Government Response To The Coronavirus (2 Viewers)

[Workhorse]

The heart of my argument was that the flu is in fact a deadly virus which has been blunted by vaccines.  You’re determined to turn play “gotcha” on the semantics.  You win.  If the infection rate changes, blah blah blah.

The flu was once worse than it is today..  We’ve studied it for decades and made it leas deadly. 

But I concede all future arguments on semantics, fatality rate, or your attempts to play “gotcha.”

Math isn't semantics. It's just math. 

 

[KPD]

Since fatality rate is based on people who are infected (whether or not they die) it should be the same. 

Vaccines provide protection by teaching your body to fight the infection.  They aren't some magic shield that stops your body from contracting the disease in the first place.  You are arguing that having flu vaccines haven't reduced death rates?  Even if the flu vaccine doesn't match the strain going around, it typically provides some cross protection and illness severity can be reduced.

 

[jm192]

Math isn't semantics. It's just math. 

But if the infection rate is lower, and less people are dying:  Then we've definitively done a good job of blunting the virus. 

But instead:  "Well the fatality rate is techinically this." 

 

[Workhorse]

Vaccines provide protection by teaching your body to fight the infection.  They aren't some magic shield that stops your body from contracting the disease in the first place.  You are arguing that having flu vaccines haven't reduced death rates?  Even if the flu vaccine doesn't match the strain going around, it typically provides some cross protection and illness severity can be reduced.

It depends on the virus. The flu is very different than say, polio.

 

[jm192]

It depends on the virus. The flu is very different than say, polio.

The fallacy is thinking that there is 1 flu.  There are several strains of influenza.  If the vaccine prevents you from contacting the more severe forms, and or helps your body mount a better response when you get the flu--then that helps prevent mortality. 

We've gone way down this flu rabbit hole.  The point was "It's not absurd to compare it to the flu.  The flu is a deadly virus.  The flu used to be a lot worse."   And now we're down to our 30th tangent arguing vaccines and statistics. 

 

[Henry Ford]

Vaccines provide protection by teaching your body to fight the infection.  They aren't some magic shield that stops your body from contracting the disease in the first place.  You are arguing that having flu vaccines haven't reduced death rates?  Even if the flu vaccine doesn't match the strain going around, it typically provides some cross protection and illness severity can be reduced.

Perhaps we understand the word “immunity” differently. 

 

[Henry Ford]

The fallacy is thinking that there is 1 flu.  There are several strains of influenza.  If the vaccine prevents you from contacting the more severe forms, and or helps your body mount a better response when you get the flu--then that helps prevent mortality. 

We've gone way down this flu rabbit hole.  The point was "It's not absurd to compare it to the flu.  The flu is a deadly virus.  The flu used to be a lot worse."   And now we're down to our 30th tangent arguing vaccines and statistics. 

It’s pretty similar to the Spanish Flu. 

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

The fallacy is thinking that there is 1 flu.  There are several strains of influenza.  If the vaccine prevents you from contacting the more severe forms, and or helps your body mount a better response when you get the flu--then that helps prevent mortality. 

We've gone way down this flu rabbit hole.  The point was "It's not absurd to compare it to the flu.  The flu is a deadly virus.  The flu used to be a lot worse."   And now we're down to our 30th tangent arguing vaccines and statistics. 

Isn’t that the point of certain thought leaders introducing that comp in the first place, that rabbit hole?

 

[jm192]

Perhaps we understand the word “immunity” differently. 

Since the post you quoted didn't use the word immunity--I'll just highlight that even in the absence of complete immunity--vaccines can prime your immune system--leading to a better response in the event of an infection.

 

[squistion]

Elizabeth Warren is calling on Trump admin officials to explain its handling of the evacuation of the Diamond Princess cruise ship, after 14 passengers infected with the coronavirus flew on a plane with other travelers despite a warning from the CDC.

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/02/26/warren-coronavirus-trump-cruise-117760

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

1. Look y’all this hurricane is just a sort of rainstorm.

2. Harumphharumphgrumbleangryshouting.
 

3. You’re just going down rabbit holes arguing about nimbus clouds, look at this disgrace we have important work to do.

 

[Skoo]

As far as Pence goes, he may not know much about science, but he is simply superb at offering nauseating public praise of President Trump which is reminiscent of Molotov praising Stalin. And that’s important if you want to accomplish anything in Washington these days. 

That is an incredibly nice way of saying he doesn't believe in science.

