Kamala Harris' border crisis. Biden put her in charge. (2 Viewers)

[FairWarning]

Dems job creation -

40,000 judges
87,000 IRS agents
100,000+ cops

Is this China?

largest employer in the world is the US Govt right ?

but at 31 + trillion in debt, we have money to add thousands more lawyers and judges ?

You don’t believe Biden when he said the debt went down? Me either.

 

[FairWarning]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

 

[KarmaPolice]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

 

[FairWarning]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

 

[KarmaPolice]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

Of course, why wouldn't that be part of the process? If their claim isn't legit, don't allow them in. If it is, let them in. IMO it should be quick and painless, not wait for 3 years to find out they shouldn’t have been here.

Do you agree part of the draw for these immigrants is that it's known it's an exploitable system that takes years and years?

 

[The Commish]

Yet another post proving you really don't read much of anything I say. If you did, you wouldn't keep asking me the same questions over and over.

you'd be ok with spending the hundreds of millions on lawyers/judges .... I am not and the truth is, it wouldn't matter anyway because of all the people who just stay anyway

if they were honest people abiding by our laws ... wouldn't there be no illegals living in the USA for the past 20 years? we know there are 20 million or more illegally here people ... they're not here waiting for their day in court

many many return after being deported - because they want to be in the USA and they'll break every law we have to get their way

Table 39. Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019 | Homeland Security

The 2019 Yearbook of Immigration Statistics data Table 39: Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019.

www.dhs.gov

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

 

[Stealthycat]

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

legal/law is irrelevant to people here illegally

what do you figure the cost would be to hire all these judges and lawyers on the Govt pay scale and all that would come with it ? you would be providing more processing .... but you've done absolutely nothing to stop people flowing over the border illegally or coming back after being deported

we both know that

 

[Shutout]

Yet another post proving you really don't read much of anything I say. If you did, you wouldn't keep asking me the same questions over and over.

you'd be ok with spending the hundreds of millions on lawyers/judges .... I am not and the truth is, it wouldn't matter anyway because of all the people who just stay anyway

if they were honest people abiding by our laws ... wouldn't there be no illegals living in the USA for the past 20 years? we know there are 20 million or more illegally here people ... they're not here waiting for their day in court

many many return after being deported - because they want to be in the USA and they'll break every law we have to get their way

Table 39. Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019 | Homeland Security

The 2019 Yearbook of Immigration Statistics data Table 39: Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019.

www.dhs.gov

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

 

[The Commish]

Yet another post proving you really don't read much of anything I say. If you did, you wouldn't keep asking me the same questions over and over.

you'd be ok with spending the hundreds of millions on lawyers/judges .... I am not and the truth is, it wouldn't matter anyway because of all the people who just stay anyway

if they were honest people abiding by our laws ... wouldn't there be no illegals living in the USA for the past 20 years? we know there are 20 million or more illegally here people ... they're not here waiting for their day in court

many many return after being deported - because they want to be in the USA and they'll break every law we have to get their way

Table 39. Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019 | Homeland Security

The 2019 Yearbook of Immigration Statistics data Table 39: Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019.

www.dhs.gov

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

It should be the primary focus IMO, but everyone wants to focus on a bunch of other stuff that costs way more and is way less effective.

 

[The Commish]

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

legal/law is irrelevant to people here illegally

what do you figure the cost would be to hire all these judges and lawyers on the Govt pay scale and all that would come with it ? you would be providing more processing .... but you've done absolutely nothing to stop people flowing over the border illegally or coming back after being deported

we both know that

My guess is a couple F35s a year for 5ish years?

The rest is arguing against yourself. In one breath it's we have to lock down the border!!! In the next it's illegals don't listen to the rules. If true, there's no point in locking down the border right? This is your weird argument that no one but you uses.

The unmitigated irony of all these conversations is I am absolutely good with 100% supporting our laws with the federal funds necessary to get the job done. All you and your crew can ask me is "who's gonna pay for it?". If that's your position and you're concerned with money (I don't believe you are) then that should be your question all the way through. However, somehow that gets dropped talking about walls and when complaining that cities/states won't use local tax dollars to do the job of the federal government. What you want costs money and a lot of it. Can't have it both ways.

