American held hostage by al Qaeda appeals to Obama... (1 Viewer)

[timschochet]

This is my last post for a while (got to get to work)- I know a lot of you are annoyed with me and you think I am defending this deal for no reason- and maybe you guys are right, maybe we'll learn that it was a terrible deal.

But the larger point is that too many of you are guilty, IMO, of linear thinking here. Saints was right about one thing- we have less leverage in Afghanistan than we did, because we're leaving. Unless you are willing to stay and invest billons of dollars and our military in Afghanistan long term, we HAVE TO LEAVE. And if we leave without diplomatic endeavors, there's going to be a bloodbath. That won't affect us much- Afghanistan never was a big deal in itself to us- it's Pakistan that is the big deal. Any action we take or don't take that results in Pakistan going Islamist will cost us, not billions but trillions, and not thousands of American lives, but hundreds of thousands, possibly more. We can afford to lose the Ukraine, even Poland, to Russia. We can afford to lose South Korea if we had to, or even Taiwan. We cannot afford to lose Pakistan to radical Islamism- not until the day when we're completely free of petroleum as an energy source.

So please consider this when you look at these sorts of deals. There is a larger issue at stake.

 

[Fennis]

So do we have a policy on prisoner swapping?

The US does not have a policy against prisoner swaps.

The US has a stated policy of not negotiating with terrorists. The way the US bypasses this is by indirectly negotiating (using a third party) with groups we commonly refer to as terrorists. The groups we negotiate with in this fashion are the ones who fight guerilla warfare against us and use some terroristic tactics. We commonly have direct negotiations, at the local level, by the military in unofficial ways.

OTOH, the US wouldn't negotiate with Al Qaeda for instance.

 

[tri-man 47]

So what we have here is a complicated diplomatic deal, the type that the Obama administration has performed again and again in this region and for which I give them great credit- he is probably the best foreign policy President in my lifetime. And as part of that deal, an American hostage is going to be released, which is a great victory for us- even though from what I'm reading, it's essentially an added bonus. The real key was getting negotiations between Karzai and the Taliban- central to our being able to leave Afghanistan. Karzai, who is a corrupt thug (but OUR corrupt thug) doesn't like it much, apparently, but we have to do this.

You are well-known for stating this over and over. As such, it doesn't allow for you to see objectively when it comes to his foreign policy.

Chicago Trib's Opinion page cartoon today (not yet posted on their web site):

A long limo parked outside the White House with just Obama, sitting alone in the back seat. The limo is labeled "Foreign Policy," and the caption is something to the effect of "the driverless car existed before Google."

 

[Zegras11]

Something about this doesn't make sense.

Why would America/Obama/whatever go against a long standing policy of not negotiating to rescue a soldier who deserted his post?

Because they are trying to clean out Guantanamo. Not sure I see any other reason to be honest.

Fine, clean out Guantanamo. But why tie their release to his release effectively destroying a long held position and putting at risk future Americans? I haven't seen a reporter ask the question which makes me also think something else is up.

No idea, doesn't make a ton of sense to me. They could have done this without making a spectacle of it also.

Just an FYI.... The mission to get Bergdahl released has constantly been on the news all four years I've been in Boise. I think he's from Hailey, next to Sun Valley.

 

[siffoin]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

 

[Ditka Butkus]

This is my last post for a while (got to get to work)- I know a lot of you are annoyed with me and you think I am defending this deal for no reason- and maybe you guys are right, maybe we'll learn that it was a terrible deal.

But the larger point is that too many of you are guilty, IMO, of linear thinking here. Saints was right about one thing- we have less leverage in Afghanistan than we did, because we're leaving. Unless you are willing to stay and invest billons of dollars and our military in Afghanistan long term, we HAVE TO LEAVE. And if we leave without diplomatic endeavors, there's going to be a bloodbath. That won't affect us much- Afghanistan never was a big deal in itself to us- it's Pakistan that is the big deal. Any action we take or don't take that results in Pakistan going Islamist will cost us, not billions but trillions, and not thousands of American lives, but hundreds of thousands, possibly more. We can afford to lose the Ukraine, even Poland, to Russia. We can afford to lose South Korea if we had to, or even Taiwan. We cannot afford to lose Pakistan to radical Islamism- not until the day when we're completely free of petroleum as an energy source.