 

[Henry Ford]

1. Look y’all this hurricane is just a sort of rainstorm.

2. Harumphharumphgrumbleangryshouting.
 

3. You’re just going down rabbit holes arguing about nimbus clouds, look at this disgrace we have important work to do.

“All those people chose to go to the Superdome.”

 

[JAA]

If we only had the wall this would be a huge nothingburger

 

[Amused to Death]

If we only had the wall this would be a huge nothingburger

But only across the southern border. No one crosses our northern border. Well, no undesirables anyway.

 

[Henry Ford]

If we only had the wall this would be a huge nothingburger

....is what Mexico should be saying, since it doesn't have a single case of coronavirus yet.

 

[Sand]

As far as Pence goes, he may not know much about science, but he is simply superb at offering nauseating public praise of President Trump which is reminiscent of Molotov praising Stalin.

No worries.  Well soon have President Sanders, who actually wants to be like Stalin.

 

[Henry Ford]

No worries.  Well soon have President Sanders, who actually wants to be like Stalin.

Thank goodness. It's so nice to see someone pick a murderous dictator to compare a Presidential candidate with other than Hitler. 

 

[jonessed]

Drink!

 

[Leroy Hoard]

Thank goodness. It's so nice to see someone pick a murderous dictator to compare a Presidential candidate with other than Hitler. 

He could have used Mussolini, but was probably saving that for Bloomberg.

 

[Joe Summer]

jonessed said:

Drink!

whoosh

 

[Skoo]

No worries.  Well soon have President Sanders, who actually wants to be like Stalin.

You think he wants to murder millions of people?

 

[Dickies]

If we only had the wall this would be a huge nothingburger

If only China had a wall

 

[joffer]

You think he wants to murder millions of people?

of course not, just gulags

 

[Sheriff Bart]

Perhaps we understand the word “immunity” differently. 

Depends on your version of freeze tag. 

 

[KPD]

Since fatality rate is based on people who are infected (whether or not they die) it should be the same. 

Perhaps we understand the word “immunity” differently. 

 2017 study showed that flu vaccination reduced deaths, intensive care unit (ICU) admissions, ICU length of stay, and overall duration of hospitalization among hospitalized adults with flu. Another study in 2018 showed that a vaccinated adult who was hospitalized with flu was 59 percent less likely to be admitted to the ICU than someone who had not been vaccinated. Among adults in the ICU with flu, vaccinated patients on average spent 4 fewer days in the hospital than those who were not vaccinated.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2016-2017/vaccine-reduces-severe-outcomes.htm

The study found that vaccinated adults were 52-79% less likely to die than unvaccinated flu-hospitalized patients. In other words, an unvaccinated hospitalized flu patient was 2 to 5 times more likely to die than someone who had been vaccinated.

 

[Sheriff Bart]

No worries.  Well soon have President Sanders, who actually wants to be like Stalin.

Here we just got free from the Sharia law Obama imposed on us. 

 

[KPD]

Not sure why we are playing word games.  Vaccines help so it's difficult to compare fatality rates of flu with Covid-19 directly.  Anyway, the purpose of this thread isn't to dissect fatality rates, it's to discuss the government's complete lack of response to what will soon become a health emergency in this country.  CDC test kits don't work, no guidance is being given to health facilities, and the public communication is to wash your hands and continue going to mass gatherings like normal and spend your money.

 

[Sand]

Thank goodness. It's so nice to see someone pick a murderous dictator to compare a Presidential candidate with other than Hitler. 

Good to see you ignore Tim's comment and jump here on the obvious socialist-socialist connection.

You think he wants to murder millions of people?

Of course he won't kill millions of people.  He's old and has a bad heart.  I'd be surprised if he makes it through the first two years.

 

[Sand]

 and the public communication is to wash your hands and continue going to mass gatherings like normal and spend your money.

What do you think the public communication should be?  Build bunkers?

 

[KPD]

What do you think the public communication should be?  Build bunkers?

Why would we need bunkers, according to our head of state, a vaccine is almost ready.

 

[Henry Ford]

Good to see you ignore Tim's comment and jump here on the obvious socialist-socialist connection.

Of course he won't kill millions of people.  He's old and has a bad heart.  I'd be surprised if he makes it through the first two years.

I'll be honest, I don't read most of tim's comments.

 

[BroadwayG]

Why would we need bunkers, according to our head of state, a vaccine is almost ready.

Who needs a vaccine? Cases will be down to zero well before then.

 

[KPD]

What do you think the public communication should be?  Build bunkers?

For starters, how about acknowledging that the US is not currently testing for this at all, so we have absolutely no idea if there are actually any cases and transmission occurring in the US.

