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2016 Green Bay Packers thread (1 Viewer)

Balco said:
I am at a loss for who the Packers can still get.  I have no problem not going after big ticket free agents.  But this roster only needs a few upgrades to be right back in Super Bowl contention.  One is solving NT and ILB positions.  The other is finding 2 tight ends who can get open. 

Why couldn't they give Ben Watson 4 mil a year, or Jerrel Freeman 6 mil. Both signed short term deals.  
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They will be in contention no matter if they add a free agent or not.  They were in contention this season (barely lost to AZ to advance to NFCC game).

the problem isn't contending, it's winning in the playoffs.  Their last two playoff losses were very winnable games. 

 
sho nuff said:
Up the middle in D is not why they lost last year or why there were not as good as previous years.
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 It absolutely why the defense played poorly. They were the 28th team in regards to opponents ypc (4.5). As you know, giving up chunks of yards makes it easier for offenses on 2nd and 3rd downs. Stop the run and every part of the d inproves. You can bring an extra DB and sub in pass rushers. Packers were softer than soft up the middle. 

 
Casey Hayward's contract:Three years, $15.3 million and featured $6.8 million of guarantees.

$2.5 million signing bonus.

His yearly compensation is as follows:

2016: $1 million base salary (guaranteed), $3.3 million roster bonus payable March 18.

2017: $3.25 million base salary, $1 million roster bonus.

2018: $3.25 base salary, $1 million roster bonus.
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Are we happy Ted didn't pay to keep him?  Hayward was a good draft pick by Ted, and subsequent good drafting made him expendable.

 
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Balco said:
I am at a loss for who the Packers can still get.  I have no problem not going after big ticket free agents.  But this roster only needs a few upgrades to be right back in Super Bowl contention.  One is solving NT and ILB positions.  The other is finding 2 tight ends who can get open. 

Why couldn't they give Ben Watson 4 mil a year, or Jerrel Freeman 6 mil. Both signed short term deals.  
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So, a couple of thoughts on where things stand.

It's becoming very clear to me that Thompson just won't sign true free agents, and it's likely because of the compensatory draft pick scenario. It's pretty clear he doesn't like losing picks in this way. Right or wrong, it's how Thompson runs the team, and he's been successful doing that.

It appears more and more that Thompson and staff believe Sam Barrington is going to be able to come back and be effective at the LB position. I liked the early returns on Barrington. I hope he can make it back and be effective.

I also think that Green Bay will start focusing in on the "Post June 1 Cut" category of players. These are folks that will be cut later than others for cap reasons. These guys aren't considered regular Free Agents, but instead are "Street" Free Agents. It's the designation Peppers had when he signed, and it means Ted can sign a free agent and not lose draft picks in compensation based on performance. 

With that said, still plenty of movement to come.

I believe strongly that Martellus Bennett ends up in Green Bay. The Bears are trying to trade him, but most teams know where they are on him. Just a matter of time before he's cut. 

 
CletiusMaximus said:
Casey Hayward's contract:Three years, $15.3 million and featured $6.8 million of guarantees.

Are we happy Ted didn't pay to keep him?  Hayward was a good draft pick by Ted, and subsequent good drafting made him expendable.
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I like him better than Randall.  

 
Thinking on Randall's gutless play during the Thanksgiving game, I wonder if he understood that winning that game would have evened the all time Packers Bears series.  Or if he cared.  

 
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Sabertooth said:
Thinking on Randall's gutless play during the Thanksgiving game, I wonder if he understood that winning that game would have evened the all time Packers Bears series.  Or if he cared.  
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It's not his fault they lost 50 other games, why should the current one matter?

 
Sabertooth said:
Thinking on Randall's gutless play during the Thanksgiving game, I wonder if he understood that winning that game would have evened the all time Packers Bears series.  Or if he cared.  
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Or that you are still have he only one calling him gutless and are still harping on that.

 
Sabertooth said:
Looks like Bennett to the Patriots.  
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Yep. I was hoping no one would bite. There's no way Chicago was trading him in the division, so Green Bay was right in waiting it out. I wonder if that bumps Cook up the list at all?

The other thing is, I still believe this WR core is quite good when healthy. A 100% Nelson and the return of Montgomery might mean a fast TE is a luxury they can wait on. 

LB depth is the more pressing concern for me. 

 
Dansby was released and might be a nice ILB option.  He is getting pretty old but has been still pretty productive.  I would think he wouldn't cost a huge contract either at his age.

 
I don't see them doing much as far as LB and a guy that would "start".  I think they believe they have Ryan and Barrington and will only add guys for depth more than anything.  Don't see a lot of 1 or 2 year short fix deals for those guys.