So please consider this when you look at these sorts of deals. There is a larger issue at stake.

If what you perceive happening hinges on our diplomatic endeavors with -untrustworthy Islamic fundamentalist - (redundant)...we are already F-ed.

 

[Kal El]

Siffoin, your post was eloquent and poignant. I can at least speak for myself in saying that I feel bad for Bowe in that I'm reasonably sure his time as a POW wasn't pleasant. I'm also glad that he'll be reunited with his parents. However, the circumstances of his departure from his base are highly questionable, as are his actions prior to said departure. Only time will tell what will happen, and if any charges will be leveled against him for at least going AWOL.

 

[fantasycurse42]

Siff - I agree about reserving judgement too... The one drawback I do see though is this; If he did leave his platoon behind, and these allegations being made by some members of this platoon are that he did, then others will not be coming home due to his actions who lost their lives looking for him. So while his parents have their child back, if the allegations being made are true, there are parents who will never see their children again due to his actions. We have to wait for the info to become available before making judgement on this particular soldier though.

 

[jonessed]

Sorry guys, but Karzai has consistently lied to the news media, just as he has lied to his own people, just as he has lied to us. He's the 21st century version of President Diem; he's our thug, we're stuck with him only because the other dudes are far worse. Maybe he didn't know about the deal, though I find that extremely doubtful, because it's been under negotiations for months now. More likely, he didn't know about Obama's final decision process to execute it, for reasons that should be obvious to anyone.

Apparently the Taliban isn't on board either.

"It won't help the peace process in any way, because we don't believe in the peace process," Taliban spokesman Zabihullah Mujahid said on Sunday.

You need to stop listening so much to what these crazies are saying and pay attention to what the bottom line goals are for us. To put it simply:1. We have to leave Afghanistan, and soon.

2. We need to prevent the Taliban from taking control of the entire country once we leave, so we don't have to go back.

3. Most important of all, we need to prevent Islamist forces sympathetic to the Taliban from gaining the upper hand politically in Pakistan, LONG TERM.

If you understand that these goals are what's really important, ESPECIALLY #3, then you can see this all as a chess match for us- a modern version of the "Great Game" that Britain played in the 19th century in the same region. What you're seeing here is small moves. I happen to think they are good small moves, really the only moves we can make at this time, but we won't know the long term results for some time.

I posted this already, but it already answers your questions:

Then explain why the Taliban says they have no desire to join the peace talks.

Karzai's not joining peace talks and neither is the Taliban, apparenly the US did not include either party to the peace talks in this little scheme.

And why the hell should the Taliban negotiate ANYTHING when the US is leaving soon. They just got their Top 5 most wanted leaders back and they're holding all the cards.

The article you posted was from 2012, when at least we still held a little leverage. That's gone now.

The Great Game was played by some of the greatest foreign policy minds of all time. There is not one single of them who would have waited two years until after their leverage had disappeared to simply hand over assets that would help lead directly to Nos. 2 & 3 actually taking place.

The AQ & Taliban forces just got a huge morale boost; our allies in AFG are running for cover.

The Taliban is holding all the cards. Yeah, sure, right. Thanks to Obama's military surge, their infrastructure has almost been completely destroyed. They are a shell of the group they once were. The only cards they hold are millions of Muslims sympathetic to Islamism who MIGHT be upset if we completely destroy the Taliban- which is the main reason we haven't done it. These 5 guys who have been rotting in prison aren't going to add anything to the Taliban strength. We've eliminated that strength.

 

[Zegras11]

The reaction to this is really starting to piss me off.

I don't care if this guy screwed up by walking off the base. If he deserted, that's another matter, but somebody had better prove it. Otherwise II don't care. And I don't care if he loves the Taliban or his dad loves the Taliban or whatever. He's an American soldier. He was being held hostage. What the #### is wrong with you people??

That was a rhetorical question, because I know what's wrong. If this were anybody but Obama, the country would celebrate that we got one of ours back safely and be damned of the cost. But not with Obama. Whatever he does has got to be wrong.