 

[Shutout]

Yet another post proving you really don't read much of anything I say. If you did, you wouldn't keep asking me the same questions over and over.

you'd be ok with spending the hundreds of millions on lawyers/judges .... I am not and the truth is, it wouldn't matter anyway because of all the people who just stay anyway

if they were honest people abiding by our laws ... wouldn't there be no illegals living in the USA for the past 20 years? we know there are 20 million or more illegally here people ... they're not here waiting for their day in court

many many return after being deported - because they want to be in the USA and they'll break every law we have to get their way

Table 39. Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019 | Homeland Security

The 2019 Yearbook of Immigration Statistics data Table 39: Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019.

www.dhs.gov

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

It should be the primary focus IMO, but everyone wants to focus on a bunch of other stuff that costs way more and is way less effective.

serious question, not trying to get into a back and forth but on this particular example you guys are discussion, what IS the other stuff that costs way more and is less effective? I just want to see what it is and understand it.

 

[Stealthycat]

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

The core problem is millions of people crossing the border illegally without any checks, counts etc

Until that is addressed nothing else will matter.

 

[Stealthycat]

My guess is a couple F35s a year for 5ish years?

The rest is arguing against yourself. In one breath it's we have to lock down the border!!! In the next it's illegals don't listen to the rules. If true, there's no point in locking down the border right? This is your weird argument that no one but you uses.

The unmitigated irony of all these conversations is I am absolutely good with 100% supporting our laws with the federal funds necessary to get the job done. All you and your crew can ask me is "who's gonna pay for it?". If that's your position and you're concerned with money (I don't believe you are) then that should be your question all the way through. However, somehow that gets dropped talking about walls and when complaining that cities/states won't use local tax dollars to do the job of the federal government. What you want costs money and a lot of it. Can't have it both ways.

if you don't understand the clear difference between where border security exists (barriers to stop illegals and people enforcing) vs where no border control exists (literally just wading across a river and you're on USA soil) then I don't know what to tell you

why do prisons have walls and barbed wire and tower sentries and guards and locks and all that ? they're criminals right? they'll just get out right ? well, not if the security is good enough, right ?


its about money and its about security for American citizens, and its about upholding our laws and its about all the border states and citizens that are having to deal with it all and its about literally 20 million people living in the USA illegally that we have no idea who they are - that's what its about

 

[KarmaPolice]

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

The core problem is millions of people crossing the border illegally without any checks, counts etc

Until that is addressed nothing else will matter.

The only people this applies to is the getaways, which I agree is an issue.

Everyone else is in our country via legit, legal avenues - one of which includes seeking asylum.

You saying there are no checks and balances is a bit insulting to the work border patrol is putting in.

 

[Stealthycat]

The only people this applies to is the getaways, which I agree is an issue.

Everyone else is in our country via legit, legal avenues - one of which includes seeking asylum.

You saying there are no checks and balances is a bit insulting to the work border patrol is putting in.

we don't have any idea how many illegals are really here, how many come back from deportation, how many are human traffickers, drug traffickers, criminals, rapists, terrorists, carriers of diseases ....... because they simply walk across the border and come on it

something people don't seem to want to address at all and no, they're not seeking asylum .... please, everyone knows that chic word isn't valid anymore. Please



and as for the border patrol ? GOP backs them, don't they? Biden/Democrats accuse them of whipping illegals and has done nothing that I've seen to bolster our border security, rather, this administration is just bussing illegals all over the country

of the 1.5 trillion bill passed, boosts domestic spending by $46 billion, a nearly 7% hike. But it gives US Customs and Border Protection just $14.8 billion, a $428 million decrease from fiscal year 2021. (Factor in inflation, and the cuts are even deeper.)

Apr 14, 2022 — Meanwhile, the President is proposing to cut Immigration and Customs Enforcement by $150 million next year.


Did Biden cut ice funding?
A victory for movements organizing to defund immigration enforcement and detention, President Biden's budget requests a significant cut to the number of ICE detention beds, eliminating all family detention beds, and cuts to ICE's enforcement and custody funding.Apr 13, 2022

 

[Joe Mammy]

@Stealthycat @knowledge dropper
Just wondering? Do you believe the 2020 election was stolen?

 

[KarmaPolice]

Exactly, like I keep saying- it's an exploitable situation because we don't have the ability to keep on top of it. Asylum is legal, but we all know what is going on, but that doesn’t make people using that system illegally here.

