bots and insiders making a killing off these sites.

Why would it matter if the lineups changed shortly after lineup lock? Its after big points start getting scored that lineup changes would matter. It would be a simple matter to download all lineups in a spreadsheet, say 5 minutes after lineup lock. The sites allow you to do it. I've done it. There should be no lag after that. Then you download them again after all of the games have been played. If they don't match or there are new entries, you got yourself a lawsuit.

 

[ROCKET]

I'm not buying that some fat cats somewhere with their big$$ computer programs are making millions off DFS. You can run algorithms and whatever programs you want but that doesn't guarantee you can predict fantasy success any better than a hardcore fan who does his homework. If it was so easy to predict performance on the field then why wouldn't they be putting Vegas out of business on playing the totals,spreads and prop bets?

To have access to the % 's that players are rostered is exactly the kind of advantage I could see them paying for thru some DFS website employee looking to make some $$ on the side.

Now if I'm a rich guy looking to cash in on DFS what angle to I take? Do I try and hire a bunch of statistics majors and sink a ton of $$ into software development in the hopes it will tilt the tables in my favor OR do I just throw some cash at someone in the know of an NFL team to find out who will be heavily involved in the current weeks game plan? I'm not asking for specific plays, just who is being featured.

There are plenty of people in any NFL organization who know which players will be featured heavily in the game plan on a given week, some of them even low level employees. To think some of them can't be bought is laughable to me. This is where the big $ players have the advantage IMO. Basically the same thing as insider trading.

 

[Daywalker]

people have screenshots of people's lineups changing after the games started which fan duel insists is due to lag or some lame excuse from these super users pushing out thousands of lineups just before game time.

Seen this happen once with my own eyes. But only once... that I noticed.

I think we're all very foolish if we think there isn't a TON of bots and insiders making a killing off these sites.

Why would it matter if the lineups changed shortly after lineup lock? Its after big points start getting scored that lineup changes would matter. It would be a simple matter to download all lineups in a spreadsheet, say 5 minutes after lineup lock. The sites allow you to do it. I've done it. There should be no lag after that. Then you download them again after all of the games have been played. If they don't match or there are new entries, you got yourself a lawsuit.

Knowing Ivory was active but not playing would have been nice the other week.

 

[ourmanflint]

It's all really no different than the online poker industry which got shut down. Both manipulated by unsavory "pros" who demonstrate a lack of ethics. As with online poker, these pseudo professional players will end up killing the goose that layed the golden eggs.

I disagree. It's backed by a lot of legit companies such as Fox Sports, MLB, NHL, MLS, Time Warner, Google and Comcast to name a few. I don't think these types of investors will let DFS go down the same road and will probably welcome transparency and scrutiny. Too much money to screw it up.

 

[ourmanflint]

people have screenshots of people's lineups changing after the games started which fan duel insists is due to lag or some lame excuse from these super users pushing out thousands of lineups just before game time.

Seen this happen once with my own eyes. But only once... that I noticed.

I think we're all very foolish if we think there isn't a TON of bots and insiders making a killing off these sites.

Why would it matter if the lineups changed shortly after lineup lock? Its after big points start getting scored that lineup changes would matter. It would be a simple matter to download all lineups in a spreadsheet, say 5 minutes after lineup lock. The sites allow you to do it. I've done it. There should be no lag after that. Then you download them again after all of the games have been played. If they don't match or there are new entries, you got yourself a lawsuit.

Knowing Ivory was active but not playing would have been nice the other week.

That wouldn't win you the money. You need to know who is going to score....BIG. That's mandatory.

 

[Daywalker]

people have screenshots of people's lineups changing after the games started which fan duel insists is due to lag or some lame excuse from these super users pushing out thousands of lineups just before game time.

Seen this happen once with my own eyes. But only once... that I noticed.

I think we're all very foolish if we think there isn't a TON of bots and insiders making a killing off these sites.

