Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Edmonds or Connor could return draft day value or eat into each others' - how do you see it?
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Cardinals RB Chase Edmonds - 08.10.21 - is at the top of the team's initial depth chart followed by James Connor - how do you see the backfield split? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Dr. Octopus
- Start date
Edmonds or Connor could return draft day value or eat into each others' - how do you see it?
jtd13
Footballguy
I've always kind of liked Edmonds and thought he could do well with a bigger role. But I find myself fading him this year. I think he needs more targets than last year to be relevant, and I don't really see a good target ceiling with Kyler being a very mobile QB, and Rondale Moore a more electric short route option than they had in the past. I know Kyler wants to run less this year, but until it happens I expect he'll run before dumping off more times than not.
With Conner, I can see him getting most of the carries Drake got last year, while probably ceding a few more targets to Edmonds than Drake did. I think of I play him I am hoping for a goal line TD and not a whole lot else.
Long story short, it's not a super interesting backfield for me this year. In redraft, I'll take one of the rookies (Etienne, Williams or Carter) if I want an upside RB near where Edmonds is going, or a guy like Moss or Sermon where Conner is going .
With Conner, I can see him getting most of the carries Drake got last year, while probably ceding a few more targets to Edmonds than Drake did. I think of I play him I am hoping for a goal line TD and not a whole lot else.
Long story short, it's not a super interesting backfield for me this year. In redraft, I'll take one of the rookies (Etienne, Williams or Carter) if I want an upside RB near where Edmonds is going, or a guy like Moss or Sermon where Conner is going .
SeniorVBDStudent
Footballguy
ugly time share. avoid.
more interested in the % of targets for the wrs....though I think this offense will negatively regress / don't trust Klingsbury to learn new tricks.
target DeAndre / Murray / Kirk in descending order but only if they slip below ADP.
more interested in the % of targets for the wrs....though I think this offense will negatively regress / don't trust Klingsbury to learn new tricks.
target DeAndre / Murray / Kirk in descending order but only if they slip below ADP.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I was able to land him pretty Affordably for Curtis Samuel and a 2022 second round pick. In PPR, I expect him to be flex worthy as his floor. I needed a depth, and he is my running back 3/4.
even if Connor gets hurt again, I would expect Benjamin to absorb those carries, while Chase Edmunds gets his 7 to 10 carry/4 to 8 reception per game role.
that’s my hope, anyway. I do feel like his one touchdown last year was a little bit fluky, and would hope for somewhere around 6 to 8 touchdowns this year.
even if Connor gets hurt again, I would expect Benjamin to absorb those carries, while Chase Edmunds gets his 7 to 10 carry/4 to 8 reception per game role.
that’s my hope, anyway. I do feel like his one touchdown last year was a little bit fluky, and would hope for somewhere around 6 to 8 touchdowns this year.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Desperation makes a man do things… Terrible things. Like putting faith into Chase Edmunds as a reliable fantasy producer for 2021.
i’m not proud
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Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
Drake had the 4th most Red Zone rushing attempts last year behind only Cook Henry & Jacobs. Given that Edmonds has one (1) career GL carry, Conner could be in line for an uptick in TDs.
The Cardinals running backs finished RB15 & RB22 last year. Not avoiding but I can think of at least 10 backfields I’m more interested in this year.
The Cardinals running backs finished RB15 & RB22 last year. Not avoiding but I can think of at least 10 backfields I’m more interested in this year.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
He’s definitely not a DND in re-draft for me… He is a player that if he falls to the right value I will happily take as a depth pick past his ADP, depending on my team needs.
If I somehow come into the fifth or sixth with an elite TE/QB I could see taking him as my third running back. Ideally he would be my fourth.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Fearless projection: 120 carries for 444 yards; 91 receptions for 682 yards, 6 total TDs.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Fearless projection: 120 carries for 444 yards; 91 receptions for 682 yards, 6 total TDs.
Tentative projections for me:
James Connor 763-7 28-182-1
Chase Edmunds 625-4 41-305-2
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I feel like the Cardinals are going to have Murray dump off more this year with fewer designed runs.
I don’t think they’ll kneecap him entirely (a peacock’s gotta fly!) but he did get hurt a couple times last year.