I think immigration is important for our country and its an idea we were built upon, hence I would rather it fixed my way.

Imo addressing this fixes more things, and also makes attempts by people who shouldn't be here less attractive. This is accomplished by facilities to hold and process and the ability to process very quickly, not by walls.

The solution of a wall only decreases the gotaway numbers, which I agree is an issue, but it's also a fraction of the total # of encounters, and last time I saw the most here illegally are so because they overstayed - again, inanimate wall does zip to address.

 

[FairWarning]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

Of course, why wouldn't that be part of the process? If their claim isn't legit, don't allow them in. If it is, let them in. IMO it should be quick and painless, not wait for 3 years to find out they shouldn’t have been here.

Do you agree part of the draw for these immigrants is that it's known it's an exploitable system that takes years and years?

No I don’t agree with that. It’s not their country, nor their rules.

 

[FairWarning]

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

The core problem is millions of people crossing the border illegally without any checks, counts etc

Until that is addressed nothing else will matter.

The only people this applies to is the getaways, which I agree is an issue.

Everyone else is in our country via legit, legal avenues - one of which includes seeking asylum.

You saying there are no checks and balances is a bit insulting to the work border patrol is putting in.

Know what else is insulting? The federal government at the highest levels not having their back.

 

[KarmaPolice]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

Of course, why wouldn't that be part of the process? If their claim isn't legit, don't allow them in. If it is, let them in. IMO it should be quick and painless, not wait for 3 years to find out they shouldn’t have been here.

Do you agree part of the draw for these immigrants is that it's known it's an exploitable system that takes years and years?

No I don’t agree with that. It’s not their country, nor their rules.

It's not their rules, you are right. We are making the rules, they are using/exploiting them. It's not their job to fix that or make new rules, it's our job.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

The core problem is millions of people crossing the border illegally without any checks, counts etc

Until that is addressed nothing else will matter.

The only people this applies to is the getaways, which I agree is an issue.

Everyone else is in our country via legit, legal avenues - one of which includes seeking asylum.

You saying there are no checks and balances is a bit insulting to the work border patrol is putting in.

Know what else is insulting? The federal government at the highest levels not having their back.

Don't disagree with that.

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

The core problem is millions of people crossing the border illegally without any checks, counts etc

Until that is addressed nothing else will matter.

The only people this applies to is the getaways, which I agree is an issue.

Everyone else is in our country via legit, legal avenues - one of which includes seeking asylum.

You saying there are no checks and balances is a bit insulting to the work border patrol is putting in.

Know what else is insulting? The federal government at the highest levels not having their back.

I won't disagree with that.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Yikes. Posting is rough on the phone sometimes.

 

[The Commish]

Yet another post proving you really don't read much of anything I say. If you did, you wouldn't keep asking me the same questions over and over.

you'd be ok with spending the hundreds of millions on lawyers/judges .... I am not and the truth is, it wouldn't matter anyway because of all the people who just stay anyway

if they were honest people abiding by our laws ... wouldn't there be no illegals living in the USA for the past 20 years? we know there are 20 million or more illegally here people ... they're not here waiting for their day in court

many many return after being deported - because they want to be in the USA and they'll break every law we have to get their way

Table 39. Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019 | Homeland Security

The 2019 Yearbook of Immigration Statistics data Table 39: Aliens Removed or Returned: Fiscal Years 1892 to 2019.

www.dhs.gov

Are we making up numbers on cost or are you basing your "hundreds of millions" on something specific? You're good spending billions on a wall though which is odd because the arguments you make against actually processing people according to the law apply to your wall too. And it will cost millions to clean everyone "illegal" out of the country and keep it that way, so of all the scenarios, the ONLY one you object to is initial application of the law. Completely weird and nonsensical IMO, but i"m not surprised.

Wouldn't that be enough? All the other stuff is damage control but if you enforce the law and prevent the issue, isn't that the thing?

It should be the primary focus IMO, but everyone wants to focus on a bunch of other stuff that costs way more and is way less effective.

serious question, not trying to get into a back and forth but on this particular example you guys are discussion, what IS the other stuff that costs way more and is less effective? I just want to see what it is and understand it.

Not processing them in a timely manner, just letting them pile up at the border and walls primarily and I'm rather confident it costs much more to let them in the country, then track them down when they don't show up, then hold them, then process them (this last part might not be true....I don't know, but it seems logical).

