Major
Footballguy
Matt Schaub imo
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2022 Las Vegas Raiders (4 Viewers)
- Thread starter Hankmoody
- Start date
I think it’s time to move from Carr, for both the Raiders and for Carr. Nine years is enough. There have been two constants over the past decade. Horrible defense and Derek Carr. Clearly, this clown show of an organization can’t build a tough defense to help out the Carr and the bazillion offenses he’s been forced to learn.
So, maybe it’s time to swallow some pride and look at how the 49ers have done it. Apparently, it doesn’t matter who your starting QB is as long as you have consistency at HC and OC and your defense is tough as nails. Building a franchise the way they have, you don’t need an elite QB just someone competent enough to not lose games.
So, maybe it’s time to swallow some pride and look at how the 49ers have done it. Apparently, it doesn’t matter who your starting QB is as long as you have consistency at HC and OC and your defense is tough as nails. Building a franchise the way they have, you don’t need an elite QB just someone competent enough to not lose games.
joey
Footballguy
That rules out Carr then, eh?
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Chaka
Footballguy
QB roulette. Odds of success are probably as good as any other kind of roulette.
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
carr is the worst because you get the worst of both worlds. no top 10 pick and no chance at a championship or even a playoff win. you also have to invest so heavily on building an offense around him, that the defense is a sad mess.
if you bring in a guy who's cheap because he sucks. then you can build up your team and end up with a high enough pick in the 1st round that you can draft your stud franchise qb with a talented team already built up around him.
the chiefs had a good offense before mahomes and qb didn't seem to be a problem. they still went and took a chance at something better. they ended up getting a super bowl.
seattle had a qb they won a super bowl with and they decided to move on. I don't think anybody would say they made the wrong move at this point.
I'd say ride with stidham and maybe find a qb to try developing in the later rounds if none of the studs fall to you in the 1st round. if stidham sucks, then you probably have a good pick next year and can use the extra money to build up the team. if stidham is mediocre, you still have extra money to build up the team. if stidham is good, you still have extra money to build up the team.
with carr you already know exactly what you're getting. it ain't a super bowl, or a good enough draft pick to replace him with. you get endless excuses for why it's not his fault and people can always make a good argument for that, or for why it's worse to replace him. worse than what? not winning anyway? watching the offense score 0 points against garbage defenses? go an entire first or second half without scoring?
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Jake delhomme
Yeah, I guess that post didn’t make any sense. What I was trying to say was the building around Derek Carr “formula “ hasn’t worked for the Raiders. It just feels like it’s time to end the relationship.That rules our Carr then, eh?
The million dollar question is what do they do post Derek Carr? Do what Cleveland did and break the bank for a more physically gifted QB. Or Seattle? Trade him for as much as possible and go with the backup? Or do what the 9ers tried to do. Keep him on the roster while drafting his heir- apparent?
joey
Footballguy
First of all, my post stinks when it’s 6 words long and had a typo that should read “rules OUT Carr”. Thanks for deciphering my post.Yeah, I guess that post didn’t make any sense. What I was trying to say was the building around Derek Carr “formula “ hasn’t worked for the Raiders. It just feels like it’s time to end the relationship.That rules our Carr then, eh?
The million dollar question is what do they do post Derek Carr? Do what Cleveland did and break the bank for a more physically gifted QB. Or Seattle? Trade him for as much as possible and go with the backup? Or do what the 9ers tried to do. Keep him on the roster while drafting his heir- apparent?
I think the only logical move, considering Carr’s contract is to draft an heir apparent and hope he hits in a couple of years.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Oh snap. Can’t wait to see the innertubes explode.
massraider
Footballguy
Whatever.
I don't want to replace Carr till we have a blue chip prospect. We can win games with him, if not titles
I don't want to replace Carr till we have a blue chip prospect. We can win games with him, if not titles
ZADO
Footballguy
Raiders coach Josh McDaniels announced Derek Carr has been benched for the final two games of the season.