Why would it matter if the lineups changed shortly after lineup lock? Its after big points start getting scored that lineup changes would matter. It would be a simple matter to download all lineups in a spreadsheet, say 5 minutes after lineup lock. The sites allow you to do it. I've done it. There should be no lag after that. Then you download them again after all of the games have been played. If they don't match or there are new entries, you got yourself a lawsuit.

Knowing Ivory was active but not playing would have been nice the other week.

That wouldn't win you the money. You need to know who is going to score....BIG. That's mandatory.

 

[Warrior]

I'm not buying that some fat cats somewhere with their big$$ computer programs are making millions off DFS. You can run algorithms and whatever programs you want but that doesn't guarantee you can predict fantasy success any better than a hardcore fan who does his homework. If it was so easy to predict performance on the field then why wouldn't they be putting Vegas out of business on playing the totals,spreads and prop bets?

To have access to the % 's that players are rostered is exactly the kind of advantage I could see them paying for thru some DFS website employee looking to make some $$ on the side.

Now if I'm a rich guy looking to cash in on DFS what angle to I take? Do I try and hire a bunch of statistics majors and sink a ton of $$ into software development in the hopes it will tilt the tables in my favor OR do I just throw some cash at someone in the know of an NFL team to find out who will be heavily involved in the current weeks game plan? I'm not asking for specific plays, just who is being featured.

There are plenty of people in any NFL organization who know which players will be featured heavily in the game plan on a given week, some of them even low level employees. To think some of them can't be bought is laughable to me. This is where the big $ players have the advantage IMO. Basically the same thing as insider trading.

You're not a #'s guy, are you?

 

[Daywalker]

Not as extreme but I imagine it's similar to the advantage the last bidder gets on Price as Right. Once you know everyone's bets you can bet one dollar more then high bid or if the bids are all too high you bid $1. Except you can bid an unlimited amount of times as well.

 

[Fantasysports1]

DfS welcome to the big time. Are you fandueled? You will play more and more DFS.

 

[jvdesigns2002]

DfS welcome to the big time. Are you fandueled? You will play more and more DFS.

English, please.

 

[Captain Hook]

Here is another thing for the DFS companies to worry about > 1.3% of the players account for 91% of the profits (link below)

http://www.mckinsey.com/insights/media_entertainment/for_daily_fantasy_sports_operators_the_curse_of_too_much_skill

 

[Chapelboy]

DfS welcome to the big time. Are you fandueled? You will play more and more DFS.

English, please.

Sounds like a strange haiku

 

[ROCKET]

I'm not buying that some fat cats somewhere with their big$$ computer programs are making millions off DFS. You can run algorithms and whatever programs you want but that doesn't guarantee you can predict fantasy success any better than a hardcore fan who does his homework. If it was so easy to predict performance on the field then why wouldn't they be putting Vegas out of business on playing the totals,spreads and prop bets?

To have access to the % 's that players are rostered is exactly the kind of advantage I could see them paying for thru some DFS website employee looking to make some $$ on the side.

Now if I'm a rich guy looking to cash in on DFS what angle to I take? Do I try and hire a bunch of statistics majors and sink a ton of $$ into software development in the hopes it will tilt the tables in my favor OR do I just throw some cash at someone in the know of an NFL team to find out who will be heavily involved in the current weeks game plan? I'm not asking for specific plays, just who is being featured.

There are plenty of people in any NFL organization who know which players will be featured heavily in the game plan on a given week, some of them even low level employees. To think some of them can't be bought is laughable to me. This is where the big $ players have the advantage IMO. Basically the same thing as insider trading.

You're not a #'s guy, are you?

If I were would I be rich gambling on DFS and playing roulette, you know the algorithm said play black?

 

[Short Corner]

I'm not buying that some fat cats somewhere with their big$$ computer programs are making millions off DFS. You can run algorithms and whatever programs you want but that doesn't guarantee you can predict fantasy success any better than a hardcore fan who does his homework. If it was so easy to predict performance on the field then why wouldn't they be putting Vegas out of business on playing the totals,spreads and prop bets?

To have access to the % 's that players are rostered is exactly the kind of advantage I could see them paying for thru some DFS website employee looking to make some $$ on the side.