 

[The Commish]

My guess is a couple F35s a year for 5ish years?

The rest is arguing against yourself. In one breath it's we have to lock down the border!!! In the next it's illegals don't listen to the rules. If true, there's no point in locking down the border right? This is your weird argument that no one but you uses.

The unmitigated irony of all these conversations is I am absolutely good with 100% supporting our laws with the federal funds necessary to get the job done. All you and your crew can ask me is "who's gonna pay for it?". If that's your position and you're concerned with money (I don't believe you are) then that should be your question all the way through. However, somehow that gets dropped talking about walls and when complaining that cities/states won't use local tax dollars to do the job of the federal government. What you want costs money and a lot of it. Can't have it both ways.

if you don't understand the clear difference between where border security exists (barriers to stop illegals and people enforcing) vs where no border control exists (literally just wading across a river and you're on USA soil) then I don't know what to tell you

why do prisons have walls and barbed wire and tower sentries and guards and locks and all that ? they're criminals right? they'll just get out right ? well, not if the security is good enough, right ?


its about money and its about security for American citizens, and its about upholding our laws and its about all the border states and citizens that are having to deal with it all and its about literally 20 million people living in the USA illegally that we have no idea who they are - that's what its about

It's your logic...not mine....I don't care to understand the knot you've twisted yourself into

To your question of escape, we have plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities....again, your logic, not mine.

 

[sho nuff]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

 

[FairWarning]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

Of course, why wouldn't that be part of the process? If their claim isn't legit, don't allow them in. If it is, let them in. IMO it should be quick and painless, not wait for 3 years to find out they shouldn’t have been here.

Do you agree part of the draw for these immigrants is that it's known it's an exploitable system that takes years and years?

No I don’t agree with that. It’s not their country, nor their rules.

It's not their rules, you are right. We are making the rules, they are using/exploiting them. It's not their job to fix that or make new rules, it's our job.

And you’re right, we need a clear plan on this. I don’t care if we let in 1 or a million (if we can handle it)). We just cannot treat the border (outside of the main entries) to be a general admission concert.

 

[FairWarning]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

They welcomed undocumented people, they have the resources. They also shielded undocumented people from ICE.

 

[sho nuff]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

They welcomed undocumented people, they have the resources. They also shielded undocumented people from ICE.

Stating you wont assist ICE in apprehending them doesn’t mean…hey ship us extra people here and we wont need resources .

 

[KarmaPolice]

So by claiming asylum and using that legal avenue of entry, people are here illegally? Learn something new every day.

I get the frustration of an exploitable system, but a lot of that is the huge backlog and having to wait years to get their hearing. That's not on them, that is on us for not focusing on that. I don't understand why the primary solution for so many is stopping that person from getting here vs fixing it so it's quick and we have proper facilities while they wait so they aren't allowed in if their claim is invalid.

Many don’t want to be caught either.

Of course.

Don’t we have a right to send them back?

Of course, why wouldn't that be part of the process? If their claim isn't legit, don't allow them in. If it is, let them in. IMO it should be quick and painless, not wait for 3 years to find out they shouldn’t have been here.

Do you agree part of the draw for these immigrants is that it's known it's an exploitable system that takes years and years?

No I don’t agree with that. It’s not their country, nor their rules.

It's not their rules, you are right. We are making the rules, they are using/exploiting them. It's not their job to fix that or make new rules, it's our job.

And you’re right, we need a clear plan on this. I don’t care if we let in 1 or a million (if we can handle it)). We just cannot treat the border (outside of the main entries) to be a general admission concert.

I agree with that last part as well, fwiw.
That's why I've said many times this administrations handling of it has been trash.

 

[FairWarning]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

They welcomed undocumented people, they have the resources. They also shielded undocumented people from ICE.

Stating you wont assist ICE in apprehending them doesn’t mean…hey ship us extra people here and we wont need resources .

I’m sure those cities can get extra resources. they also have more infrastructure and people to help, vs a border town.

 

[sho nuff]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

They welcomed undocumented people, they have the resources. They also shielded undocumented people from ICE.

Stating you wont assist ICE in apprehending them doesn’t mean…hey ship us extra people here and we wont need resources .

