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2017-18 NBA (Playoffs): A gasping, wheezing thread begs message board poster arguing how Jordan never lost a Finals to just let it die in peace (1 Viewer)

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Gr00vus said:
It bums me out that Portland can't put a better team around Lillard and McCollum. Those guys are unbelievable, particularly Lillard. They should be playing in conference finals.
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Trading Plumlee away for Nurkic was huge for them.  They were a losing team before getting him.  In last years version of this thread I said that the Nurk trade was a huge move for them and some of the members in this board clowned me for thinking that he could have such a dramatic impact.  The Blazers were 23-32 last season before they got Nurk.  In the games that he played for them towards the end of last season--they went 14-6.   This season--in games where Nurk played for the Blazers--they are 37-24.   This means that the Blazers are 51-30 in games where Nurk has played for them--which really proves your point. If this team could improve in even one more position--you could easily be looking at a contender.  

 
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jvdesigns2002 said:
Trading Plumlee away for Nurkic was huge for them.  They were a losing team before getting  In last years version of this thread I said that the Nurk trade was a huge move for them and some of the members in this board clowned me for thinking that he could have such a dramatic impact.  The Blazers were 23-32 last season before they got Nurk.  In the games that he played for them towards the end of last season--they went 14-6.   This season--in games where Nurk played for the Blazers--they are 37-24.   This means that the Blazers are 51-30 in games where Nurk has played for them--which really proves your point. If this team could improve in even one more position--you could easily be looking at a contender.  
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Yeah, if you could upgrade over Aminu or something like that it would be a big help. 

 
Like if they could clear Aminu, renounce Ed Davis, they could make a competitive offer on Julius Randle. Will they have enough cap space for something like that without dumping Aminu?

Myers Leonard for 10.5M and 17.9M for Turner next year. Ouch. Not Lulol Deng ouch, but still ouch.

 
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Gr00vus said:
Like if they could clear Aminu, renounce Ed Davis, they could make a competitive offer on Julius Randle. Will they have enough cap space for something like that without dumping Aminu?
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Aminu and Davis have actually contributed decently and don't hurt the Blazers financially nearly as bad as Evan Turner, Moe Harkless and the most egregious of all, Meyers Leonard.  Those three contracts have really hurt Portland, who even with cap space, cannot land marque players.  What's worse is very few want to stick around; how good with this team look with LaMarcus now?  Guy couldn't wait to bolt back to Texas, which, that's his home state and he has a kid(s?) there.  Hard to blame him, but it is incredibly frustrating to be a fan here.

 
Gr00vus said:
Like if they could clear Aminu, renounce Ed Davis, they could make a competitive offer on Julius Randle. Will they have enough cap space for something like that without dumping Aminu?

Myers Leonard for 10.5M and 17.9M for Turner next year. Ouch. Not Lulol Deng ouch, but still ouch.
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Per shamsports, if the renounce everyone (including Nurkic), and dump Aminu for nothing, they are still 6-7m over the cap. I suppose they could sign someone with the MLE. Randle’s market value will be interesting. 

 
thecatch said:
Per shamsports, if the renounce everyone (including Nurkic), and dump Aminu for nothing, they are still 6-7m over the cap. I suppose they could sign someone with the MLE. Randle’s market value will be interesting. 
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That's brutal.

Randle's going to make $15M minimum - right?

 
Gr00vus said:
That's brutal.

Randle's going to make $15M minimum - right?
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That seems pretty rich to me. That’s good starter money these days, and I’m not sure that’s how Randle profiles. maybe a rebuilding team will get desperate and throw him money and hope he can be a building block given his age. 

 
thecatch said:
That seems pretty rich to me. That’s good starter money these days, and I’m not sure that’s how Randle profiles. maybe a rebuilding team will get desperate and throw him money and hope he can be a building block given his age. 
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That's my thinking. Someone misses out on the upper tier FAs and blows the money anyway. I'd be happy if it didn't happen, would increase the chances he could return to the Lakers.

 
Don't Noonan said:
The problem that Portland always has is attracting big time free agents to sign with them.  It never happens.  They have to draft well to compete.  Crazy.
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Pretty much 80% of the league has the same problem. And when these teams can't get good players to come there they end up overpaying for average or worse players.