 

[Henry Ford]

 2017 study showed that flu vaccination reduced deaths, intensive care unit (ICU) admissions, ICU length of stay, and overall duration of hospitalization among hospitalized adults with flu. Another study in 2018 showed that a vaccinated adult who was hospitalized with flu was 59 percent less likely to be admitted to the ICU than someone who had not been vaccinated. Among adults in the ICU with flu, vaccinated patients on average spent 4 fewer days in the hospital than those who were not vaccinated.

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/spotlights/2016-2017/vaccine-reduces-severe-outcomes.htm

The study found that vaccinated adults were 52-79% less likely to die than unvaccinated flu-hospitalized patients. In other words, an unvaccinated hospitalized flu patient was 2 to 5 times more likely to die than someone who had been vaccinated.

That's a good study.  As it says, it needs a good deal more research.  I'm hopeful that further research shows similar results.

 

[Sheriff Bart]

It concerns me that I don't hear any worry from anyone I've interacted with IRL the last few days.

 

[zoonation]

It’s getting rather likely. 

I dont see how they can hold them at this point.  Really sucks.  

 

[Skoo]

Good to see you ignore Tim's comment and jump here on the obvious socialist-socialist connection.

Of course he won't kill millions of people.  He's old and has a bad heart.  I'd be surprised if he makes it through the first two years.

So in your mind he'll kill a lot of people, but won't reach millions because he's old and won't last?

What about Bernie makes you think he's gonna be such a murderer?

 

[Sand]

Who needs a vaccine? Cases will be down to zero well before then.

It could end up like a typical flu with typical flu season tendencies and it wanes in a couple months.  Could being the key word there.  It all depends on how the Chinese lab constructed it.

 

[Sand]

So in your mind he'll kill a lot of people, but won't reach millions because he's old and won't last?

What about Bernie makes you think he's gonna be such a murderer?

You're being way too serious for a message board.  I should have written my initial thought about betting odds between Sanders and a horde of 6 year olds.  That was a fun thread.

 

[Henry Ford]

It could end up like a typical flu with typical flu season tendencies and it wanes in a couple months.  Could being the key word there.  It all depends on how the Chinese lab constructed it.

I see.

 

[zoonation]

Good to see you ignore Tim's comment and jump here on the obvious socialist-socialist connection.

Of course he won't kill millions of people.  He's old and has a bad heart.  I'd be surprised if he makes it through the first two years.

Stalin wasn’t a socialist.  He was a communist.  I have t read that Bernie wants to centralize production and purge all of his enemies. 

do you really believe they are similar?   Wow.  

 

[Skoo]

You're being way too serious for a message board.  I should have written my initial thought about betting odds between Sanders and a horde of 6 year olds.  That was a fun thread.

Glad you were joking, almost seemed like you bought what the GOP is selling hook line and sinker.

 

[Sand]

Stalin wasn’t a socialist.  

Socialism in one country.

 

[urbanhack]

No worries.  Well soon have President Sanders, who actually wants to be like Stalin.

And based on what we know of Sanders...

• he wouldn't have eliminated the pandemic response team or made cuts to the CDC
  
• he would have already reduced the cost of prescription drugs so there wouldn't be any worry about paying for vaccines if this becomes a real issue
  

What else am i missing?

 

[timschochet]

I'll be honest, I don't read most of tim's comments.

So hurt by this. 

BTW I wasn't comparing Trump to Stalin; I was comparing Pence to Molotov and the other Soviet officials who slavishly praised Stalin every chance they got. The way Pence and some of these White House people treat Trump is really sickening: 

“Under your great leadership, Mr. President...” 

How can anybody stand that? 

 

[zoonation]

Socialism in one country.

?

Do you have any thoughts of your own on the matter?   

 

[Sand]

“Under your great leadership, Mr. President...” 

How can anybody stand that? 

For some reason I laugh at this as all I can think of as a counterpoint is "This is a big ####### deal..."

Love ya', Joe.

 

[Jackstraw]

This is a time when for profit medicine/pharmaceuticals and tens of millions of people with no health insurance coverage seems especially perverse. 

Poeple will hold off on a diagnosis/treatmment for fear of financial ruin. https://www.miamiherald.com/news/health-care/article240476806.html

Health and human Services Secretary just couldn't commit to an afforadable vaccine because we need the private sector to profit ERRRRRR invest. 

We literally have a national crisis and we need to look out for private industry FIRST. 

NUTBALLS. Immoral.    

 

[Cowboysfan8]

....is what Mexico should be saying, since it doesn't have a single case of coronavirus yet.

Are they testing for it ?