Coming off the heels of a back-breaking loss to the Steelers, McDaniels and company appear desperate for a spark as their season spirals the drain. The Raiders aren't technically out of the playoff hunt yet, but Carr's second-half meltdown in Week 16 put them at death's door. Even with a pair of wins, which will now have to come with Jarrett Stidham under center, the Raiders are extremely unlikely to make the playoffs. With Las Vegas looking to the 2023 season, the move has financial underpinnings. If Carr suffers an injury that carries into the start of the next league year, his $33 million base salary becomes fully guaranteed. Potentially looking to cut or trade him after this year, GM Dave Ziegler isn't taking any chances with Carr's health and contract by extension. It looks like Carr has played his last game in a silver and black uniform.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Hope notTom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
raidersraidersraiders
Footballguy
GreenNGold
Footballguy
Has McDaniels considered benching himself?
ZADO
Footballguy
Hear me out.Hope notTom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
Brady didnt make that call on the field , the NFL and refs screwed us that night. Brady is even on record admitting it was fumble , so some forgiveness may be in order.
He knows that offensive system better than any QB alive and he can literally be a player/coach for anyone the Raiders may draft . He brings a winning attitude where ever he plays , to win a SB his first year in Tampa is almost unheard of , we need that in LV , he could be the missing piece to set this Raider ship straight.
I know he`ll be 45 yo but again he knows the McDaniel's system like nobodies business , he would have better weapons around him than he`s ever had IMO . Tweak the Oline and build the defense , easy peasy
habsfan
Footballguy
I don't get strong "I love mentoring" vibes from Brady.Hear me out.Hope notTom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
Brady didnt make that call on the field , the NFL and refs screwed us that night. Brady is even on record admitting it was fumble , so some forgiveness may be in order.
He knows that offensive system better than any QB alive and he can literally be a player/coach for anyone the Raiders may draft . He brings a winning attitude where ever he plays , to win a SB his first year in Tampa is almost unheard of , we need that in LV , he could be the missing piece to set this Raider ship straight.
I know he`ll be 45 yo but again he knows the McDaniel's system like nobodies business , he would have better weapons around him than he`s ever had IMO . Tweak the Oline and build the defense , easy peasy
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
here are my main issues with TB. He’s old and kinda sucks now.Hear me out.Hope notTom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
Brady didnt make that call on the field , the NFL and refs screwed us that night. Brady is even on record admitting it was fumble , so some forgiveness may be in order.
He knows that offensive system better than any QB alive and he can literally be a player/coach for anyone the Raiders may draft . He brings a winning attitude where ever he plays , to win a SB his first year in Tampa is almost unheard of , we need that in LV , he could be the missing piece to set this Raider ship straight.
I know he`ll be 45 yo but again he knows the McDaniel's system like nobodies business , he would have better weapons around him than he`s ever had IMO . Tweak the Oline and build the defense , easy peasy
joey
Footballguy
Yet, unlike Carr, in Brady’s current state, he’s led 4th quarter comebacks this year with the Bucs.
I'm torn for sure but a Brady rental and draft a rookie QB seems like as good a stop gap plan as any. can you tell I’m desperate?
ZADO
Footballguy
He`s set to make 500 mil talking in a booth for FOXI don't get strong "I love mentoring" vibes from Brady.Hear me out.Hope notTom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
Brady didnt make that call on the field , the NFL and refs screwed us that night. Brady is even on record admitting it was fumble , so some forgiveness may be in order.
He knows that offensive system better than any QB alive and he can literally be a player/coach for anyone the Raiders may draft . He brings a winning attitude where ever he plays , to win a SB his first year in Tampa is almost unheard of , we need that in LV , he could be the missing piece to set this Raider ship straight.
I know he`ll be 45 yo but again he knows the McDaniel's system like nobodies business , he would have better weapons around him than he`s ever had IMO . Tweak the Oline and build the defense , easy peasy
I`m guessing he would do McDaniel's a solid while enjoying the LV lifestyle (divorced woooo party time ) and then join the Pats for a day to officially retire as a Patriot.
It`s just a thought but ya never know , will be an interesting offseason for sure
joey
Footballguy
The only thing to look forward to with the Raiders for 20 years.
DocHolliday
Footballguy
It’s going to be a crazy offseason and it looks like it’s starting now. Carr is gone and I assume he’s just the beginning. It’s not like Carr was the only reason the losses piled up. This season sucked. I didn’t expect much but I expected an offense that could score points. Next season is going to be awful but rebuilds aren’t ever fun. It’s the right thing to do though.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Brady isn't exactly the mentor type.Tom Brady to the Raiders next year to groom a young prospect perhaps
Chaka
Footballguy
To be fair they needed to make 4th quarter comebacks because the offense couldn't score for three quarters. The Raiders have blown 4 (5?) 10+ point halftime leads.