 
Gr00vus said:
That's my thinking. Someone misses out on the upper tier FAs and blows the money anyway. I'd be happy if it didn't happen, would increase the chances he could return to the Lakers.
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I don't really think anyone will have the money to do this.  

Or at least none of the teams that could seem like they would want to.  CHI, ATL, SAC, BKN, etc. seem averse to spending right now.  Maybe DAL or PHX could be a wild card.

 
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Long Ball Larry said:
I don't really think anyone will have the money to do this.  

Or at least none of the teams that could seem like they would want to.  CHI, ATL, SAC, BKN, etc. seem averse to spending right now.  Maybe DAL or PHX could be a wild card.
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You're probably right. Based on a few advanced stats he's like somewhere between the 55th and 75th best in the league. I have no feel for what that's worth.

 
Gr00vus said:
You're probably right. Based on a few advanced stats he's like somewhere between the 55th and 75th best in the league. I have no feel for what that's worth.
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Interesting take on Randle using advanced stats.  https://hashtagbasketball.com/los-angeles-lakers/content/julius-randle-allstar-caliber-player  

I'm coming around to the idea of bringing Paul George on board, keeping Randle, and then waiting until 2019 to bring in a 2nd max player.  Lakers will be a playoff team in 2018-19 if they keep the core intact and add PG13.  Problem of course is that would result is such a forward dominated roster that perimeter shooting and interior defense (the 5) would suffer drastically.  

Deng contract is really the albatross that's going to cost us Randle.  FU Jimbo and Mitch.  

 
tommyGunZ said:
Interesting take on Randle using advanced stats.  https://hashtagbasketball.com/los-angeles-lakers/content/julius-randle-allstar-caliber-player  

I'm coming around to the idea of bringing Paul George on board, keeping Randle, and then waiting until 2019 to bring in a 2nd max player.  Lakers will be a playoff team in 2018-19 if they keep the core intact and add PG13.  Problem of course is that would result is such a forward dominated roster that perimeter shooting and interior defense (the 5) would suffer drastically.  

Deng contract is really the albatross that's going to cost us Randle.  FU Jimbo and Mitch.  
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I think the most likely scenario is they resign Randle and aren't able to sign George or/and James. The problem for them will be getting the no from James soon enough to be able to match whatever offer Randle gets from someone else. LeBron hasn't exactly been one to make his decision the 1st day of free agency.  It would really suck if they end up with none of those 3.

It would be a good offseason for the Lakers if they could retain Randle and sign George. Nobody emphasizes the 5 down low in any real way anymore, running Randle out there isn't going to kill them, particularly with how they'd be able to rotate given a lineup of Randle, Ingram, George, Ball, whoever.

 
Randle's a wonderfully talented & highly motivated basketball player who will #### up the offensive & defensive spacing of any team which doesnt have a specific plan for him. The Andrew Wiggins of bigs.

 
wikkidpissah said:
Randle's a wonderfully talented & highly motivated basketball player who will #### up the offensive & defensive spacing of any team which doesnt have a specific plan for him. The Andrew Wiggins of bigs.
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Its true, he doesn't fit the current 4/5 mold on offense. Walton seems to have figured out how to make it work - Randle is basically a wrecking ball used to knock the D physically off balance, and the Lakers then capitalize on the ensuing mayhem. Its fun to watch when it clicks. He's like a fun sized Shaq.

 
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Gr00vus said:
Its true, he doesn't fit the current 4/5 mold on offense. Walton seems to have figured out how to make it work - Randle is basically a wrecking ball used to knock the D physically off balance, and the Lakers then capitalize on the ensuing mayhem. Its fun to watch when it clicks. He's like a fun sized Shaq.
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well, Walton spent the first half of the season wanting to use JR solely as the backup 5, which was the only way he didnt wreck the spacing and keep all the Lakers' young from learning how to play. Luke was right to do so, but this kid is far too talented for 18 mins, especially w this crew, but that's the only role in which the Lakers' coach considers its best current player as an asset

