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Defensive Projections (1 Viewer)

taylorj99

Footballguy
So, rather than just basing my starting lineup on the projections provided, I decided to look at the FP Scored/Against statistics. Based on those numbers alone, I find myself a bit confused. While, I see a greater opportunity for player A to outscore player B, the weekly projections don't reflect the same. Is there something I'm missing, or is player A given more value based on his name?

 
John Norton produces our projections and Clayton Gray runs the FP scored against spreadsheets from the statistics through Doug Drinen's database.

The FP scored sheets only provide a historical overview and don't separate DT from DE, ILB from OLB and CB from S. It also doesn't break out tackles from other defensive plays. I know John works from his own spreadsheet that totals tackles by position against each team and that he considers quite a few other forward thinking trends (injuries, more highly values the most recent 1-3 games, expectations of game flow, known subpackage trends, expected lineup changes, etc.).

We'd prefer not to discuss large portions of the projections outside the subscriber window, but I'm happy to try to decipher the differences between the FP scored list and John's projections for a couple of selected examples if you like.

 
Here’s an example. NYG DL are projected to scored 31.8 points combined. Looking at FP scored/allowed they’ve scored an average of 20.3. SF has allowed -3.6 for a differential of 16.7.

For comparison I looked at Tampa Bay. Combined, their DL are projected for 13.9. Again, I looked at FP scored/allowed. They’ve scored an average of 20.6 and KC has allowed +10 for a differential of 30.6.

I also looked at total FP scored for each player listed as a DL for both teams. To date, NYG DL (JPP, Osi, and Tuck) are ranked 28, 49, and 53. This week they are projected to be 24, 41, and 17. I compared Tampa Bay DL again. Bennett and McCoy thus far are ranked 16 and 23 for points scored. This week, they’re ranked 19 and 40 among DL.

Now, I realize that the “benefit of the doubt” is given to the Giants linemen, but this seems like a big gap. Maybe I’m overlooking something very important. I do appreciate your help.

 
without looking at the numbers too closely, I think it's clear the Giants DL has underperformed compared to expectations so I'd expect them to improve over time. this is a tough matchup as the 49ers don't give up many sacks and block pretty well up front in the running game, but the Giants players were thought to be pretty matchup-independent coming into the year.

as for Tampa, they did lose a starting DE so I'd expect them to perform worse than they have earlier this year. KC does look like a favorable matchup for them, but Baltimore and San Diego linemen didn't do a whole lot the past two weeks so it's trending downward.

 
NYG DL are projected to scored 31.8 points combined. Looking at FP scored/allowed they’ve scored an average of 20.3. SF has allowed -3.6 for a differential of 16.7.

The DL points/scored allowed sheets are (unfortunately) filled with confounding factors, especially early in the season when there are small sample sizes. Of the five teams SF has faced, two are 3-4 fronts. That generally depresses fantasy scoring overall and there are fewer defensive linemen to tally. However, your point that John may be over-projecting the NYG defensive linemen is well made. Very few defensive linemen (3-4 or 4-3) have been successful against them.

I think it's reasonable to project them to have above-average tackle stats on the road against this San Francisco offense. It looks like Tuck and JPP are given the benefit of about an extra tackle each from their yearly personal averages. Of the top three defensive ends, John has only projected them for 1.5 sacks total, which also isn't too far out of line for an OL that's allowed 2.5 per game thus far.

When you compare each individual NYG DL stat lines thus far to what could be expected in this week's game, the strikingly optimistic differential is a little easier to buy.

The larger question, of course, is how useful one set of data is versus another. Frankly, I'm not sure how to answer that question. My bias is to consider the historical stat lines (both DL and opposing OL) in the context of their play on the field and this particular week's expectation. The FP scored/allowed plays some role in that, but a small role.

To complete the exercise in this case (hopefully this stays on point as I ramble through the thought process)...

**The Niners allow an above-average number of tackle opportunities and have been running just over 50% of the time (below average). The Niners allow 2.5 sacks a game, which is slightly above average and possibly underestimates the strength of their pass blocking given the shutout they pitched against a terrible NYJ group last week.

**The most attractive prior DL comps (Mario Williams, Jared Allen, Brian Robison, Mark Anderson, Cliff Avril and Kyle Vanden Bosch) have not had great success. How much of that is due to their own inconsistency versus the strength of the SF offensive line is something of an open question.

Jason Pierre-Paul is projected 3-1, 0.5 sacks.

He's not had a three solo (or better) week since W2. He has a long history of 3+ solo weeks over the past 20+ weeks, however. I think there's a very reasonable argument that three solos and 0.5 sacks is a very reasonable baseline for JPP, regardless of matchup. Recent SF / JPP history suggests 2-0-0 is very possible, past history and a different argument looking at the same numbers might make a 4-1-1 line look reasonable.

Justin Tuck is projected 4-1, 0.5 sacks.

That looks optimistic on the surface for lots of reasons. But Tuck's tackle numbers have been more consistent in the past two weeks and he's been a slightly more effective pass rusher so I can see where John's optimism can be argued. But it's still a little high for me.

 
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Ugh, that post is a mess. That's what comes from stepping away from it three different times to do other things I suppose. :wall:

I'll leave it up in the hopes there's some value in there and I'll try to clean it up later.

 
I guess I didn't give enough weight to the underlying causes of points scored/against or the small sample size. I too believe that the NYG DL will, by seasons end, meet or come close to preseason projections. I'm just leery of DL projected to score nearly 10 points, when they haven't shown that trend at all this year. I'm also not quick to discount stronger performances from players who haven't historically performed to that level. Things change, sometimes drastically.

I have numerous players on my roster that, based on preseason projections, should be dominating but aren't. *points to the shirt*. I'm just trying to learn more about how the weekly projections are formulated so that maybe I may tweak based on what I feel carries more weight(ie. opportunity vs historical performances).

Again, thank you for your insight.

 

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