It's not Obama you paid shill, it's the Rolling Stones article and now the tweets posted here that people are legitimately questioning. How much do you get paid for posting your Obama rhetoric over and over and over all the time?

 

[timschochet]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

Great. great posting.

 

[igbomb]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

Great post. I think your portrayal is probably the most likely. He almost certainly pulled a dumb move and walked off the base intentionally. He likely also didn't want to become Taliban, just wanted to get out of the conflict.

 

[Zegras11]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

Same here. Never heard anything about this part until now.

I also heard that he won't be charged because the penalty is five years and they are going to count his five years as being served.

 

[Todd Andrews]

I think we should have given the Taliban 1500 missiles for him.

 

[MaxThreshold]

This is was part of a larger deal that we've been working on for some time in order to bring about negotiations between the Taliban and the Karzai government. The release of this American was only a small part of that larger deal, which apparently is quite complex.

Karzai doesn't seem too pleased about the deal

The Afghan president is angry at being kept in the dark over a deal to free five Taliban leaders in exchange for a captured U.S. soldier, and accuses Washington of failing to back a peace plan for the war-torn country, a senior source said on Monday.

The five prisoners were flown to Qatar on Sunday as part of a secret agreement to release Army Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl, who left Afghanistan for Germany on the same day.

The only known U.S. prisoner of war in Afghanistan, Bergdahl had been held captive for five years.

"The president is now even more distrustful of U.S. intentions in the country," said the source close to President Hamid Karzai's palace in Kabul, who declined to be identified.

"He is asking: How come the prisoner exchange worked out so well, when the Afghan peace process failed to make any significant progress?"

http://www.newsweek.com/president-hamid-karzai-reportedly-angry-over-prisoner-deal-252968

Tim's reply:

That isn't proof. The only proof I need is the fact that I worship Obama. Don't go and send me links because I won't read them. I make up my own #### and go along with it.

To be fair to Tim, you can pretty much say this about 98% of the progressive posters in these forums.

 

[Bogeys]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

Same here. Never heard anything about this part until now.

I also heard that he won't be charged because the penalty is five years and they are going to count his five years as being served.

I agree, never heard it either. The reports that are coming out from the people in his unit (supposedly I guess) are saying they were forced to tell the official story while he was still a prisoner but can tell the truth now, who knows at this point?

I am guessing the 5 year penalty you are referencing would be AWOL? Some of the military folks help me out here, assuming that he did leave his post and just walk away why would that not be desertion in a war zone?

 

[StrikeS2k]

When I was a young boy, I wore a metal bracelet around my wrist with the name of a US Air Force pilot who was shot down over Vietnam and became a POW.

There was a time when one of the POW's who got released came and spoke at our church. I was probably 8 years old, and the speech made an impact. He spoke of torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation. The worst of the worst that someone could do to another was what I heard.

I live in Idaho, and the story of Bowe Bergdahl has been in the news for the past five years. Idaho is a very conservative state...extremely supportive of the military. Until now I don't recall ever hearing Bowe was a traitor. And I'm quite confident that over the past five years Bowe has suffered torture, humiliation, degradation, starvation, and isolation.

I'm going to reserve judgement, until there are formal charges against him.

My take is that Bowe was an idealistic young man who became morally conflicted by the horrors of war. It's quite possible he made a series of bad decisions, that not only affected his life but others. He has certainly suffered for those decisions. And again, if he is guilty of a crime, I will reserve judgement until he is actually charged with a crime. For Americans to print and sell t-shirts designed to further humiliate this man and for others to "cheer" that further is disgusting and is just symbolic of our own descent away from a moral high ground.

As for his parents. I find it extremely distasteful for others to judge them primarily based upon the looks of the father (who to me looks like Phil Robertson GOP headline speaker or any other random collection of men living in Idaho). I know if my kid were a captive POW, I would be doing anything to try and secure their release. If that meant using twitter or letters or appealing to any ends possible I would do it because I'm 100000% biased for my own flesh and blood. I would be desperate for my child's release, and I would go to the ends of the world for it. And I would hope any of you fathers would too.

Back to the bracelet. I wore that for at least a year. And I can remember bawling when I was told "MY" POW wouldn't be coming home. I'm glad Bowe Bergdahl is.

