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Predict Pujol's Next Contract (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter otello
- Start date
dparker713
Footballguy
10 yrs 310 million
dparker713
Footballguy
The Yankees have no place to put him. Ditto with Boston and Philly. The Dodgers have no money. The Cubs have a definite hole, but a ton of money tied up. The Mets could certainly ditch Davis for him. LAA, CWS and Det could all find room, but I'm not sure how likely any of those spots really are. I guess Was, Bal and Hou are possibilities as well, but they're even more dark horse candidates.The market for expensive 1B really isn't all that big and if Fielder signs early in the offseason it would be even smaller.
Thunderlips
Footballguy
Cha Ching!!!!
dparker713
Footballguy
They're already paying a 1B 23 mil a year. They're committed to ARod for 27+ mil a year and they've got Jeter at 17 mil a year - both of whom will spend significant time at DH coming up soon. Plus, they have Posada for this year and Montero on the farm. Besides, putting either Tex or Pujols at DH is a waste - they're both good fielders.
the moops
Footballguy
When you can dish out 35 million for a set up man, paying a good fielder to DH is not an issue.
Michael Brown
Footballguy
I don't see why Boston doesn't have a spot for him. Ortiz's option is for this year and then he'll likely be done. Pujols would be insane there.
But I think the Cards find a way to get it done. I don't think they'd have paid Holliday the dollars they did if they didn't know they had the budget for Albert too.
But I think the Cards find a way to get it done. I don't think they'd have paid Holliday the dollars they did if they didn't know they had the budget for Albert too.
Smack Tripper
Footballguy
I think it all depends if he's able or willing to play the OF. If he were smart, he'd make this known and the Yanks would come a calling. 10 years, 350 million
dparker713
Footballguy
Not a chance he winds up a Yankee.
RnR
Footballguy
Cards will resign him in the upcoming weeks. It'll be a blank check situation, and Pujols will have to weigh out how much he wants with the understanding that the more he takes the less they have to spend on putting players around him. Personally, I think he settles in at a 10 year, 250-270 mil deal. Pujols has said all along that as long as the Cardinals continue to field a competitive team around him, he wants to remain a Cardinal. He's a family man with strong roots in the St. Louis community. He's stated several times he loves St. Louis and does not take lightly the opportunity they have provided him.
Unlike many other players that pay lip service to their hometown team and community, I actually believe what Pujols says.
Unlike many other players that pay lip service to their hometown team and community, I actually believe what Pujols says.
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Captain Hook
Footballguy
I agree that the Cardinals will pay him
The trick will be figuring out the compromise point - really up to him but I don't see a really long contract, the team wouldn't wat to do it and I am not sure that Pujols wants to play that long.
My guess is $30 million per year for five or six years - the total will be less than other deals but the dollars per year will exceed all previous contracts
The trick will be figuring out the compromise point - really up to him but I don't see a really long contract, the team wouldn't wat to do it and I am not sure that Pujols wants to play that long.
My guess is $30 million per year for five or six years - the total will be less than other deals but the dollars per year will exceed all previous contracts
boubucarow
Footballguy
Cubs will have enough to sign him to a huge contract if they want with Ramirez, Silva, Kosuke, and Pena coming off the books with over 40 million. There is no way I see it happening though.
Mr. Know-It-All
Footballguy
That would make me very unhappy...almost as bad as if one of my kids wanted to go to Kansas University. They'd be disowned.
Bogart
Footballguy
I think he stays in St Louis, his yearly number will be more than A-Rod. The number of years will be interesting.
Pipe dream would have him coming to Texas. It would be the perfect situation if Texas really wanted to push their payroll into the top 5 or 6 in baseball. The glaring weakness on this team is at 1B. You put Fat Albert in the middle of a lineup of Hamilton, Cruz, Beltre, Kinsler, Young and Andrus leading things off. Would be an amazing lineup.
Pipe dream would have him coming to Texas. It would be the perfect situation if Texas really wanted to push their payroll into the top 5 or 6 in baseball. The glaring weakness on this team is at 1B. You put Fat Albert in the middle of a lineup of Hamilton, Cruz, Beltre, Kinsler, Young and Andrus leading things off. Would be an amazing lineup.
Mr. Know-It-All
Footballguy
That's Phat Albert to you, sir. If he left for any other team, I w ould hope it would be Texas - Rangers are probably my second favorite team...my favorite AL team by far.Bogart said:
Snotbubbles
Footballguy
I can't see the Cards letting Pujols go, but there's no way the Cards can go 30M for Pujols and continue to keep their payroll at under 100M. They have to radically change their budgetary structure in order to compete.
Tackling Dummies
Footballguy
It's not that StL is letting him go, but they can't afford the $240M-280M contract.
RnR
Footballguy
False.