I’m sure those cities can get extra resources. they also have more infrastructure and people to help, vs a border town.

Isn’t that what the mayor is requesting? Federal funding?

 

[Stealthycat]

@Stealthycat @knowledge dropper
Just wondering? Do you believe the 2020 election was stolen?

"stolen" .... words both the GOP and DNC have used huh ?

I don't believe Biden got the votes that we're told he got, and I believe the mail in balloting system is highly questionable .... I don't believe Biden was nearly as popular as Hillary and yet got way more votes I simply don't for a variety of reasons

but Joe Biden is the President, I'm not looking back but forward


as to the border issue ... this is one of those things like Roe ..... neither side seems to want to compromise so at some point, one side will dominate and roll forth right over the other side

 

[Stealthycat]

It's your logic...not mine....I don't care to understand the knot you've twisted yourself into

To your question of escape, we have plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities....again, your logic, not mine.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at other than because we know and agree illegals don't abide the law and they'll keep returning even when deported you believe we should hire lawyers and judges and allow millions to stay here and flip the bill for it all and me ?

I say lock the border and don't let them in

I say my way solves the problem of illegals being the USA and yours does it

"plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities" .... well then treat it like the border, take down the walls/security, right ? c'mon, what twisting are you trying to do here ?

 

[Stealthycat]

Exactly, like I keep saying- it's an exploitable situation because we don't have the ability to keep on top of it. Asylum is legal, but we all know what is going on, but that doesn’t make people using that system illegally here.

I think immigration is important for our country and its an idea we were built upon, hence I would rather it fixed my way.

Imo addressing this fixes more things, and also makes attempts by people who shouldn't be here less attractive. This is accomplished by facilities to hold and process and the ability to process very quickly, not by walls.

The solution of a wall only decreases the gotaway numbers, which I agree is an issue, but it's also a fraction of the total # of encounters, and last time I saw the most here illegally are so because they overstayed - again, inanimate wall does zip to address.

with literally millions coming across now every year ... I don't think anyone can say overstayed VISA"s are the problem

 

[KarmaPolice]

It's your logic...not mine....I don't care to understand the knot you've twisted yourself into

To your question of escape, we have plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities....again, your logic, not mine.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at other than because we know and agree illegals don't abide the law and they'll keep returning even when deported you believe we should hire lawyers and judges and allow millions to stay here and flip the bill for it all and me ?

I say lock the border and don't let them in

I say my way solves the problem of illegals being the USA and yours does it

"plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities" .... well then treat it like the border, take down the walls/security, right ? c'mon, what twisting are you trying to do here ?

It certainly doesn't. Unless something drastically changed in the last two years, which I admit is possible, last article I read had a 7 year streak of the majority of illegals in the US are from overstayed visas, not the southern border. I think that data was from 2020 and the years before it. So your way doesn't even address the majority of illegal immigrants in the US.

 

[The Commish]

It's your logic...not mine....I don't care to understand the knot you've twisted yourself into

To your question of escape, we have plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities....again, your logic, not mine.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at other than because we know and agree illegals don't abide the law and they'll keep returning even when deported you believe we should hire lawyers and judges and allow millions to stay here and flip the bill for it all and me ?

I say lock the border and don't let them in

I say my way solves the problem of illegals being the USA and yours does it

"plenty of instances where people escape from those sorts of facilities" .... well then treat it like the border, take down the walls/security, right ? c'mon, what twisting are you trying to do here ?

You're also the one that says criminals (and illegals) don't follow the rules so by your logic, one could "lock" the border all they want, but the criminals and illegals aren't going to listen so what does it matter?

All I continue to do is regurgitate your own talking points. I'm not twisting anything. I'm simply repeating your nonsense.

 

[Stealthycat]

It certainly doesn't. Unless something drastically changed in the last two years, which I admit is possible, last article I read had a 7 year streak of the majority of illegals in the US are from overstayed visas, not the southern border. I think that data was from 2020 and the years before it. So your way doesn't even address the majority of illegal immigrants in the US.

1.7 conservative est to 2 million came across last year alone right ? now how many overstay visa's, can you find that ?

and even so, we're ALL in agreement to oust the overstay visa people right? AND at least they've been vetted somewhat to GET their visa

 

[Stealthycat]

You're also the one that says criminals (and illegals) don't follow the rules so by your logic, one could "lock" the border all they want, but the criminals and illegals aren't going to listen so what does it matter?