 
I agree that would be their approach.  I think it's a mistake.  We will see how the season works out but I'm tired of their philosophy of not making any free agent moves and take a bit more of a win now mentality.  I think there needs to be some balance there.  They were edged out for the division title last year and Minnesota seems to be getting better.

 
Warhogs said:
I agree that would be their approach.  I think it's a mistake.  We will see how the season works out but I'm tired of their philosophy of not making any free agent moves and take a bit more of a win now mentality.  I think there needs to be some balance there.  They were edged out for the division title last year and Minnesota seems to be getting better.
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It absolutely is a mistake. Ryan showed that he is a step slow, and lacks instincts. Dansby would make a ton of sense as he had another solid year last season.

 
Yes and no.  I think Chicago got really the only 2 ILBs out there that were worth anything as far as upgrades in talent vs. potential.

Is there really an upgrade just because its a vet out there right now?  Dansby maybe?

I like using it for depth...because depth is what has hurt lately.  They can sustain some injuries here and there...but if a few hit, they get hurt bad.  They need depth at ILB...if they are going to go with Ryan and Barrington.  WIll it come from FA?  WIll Ragland fall to them and one of those guys become the depth?

I agree with some about keeping Matthews outside...but I think they would really like to have the versatility to just move Matthews wherever.  Switch in and out of packages and keep offenses guessing what Clay is really playing.  That could be dangerous.  But they have to have more depth at ILB to do that.  He had to stay inside because of that lack of depth when Barrington got hurt.

 
Balco said:
It absolutely is a mistake. Ryan showed that he is a step slow, and lacks instincts. Dansby would make a ton of sense as he had another solid year last season.
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He did?  One year and he is already just slow and lacks instincts?

How quickly would some of you have given up on players in the past?  Would Driver have ever even made the team?

 
sho nuff said:
He did?  One year and he is already just slow and lacks instincts?

How quickly would some of you have given up on players in the past?  Would Driver have ever even made the team?
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You disagree he was a step slow and displayed sub par instincts? I think he might be best suited at olb.

Here is our weakness on defense- up the middle. Solve that, and good things happen. Great news is it won't cost a ton of $$$$ because role players can be plugged in. Bad news is it appears TT is satisfied with what's there.

Richard Rodgers is not a good tight end. He is slow, can't block well, and averages about 0.6 yards per catch. And it looks like he is going to be best option next year. That is horrifying.

 
Balco said:
You disagree he was a step slow and displayed sub par instincts? I think he might be best suited at olb.

Here is our weakness on defense- up the middle. Solve that, and good things happen. Great news is it won't cost a ton of $$$$ because role players can be plugged in. Bad news is it appears TT is satisfied with what's there.

Richard Rodgers is not a good tight end. He is slow, can't block well, and averages about 0.6 yards per catch. And it looks like he is going to be best option next year. That is horrifying.
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I think him being a "step slow" could easily be due to rookie learning the game and it has not caught up to him.  I don't think he is an OLB at all.

Rodgers is average at best, Id agree there.  We don't know he will be the best option at this point.  

But last year's issues, were mostly on the offensive side of the ball.  D gave up 20.2 points per game.(it was 21.8 per game the previous year)  That with an offense that turned it over more than in the past, didn't sustain drives like in the past, and gave up poor field position more than they had in the past.  The offense scored 23 per game last year, down from 30.4 the previous year.

Again, this is not saying the D was great...but it was a good defense.  They were weak at MLB when Barrington went down and struggled to find anything....Ryan didn't really come on til late and that was as a rookie.

Would I have liked Trevathan there...sure, but TT was not going to spend that much on that spot knowing what is coming up next year in FA on their own team.  Freeman...sure, better option I guess for the money.  But its not as if there were just great sure fire options that are not going to change what they want to do with resigning guys next year.

But this team is built mostly on offense.  They will have so much tied up there in the cap with Rodgers, Cobb, Nelson, and on the OL...add in the bigger $$$ to Shields and Matthews on the D and they have to think cheaper at other positions.  Nature of the beast mostly.

 
I'm with Sho on Ryan. Really hard to judge Ryan as slow and having sub par instincts. I actually thought his biggest problem last year strength more than anything. He has potential, and judging rookies is really an inexact science. If they roll into the season with Barrington and Ryan as the starters, I won't lose sleep over it. Barrington is an improvement over what they started last year. Ryan will be a year longer in the system. They'll be better at ILB by default, more or less.

 
I have no problem with not signing huge $$$ free agents. I have a problem not signing reasonably priced defenders. Freeman I believe was rated the #1 run stopping ILB available in fa. Packers easily could have signed him. Some of these tight end contracts recently have been cheap. And they could have had Martellus Bennett for a couple late picks. Not flashy signings, but smart signings that would greatly help team. I fear they won't even look at Dansby which is a shame.