Snotbubbles
Footballguy
They can sign Pujols, but they're gonna have to go well above their usual 90-100M opening day payroll in 2012. This is what I mean when I say they have to change their budgetary structure. They already have 49M committed in 2012 (Holliday, Lohse, Westbrook and Wainwright + buyouts). They have a 15M option for Carpenter so assuming they pick that up, plus another 25M for Pujols they are already at 88M for only 6 players of a 25 man roster. Even dime a dozen vets will run you 3M. They probably need another 30M or so to fill out the roster unless they plan on filling out the roster with minor leaguers. Their opening day payroll has been around 90-100M for the past 5 years so they have to be willing to go to around 120M opening day to fit Pujols in and still field a semi-competitive team around him. It not a question of if they can, it's more of a question if they will.
RnR
Footballguy
Exactly, and given the backlash they'd see from their harshly loyal fan base if they don't make this happen, I think it will happen. Don't kill the cash cow over a little greed. Pujols pays for himself in that town.
This is what I think too, and he will resign with St. Louis. At least I hope he stays. I can't imagine him playing in Busch stadium with another team.
igbomb
Footballguy
This is my thought too, at least in years. I wouldn't be surprised if they climbed above $30, but I think they will inflate the annual number before increasing the years to 8-10.
Eephus
Footballguy
$29.95 every year for infinity
Gopher State
Footballguy
Ends up in Boston 10 years 360M
In other news the price of red sox tickets just went up
In other news the price of red sox tickets just went up
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
I don't see how anyone can realistically give him a 10 year deal, especially STL.
I see 8 as still somewhat objectively absurd, but given that Pujols is a walking legend, it's probably necessary. Look at what you've wrought, MLB.
I see 8 as still somewhat objectively absurd, but given that Pujols is a walking legend, it's probably necessary. Look at what you've wrought, MLB.
Notorious T.R.E.
Showdown!™ Administrator
8/$245MMBOOK IT
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
Albert might be 33. Just sayin'.
Looks like this deal isn't going to get done by Pujols' deadline. I'm sure the Cards could still make an offer sometime this season and he could accept, even though he has his deadline of tomorrow.
I still believe the Cards can resign him if he ends up being a free agent. If Pujols still wants $300 million over 10 years, then I think the Cards will pass on him. That is just too much money for a team like the Cardinals to give to one guy. He would take up almost 1/3 of their payroll. So, he would have his millions, and the rest of the team would not be very good.
I would hate to see him go, but I'm a bigger Cardinals fan than I am a Pujols fan. I don't want them to be non-contenders because of too much money going to one guy. I just hope he doesn't end up playing on the North side!
I still believe the Cards can resign him if he ends up being a free agent. If Pujols still wants $300 million over 10 years, then I think the Cards will pass on him. That is just too much money for a team like the Cardinals to give to one guy. He would take up almost 1/3 of their payroll. So, he would have his millions, and the rest of the team would not be very good.
I would hate to see him go, but I'm a bigger Cardinals fan than I am a Pujols fan. I don't want them to be non-contenders because of too much money going to one guy. I just hope he doesn't end up playing on the North side!
RnR
Footballguy
You're eating what the Cards are spooning onto your plate without much resistance. They can make 10/300 work if you put a gun to their head, but DeWitt and Co. have to shoot the lock off their wallets. I read something recently that said if the DeWitt ownership group were to sell the team tomorrow, it would be worth $600 mil more than they paid the Busch family for it. They are operating with a little bit of a cushion.If they're willing to commit to Matt Holiday for 7 seasons, they can commit to the best player of this generation for an extra 3. What kills me about this is that by the end of their proposed 6 year contract, Pujols is going to be approaching all kinds of historical landmarks. Are they going to let him go and fill the stands for some other team while approaching 3000 hits, 700 HR's, etc? No, they're going to try to lock him up at another 3 or 4 years and make him a "Cardinal for life." Just save us the trouble and go with a 10-year deal. I'm almost 100% sure that Pujols will come off the 300 mil number if they show the commitment of giving him 10 years. 10-year, 270 mil front-loaded contract seems appropriate, fair, and a no-brainer for both sides. It will pay for itself in terms of the latter years with one World Series win in the early years.
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
This is nice and all, but it completely hamstrings the club to do anything over the next decade. Not sure this is a good idea. I hope the scouting department is unbelievable. The Yankees can get away with crap like this. St. Louis? No chance.I'm all for team loyalty and keeping him a Cardinal for life, but he has to give a hometown discount a la Joe Mauer (8 years, 184 million). And keep in mind that Mauer will be turning 28. I'm convinced Pujols is 33.
RnR
Footballguy
On 99 out of 100 players, I'd be agreeing with you. Pujols is that exception to me. He's a "once every couple of generations" type talent. In fact, he may go down as the best first baseman of all-time when it is said and done. That's the kind of player you extend payroll for over the next decade.We're talking about a team with a 90 mil payroll. You're telling me they can't sustain ~100 mil for a decade? Have you seen what that franchise does in terms of ticket and merchandising sales? They own like 8 states.