All I continue to do is regurgitate your own talking points. I'm not twisting anything. I'm simply repeating your nonsense.

you can't say that about me without adding the other thing I say ......... we still need laws and rules and penalties and punishments and prevention as best we can and right now the southern border is pathetic, its a humanitarian crisis, sex/human trafficking, drug trafficking and it needs stopped NOW

you ARE twisting by not talking fully c'mon man

 

[FairWarning]

We need Tim back to comment on this CNN story - https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/07/us/nyc-mayor-emergency-migrants/index.html

What were Adams' stance on immigration before this?

He proudly announced that nyc was a Santuary City. If they can’t handle it, who can?

What does a sanctuary city have to do with that?

They welcomed undocumented people, they have the resources. They also shielded undocumented people from ICE.

Stating you wont assist ICE in apprehending them doesn’t mean…hey ship us extra people here and we wont need resources .

I’m sure those cities can get extra resources. they also have more infrastructure and people to help, vs a border town.

Isn’t that what the mayor is requesting? Federal funding?

They should get it.

 

[KarmaPolice]

It certainly doesn't. Unless something drastically changed in the last two years, which I admit is possible, last article I read had a 7 year streak of the majority of illegals in the US are from overstayed visas, not the southern border. I think that data was from 2020 and the years before it. So your way doesn't even address the majority of illegal immigrants in the US.

1.7 conservative est to 2 million came across last year alone right ? now how many overstay visa's, can you find that ?

and even so, we're ALL in agreement to oust the overstay visa people right? AND at least they've been vetted somewhat to GET their visa

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

 

[Stealthycat]

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

Of the 1.66 million migrants encountered in FY 2021, about two-thirds of all encounters by the Border Patrol between ports of entry resulted in migrants being immediately expelled. The remaining one-third resulted in migrants being detained or released inside the United States.

that's the encounters

how many do you think were NOT encountered ?

you think we catch 50% ? 30% ?

 

[FairWarning]

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

Of the 1.66 million migrants encountered in FY 2021, about two-thirds of all encounters by the Border Patrol between ports of entry resulted in migrants being immediately expelled. The remaining one-third resulted in migrants being detained or released inside the United States.

that's the encounters

how many do you think were NOT encountered ?

you think we catch 50% ? 30% ?

I don’t think anyone has an idea how many we catch.

 

[jamny]

Misuse of Texas Data Understates Illegal Immigrant Criminality​

Conclusion​

Studies purporting to show low illegal immigrant crime rates in Texas fail to account for the fact that illegal immigrants are not always identified immediately upon arrest. In many cases, illegal immigrants are identified only after they are imprisoned. Given sufficient time for data collection, it appears that illegal immigrants have above average conviction rates for homicide and sexual assault, while they have lower rates for robbery and drugs. Significant uncertainty persists, however, as to how many illegals may remain unidentified, especially those who committed lesser offenses requiring little or no prison time. While strong claims about the overall criminality of illegal immigrants are not possible with the current data, prior research has understated it substantially.

 

[The Commish]

You're also the one that says criminals (and illegals) don't follow the rules so by your logic, one could "lock" the border all they want, but the criminals and illegals aren't going to listen so what does it matter?

All I continue to do is regurgitate your own talking points. I'm not twisting anything. I'm simply repeating your nonsense.

you can't say that about me without adding the other thing I say ......... we still need laws and rules and penalties and punishments and prevention as best we can and right now the southern border is pathetic, its a humanitarian crisis, sex/human trafficking, drug trafficking and it needs stopped NOW

you ARE twisting by not talking fully c'mon man

You mean like when you say, "laws only punish the ones who follow the laws"? Sorry....i did forget that gem

 

[Sand]

largest employer in the world is the US Govt right ?

It's almost assuredly the Chinese government.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

Of the 1.66 million migrants encountered in FY 2021, about two-thirds of all encounters by the Border Patrol between ports of entry resulted in migrants being immediately expelled. The remaining one-third resulted in migrants being detained or released inside the United States.

that's the encounters

how many do you think were NOT encountered ?

you think we catch 50% ? 30% ?

Now we are in the goalpost moving portion of the discussion. Awesome. Good to know I underestimated the % of encounters sent back.