Now if I'm a rich guy looking to cash in on DFS what angle to I take? Do I try and hire a bunch of statistics majors and sink a ton of $$ into software development in the hopes it will tilt the tables in my favor OR do I just throw some cash at someone in the know of an NFL team to find out who will be heavily involved in the current weeks game plan? I'm not asking for specific plays, just who is being featured.

There are plenty of people in any NFL organization who know which players will be featured heavily in the game plan on a given week, some of them even low level employees. To think some of them can't be bought is laughable to me. This is where the big $ players have the advantage IMO. Basically the same thing as insider trading.

You're not a #'s guy, are you?

If I were would I be rich gambling on DFS and playing roulette, you know the algorithm said play black?

 

[massraider]

Me personally, I won't play it again. I hope Apple Jack and Senior VBD Student don't think I'm going all "fascist" here, because I'm not. You have my blessing to continue to throw your money down an internet hole.

I never thought it was a completely level playing field, but if what we are reading is true, it seems like there is a small percentage of people with any legitimate hope to make real money. That sucks.

Some random anecdotal evidence bout this guy or that guy that won big isn't going to convince me. My buddy won 25 grand one week in football. He's lost consistently ever since. He may still be 'up', but he isn't behaving like he is.

I really thought that the money was too big for FD or DK to ever let anything screw it up, Think I posted about it in one of the DFS threads, because people were in there, warning about the dangers. Whether they had any real reason to be worried, they were right. I was wrong.

With the company making good money, I thought they would guard their golden goose vigilantly. Instead, the staff has been using data to make more likely to win lineups. How can we ever really know this is going to stop? We can't. They are going to 'protect' the data? Please.

Not to mention the whales, that are entering massive amounts of lineups, and cleaning up in the tournaments. Nothing they are doing is "wrong", they've just figured the system, have the resources, and are doing well. Good for them. That doesn't mean that I need to be depositing my money in their account. Just because what they are doing isn't illegal, that doesn't mean I need to be the rube that throws money down the drain every week, because I'm going to 'outsmart' their algorithm.

The online poker comparison works to me. Lots of money to be made. Cheating. Maybe lots of cheating. Guys with multi-screen systems playing all day long, grinding. And the fish. The rest of us. Some of the fish valiantly defending it, bunch of suckers . Online poker got fished out, as people got tired of handing their money to pros, or cheaters, or cheating pros.

DFS will take longer, because it's a lot more fun to watch games, and root for your guys, and follow along online.

Also, people can convince themselves of anything. This thread has proven it. What are the chances this is the last of this story, that everything has come out? 5%? 10% chance?

There's already this post over on Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/dfsports/comments/3nsq94/dkleak_day_3_megathread/cvrkp5w

Is it gambling? I don't know, but people are sure behaving like it is. Cheaters, suckers, fish, and whales.

I'm not a whale, and not a cheater, that doesn't leave too many other appetizing choices.

 

[Hoss Style]

Pretty good read here on how the NFL has influenced the Fantasy Football Industry, and DFS in particular, to stay legal. Of course we all know that the NFL makes LOADS of money from it. The NFL had their own lawyers working in Congress to slide rules through that would keep Fantasy Football legal, and then tacked those rules onto other huge bills that were being passed involving National Security stuff. Nobody noticed or cared enough to argue. After all, its just fantasy sports, right? Well, that was 9 years ago. Now there's billions involved.

DFS took advantage of it, and is now starting to stretch thin the leniency that was given to our industry (fantasy sports in general).

Interesting read if you have the time.

 

[freeannyong]

ESPN has just wiped itself clean. They no longer have any of that crap littering the site. I think anyone who thinks this isn't blowing up is kidding themselves. These are probably the same types who spend time semantically arguing that Jared Fogle isn't a child molester over on the FFA.

Where there is smoke there's fire......

Usually. But this story has gotten in front of any proof at this point. Clearly there needs to be some investigation, but two people having success does not prove wrong doing. The Larry Brown article posted earlier is a good example. He seems to suggest that Ethan having success means he is cheating. It is not uncommon for a top level player to go on a run, Ethan is a top level player. He might just be on a heater.