Everyone keeps approaching this like they are paying him pennies right now, but he made roughly 15 mil last season. If they haven't been budgeting on paying him 25 mil+ at the end of this current contract, that's poor foresight on their part.
With a healthy Pujols, Holliday, Wainwright, Carpenter, Rasmus, etc., they have a window still open for 3-5 years that could bring a World Championship or two if things break right. Will they have issues staying competitive in the last 3-4 years of a 10-year pact? Possibly, but contracts like Carpenter and Holliday will be off the books then. It is really hard to say what the payroll situation will look like at that point because it involves way too much speculation, but that's why I think it is important to front-load the contract. If they're paying him 15 mil at age 40, it won't be the end of the world in term of the yearly payroll.
Also, the "hometown discount" was given in his last contract. He has played his prime at well under market value. He will re-sign again with the Cardinals for under market value if they will commit to the years he wants. Doesn't seem too unreasonable to me. He'll get 10/300 on the open market.
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
I see your argument, but it seems to cater to the idea that St. Louis' image and other side benefits are more important than how Pujols will contribute for 10 years and what it will do to the team down the road. Assuming the goal is to win the World Series, I think 10 for $300 million is a no-brainer bad deal. If he was 28, go for it. He's 31, perhaps older, and you're locking him in for probably 5 superior years and 5 very good to good years. I think the window to go hog-wild with a decade-long contract is long gone.I know Pujols is going to go down as an all-time great, but the reality is that they'd be paying far too much for past performance. At least they're in a better position than the Yankees with Jeter. They almost had no choice but to pay him off for his service. Dreadful deal that will hurt them, but they can eat it. The Cards can't.
Bogart
Footballguy
Dumb question guy: Can it be assumed that the Cards know exact how old Pujols is? Wouldn't you do everything in your power to know everything about the most important piece of your organization? Is this the Cards knowing something that the rest of us don't, and taking their time before leaping?
RnR
Footballguy
That's certainly possible, but pretty much impossible to prove at this point.
The "hometown discount" wasn't given to him in his last deal. He had only played 3 seasons and still had 3 more under the team's control. It was a lot of money at that time for a player who wasn't going to be a free agent for 3 more years.Right now, the Cardinals continually draw in excess of 3 million fans per year. How many more can they pack into the place when he is going for HR records?
Even if they bump up the payroll to over $100 million and they give Pujols $30 million a year, that is still 30% to 1 player. They have only $70 million leftover to pay the other 24.
Here is what I would offer. $250 million over 10 years. After he retires, pay him $5 million a year for however long he wants as an advisor or some position where he comes to spring training and makes several appearances at the park each season.
RnR
Footballguy
If 10 yrs, 250 mil was on the table from the Cards we wouldn't be having this discussion. Pujols signs that contract. This squabble is over years, not necessarily total dollar amount.You do realize its a little absurd that you're completely fine with a 10/250 deal, but completely opposed to a 10/300 deal, right? 5 mil a season is one bad contract to a middle reliever. The difference certainly won't break the bank for a team with a $100 mil payroll.
As for "How much more can they bring in with attendance over 3 million already?", I don't have a finite answer to that question. I'll pose one to you though, "How much do they stand to lose by letting the most popular player since Stan the Man walk over a few years on the back of a contract?"
RnR
Footballguy
No, they are negotiating "in private." Most of the "reports" out are that the Pujols camp is insistent on 10 years, and the Cards are hesitant to go beyond 6. Money has not been a perceived issue as Pujols has been pretty open about wanting to find a way to stay in St. Louis.To be honest, I'm not sure of the accuracy of any of the reporting being done on this issue, because it involves far too many "sources" and has too few actual quotes from people making decisions.
Wrigley
Footballguy
I giggled
Mr. Pickles
Footballguy
Regarding the bold... huh? Of course it's about money. Years IS money. If that wasn't about money, it'd be done already. Mauer's deal was done in virtually no time. That was still a whole lot about money, but he didn't play around like this. Took less to stay home, and that was that.The Cards are probably saying they are hesitant to go over 6 years, but they know they're on the hook for 8+ here. They are right to want to keep it to 6. That's the only sane move, but the fans would kill them over it. They'll have to do 8.
Albert has to realize that STL isn't New York or Boston. The revenues just aren't there in that market to make an absurd deal happen. If he wants to hold STL to $300 mil over 10 years, he'll have to bear the personal responsibility for them not being competitive in five years. That's just how it goes. I know the man is a walking baseball Jesus, but let's get real here.
RnR
Footballguy
I was talking on a per year basis. I don't think either side questions that it should be in the 25-27 mil per season range. The disagreement is over the length of the deal. Obviously, you're right in saying "years IS money", but I sincerely doubt they are at the negotiating table right now quibbling over whether it is 24 or 26 mil for 8 seasons. It's a matter of one of the sides budging from their length of contract demand.
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