But yes I agree- this is what a wall addresses, and have said as much. Due to cameras and such they have estimates as to what that number is- you don't have to guess and make up numbers.

We agree on this, so we should agree your solution doesn't solve illegals in the country, and it only addresses a portion of the problems when we talk about the border and illegal immigrants.

 

[KarmaPolice]

You're also the one that says criminals (and illegals) don't follow the rules so by your logic, one could "lock" the border all they want, but the criminals and illegals aren't going to listen so what does it matter?

All I continue to do is regurgitate your own talking points. I'm not twisting anything. I'm simply repeating your nonsense.

you can't say that about me without adding the other thing I say ......... we still need laws and rules and penalties and punishments and prevention as best we can and right now the southern border is pathetic, its a humanitarian crisis, sex/human trafficking, drug trafficking and it needs stopped NOW

you ARE twisting by not talking fully c'mon man

You mean like when you say, "laws only punish the ones who follow the laws"? Sorry....i did forget that gem

Wait, what?

 

[parasaurolophus]

largest employer in the world is the US Govt right ?

It's almost assuredly the Chinese government.

Which one employs swalwell?

 

[FairWarning]

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

Of the 1.66 million migrants encountered in FY 2021, about two-thirds of all encounters by the Border Patrol between ports of entry resulted in migrants being immediately expelled. The remaining one-third resulted in migrants being detained or released inside the United States.

that's the encounters

how many do you think were NOT encountered ?

you think we catch 50% ? 30% ?

Now we are in the goalpost moving portion of the discussion. Awesome. Good to know I underestimated the % of encounters sent back.

But yes I agree- this is what a wall addresses, and have said as much. Due to cameras and such they have estimates as to what that number is- you don't have to guess and make up numbers.

We agree on this, so we should agree your solution doesn't solve illegals in the country, and it only addresses a portion of the problems when we talk about the border and illegal immigrants.

So how do you propose fixing the last point? We have established two things
- not all of them want to be here legally
- sanctuary cities protect the illegals.

 

[KarmaPolice]

Came across <> entered <> illegal. This is where you are being ignorant.

Last I looked of the encounters about 40% were turned away. There is step 1. If they were encountered and let in, they are using our legit and legal method of entry- get in, get a court date (unfortunately probably years away), and show up to your date. So another chunk of your millions are here via our rules- you know, not illegally. We can argue about those rules, the lack of enforcement and ability to keep up with those rules, but it's not illegal. So again, what you are largely left with from the border are the gotaways, which is a fraction of this 2M you keep trotting out there for reasons I can guess.

I didn't see stats on expired visas that year, what I have run across is what I have said - the steak of 7 years of it being that way. The trend could very well be reversed under Biden, but that would still be 7 of 9 years being the case, and still makes your claim that your solution solves the problem of illegals being in the US completely bogus.

Of the 1.66 million migrants encountered in FY 2021, about two-thirds of all encounters by the Border Patrol between ports of entry resulted in migrants being immediately expelled. The remaining one-third resulted in migrants being detained or released inside the United States.

that's the encounters

how many do you think were NOT encountered ?

you think we catch 50% ? 30% ?

Now we are in the goalpost moving portion of the discussion. Awesome. Good to know I underestimated the % of encounters sent back.

But yes I agree- this is what a wall addresses, and have said as much. Due to cameras and such they have estimates as to what that number is- you don't have to guess and make up numbers.

We agree on this, so we should agree your solution doesn't solve illegals in the country, and it only addresses a portion of the problems when we talk about the border and illegal immigrants.

So how do you propose fixing the last point? We have established two things
- not all of them want to be here legally
- sanctuary cities protect the illegals.

Sorry, what last point? The numbers that get across regardless, that a wall would help address?

If so, I said the other day, that it's not like I am against securing those trouble spots- be it with more tech, people, wall, etc. Of those things, I am still mostly against a physical wall because it just sits there and does nothing else- ie people could be used a variety of ways, tech could be moved/updated, etc. I know it sounds silly, but I will admit the symbolism of it is a part of my not liking it too.
Also, my overall gripe is the suggestion that this should be first and foremost step, and especially when it's suggested like SC did that it will fix illegals in the US.

If that's not what you meant, forgive the early morning rant and clarify.