We don't have the FULL data set yet to say with 100% certainty he is winning at a rate that far exceeds expected over a long enough period of time. Thankfully the NYAG requested that data from Fanduel so we will have it. However we have have part of a data set.Where do you get the idea that Ethan is a top level player? 93 out of 105 of his big wins have come since working at DK AND he has been playing since 2013. If that doesn't scream statistical outlier not sure what does.

From Larry Brown Sports:

83 from FanDuel, between Oct. 2014-present. All but 5 came in 2015

10 were from Fantasy Feud, all between April-July 2015

6 from DraftKings, all between Nov-Dec, 2013 before he worked for them

1 from DraftStreet in Nov. 2013

Click my sig link. My RG profile will say basically the same thing but at much lower levels because I do not play the same volume. Mostly from Fanduel, almost all big wins are in 2015, etc. I have been playing daily for 3 years but did not have more than a few big wins until this year. This industry as a whole has ballooned recently, so for many players the majority of their success if going to be recent.

I clicked your link. I see a big win in a few NBA contests on April 1st. A big win in a couple MLB contests on September 12th. There are a couple others in there on random dates. Congrats, I'm sure that's been great for you.All that is nothing close to what this guy's success rate was in MLB during August. Not even remotely approaching "basically the same thing".

Ethan plays many times the number of events at many times the entry fees. I have taken the money off every big win and keep my bankroll and method steady. It is not the same, but is the same pattern that Brown mentioned. If I was rolling over winnings into higher dollar contests and increasing activities It would look more similar if I got on a heater. McJester, Maxdulary,eHafner and many other top level players have had similar run of success. If you are playing thousands or 10s of thousands of dollars a day and have a good run it looks like Ethan.

Please provide proof that any pro has done anything near what he did in August.

 

[Steve Tasker]

I don't play DFS though I find the topic and this whole "scandal" fascinating. Something about the advertising has always struck me as shady and misleading; I think I likened it to Quibids awhile back. I think DFS would be a good way to have a little fun with your friends in a smaller pool, everyone submits a lineup once a week, and you know everyone in the league. But this thing is ripe for manipulation in the grand scheme, and I think the heightened scrutiny is going to be a problem now that there's an arms race between FD and DK for consumer money. Should be interesting to see how it plays out.

 

[Mr. Irrelevant]

I don't play DFS though I find the topic and this whole "scandal" fascinating. Something about the advertising has always struck me as shady and misleading; I think I likened it to Quibids awhile back. I think DFS would be a good way to have a little fun with your friends in a smaller pool, everyone submits a lineup once a week, and you know everyone in the league. But this thing is ripe for manipulation in the grand scheme, and I think the heightened scrutiny is going to be a problem now that there's an arms race between FD and DK for consumer money. Should be interesting to see how it plays out.

I said in another thread (think it was going on two years ago) that MFL could sign up a million new leagues overnight if only they would roll out some sort of hybrid DFS / private league option. I'd happily throw $69 at one myself, the same way I happily sit down with $200 at my neighborhood poker game even when I wouldn't have put that amount of money in play at Full Tilt.

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

im surprised Dodds & JB let this scrutiny stay here on their site to be honest. Im sure they are pocketing a lot from the DFS sites. Don't want to bite the hand that feeds ya know

 

[MattFancy]

Here's Goodell on DFS: Goodell explains why NFL has no issues with daily fantasy

“t’s hard to see the influence that it could have on the outcome of a game because individual players are picking different players from different teams, mashing them up, you might call it,” Goodell told reporters on Wednesday. “t’s not based on the outcome of a game, which is what our biggest concern is with sports betting.”

 

[RUSF18]

Me personally, I won't play it again. I hope Apple Jack and Senior VBD Student don't think I'm going all "fascist" here, because I'm not. You have my blessing to continue to throw your money down an internet hole.

I never thought it was a completely level playing field, but if what we are reading is true, it seems like there is a small percentage of people with any legitimate hope to make real money. That sucks.