Pure speculation on my part, but it seems like it would be a smart evolution.
Ilov80s
Footballguy
That's probably about right with Eno Benjamin chipping in 100-200 yards or filling in if Chase or Conner get banged up.
rschroeder1
Footballguy
As a transparency note, Edmonds is a likely keeper for me in a 12-team league (from a 2019 roster, never would have kept him in '20 but a lot has changed, suffice to say it's a wacky).
I think there's some things to like about Edmonds. He saw a significant jump in playing time with the current GM/coach regime, so it seems they view him favorably, at least in terms of what is on their roster. Not drafting an RB is a positive sign, though also was expected (at least to me) given their dearth of draft capital and other pressing needs.
My biggest concern for Edmonds is that his usage last year at times defied any sort of logic. The one game he started against the Dolphins stands out, when he had 25 carries and 3 targets. There was no attempt to put him in a position to succeed with what he does best. In other games with his normal role, sometimes you would see a lot of him...other times not. For no rhyme or reason. Suffice to say I don't really trust the head coach here.
I'm betting on his reception totals holding steady or actually increasing. Given how Murray got banged up last year, I expect he will curtail his running, not stop it entirely, but try to be more judicious. For 12-team leagues, Edmonds was knocking on the door last year of RB2 in PPR and 1/2 PPR. I expect some modest improvement from the high 20s in his ranking toward the low 20s.
I think there's some things to like about Edmonds. He saw a significant jump in playing time with the current GM/coach regime, so it seems they view him favorably, at least in terms of what is on their roster. Not drafting an RB is a positive sign, though also was expected (at least to me) given their dearth of draft capital and other pressing needs.
My biggest concern for Edmonds is that his usage last year at times defied any sort of logic. The one game he started against the Dolphins stands out, when he had 25 carries and 3 targets. There was no attempt to put him in a position to succeed with what he does best. In other games with his normal role, sometimes you would see a lot of him...other times not. For no rhyme or reason. Suffice to say I don't really trust the head coach here.
I'm betting on his reception totals holding steady or actually increasing. Given how Murray got banged up last year, I expect he will curtail his running, not stop it entirely, but try to be more judicious. For 12-team leagues, Edmonds was knocking on the door last year of RB2 in PPR and 1/2 PPR. I expect some modest improvement from the high 20s in his ranking toward the low 20s.
rockaction
Footballguy
I expect Chase Edmonds to get the bulk of the carries until and unless he shows that he can't run between the tackles. I think Conner definitely eats into his role. I also think Conner doesn't stay. My personal sleeper follows, and he moved up the depth chart. I roster him because of Matt Waldman's take on him back in last year's RSP. His name is Jonathan Ward.
It is surprising that he is third on the depth chart ahead of Eno Benjamin. If I'm not mistaken, Ward, a Central Michigan product, has more size and a better speed score than Benjamin. Ward clocks in at about 6'0" and weights north of 200 lbs., unlike Benjamin and Edmonds, who are 5'9" and maybe two hundred lbs. Ward is 23.8 years old, Benjamin 22.3, according to Player Profiler. Benjamin runs a 4.57 forty, while Ward is listed with a 4.50 pro day, which means Profiler adds .05 to the time, making it a 4.55. So they're about even in speed. Benjamin has a nice 87th percentile Burst Score, Ward has no measurement.
It is surprising that he is third on the depth chart ahead of Eno Benjamin. If I'm not mistaken, Ward, a Central Michigan product, has more size and a better speed score than Benjamin. Ward clocks in at about 6'0" and weights north of 200 lbs., unlike Benjamin and Edmonds, who are 5'9" and maybe two hundred lbs. Ward is 23.8 years old, Benjamin 22.3, according to Player Profiler. Benjamin runs a 4.57 forty, while Ward is listed with a 4.50 pro day, which means Profiler adds .05 to the time, making it a 4.55. So they're about even in speed. Benjamin has a nice 87th percentile Burst Score, Ward has no measurement.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I made the same observation above. It seems like the right thing for the Cardinals to do. Whether they think that is another question.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Fair point, and I probably need to bump Edmonds receptions up. Didn’t realize he had 53 receptions last season and his snaps likely go up this season with Drake gone.