Same here. Never heard anything about this part until now.

I also heard that he won't be charged because the penalty is five years and they are going to count his five years as being served.

I agree, never heard it either. The reports from that are coming out from the people in his unit (supposedly I guess) are saying they were forced to tell the official story while he was still a prisoner but can tell the truth now, whoe knows at this point?

I am guessing the 5 year penalty you are referencing would be AWOL? Some of the military folks help me out here, assuming that he did leave his post and just walk away why would that not be desertion in a war zone?

My understanding is he could be charged with desertion or being AWOL. Most people don't think he will be since he was held prisoner for 5 years. They figure that's punishment enough.

 

[Zegras11]

HAILEY - Mayor Fritz Haemmerle says Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl's hometown and a planned celebration for the released soldier are coming under fire.

Hailey has received a flood of emails and calls since it was announced Saturday that Bergdahl had been released after almost five years as prisoner of the Taliban. US officials negotiated the exchange of Bergdahl for five Guantanamo Bay detainees.

Many of the comments the town has received come from "extreme polar sides," Haemmerle wrote in a Monday release. As the town celebrates the return of one of their own, he urged those with a dim view of Bergdahl not to"pre-judge" the man.

The circumstances around Bergdahl's capture have come under scrutiny, with some saying he lagged behind on a patrol and others branding him a deserter who snuck away from his post. There are still few details on how he was taken prisoner.

If Bergdahl did leave his post without official leave, he could face prosecution under military law. But Haemmerle says people should wait until an investigation is complete before railing against the soldier.

"If objective facts and a careful investigation reveal that Bowe Bergdahl should face consequences in a United States Courtroom, then the United States should do what it believes is necessary, " he wrote. "On the other hand, if the same investigation shows that there is no evidence to support any action, then the process has worked, and people should take comfort that due process has been served."

The rally-turned-celebration, the name of which was changed from "Bring Bowe Back" to "Bowe is Back" after news broke of his release, is scheduled for June 28.

Mayor Fritz Haemmerle's full statement is below:

The City of Hailey is very pleased with the release of Bowe Bergdahl from captivity. For these past nearly five years, the City of Hailey has stood by Bowe Bergdahl’s family in their quest to bring their son home. That day has arrived, and the City of Hailey can take comfort that Bowe Bergdahl has been returned.

Past Bowe Bergdahl celebrations in Hailey have focused on bringing this soldier home. For the men and women who choose to serve, the City of Hailey believes we do not leave our soldiers behind. Bowe Bergdahl’s family is a part of our community. We celebrate the return of their son to his hometown.

The City of Hailey has received many phone calls and e-mails on the extreme polar sides of Bowe Bergdahl’s release. There are those who have negative opinions about the release of Bowe Bergdahl and the City of Hailey's planned celebration of the return of this young man to his hometown. Some of these negative e-mails do raise some very important points. If objective facts and a careful investigation reveal that Bowe Bergdahl should face consequences in a United States Courtroom, then the United States should do what it believes is necessary. On the other hand, if the same investigation shows that there is no evidence to support any action, then the process has worked, and people should take comfort that due process has been served.

The City of Hailey respectfully requests that people do not pre-judge this young man. The City of Hailey believes in due process, and we are very happy to let the process unfold. In the meantime, our celebration will focus on Bowe Bergdahl’s release and the relief of his family and those who live here.

http://www.ktvb.com/news/local/Haileys-mayor-releases-statement-after-negative-opinions-on-Bergdahl-release-261559201.html

 

[juanjuan]

Tim's reply:

That isn't proof. The only proof I need is the fact that I worship Obama. Don't go and send me links because I won't read them. I make up my own #### and go along with it.

Mullah Abbas Timschochet is getting pissed? #### him!

Good postings

 

[Widbil83]

Anybody see that interview on CNN about 20 minutes ago from the SGT who served with Bergdaul? Definitely confirmed that he was a deserter. The guy had tattoos of his two buddies that died looking for his dumb ###.

 

[jon_mx]

Has Tim weighed in yet? This has got to be part of Obama's brilliant foreign policy that the common laymen are just too stupid to understand.