Cut the rest for size but just wanted to say this is a really good post and captures my own thoughts on this situation really well.

I'm most curious about the people running these companies on a day to day basis. I could very well be wrong but I'm guessing they are managed by the people who created them, long time fantasy football people who came up with this idea and pounced. Wisely, of course. But with the money at stake, they needed to be run and staffed like any other multi-billion dollar business.

 

[habsfan]

I don't play DFS though I find the topic and this whole "scandal" fascinating. Something about the advertising has always struck me as shady and misleading; I think I likened it to Quibids awhile back. I think DFS would be a good way to have a little fun with your friends in a smaller pool, everyone submits a lineup once a week, and you know everyone in the league. But this thing is ripe for manipulation in the grand scheme, and I think the heightened scrutiny is going to be a problem now that there's an arms race between FD and DK for consumer money. Should be interesting to see how it plays out.

For me, it isn't "shady" so much as it is "guppy oriented". The ads I've seen convey that these winners are just "regular people" like me and the only reason I don't have a big cardboard cheque like they do is that I'm not getting in the game. This is akin to <insert weight loss program here> where examples of success stories are paraded out and you know full well 99% of the people fail miserably.

The game doesn't bother me or truthfully the misleading nature of the ads (name some that aren't). It's the volume (both in terms of "loudness" and frequency).

 

[Eire32]

In a statement posted on its FD website, FanDuel said it has now permanently banned its workers from playing fantasy sports for cash anywhere online. Employees of other fantasy companies also are covered: “We will also require all customers to confirm that they are not an employee of any other third-party fantasy site, and if they are, they will not be allowed to access our site,” it said.

Perhaps we will see real lineup recommendations opposed to sample lineups but I highly doubt it.

 

[Soulfly3]

im surprised Dodds & JB let this scrutiny stay here on their site to be honest. Im sure they are pocketing a lot from the DFS sites. Don't want to bite the hand that feeds ya know

I'm not.

Taking this thread down would basically be a "death wish" for anyone on this forum, who in turn would likely talk their friends out of it, etc

You cant pull a thread like this from the most important FF website going... It'd just be wayyyyy too much shade

 

[DoubleG]

In a statement posted on its FD website, FanDuel said it has now permanently banned its workers from playing fantasy sports for cash anywhere online. Employees of other fantasy companies also are covered: “We will also require all customers to confirm that they are not an employee of any other third-party fantasy site, and if they are, they will not be allowed to access our site,” it said.

Perhaps we will see real lineup recommendations opposed to sample lineups but I highly doubt it.

The problem with this policy is as long as the employees have access to data earlier than the public, it's not that hard to simply "pass the info along" to a friend, family member, etc. - for a small % of the take, of course.

 

[Eire32]

What exactly constitutes a "3rd party employee" does this include independent contractors who write for fantasy football websites?

A mass exodus will be taking place very soon.

 

[Raiderfan32904]

Speaking of biting the hand that feeds....was listening to Erik Kuselias on his national radio gig talking about the scandal. He prefaces everything with "DK and FD...both of them are great great companies"....then tries to compare it to the national march madness tournament entries essentially calling DFS the same exact thing. Now I know Kuselias is smart man and he's purposely throwing out a red herring to try to make his point. Except he's being paid to shill for FD and DK inside his monologue. I hear him try to defend DFS and laugh. He's got zero credibility on the subject.

 

[Old Smiley]

In a statement posted on its FD website, FanDuel said it has now permanently banned its workers from playing fantasy sports for cash anywhere online. Employees of other fantasy companies also are covered: “We will also require all customers to confirm that they are not an employee of any other third-party fantasy site, and if they are, they will not be allowed to access our site,” it said.

Perhaps we will see real lineup recommendations opposed to sample lineups but I highly doubt it.

The problem with this policy is as long as the employees have access to data earlier than the public, it's not that hard to simply "pass the info along" to a friend, family member, etc. - for a small % of the take, of course.

But, at least there's clear grounds for discipline. A policy in place to violate.