32 Counter Pass
Footballguy
As the saying goes, a franchise's successes (or failures) start at the top. I found this tweet about Mark Davis to be particularly damning:
"mark davis admitted that he simply doesn’t know enough about front offices workings, and would rather sit on the sidelines after his father passed. he’s parlayed that into del rio, gruden, and now mcdaniels hires. it always starts at the top."
It bares repeating, the Raiders will never have sustained success under Tommy-boy. For the sake of the players and fans he should just sell the team.
https://twitter.com/StillRyanFive/status/1608198194307158016
"mark davis admitted that he simply doesn’t know enough about front offices workings, and would rather sit on the sidelines after his father passed. he’s parlayed that into del rio, gruden, and now mcdaniels hires. it always starts at the top."
It bares repeating, the Raiders will never have sustained success under Tommy-boy. For the sake of the players and fans he should just sell the team.
https://twitter.com/StillRyanFive/status/1608198194307158016
joey
Footballguy
You’ve solved the puzzle….Carr starts the 1st half and Brady plays the 2nd half. Houshmazilli.
We’ve been wondering in this thread if the brutal losses this year was McDaniels or Carr…well, the coaches proactively took control of that conversation by basically trying to say “it was Carr”. Man, I hate being a fan of this team. So much freakin drama.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
It is obvious that this is to keep the contract from becoming guaranteed due to injury giving options to move on. The crap about seeing what Stidham can do is silly, McD has plenty of time with Stidham to know what he is and isn't.
If we cut him, I will riot. The writing is on the wall and this coaching staff is going to move on. It didn't work out for McD in Denver... I hope it works out better here. There will be plenty of teams that will be willing to trade for him. If we don't swing a decent trade then our GM should be fired. If we don't get a trade, moving on from him is moronic. We will have needs for multiple defensive spots, RG and RT... possibly RB if we don't resign Jacobs and then of course the most important position- QB, which is also the hardest to fill.
If we try to draft a QB then we should go ahead and also trade Waller away too to gain more draft capital and build around youth... hope that we hit on those picks and everyone develops quickly.
If we go for a veteran who? Basically Brady or Jackson are the only real clear upgrades and both are risky. Brady is ancient in football years and father time is may be delayed but is never defeated. Does he have one more good year left in him for a run with McD? A SB run without a significantly improved defense is highly unlikely, so even if he does, we could rent him for a year to be mediocre. The idea of him mentoring his replacement seems... unlikely. So, what about Jackson? He is clearly an upgrade and can carry an offense all on his own but the problem with QB's who can and do run is that they get hurt more often and he has shown he is not immune to getting broken. On top of that, to get him would break the bank. We would have very little or no room to build up the defense. Brady or Jackson, a poor defense means we likely will be where we have been as a bubble playoff team.
It is hilarious to me that anyone thinks Mike White is an upgrade over Carr. Moving on. Mayfield? If anything about the game against us shows is that he is best not thinking. McD's offense is anything but that type of offense. I don't think he is a good fit. Anyone else?
So... we draft. And hope. And if history stays steady, we have like a 1 in 15 shot of burning a high draft pick on a QB that will end up being a journey man after a few years struggling as a starter and another half decade of being stuck as a crappy team and then if we have good draft picks being like the Colts of being desperate for a QB while wasting a good and complete team.
If we cut him, I will riot. The writing is on the wall and this coaching staff is going to move on. It didn't work out for McD in Denver... I hope it works out better here. There will be plenty of teams that will be willing to trade for him. If we don't swing a decent trade then our GM should be fired. If we don't get a trade, moving on from him is moronic. We will have needs for multiple defensive spots, RG and RT... possibly RB if we don't resign Jacobs and then of course the most important position- QB, which is also the hardest to fill.
If we try to draft a QB then we should go ahead and also trade Waller away too to gain more draft capital and build around youth... hope that we hit on those picks and everyone develops quickly.