 
wikkidpissah said:
well, Walton spent the first half of the season wanting to use JR solely as the backup 5, which was the only way he didnt wreck the spacing and keep all the Lakers' young from learning how to play. Luke was right to do so, but this kid is far too talented for 18 mins, especially w this crew, but that's the only role in which the Lakers' coach considers its best current player as an asset
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I don't think that was all Walton's decision. Randle wasn't exactly a darling of the new management when they came in (they had questions about his commitment to the team, ability to focus on the game and not get distracted, and his work ethic) they were sending a message to him with that, that he needed to show the work to earn his minutes and his next contact. There was much talk of this over the summer here on L.A. talk radio. They put him on the bench to see how he'd respond. Obviously he's done well and they've increased his role accordingly over the course of the season. I think Walton's always known Randle was critical to the team, if nothing else for his defense, boards and physical presence.

 
Gr00vus said:
I think the most likely scenario is they resign Randle and aren't able to sign George or/and James. The problem for them will be getting the no from James soon enough to be able to match whatever offer Randle gets from someone else. LeBron hasn't exactly been one to make his decision the 1st day of free agency.  It would really suck if they end up with none of those 3.

It would be a good offseason for the Lakers if they could retain Randle and sign George. Nobody emphasizes the 5 down low in any real way anymore, running Randle out there isn't going to kill them, particularly with how they'd be able to rotate given a lineup of Randle, Ingram, George, Ball, whoever.
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i think the chance of Lebron signing with the Lakers is, and has been, less than 2%. think you guys can go ahead and plan as if he won't be there

 
modogg said:
i think the chance of Lebron signing with the Lakers is, and has been, less than 2%. think you guys can go ahead and plan as if he won't be there
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I certainly am not expecting him to be here. But management is going to make an effort to bring him here, as they must really. If he plays coy it could cost them. Hopefully he gives them a quick no (assuming the answer will eventually be no) and they can move on.

 
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Don't Noonan said:
Very suprised the Pelicans are winning this much without Cousins.  Impressive 
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I got killed in last seasons version of this thread for saying that Jrue Holiday was at least a top 15pg in the league.  That dude is such a complete player. Great range on his jumper, great ball handling skills, great vision, fantastic defender.   Adding Rondo to that team has allowed Jrue to showcase more of his his offensive skills.   While I think that they are a far better team with Cousins--the hit isn't as brutal with guys like Holiday stepping up--and the addition of Mirotic helped as well.   Okafor has  also been a pleasant surprise a defender of the paint.   

 
wikkidpissah said:
Randle's a wonderfully talented & highly motivated basketball player who will #### up the offensive & defensive spacing of any team which doesnt have a specific plan for him. The Andrew Wiggins of bigs.
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Do you live in the LA area and get to watch him regularly?  I'm very curious--as I do--and I've watched the vast majority of Lakers games over the past many seasons.  The Byron Scott Randle versus the current Luke Walton Randle are two completely different players.  Byron Scott effectively did nothing to develop and improve the skill set and mentality of his young players.  When the Lakers had a healthy Nance this season--Walton had to do a job juggling the development of both him and Randle--both of whom are solid young players.  Now that Nance is away--Randle is allowed to get the full development focus that he never got before.  We're talking about a guy who broke his leg in the first NBA game that he played.  If you look at him now--he's far more focused and has learned how to be a smarter player with his high running motor. He used to constantly get offensive fouls called on him and would play out of control on a regular basis.   If you watch a Lakers game now--he effectively is the attitude, swag, and energy of the team.  That team has been the 4th or 5th best in the NBA in the last 25 games or so.   I agree with you that his game has some offensive holes--but he's far from this cancerous player that many of the posters here are making him out to be.   The guy is an absolute walking double double that plays harder than 90% of the NBA.    As a Laker fan--I wouldn't be bummed at all if they ended up keeping him.   