I would like to offer my sincerest apologies to the entire FFA for asking Tim to weigh in on this subject.

 

[Billy Bats]

Did anyone read the Rolling Stone article from 2012?

According to officials familiar with the internal debate, there are those in both Congress and the Pentagon who view Bowe as a deserter, and perhaps even a traitor.

And I doubt those opinions started in 2012.http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/americas-last-prisoner-of-war-20120607#ixzz33W7JMRZS

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Sorry guys, but Karzai has consistently lied to the news media, just as he has lied to his own people, just as he has lied to us. He's the another version of President Obama; he's our thug, we're stuck with him only because the other dudes are far worse. Maybe he didn't know about the deal, though I find that extremely doubtful, because it's been under negotiations for months now. More likely, he didn't know about Obama's final decision process to execute it, for reasons that should be obvious to anyone.

Fixed

 

[mr roboto]

I don't know how the Obama administration wouldn't have vetted out these stories. This is just such a cluster.

 

[Wilfredo Ledezma]

what a cluster#### this is gonna lead to. This makes no sense and is plum ######ed. Mental note: when travelling foreign attach maple leaf to backpack. How could this happen?

 

[ArbyMelt]

I think this will be the worst of all the Obama scandals. I know people on both sides politically that are pissed off by this story. I have no idea what the Obama administration was thinking on this one. And they throw Susan Rice on the Sunday shows to defend it.

And, Tim, do you really think he didn't desert? Even the pentagon concluded that in 2010:

A Pentagon investigation concluded in 2010 that Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl walked away from his unit, and after an initial flurry of searching the military decided not to exert extraordinary efforts to rescue him, according to a former senior defense official who was involved in the matter.

http://news.yahoo.com/us-concluded-2010-bergdahl-walked-away-185047684--politics.html?soc_src=mediacontentstory

 

[avoiding injuries]

I'm glad the solider is free. I'm sorry other soilders lost their life trying to rescue him. I'll withhold judgment about the legitimacy of him being a deserter until more info comes out (although it's not looking good). I don't like that this decision was made without following the laws in place. I also don't agree with the trading of 5 terrorists who are "high risk" to return to the fight.

Here is an article from the Washington Post about what the release of these 5 guys could mean, and talks about what happened when President Bush released a "medium risk" prisoner. : http://wapo.st/T72LQS

With all that said, I am really confused why the White House would hold a ceremony in the Rose Garden to celebrate this. They had to be aware that if nothing else, this move would be viewed as controversial.

 

[jon_mx]

This is my last post for a while....

It was only an hour, but a fine hour it was.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

what a cluster#### this is gonna lead to. This makes no sense and is plum ######ed. Mental note: when travelling foreign attach maple leaf to backpack. How could this happen?

POWs are different than civilians, in case you guys are seriously worried that this is some big sea change in the whole "negotiating with terrorists" thing.

 

[BeaverCleaver]

So what we have here is a complicated diplomatic deal, the type that the Obama administration has performed again and again in this region and for which I give them great credit- he is probably the best foreign policy President in my lifetime. And as part of that deal, an American hostage is going to be released, which is a great victory for us- even though from what I'm reading, it's essentially an added bonus. The real key was getting negotiations between Karzai and the Taliban- central to our being able to leave Afghanistan. Karzai, who is a corrupt thug (but OUR corrupt thug) doesn't like it much, apparently, but we have to do this.

You never know when to stop. You look like a total fool in this thread.

 

[avoiding injuries]

Wait, I thought these terrorists were going to be held in custody by Qatar for a certain time? They arrived this morning free and received a hero's welcome. That sucks.

http://drudge.tw/1l1ozI1

 

[Zegras11]

I'm glad the solider is free. I'm sorry other soilders lost their life trying to rescue him. I'll withhold judgment about the legitimacy of him being a deserter until more info comes out (although it's not looking good). I don't like that this decision was made without following the laws in place. I also don't agree with the trading of 5 terrorists who are "high risk" to return to the fight.