We should always look to improve our team.  And the defense needs significant improvement. I am completely fine with the secondary as constructed. I am fine with olb and defensive end. But ILB and NT are way below average. I would hope TT is going to take advantage of a very deep dl draft. But I fear Ragland won't be available at their pick at ilb.

Richard Rodgers should see time inside the 10 yard line. He is Joe Fauria with less speed and athleticism. In a perfect world, Packers sign two tight ends to push him down to #3 or off roster.

 
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Balco said:
I have no problem with not signing huge $$$ free agents. I have a problem not signing reasonably priced defenders. Freeman I believe was rated the #1 run stopping ILB available in fa. Packers easily could have signed him. Some of these tight end contracts recently have been cheap. And they could have had Martellus Bennett for a couple late picks. Not flashy signings, but smart signings that would greatly help team. I fear they won't even look at Dansby which is a shame.

We should always look to improve our team.  And the defense needs significant improvement. I am completely fine with the secondary as constructed. I am fine with olb and defensive end. But ILB and NT are way below average. I would hope TT is going to take advantage of a very deep dl draft. But I fear Ragland won't be available at their pick at ilb.

Richard Rodgers should see time inside the 10 yard line. He is Joe Fauria with less speed and athleticism. In a perfect world, Packers sign two tight ends to push him down to #3 or off roster.
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How do you know what they could have had Bennett for?  You think the Bears were dealing him to GB like they did NE?

I don't think the defense needs "significant" improvement.

 
sho nuff said:
How do you know what they could have had Bennett for?  You think the Bears were dealing him to GB like they did NE?

I don't think the defense needs "significant" improvement.
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Our defense was ranked 21st in rushing yards allowed and 29th in yards per rush. So yes, I think there needs to be significant improvement. I responded several posts up as to why I think a solid rushing d is the key to a good d.  

Chicago would trade Bennett to the highest bidder. If not, then the GM should be fired. 

 
I like Bennett's skill set and size.  So too have four teams now, though three got tired of his #### in spite of his talent and his size.  I wonder what they know that I don't.  I also wonder whether Thompson may know what those three teams know but I don't.

 
Balco said:
Our defense was ranked 21st in rushing yards allowed and 29th in yards per rush. So yes, I think there needs to be significant improvement. I responded several posts up as to why I think a solid rushing d is the key to a good d.  

Chicago would trade Bennett to the highest bidder. If not, then the GM should be fired. 
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I don't go he a crap about yards.

Points given up...in addition look at how the offense played and what position that put the D in last year.

And no, I do t think we get near the deal the Patriots got. Teams don't trade in the division like that.

 
sho nuff said:
I don't see them doing much as far as LB and a guy that would "start".  I think they believe they have Ryan and Barrington and will only add guys for depth more than anything.  Don't see a lot of 1 or 2 year short fix deals for those guys.
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I actually wouldn't mind seeing one before Saturday this year.  

 
sho nuff said:
I don't go he a crap about yards.

Points given up...in addition look at how the offense played and what position that put the D in last year.

And no, I do t think we get near the deal the Patriots got. Teams don't trade in the division like that.
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Not sure if I am reading this right. You are saying you are fine with the run defense? Or that you don't care about run defense because our ppg allowed was 20.1?

 
sho nuff said:
He did?  One year and he is already just slow and lacks instincts?

How quickly would some of you have given up on players in the past?  Would Driver have ever even made the team?
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Ryan is too slow for my taste.  I just don't think he's starting material.  Move him in a few plays here and there but I dont want to see him as an every down player.

 
Balco said:
Not sure if I am reading this right. You are saying you are fine with the run defense? Or that you don't care about run defense because our ppg allowed was 20.1?
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I don't care about yardage given up all that much. And pure stats don't take into consideration stalled droves, short fields based on poor offensive play, or defense going back in the field because the offense was not sustaining drives.

 
Warhogs said:
Dansby was released and might be a nice ILB option.  He is getting pretty old but has been still pretty productive.  I would think he wouldn't cost a huge contract either at his age.
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Dansby. Wow. I find myself transported back to the 2004 draft...the Packers' pick is up at 1.25 and I'm elated because Dansby's still on the board and it looks like a perfect marriage of player and need. Instead, Batman freaking Carroll is the pick, and arguably the dumbest draft in Packers history is off to its notorious start...meanwhile Dansby goes 8 picks later. I guess better late than never..

 
Sho, I admire your positive spin on everything.  Wish I could be so adept at spinning everything in a positive light.  You're like Bizarro me.  

 
Sabertooth said:
Sho, I admire your positive spin on everything.  Wish I could be so adept at spinning everything in a positive light.  You're like Bizarro me.  
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Not everything is positive or spin.

The offense was bad last year...terrible when compared to previous Rodgers offenses.

The line was beat up and not playing well even when healthy.  Rodgers was off all year and the wrs played poorly.