 
jvdesigns2002 said:
Do you live in the LA area and get to watch him regularly?  I'm very curious--as I do--and I've watched the vast majority of Lakers games over the past many seasons.  The Byron Scott Randle versus the current Luke Walton Randle are two completely different players.  Byron Scott effectively did nothing to develop and improve the skill set and mentality of his young players.  When the Lakers had a healthy Nance this season--Walton had to do a job juggling the development of both him and Randle--both of whom are solid young players.  Now that Nance is away--Randle is allowed to get the full development focus that he never got before.  We're talking about a guy who broke his leg in the first NBA game that he played.  If you look at him now--he's far more focused and has learned how to be a smarter player with his high running motor. He used to constantly get offensive fouls called on him and would play out of control on a regular basis.   If you watch a Lakers game now--he effectively is the attitude, swag, and energy of the team.  That team has been the 4th or 5th best in the NBA in the last 25 games or so.   I agree with you that his game has some offensive holes--but he's far from this cancerous player that many of the posters here are making him out to be.   The guy is an absolute walking double double that plays harder than 90% of the NBA.    As a Laker fan--I wouldn't be bummed at all if they ended up keeping him.   
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Been a fan since Kentucky, wanted the Celts to take him over Maaaacus Smaaaat. At that time he was considered a 3-4 tweener. Does some wonderful things, but simply doesn't care where he is on the floor, which cancels out a lot of value in today's game. Seen about a dozen Laker games this year and, when he starts, he's consistently in Ball & Ingram's way. He's the only guy on the Lakers who always knows where the hole is, so he looks better than he plays. There are more developed teams where he'd work as an energy guy or a Z-Bo type, but he's a net negative in LA if Ball, Kuzma & Ingram are to be the core.

 
Gr00vus said:
I certainly am not expecting him to be here. But management is going to make an effort to bring him here, as they must really. If he plays coy it could cost them. Hopefully he gives them a quick no (assuming the answer will eventually be no) and they can move on.
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I will be stunned if LeBron wants to come to LA and get sucked into the Lavar Ball clown show/circus act.  Even if LaTrumpJr vows to be quiet, will anyone with a brain believe him?  

 
@presidual
DeMar DeRozan had 42 points on 30 shooting possessions. Five of his 6 assists led to shots from 3 and in the restricted area (the exception was Fred VanVleet's game-winner). Despite high usage, DeRozan had just 1 turnover. He was an insane +154% win probability added (@inpredict)

@presidual 

DeMar DeRozan's +154% win probability added is the best single-game performance in the @inpredict database, which goes back to 1999-2000. http://stats.inpredictable.com/nba/topGame.php?sort=mvpWPA&season=ALL&team=ALL&po=2&frdt=2000-06-04&todt=2018-03-06 …
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DeRozan was pretty good tonight. 

 
wikkidpissah said:
Been a fan since Kentucky, wanted the Celts to take him over Maaaacus Smaaaat. At that time he was considered a 3-4 tweener. Does some wonderful things, but simply doesn't care where he is on the floor, which cancels out a lot of value in today's game. Seen about a dozen Laker games this year and, when he starts, he's consistently in Ball & Ingram's way. He's the only guy on the Lakers who always knows where the hole is, so he looks better than he plays. There are more developed teams where he'd work as an energy guy or a Z-Bo type, but he's a net negative in LA if Ball, Kuzma & Ingram are to be the core.
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Randle was never a 3-4 tweener.

 
Synthesizer said:
As a Pistons fan, I hate watching Blake every night.  He muscles guys all over the court but then as soon as someone nudges him, he snaps his neck back and starts flailing his arms.  Complains constantly.  This is awful.
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The neck snap back is one of my top 3 pet peeves with basketball today.  I went to a high school section game last night, and one point guard lost control of his dribble and gave up a turnover leading to a breakaway layup after he snapped his neck back so violently he lost control of his dribble.

 
bananafish said:
Curry hurt his ankle again. It's like 6-7 years ago when he just couldn't stay healthy because of his darn ankles. Supposedly he has shoe inserts that solved the issue but that's the third time this year. 

Eta: sorry, fourth time
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They need to keep him out until playoffs and maybe even the first round depending on match ups.

 
General Malaise said:
Blazers win their 9th in a row, pulverizing the Golden State JV squad.  This winning streak started on Valentine's Day against Golden State's Varsity team and has been fun to follow.  Zach Collins has been a godsend.  

Maybe LeBron will sign here.  Nike right here.  Legal weed, great beer, best guard combo in the league, endless pockets.  
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Do you go to many games GM?

 
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