Here is an article from the Washington Post about what the release of these 5 guys could mean, and talks about what happened when President Bush released a "medium risk" prisoner. : http://wapo.st/T72LQS

With all that said, I am really confused why the White House would hold a ceremony in the Rose Garden to celebrate this. They had to be aware that if nothing else, this move would be viewed as controversial.

that link paints a picture only Tim can defend. oof.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Wait, I thought these terrorists were going to be held in custody by Qatar for a certain time? They arrived this morning free and received a hero's welcome. That sucks.

http://drudge.tw/1l1ozI1

This .... is going to get so, so bad.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Did anyone read the Rolling Stone article from 2012?

According to officials familiar with the internal debate, there are those in both Congress and the Pentagon who view Bowe as a deserter, and perhaps even a traitor.

And I doubt those opinions started in 2012.http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/news/americas-last-prisoner-of-war-20120607#ixzz33W7JMRZS

I am ashamed to even be american.

I am ashamed to be an american. And the title of US soldier is just the lie of fools. ... The US army is the biggest joke the world has to laugh at. It is the army of liars, backstabbers, fools, and bullies.

Page 4, quotes from BB.

 

[Chaka]

Has anyone seen pics of Bob Bergdahl, the soldier's father? He looks like an American Taliban himself.

He also looks like an extra from Duck Dynasty.

 

[Jim11]

Contrast:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/05/obama-negotiates-with-taliban-to-release-pow-but-leaves-us-marine-to-rot-in-mexican-jail/

Obama Negotiates With Taliban to Release POW But Leaves US Marine to Rot in Mexican Jail

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Has anyone seen pics of Bob Bergdahl, the soldier's father? He looks like an American Taliban himself.

He also looks like an extra from Duck Dynasty.

Somehow, this might be the picture of Bob we see most frequently in the coming months.

http://thecount.com/wp-content/uploads/Bob-Jani-Bergdahl-obama-1.jpg

 

[Chaka]

Here's Bob Bergdahl tweeting the Taliban again, actually retweeting out their tweets::

Retweeted by Robert Bergdahl

zabihullahmujahid @zabihmujahid · May 30
Rejoinder of the Islamic Emirate regarding Obama’s recent announcement of extension of occupation http://shahamat-english.com/index.php/comments/45429-torment-of-the-prisoners-and-silence-of-the-human-rights-societies …

https://twitter.com/bobbergdahl

so?

So? Are you crazy? You can't trust the tweets of anyone who doesn't know how to use tinyurl.

 

[Homer J Simpson]

Contrast:

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2014/05/obama-negotiates-with-taliban-to-release-pow-but-leaves-us-marine-to-rot-in-mexican-jail/

Obama Negotiates With Taliban to Release POW But Leaves US Marine to Rot in Mexican Jail

Why am I not surprised you read that blog?

 

[dozer]

Be strong Tim. Nice work in here.

Bergdahl is no hero.

However, his duty status was POW and we were obligated to do whatever we could to bring him home, including a prisoner exchange. Something that’s been done in every conflict we’ve ever been involved with. After that it’s up to the chain of command to deal with his status.

The investigation, court martial (I would guess), and the trial for desertion means this is going to be one damn long thread.

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

Anyone care to try and explain how this guy is having trouble speaking English?

From the CNN article:

There was no immediate word on Bergdahl's condition after his release. A senior Defense official said Bergdahl is having trouble speaking English but the reasons for that were not clear, given the trauma he's been through.

Actually the more controversial part might be at 4:02:

http://wapo.st/SmcnGX

That's not Pashtun, that's Arabic.

Muslims often say this phrase when embarking on any significant endeavor, and the phrase is considered by some to be a major pillar of Islam. This expression is so magnificent and so concise that all but one chapter of the Qur'an begins with the words Bismillah ir-Rahman ir-Rahim.

The common translation: "In the name of God, most Gracious, most Compassionate"....

Every chapter of the Qur'an (except the ninth chapter) begins with the Arabic phrase

http://wahiduddin.net/words/bismillah.htm

 

[Todd Andrews]

This is was part of a larger deal that we've been working on for some time in order to bring about negotiations between the Taliban and the Karzai government. The release of this American was only a small part of that larger deal, which apparently is quite complex.