You asked about 3rd down D, I gave you the percentages and ranks showing it probably wasn't as bad as you thought.

The team needs depth.  Depth at lb, depth in the OL, depth at wr(though, with jordy and Montgomery healthy they have more depth there now), and need depth at rb.

Secondary does not seem to be a concern or outside pass rush or DE.

But I've said for a while, as they are constructed, barring major injury (namely to Rodgers or Matthews), they will again be a contender.

Not spin, just how this team is built when you have cap tied up high in those 2 players.

 
onionsack said:
Dansby. Wow. I find myself transported back to the 2004 draft...the Packers' pick is up at 1.25 and I'm elated because Dansby's still on the board and it looks like a perfect marriage of player and need. Instead, Batman freaking Carroll is the pick, and arguably the dumbest draft in Packers history is off to its notorious start...meanwhile Dansby goes 8 picks later. I guess better late than never..
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Every team has horrendous first round busts but Carroll really sticks in my craw. However, his mid-season dumping was another step in Ted Thompson's process of reversing the damage done by Mike Sherman.

Let us not forget Carroll's hilarious nicknames (well-earned) of Grabby Smurf and Highway 27. I actually respected the fact that after cycling through the arena league he made it back to the NFL. The Jets used him in 1-on-1 coverage of Randy Moss for some insane reason but that was when Cassell was QB so he kept missing open throws.

I remember a lot about Ahmad Carroll for some reason.

 
I figured Starks would be back.  Some teams maybe looked a little but he wasn't going to get a big contract to go somewhere else.  I think that also ends them looking at a different veteran RB.  They might draft a rookie at some point to start getting some time in the system.

 
I didn't have to hear it from Bob McGinn, I saw it with my own eyes.  See that's the difference between us.  I can form my own opinion because I'm not subject to the Fox Valley groupthink.  

 
sho nuff said:
Not everything is positive or spin.

The offense was bad last year...terrible when compared to previous Rodgers offenses.

The line was beat up and not playing well even when healthy.  Rodgers was off all year and the wrs played poorly.

You asked about 3rd down D, I gave you the percentages and ranks showing it probably wasn't as bad as you thought.

The team needs depth.  Depth at lb, depth in the OL, depth at wr(though, with jordy and Montgomery healthy they have more depth there now), and need depth at rb.
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The team needs to improve some starters, namely ILB and NT, and it could have signed several affordable upgrades.

I am fine with the receiver situation, obviously Jordy is the wild card, but if he comes back 100 % that takes a ton of attention away from Cobb.  Montgomerys knock (aside from injuries) was that he was unpolished as a route runner.  Because Richard Rodgers was so terrible, the Pack was utilizing him on short routes with effectiveness.  I really like what I saw of him.  Think he can be a solid guy in the slot, built like a running back. I also believe Adams was hurt last year.  I expect a pretty big bounce back.  Janis is a solid special teamer who has ridiculous physical skills.  He just doesn't appear to be smart enough to learn routes/read defenses.

3 positions need to be addressed, TE, ILB, and NT.  So far they have done zero, despite plenty of affordable options.  Dissapointing.

 
Balco said:
The team needs to improve some starters, namely ILB and NT, and it could have signed several affordable upgrades.

I am fine with the receiver situation, obviously Jordy is the wild card, but if he comes back 100 % that takes a ton of attention away from Cobb.  Montgomerys knock (aside from injuries) was that he was unpolished as a route runner.  Because Richard Rodgers was so terrible, the Pack was utilizing him on short routes with effectiveness.  I really like what I saw of him.  Think he can be a solid guy in the slot, built like a running back. I also believe Adams was hurt last year.  I expect a pretty big bounce back.  Janis is a solid special teamer who has ridiculous physical skills.  He just doesn't appear to be smart enough to learn routes/read defenses.

3 positions need to be addressed, TE, ILB, and NT.  So far they have done zero, despite plenty of affordable options.  Dissapointing.
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The bigger knock on Montgomery is that he can't catch passes beyond 10 yards, particularly over his shoulder, down the sideline.  He isn't good at tracking the ball.  Which, unfortunately, is a pretty big deal for a "WR".

 
I've been reading this thread some to see if the Pack fans view it like I do.  It seems strange that they refuse to play the FA at all.   Being a Bears fan,  I'm always looking for a reason to hate the Packers, but I always come back to the same conclusion.  Until Ted or the Packers show me a reason to doubt them,  they'll continue to be the strongest franchise in the division,  unfortunately. :mellow:

 
sho nuff said:
He did?  One year and he is already just slow and lacks instincts?

How quickly would some of you have given up on players in the past?  Would Driver have ever even made the team?
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See now Ryan showed a lot more promise to me than Randall.  He made a great tackle in the Arizona game that really got my attention.  Plus Go Blue! 

 
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