If we go for a veteran who? Basically Brady or Jackson are the only real clear upgrades and both are risky. Brady is ancient in football years and father time is may be delayed but is never defeated. Does he have one more good year left in him for a run with McD? A SB run without a significantly improved defense is highly unlikely, so even if he does, we could rent him for a year to be mediocre. The idea of him mentoring his replacement seems... unlikely. So, what about Jackson? He is clearly an upgrade and can carry an offense all on his own but the problem with QB's who can and do run is that they get hurt more often and he has shown he is not immune to getting broken. On top of that, to get him would break the bank. We would have very little or no room to build up the defense. Brady or Jackson, a poor defense means we likely will be where we have been as a bubble playoff team.
It is hilarious to me that anyone thinks Mike White is an upgrade over Carr. Moving on. Mayfield? If anything about the game against us shows is that he is best not thinking. McD's offense is anything but that type of offense. I don't think he is a good fit. Anyone else?
So... we draft. And hope. And if history stays steady, we have like a 1 in 15 shot of burning a high draft pick on a QB that will end up being a journey man after a few years struggling as a starter and another half decade of being stuck as a crappy team and then if we have good draft picks being like the Colts of being desperate for a QB while wasting a good and complete team.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
It is damn laughable to suggest Jimmy G is a better QB than Carr. I would rather have Purdy. Jimmy G is NFL backup material and the NFL knows this which is why no one traded for him.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
it. was. a. joke.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
It is damn laughable to suggest Jimmy G is a better QB than Carr. I would rather have Purdy. Jimmy G is NFL backup material and the NFL knows this which is why no one traded for him.
i kinda want to see chad riot. the raiders have 2 choices with carr. keep him or cut him. he has a no trade clause. i believe him that he'll hang it up, rather than play for another team. gonna be a crazy off season. and i hope they do trade waller he's the best asset they have, that they can do without.
joey
Footballguy
it. was. a. joke.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
It is damn laughable to suggest Jimmy G is a better QB than Carr. I would rather have Purdy. Jimmy G is NFL backup material and the NFL knows this which is why no one traded for him.
i kinda want to see chad riot. the raiders have 2 choices with carr. keep him or cut him. he has a no trade clause. i believe him that he'll hang it up, rather than play for another team. gonna be a crazy off season. and i hope they do trade waller he's the best asset they have, that they can do without.
I think the “I’d rather retire than play for another team” talk makes sense to a player at the time, in the heat of emotions and competing on their team that they want to win it all….until the reality of The Business hits them in the face and in the wallet and, suddenly, they’re open to be traded to a team that wants them and is ready to compete for a playoff spot (something he’s only seen once as a Raider)
ICON211
Footballguy
I don't necessarily think Mike White is an upgrade over Carr. I still don't know what Mike White really is. I do think we know what Carr is at this point. A guy that plays great sometimes, but also plays poorly a lot more often than truly big time QBs and is very bad when pressured and horrible in the red zone. Mike White also will not eat up $30-40M in cap space and would allow them to upgrade other positions. Mike White may not be the best option, but it hasn't worked with Carr for nine years. If I had a choice between seeing what Mike White is and being able to upgrade at other positions or Carr then I'd choose Mike White. And if they were able to get a high pick or picks for Carr I'd trade him in a heartbeat.
This could be the best thing to happen Derek Carr. Set him free, there’s a whole world out there. He can go to a team that actually wants him and needs him. Once DC gets away from the Raiders, he’ll see how dysfunctional they have been. Maybe he’ll go somewhere like the Jets that actually have a real defense, he can see what he’s been missing.it. was. a. joke.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
It is damn laughable to suggest Jimmy G is a better QB than Carr. I would rather have Purdy. Jimmy G is NFL backup material and the NFL knows this which is why no one traded for him.
i kinda want to see chad riot. the raiders have 2 choices with carr. keep him or cut him. he has a no trade clause. i believe him that he'll hang it up, rather than play for another team. gonna be a crazy off season. and i hope they do trade waller he's the best asset they have, that they can do without.
I think the “I’d rather retire than play for another team” talk makes sense to a player at the time, in the heat of emotions and competing on their team that they want to win it all….until the reality of The Business hits them in the face and in the wallet and, suddenly, they’re open to be traded to a team that wants them and is ready to compete for a playoff spot (something he’s only seen once as a Raider)
Good luck (not good riddance)Derek, nothing lasts forever. You deserve better, hopefully you find it.