BobbyLayne
Footballguy
There is a lot of bias in the fantasy football community against Edmonds this year. It all goes back to the Miami game last year. He had a couple really good (>20 points in PPR) games before the bye week and Drake was out the first game after the bye. He had this massive bell cow opportunity and it didn’t go so great. They lost to Tua (first start) and he had a diminished role most of the remainder of the season.
I like him, but where he’s being drafted (late 5th/early 6th) I’m generally looking at TE or WR3 around then. Doubt I draft him but who knows, if he falls to the 7th I’d go for it.
Conner will score a lot and end up with more carries, but I predict Edmonds will still lead the team in rushing. There is talk of Murray running less and maybe he dumps off more, but I’ll believe it when I see it. 55-60 receptions for Chase and maybe 25-30 for the “backup” seems about right.
Skeletore Eh
Footballguy
Conner looked completely cooked to me last year. I think it may start off a 60/40 split favoring Edmunds, with edmunds increasing his advantage as season progresses. Can Edmunds hold up? Probably not, but that’s the question to me
rzrback77
Footballguy
Edmunds had 60 carries as a rookie and 60 carries in 10 games in 2019. Last year, he upped that to 97, but 25 came in one game. Outside of that game, he averaged under 5 carries per game. It seems like a real stretch for him to get the majority of the rushing opportunities.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I have no doubt this is the plan, but I have much doubt in Conner’s ability to stay on the field.BobbyLayne said:
We’ll see what happens.
Fair points all around
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I mean, they just need to hand him the ball more each game. That’s not much of a stretch. Seems easy.
what they should be doing is pounding Conner up the gut as long as he’s vertical, and running sweeps and stretch plays with Edmonds
I don’t have any illusions about Edmonds being in the RB1 conversation this year, but I think the Cards give him a legit chance to be featured in this offense. I can’t imagine why the coaching staff would blow this much smoke otherwise.
Conner looked awful every time I watching him last year. I actually was on the other side of this discussion (in the Edmonds topic) when they signed Conner, saying they didn’t sign him to ride the bench. That said, I was convinced by others & by the data they offered tHat Edmonds was being undervalued.
I’m also unsure if I’ll have him in redraft unless he slides a bit, but He should be flex-worthy in PPR this year.
I’m not sure how many TDs Conner is gonna score. I’m more concerned about Murray stealing them.
deadlyrange0321
Footballguy
I saw enough of Conner last year. He was awful, the definition of a mud runner. If he is stealing meaningful work after the first few games then Edmonds would have severely underperformed. I can see the case for Conner to get some GL work, but even then, it may be suboptimal for AZ to give him the ball there.
Dizzy
Footballguy
JAG 1 and JAG 2... I am not excited about either of them. I'm guessing Conner will get the "3 yds and a cloud of dust" carries - when Kyler Murray needs to catch his breath. And Chase will be more explosive on fewer touches. Either will be challenged to crack the top 20 in fantasy RBs IMO. Injury to either could change things.
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I wouldn't target these two in any snake draft. In my auction draft I'll nominate Edmonds early to blow someone's budget and then I'll go for Conner for around 1$.
Anyone who had a Cardinal RB last year knows the usage will render them TD or bust options. Let someone else pay the higher price for Edmonds and then go for Conner if you want a piece of the Cards backfield
Anyone who had a Cardinal RB last year knows the usage will render them TD or bust options. Let someone else pay the higher price for Edmonds and then go for Conner if you want a piece of the Cards backfield
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Sure, but if Chase is RB20 -> 30, he's flex-worthy, or at least a solid BYE-week/injury back. PPR I don't see him outside the top 30.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Ordinarily I would agree with this philosophy.
When it comes to Conner Vs Edmonds, I'm taking Edmonds at or after his ADP as a reliable PPR option.
I'm fading Conner hard as a dude who looked cooked, and is very likely to get hurt again. I see Conner as a wasted pick. Edmonds at least has upside.
RenegadeRoy
Footballguy
I'm thinking the exact opposite. I'll nominate Conner and let people bid on the name and then sneak in on Edmonds later. I think Edmonds has better flex value (half or full PPR) which is where either of these guys is going to end up on your roster.