 

[Eire32]

Difficult to differentiate between DFS and stock option calls.

 

[Skoo]

Speaking of biting the hand that feeds....was listening to Erik Kuselias on his national radio gig talking about the scandal. He prefaces everything with "DK and FD...both of them are great great companies"....then tries to compare it to the national march madness tournament entries essentially calling DFS the same exact thing. Now I know Kuselias is smart man and he's purposely throwing out a red herring to try to make his point. Except he's being paid to shill for FD and DK inside his monologue. I hear him try to defend DFS and laugh. He's got zero credibility on the subject.

Seems kind of short-sighted for these guys to give up their integrity like that.

I understand they're being paid by these companies, but if no one trusts what they say anymore, people will stop listening/subscribing or whatever, and the DK and FD sponsorships will be soon to follow.

 

[bagger]

How do we know that DK and FD aren't using bots to play in their own contests?

you mean like this?https://dfsreport.com/6840/fanduel-draftkings-mishaps/

(Read a bit of the way down past the current scandal).

Actually that wasn't the exact link I was looking for I think there is one on Reddit or rotogrinders that shows fan duel filling contests with their own entries.

 

[urbanhack]

Speaking of biting the hand that feeds....was listening to Erik Kuselias on his national radio gig talking about the scandal. He prefaces everything with "DK and FD...both of them are great great companies"....then tries to compare it to the national march madness tournament entries essentially calling DFS the same exact thing. Now I know Kuselias is smart man and he's purposely throwing out a red herring to try to make his point. Except he's being paid to shill for FD and DK inside his monologue. I hear him try to defend DFS and laugh. He's got zero credibility on the subject.

Still can't believe he's married to Holly Saunders. mind blowing.

 

[habsfan]

In a statement posted on its FD website, FanDuel said it has now permanently banned its workers from playing fantasy sports for cash anywhere online. Employees of other fantasy companies also are covered: “We will also require all customers to confirm that they are not an employee of any other third-party fantasy site, and if they are, they will not be allowed to access our site,” it said.

Perhaps we will see real lineup recommendations opposed to sample lineups but I highly doubt it.

The problem with this policy is as long as the employees have access to data earlier than the public, it's not that hard to simply "pass the info along" to a friend, family member, etc. - for a small % of the take, of course.

or more simply, how on earth will they enforce this? To suggest they can keep "employees of other fantasy companies" out of their games seems impossible. To institute a policy to try to do this tells me that insiders can and do cheat.

 

[shadyridr]

Wow how will those EEs every get past the checkbox security question? I never knew how to get past the age verification question when I was viewing porn online as a teenager.

 

[Quez]

I'm sure DK & FD are going to do whatever it takes to keep this cash cow rolling. It's comforting to see DK being proactive. They make so much money, they don't need or want this crap going on.

Percentages owned is a minor advantage, but the avg. Joe can get an idea of % owned by getting in Thur $1's.

You still need the players to perform. I'm more concerned about Peyton Marino's story of someone stalking him to play h2h.

I wonder if FBGs can see what lineups people are trying the most on their tool? I'd bet those #'s would look pretty similar.

 

[freeannyong]

Do you guys really think he only had the % ownership data? Come on. If he had that data there is >90% chance he had full lineups with screen names.

And he didn't just have this for NFL but for MLB where he absolutely shredded FD in the entire month of August.

 

[freeannyong]

And here we have some more goodies:

https://rotogrinders.com/threads/go-to-draftstreet-put-in-chat-league-1874137-look-at-175242?page=4#reply-175529

https://twitter.com/jbxx21/status/651936478113701891

Cliffs: looks like a lot of people had access to the database with lineups and usernames

Edit: fixed links

 

[Quez]

Links are broken

 

[Steve Tasker]

Do you guys really think he only had the % ownership data? Come on. If he had that data there is >90% chance he had full lineups with screen names.

And he didn't just have this for NFL but for MLB where he absolutely shredded FD in the entire month of August.

Nonsense, I'm sure he's just really really good at DFS. You could be too if you tried harder