ICON211
Footballguy
There was the weird game in Washington a couple years ago with the O line. I'm still not sure what that was. I haven't heard many guys comment on him at all either way. We definitely have heard some guys praise him and Adams obviously thinks the world of him. It will be very interesting to see how the team plays on Sunday.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
I agree. But we’re talking about a very religious man that’s made a ton of money. How much does one man need? I tend to believe him.it. was. a. joke.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
It is damn laughable to suggest Jimmy G is a better QB than Carr. I would rather have Purdy. Jimmy G is NFL backup material and the NFL knows this which is why no one traded for him.
i kinda want to see chad riot. the raiders have 2 choices with carr. keep him or cut him. he has a no trade clause. i believe him that he'll hang it up, rather than play for another team. gonna be a crazy off season. and i hope they do trade waller he's the best asset they have, that they can do without.
I think the “I’d rather retire than play for another team” talk makes sense to a player at the time, in the heat of emotions and competing on their team that they want to win it all….until the reality of The Business hits them in the face and in the wallet and, suddenly, they’re open to be traded to a team that wants them and is ready to compete for a playoff spot (something he’s only seen once as a Raider)
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Had something to do with BLM and kneeling, not kneeling IIRCThere was the weird game in Washington a couple years ago with the O line. I'm still not sure what that was. I haven't heard many guys comment on him at all either way. We definitely have heard some guys praise him and Adams obviously thinks the world of him. It will be very interesting to see how the team plays on Sunday.You might not like Carr but every single indication we have ever seen or heard that would indicate what the locker room thinks of Carr is that they are 100% behind him. I have never seen one single piece of evidence that would suggest the locker room has nothing but full respect, admiration, friendship and trust in Carr.We don’t know the locker room. Maybe they’re tired of the Bible thumping. Maybe some porn star hitting Jimmy G is just what the dr ordered.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
Carr has apparently left the team, with permission, in order to not be a distraction
Chadstroma
Footballguy
Carr to the Jets would make them a SB contending team.
The NFL trash heap is full of QB needy teams. We lived that from Gannon to Carr. Then with Carr we couldn't manage to put together a complete team.
Now we go back to being one of the QB searching teams. I am not looking forward to that.
The NFL trash heap is full of QB needy teams. We lived that from Gannon to Carr. Then with Carr we couldn't manage to put together a complete team.
Now we go back to being one of the QB searching teams. I am not looking forward to that.
Chadstroma
Footballguy
No idea what my phone did on that post and I don't have the energy to fix it
We’re facing another full blown Gruden style rebuild. No way a QB like Brady will play for Vegas unless they shore up that defense with draft picks and the right free agent moves.
ICON211
Footballguy
Could the Raiders do worse than Carr.....yes it's possible.
They could also end up doing better.
Let's not act like the Raiders are moving on from a Burrow, Mahomes, Allen type of QB here.
I get that the Carr hate goes over the top at times, but so does the Carr love from his unconditional supporters.
After nine years it's time to at least try to do better.
They could also end up doing better.
Let's not act like the Raiders are moving on from a Burrow, Mahomes, Allen type of QB here.
I get that the Carr hate goes over the top at times, but so does the Carr love from his unconditional supporters.
After nine years it's time to at least try to do better.
Chaka
Footballguy
I'll take it 10 times out of 10 over rooting for a Daniel Snyder team.
That's all I got...
joey
Footballguy
You built drama. Nicely done
I'll take it 10 times out of 10 over rooting for a Daniel Snyder team.
That's all I got...
”it could be worse. It could be raining” - Young Frankenstein
DocHolliday
Footballguy
This is a rebuild. Carr is gone. Waller is gone. Any player on the downside of their career worth anything should be traded away. This team isn’t a great QB away from being a SB contender. You could insert Mahomes and have a better team but the D isn’t stopping anyone. They couldn’t even stop an average rookie QB last week. How many leads does the team need to blow before it’s obvious that talent is needed all over the field?
I like Carr. He is a good QB and a good guy. It’s easy to root for him but things just didn’t work out. We will miss him but Gruden wasted so many draft picks that there is no way to build a team without obtaining draft capital and salary cap space. It’s going to get really ugly before it can get better. The good thing is that the fans are used to losing.
I like Carr. He is a good QB and a good guy. It’s easy to root for him but things just didn’t work out. We will miss him but Gruden wasted so many draft picks that there is no way to build a team without obtaining draft capital and salary cap space. It’s going to get really ugly before it can get better. The good thing is that the fans are used to losing.
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