Karzai doesn't seem too pleased about the deal

The Afghan president is angry at being kept in the dark over a deal to free five Taliban leaders in exchange for a captured U.S. soldier, and accuses Washington of failing to back a peace plan for the war-torn country, a senior source said on Monday.

The five prisoners were flown to Qatar on Sunday as part of a secret agreement to release Army Sergeant Bowe Bergdahl, who left Afghanistan for Germany on the same day.

The only known U.S. prisoner of war in Afghanistan, Bergdahl had been held captive for five years.

"The president is now even more distrustful of U.S. intentions in the country," said the source close to President Hamid Karzai's palace in Kabul, who declined to be identified.

"He is asking: How come the prisoner exchange worked out so well, when the Afghan peace process failed to make any significant progress?"

http://www.newsweek.com/president-hamid-karzai-reportedly-angry-over-prisoner-deal-252968

Tim's reply:

That isn't proof. The only proof I need is the fact that I worship Obama. Don't go and send me links because I won't read them. I make up my own #### and go along with it.

To be fair to Tim, you can pretty much say this about 98% of the progressive posters in these forums.

And you worship George W Bush and Ken Mehlman, MaxKooK.

 

[Billy Bats]

Be strong Tim. Nice work in here.

Bergdahl is no hero.

However, his duty status was POW and we were obligated to do whatever we could to bring him home, including a prisoner exchange. Something thats been done in every conflict weve ever been involved with. After that its up to the chain of command to deal with his status.

The investigation, court martial (I would guess), and the trial for desertion means this is going to be one damn long thread.

Doesn't sound likely:

Another senior Defense official said Bergdahl will not likely face any punishment. "Five years is enough," he told CNN on condition of anonymity.

 

[jon_mx]

So what we have here is a complicated diplomatic deal, the type that the Obama administration has performed again and again in this region and for which I give them great credit- he is probably the best foreign policy President in my lifetime. And as part of that deal, an American hostage is going to be released, which is a great victory for us- even though from what I'm reading, it's essentially an added bonus. The real key was getting negotiations between Karzai and the Taliban- central to our being able to leave Afghanistan. Karzai, who is a corrupt thug (but OUR corrupt thug) doesn't like it much, apparently, but we have to do this.

You never know when to stop. You look like a total fool in this thread.

To be fair, Tim likes things he does not have any clue about. It allows him to blindly put faith in government whom he assumes is much smarter than him concerning these things.

 

[Billy Bats]

Anyone care to try and explain how this guy is having trouble speaking English?

From the CNN article:

There was no immediate word on Bergdahl's condition after his release. A senior Defense official said Bergdahl is having trouble speaking English but the reasons for that were not clear, given the trauma he's been through.

Actually the more controversial part might be at 4:02:

http://wapo.st/SmcnGX

That's not Pashtun, that's Arabic.

Muslims often say this phrase when embarking on any significant endeavor, and the phrase is considered by some to be a major pillar of Islam. This expression is so magnificent and so concise that all but one chapter of the Qur'an begins with the words Bismillah ir-Rahman ir-Rahim.

The common translation: "In the name of God, most Gracious, most Compassionate"....

Every chapter of the Qur'an (except the ninth chapter) begins with the Arabic phrase

http://wahiduddin.net/words/bismillah.htm

I hope they jack this guy up with truth syrum and find out what in the hell is running through his mind.

And those 5 jokers they released probably can't wait to attach their names to a terrorist attack, like you said it will probably end badly.

 

[jon_mx]

And thank God we have Todd who is actually making Tim seem brilliant.

 

[jamny]

What happened to the 30 day notice to Congress that is required by law? This couldn't still have happened in 30 days?

 

[Homer J Simpson]

What happened to the 30 day notice to Congress that is required by law? This couldn't still have happened in 30 days?

Pretty idiotic that Congress be involved in this kind of thing anyway.

 

[Fennis]

What happened to the 30 day notice to Congress that is required by law? This couldn't still have happened in 30 days?

This country loves a strong executive and weak legislative branch. When Obama signed the provisioned, he added that he has flexibility to the 30 days. He exercised that flexibility. Congress will do nothing and the next president will do the same thing.

 

[jon_mx]

Has Obama signed the surrender papers yet to the Taliban?